[...]
Whatever you do now, just do me one favor please. Don’t listen to players that
- make you think that the game is broken hindering to do well in it or play fair, or
[...]
The game is broken for ruining his fun in that instance, not because it would hinder him, but because it is unable to deliver on its promise.
That has as much substance as if you’d say elite maps are broken because they can’t be beaten by a bunch of weak players wanting to have fun.
So in your opinion, a game's purpose is no to entertain in an engaging manner? That reyan, having invested quite some time, effort and brains into his build, should not at least feel he is doing a significant contribution to the team effort?
Because it pretty much reads like you're saying that.
Rayan can at any given time have an engaging gameplay experience on all maps we have where his team mates don’t force him in a competitive PvE situation.
If he ends up in one his challenge in difficulty is moved away from the map opposition to outdoing to capabilities of the others in his team.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
So in your opinion, a game's purpose is no to entertain in an engaging manner? That reyan, having invested quite some time, effort and brains into his build, should not at least feel he is doing a significant contribution to the team effort?
Because it pretty much reads like you're saying that.
Rayan can at any given time have an engaging gameplay experience on all maps we have where his team mates don’t force him in a competitive PvE situation.
If he ends up in one his challenge in difficulty is moved away from the map opposition to outdoing to capabilities of the others in his team.
That's a very convoluted way of saying that I understood you correctly.
It is the way things are. Deal with it or keep on crying for help from the Devs to change it. Odds are that they will at some point but they won’t do it for you but rather just to start the cycle power creep all over again.
They want you to be enthusiastic about the game if you want to have a good time in it; either when it comes to beating difficult content or if you try to compete with others in easy content.
The effort that needs to be put into this game will keep on getting higher and higher. You can count on that and play accordingly, or let it be.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Well, just had the (mis?)fortunte of being in an ISA instance with @tunebreaker
Was over before it started.
Not overly bothered - but does highlight the primary setback of playing a torpedo boat. Get a player like Tunebreaker on the map and everything is dead before the torpedoes even hit anything.
I'm not going to go all negative here, but chasing around after someone who basically solos the map and all but one-shots everything is a bit TRIBBLE.
Fwiw, the parse looked like this...
SCM - Infected [LR] (S) - [02:26] DMG(DPS) - @sf911: 23.98M(167.96K) @tunebreaker: 10.02M(69.19K) @[pug1]: 3.89M(35.41K) @reyan01: 1.75M(12.87K) @[pug2]: 318.03K(3.81K)
I tanked for my friend Florian, and while I am capable of outputting similar numbers myself (especially when Florian tanks for me), I'm not so sure I solely accept the blame in that particular case.
Also, fwiw^2, you can very well do 100k+ in a fast ISA with a torp boat.
No, I really can't. Your combatlog just proved that my DPS is a JOKE and, contrary to what @peterconnorfirst said, I've actually accomplished nothing.
Well, just had the (mis?)fortunte of being in an ISA instance with @tunebreaker
Was over before it started.
Not overly bothered - but does highlight the primary setback of playing a torpedo boat. Get a player like Tunebreaker on the map and everything is dead before the torpedoes even hit anything.
I'm not going to go all negative here, but chasing around after someone who basically solos the map and all but one-shots everything is a bit rubbish
Well, just had the (mis?)fortunte of being in an ISA instance with @tunebreaker
Was over before it started.
Not overly bothered - but does highlight the primary setback of playing a torpedo boat. Get a player like Tunebreaker on the map and everything is dead before the torpedoes even hit anything.
I'm not going to go all negative here, but chasing around after someone who basically solos the map and all but one-shots everything is a bit TRIBBLE.
Fwiw, the parse looked like this...
SCM - Infected [LR] (S) - [02:26] DMG(DPS) - @sf911: 23.98M(167.96K) @tunebreaker: 10.02M(69.19K) @[pug1]: 3.89M(35.41K) @reyan01: 1.75M(12.87K) @[pug2]: 318.03K(3.81K)
I tanked for my friend Florian, and while I am capable of outputting similar numbers myself (especially when Florian tanks for me), I'm not so sure I solely accept the blame in that particular case.
Also, fwiw^2, you can very well do 100k+ in a fast ISA with a torp boat.
No, I really can't. Your combatlog just proved that my DPS is a JOKE and, contrary to what @peterconnorfirst said, I've actually accomplished nothing.
Well, just had the (mis?)fortunte of being in an ISA instance with @tunebreaker
Was over before it started.
Not overly bothered - but does highlight the primary setback of playing a torpedo boat. Get a player like Tunebreaker on the map and everything is dead before the torpedoes even hit anything.
I'm not going to go all negative here, but chasing around after someone who basically solos the map and all but one-shots everything is a bit rubbish
You think?
This is precisely the balance issue I am always talking about. "But naw, soph, it's okay, because it requires skill!"
Maybe, but that doesn't change the fact that it's not a good game experience for everyone on the team.
Disclaimer: I blame the game, not the players. Just saying that so that nobody gets all foamy around the mouth.
Forced to agree. In fact I've lost motivation to bother running anything else after being reduced to little more than a spectator in that instance.
I’m very sorry that one of your first ISA ventures with your recently adjusted build lead to results far below your expectations.
What happened? You were caught by surprise, nothing more. ISA has a creeping low DPS ceiling compared to the dmg potential players/teams can bring quickly reaching a point where you and your build can’t unleash its full dmg potential no matter how good or bad you manage to play.
Experienced players know that and when they have reached a point where they don’t cut it in channels runs often feel compelled to display and test their abilities in public matches where they have a higher chance to get their share of the small DPS cake that ISA is nowadays.
With my exotic build on a sci I average around 100-150k after playing with it for a few days because my league experience has me better prepared for fast matches. This is of course under the consideration that nothing goes terribly wrong (dying, missing out critical target groups with the slow attacks I have) or terribly right (setting up the stage to my advantage over my team) where I can easily loose a 100k or even gain it.
Even this 50k discrepancy on an average is much higher than it is with my beam and especially cannon boats because EPG and torpedos are just slow and the map composition is stacked against me compared to other maps we have. I either run into weaker players still supplying me with valuable buffs without taking targets away from me or I run into stronger ones which use the high DMG spikes cannon builds can pull to melt large amounts of HP I’d could usually reach with my slow working attacks.
All that applies to me in this game applies to you as well. That’s the good part. In short you can look at my build and see what more expensive items and traits I was able to gather to help me up those slow attacks a bit.
Additionally you can look at a video I linked in your thread which discretely shows how epg/torp builds can be set into motion in fast runs. Lots of stuff can be learned there, especially a high hitting epg attack (you can already do too with your build) during the last part of ISA. This alone can add over a third of the DPS you are capable of doing otherwaise. It gives a bit of false impression towards your DPS performance over the entire duration of this map but can make you easily look better if anybody throws a log at you and it is still *your* DPS in the end.
As for logs it would help immensely if you just get one yourself. Not to be able to gloat over others someday but rather to get a better picture as to what is really going on from match to match and what could be done to improve.
Whatever you do now, just do me one favor please. Don’t listen to players that
- make you think that the game is broken hindering to do well in it or play fair, or
- only seem to chime in here once in a while to spit on your progress.
I cannot express in words how glad I am that the leaders of the DPS community I choose to play in the past few years don’t do either and have always limited their input towards my improvement. Playing with them now fills me with more pride than my DPS numbers ever would.
Sorry for the long text but I don’t want you to burry your head in the sand. You managed Bronze DPS in a run where every odds were stacked against you. Under better conditions your build can pull Silver DPS easily and given further improvement both in gear and piloting you can do the same Gold DPS I pull with it. At such a point even Diamond is possible via appropriate team play similar to what Tune did for his friend.
You don’t need to get there for me but never doubt yourself over this please!
Thanks for the words of encouragement, but honest - just feel like I hit a brick wall.
All the advice I put into practice, all the build-tweaks - feels like it was all for nought at this point.
Anyway - I guess it did expose one fatal flaw in my Rhode Island's build. Her speed is apalling. Will post in the thread I made seeking advice (on the 'Academy' forum) regarding this though.
Thing is though, it really wasn't anything to do with your flying or build that led to that single experience.
It's like you could have entered a car race and have been in the best car you could afford and still get beaten by a guy turning up in an F1 car. That's just how these things go sometimes. Now the errot there is not with you, it's with the race itself, those two different "classes" of player/racer should never really be going against each other in the same race.
Just the same with STO. The issue is not so much with the mechanics being broken as it is to do with there not really being a way to separate the top 1% from the rest of the pack. Eventually you will end up with matches where someone like @tunebreaker comes along to "steal" the match from everyone else. It's not his intention to do so, he after all is stuck with the same end-game random TFO system we all are. So what's he to do? Sit and not play? Only run endless HSE matches as he's too good to be allowed anywhere else?
I know when i go into a mission with him I'm going to be pretty far down the ladder as his ability is way above mine. But i don't let it ruin my run. I try my best and if i fail then i'll just try again. Unless Tune was bragging in chat afterwards about how he stole my DPS or how much i sucked then i'd have no real issue with the run.
[...]
The effort that needs to be put into this game will keep on getting higher and higher. You can count on that and play accordingly, or let it be.
My fear is that more and more people choose the latter option. Which would be a pity, as I like to play STO. But bad game design I fear will destroy the financial base for the game's existence eventually.
Oh I agree though I feel that most of the damage has already been done. Players that don’t manage either because they feel teamed PvE is too hard or too easy will give that content a wide berth. They will either enjoy the rest of what this game offers or leave.
In my almost 7 years into STO I have lost countless in game friends from both extremes. I found it prudent to avoid either via my social in game network (fleets, league and friends).
I cross my fingers that SRS will be able to do the same for you because I know that the developers of this title wont.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I've said it many times, in many missions these days the real fight is not with the enemy so much as against your teammates to see who gets the lion's share of the HP's to kill.
Well, just had the (mis?)fortunte of being in an ISA instance with @tunebreaker
Was over before it started.
Not overly bothered - but does highlight the primary setback of playing a torpedo boat. Get a player like Tunebreaker on the map and everything is dead before the torpedoes even hit anything.
I'm not going to go all negative here, but chasing around after someone who basically solos the map and all but one-shots everything is a bit TRIBBLE.
Fwiw, the parse looked like this...
SCM - Infected [LR] (S) - [02:26] DMG(DPS) - @sf911: 23.98M(167.96K) @tunebreaker: 10.02M(69.19K) @[pug1]: 3.89M(35.41K) @reyan01: 1.75M(12.87K) @[pug2]: 318.03K(3.81K)
I tanked for my friend Florian, and while I am capable of outputting similar numbers myself (especially when Florian tanks for me), I'm not so sure I solely accept the blame in that particular case.
Also, fwiw^2, you can very well do 100k+ in a fast ISA with a torp boat.
No, I really can't. Your combatlog just proved that my DPS is a JOKE and, contrary to what @peterconnorfirst said, I've actually accomplished nothing.
Well, just had the (mis?)fortunte of being in an ISA instance with @tunebreaker
Was over before it started.
Not overly bothered - but does highlight the primary setback of playing a torpedo boat. Get a player like Tunebreaker on the map and everything is dead before the torpedoes even hit anything.
I'm not going to go all negative here, but chasing around after someone who basically solos the map and all but one-shots everything is a bit rubbish
Well, just had the (mis?)fortunte of being in an ISA instance with @tunebreaker
Was over before it started.
Not overly bothered - but does highlight the primary setback of playing a torpedo boat. Get a player like Tunebreaker on the map and everything is dead before the torpedoes even hit anything.
I'm not going to go all negative here, but chasing around after someone who basically solos the map and all but one-shots everything is a bit TRIBBLE.
Fwiw, the parse looked like this...
SCM - Infected [LR] (S) - [02:26] DMG(DPS) - @sf911: 23.98M(167.96K) @tunebreaker: 10.02M(69.19K) @[pug1]: 3.89M(35.41K) @reyan01: 1.75M(12.87K) @[pug2]: 318.03K(3.81K)
I tanked for my friend Florian, and while I am capable of outputting similar numbers myself (especially when Florian tanks for me), I'm not so sure I solely accept the blame in that particular case.
Also, fwiw^2, you can very well do 100k+ in a fast ISA with a torp boat.
No, I really can't. Your combatlog just proved that my DPS is a JOKE and, contrary to what @peterconnorfirst said, I've actually accomplished nothing.
Well, just had the (mis?)fortunte of being in an ISA instance with @tunebreaker
Was over before it started.
Not overly bothered - but does highlight the primary setback of playing a torpedo boat. Get a player like Tunebreaker on the map and everything is dead before the torpedoes even hit anything.
I'm not going to go all negative here, but chasing around after someone who basically solos the map and all but one-shots everything is a bit rubbish
You think?
This is precisely the balance issue I am always talking about. "But naw, soph, it's okay, because it requires skill!"
Maybe, but that doesn't change the fact that it's not a good game experience for everyone on the team.
Disclaimer: I blame the game, not the players. Just saying that so that nobody gets all foamy around the mouth.
Forced to agree. In fact I've lost motivation to bother running anything else after being reduced to little more than a spectator in that instance.
I’m very sorry that one of your first ISA ventures with your recently adjusted build lead to results far below your expectations.
What happened? You were caught by surprise, nothing more. ISA has a creeping low DPS ceiling compared to the dmg potential players/teams can bring quickly reaching a point where you and your build can’t unleash its full dmg potential no matter how good or bad you manage to play.
Experienced players know that and when they have reached a point where they don’t cut it in channels runs often feel compelled to display and test their abilities in public matches where they have a higher chance to get their share of the small DPS cake that ISA is nowadays.
With my exotic build on a sci I average around 100-150k after playing with it for a few days because my league experience has me better prepared for fast matches. This is of course under the consideration that nothing goes terribly wrong (dying, missing out critical target groups with the slow attacks I have) or terribly right (setting up the stage to my advantage over my team) where I can easily loose a 100k or even gain it.
Even this 50k discrepancy on an average is much higher than it is with my beam and especially cannon boats because EPG and torpedos are just slow and the map composition is stacked against me compared to other maps we have. I either run into weaker players still supplying me with valuable buffs without taking targets away from me or I run into stronger ones which use the high DMG spikes cannon builds can pull to melt large amounts of HP I’d could usually reach with my slow working attacks.
All that applies to me in this game applies to you as well. That’s the good part. In short you can look at my build and see what more expensive items and traits I was able to gather to help me up those slow attacks a bit.
Additionally you can look at a video I linked in your thread which discretely shows how epg/torp builds can be set into motion in fast runs. Lots of stuff can be learned there, especially a high hitting epg attack (you can already do too with your build) during the last part of ISA. This alone can add over a third of the DPS you are capable of doing otherwaise. It gives a bit of false impression towards your DPS performance over the entire duration of this map but can make you easily look better if anybody throws a log at you and it is still *your* DPS in the end.
As for logs it would help immensely if you just get one yourself. Not to be able to gloat over others someday but rather to get a better picture as to what is really going on from match to match and what could be done to improve.
Whatever you do now, just do me one favor please. Don’t listen to players that
- make you think that the game is broken hindering to do well in it or play fair, or
- only seem to chime in here once in a while to spit on your progress.
I cannot express in words how glad I am that the leaders of the DPS community I choose to play in the past few years don’t do either and have always limited their input towards my improvement. Playing with them now fills me with more pride than my DPS numbers ever would.
Sorry for the long text but I don’t want you to burry your head in the sand. You managed Bronze DPS in a run where every odds were stacked against you. Under better conditions your build can pull Silver DPS easily and given further improvement both in gear and piloting you can do the same Gold DPS I pull with it. At such a point even Diamond is possible via appropriate team play similar to what Tune did for his friend.
You don’t need to get there for me but never doubt yourself over this please!
Thanks for the words of encouragement, but honest - just feel like I hit a brick wall.
All the advice I put into practice, all the build-tweaks - feels like it was all for nought at this point.
Anyway - I guess it did expose one fatal flaw in my Rhode Island's build. Her speed is apalling. Will post in the thread I made seeking advice (on the 'Academy' forum) regarding this though.
Thing is though, it really wasn't anything to do with your flying or build that led to that single experience.
It's like you could have entered a car race and have been in the best car you could afford and still get beaten by a guy turning up in an F1 car. That's just how these things go sometimes. Now the errot there is not with you, it's with the race itself, those two different "classes" of player/racer should never really be going against each other in the same race.
Just the same with STO. The issue is not so much with the mechanics being broken as it is to do with there not really being a way to separate the top 1% from the rest of the pack. Eventually you will end up with matches where someone like @tunebreaker comes along to "steal" the match from everyone else. It's not his intention to do so, he after all is stuck with the same end-game random TFO system we all are. So what's he to do? Sit and not play? Only run endless HSE matches as he's too good to be allowed anywhere else?
I know when i go into a mission with him I'm going to be pretty far down the ladder as his ability is way above mine. But i don't let it ruin my run. I try my best and if i fail then i'll just try again. Unless Tune was bragging in chat afterwards about how he stole my DPS or how much i sucked then i'd have no real issue with the run.
Nah, he was fine about it. I guess I just hate being a spectator.
I'll be honest - what didn't help was that I teamed with a friend and brought said friend into the match (@[pug1]: 3.89M(35.4) ))as we'd been talking about builds and I was telling said friend how useful a powerful GWIII can be. I chose ISA as the nanite spheres lend themselves well to proving what a strong GWIII can do.
But I didn't get to demonstrate ANY of that; GWIII = completely useless when everything is dead.
and was out-DPS'ed by said friend as well.
So yeah, am sulking a little and will get over it. But it was still embarassing, on BOTH counts.
I've said it many times, in many missions these days the real fight is not with the enemy so much as against your teammates to see who gets the lion's share of the HP's to kill.
This. And sadly I was left WAY behind.
GW and other means of crowd control can have three purposes in PvE and you can always decide for which one of them to go for (for example in isa).
1) tend to game sided criticals as in mission objectives (weak team: nanite spheres are in danger to move in to regenerators)
2) support others (teamed run: spheres use EPtE, round them up for the others to go for the kill faster)
3) you’r own DPS (competitive run: funnel as much exotics in the GW as you can and do so well ahead of the team)
While you master 1) already and feel annoyed by 2) learn from the video I mentioned in your thread to work on 3). It’s not as if you could not ruin other’s DPS nubers when you catch them by surprise in a public match as well.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
[...]
So yeah, am sulking a little and will get over it. But it was still embarassing, on BOTH counts.
It should not embarass you at all. It should embarass the systems devs, because preventing such stuff is basically their job.
Unless they have been given different goals by their managers. Then it would be the managers who should feel embarassed.
Well they also have metrics to read and quotas to meet. In any case for those who play the game they offered the option to slot 15 new and completely free reputation traits yesterday, each of them 25% more effective than the previous ones. Speaks volumes on how they feel.
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Cryptic makes easy puzzles when players can solve it doing only one thing.
What can be done to fix this, though? How do you make content where DPS is not the only answer?
You know, and still be about fighting and battles?
you have that with counterpoint as example. shooting the infinite respawn there is just the dumbest thing you could do, its about transporting teams, closing rifts and shoot terok nor below 50%. but every time if i get this mission during random tfos 2-3 people are normaly just shooting the infinite respawn and not doing anything for the mission
[[...]
Yea! Okay, they also have metrics to read and quotas to meet. In any case for those who play the game they offered the option to slot 15 new and completely free reputation traits yesterday, each of them 25% more effective than the previous ones. Speaks volumes on how they feel.
I am not quite sure they understand the implications, really.
I felt the same in PvP for a long time but given how the game even evolved in teamed PvE the past 4 years I arrived at the conclusion that they simply care less about you than they care about me as I learned to make do with what I got in game.
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Then what is your suggestion for a good mission that does this, excluding the Foundry?
Excluding Foundry, I don't know, nor do I care that much about solo-and-solo-only-without-any-outside-influences-at-all DPS to do any research on that.
Including Foundry, Borg Infestation by spencerb96 is an excellent map, but again, I actually run it pretty rarely (even at times when we do have access to foundry).
After having looked at it, one question really burns in me... I hope you feel like answering it.
How in the four quadrants of the Milky Way galaxy did you get your effective Critical Hit Chance up to 46.55%? Or rather, for your attack abilties, to 53.98%?
My build is in my forum signature, RRW Ri Maajon.
But tl;dr version - tacrom master race, combined with favourable RNG.
Gruber's already said everything I could hope to say about HSE, and he's said it better, so thanks man. I do want to clarify on the following point, though:
Did one run yesterday with a build that usually does 30k, on a team from SRS. We lacked the DPS to complete the first optional, so it failed, though only by one Tactical Cube or so. (I did 26k or so because I died a few times, and was last, so it was in part my fault. But I think I found a few things to improve in the build afterwards, increasing both CritH and survivability at the same time.)
Let me be absolutely clear here: playing this game isn't about assigning fault. And if I've given you the impression that I'm trying to dismiss your opinion based on your DPS numbers, then that wasn't, and will never be, my intention. I don't DPS shame; it would be a silly thing to do anyway. We all started somewhere.
I'm glad you got some experience in HSE. I would be interested to see how the whole team's performance panned out in that run, whether you had a tank, etc. There's no shame in failing HSE; my entire point this whole time is that it's a very difficult queue.
WRT the power imbalance among ship builds, someone nailed it earlier: this is a problem in all Cryptic games. Recently I've been messing around in Neverwinter again, and if anything the problem (if you want to call it that) seems worse over there: not only is there a huge divide between the best geared players and new 70s, but there are a series of daily bonuses encouraging the highest geared players to run leveling queues. In other words, you could be level 12, running the only level-appropriate dungeon instance, and there'll be someone from the top of the end game grind one-shotting everyone. That's one of the ways they get their version of Dil every day.
I don't disagree with you that it can be frustrating to have top-end players roflstomping easy queues, but that isn't necessarily a fault in the game's progression. We can all complain about power creep, but the game needs progression to give players purpose. So whether you think the performance gap should be 200% or 1000%, it has to be fairly big. The developers aren't going to nerf the progression significantly, unless, as Peter said, it's so they can start the cycle again, a la Season 13.
There are no incentives to run elite content. We run it for fun, and/or to test builds. Usually we reset the queue before even taking the rewards, so we can run it again immediately - but almost no one's pugging HSE, because the difficulty is absurdly disproportionate to the rewards. Instead, when we're not with a good team of buddies, we run things like ISA. And yeah, that can frustrate the newer or less experienced players - but it can also give them something to strive towards.
[...]
So yeah, am sulking a little and will get over it. But it was still embarassing, on BOTH counts.
It should not embarass you at all. It should embarass the systems devs, because preventing such stuff is basically their job.
No, it's not. In any competitive activity, almost everyone is going to find other people much better than themselves. And most people are going to find a whole lot of others better than themselves. It's inevitable. By definition, 50% of people must be below-average. The only solutions are to either get better or to stop being so competitive about it.
What you're suggesting is basically like demanding that the rules of ice hockey be changed to allow little kids to compete with NHL stars. Which is obviously impossible.
STO's problem with this is not the inevitable existence of differently skilled and equipped players. But the encouraging, by whatever means, of all people of different skill to play the same content in the same instances. Essentially, inviting NHL stars into little kids' games in the first place (and, via the poorly-designed AFK penalty, punishing the bottom end of the performance scale for a mismatch that wasn't any of their fault).
1) There's little actual in-game incentive to push your build harder, to achieve those big numbers, or fast times on missions. Outside of earning more resources to buy more powercreep what do ou gain from having a big DPS score, or completing Korfez or even HSE? Nothing. You don't gain a special title, or a nice shield cosmetic, or a unique boff for pushing yourself.
STO consists of dungeons with no prizes at the end, so no wonder people don't feel the need to really push themselves.
2) Everyone (top 1% and newbies alike) get dumped into the exact same content and instances. There's no real place for most players to run TFO's these days with dead channels and lack of good players to run and help in missions. So everyone is lumped into the Adv TFO's using the random system. That's like putting go-carts on the same track as F1 cars and expecting everyone to be in the same situation.
Comments
That has as much substance as if you’d say elite maps are broken because they can’t be beaten by a bunch of weak players wanting to have fun.
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Rayan can at any given time have an engaging gameplay experience on all maps we have where his team mates don’t force him in a competitive PvE situation.
If he ends up in one his challenge in difficulty is moved away from the map opposition to outdoing to capabilities of the others in his team.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
It is the way things are. Deal with it or keep on crying for help from the Devs to change it. Odds are that they will at some point but they won’t do it for you but rather just to start the cycle power creep all over again.
They want you to be enthusiastic about the game if you want to have a good time in it; either when it comes to beating difficult content or if you try to compete with others in easy content.
The effort that needs to be put into this game will keep on getting higher and higher. You can count on that and play accordingly, or let it be.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Don't beat yourself up so much.
Thing is though, it really wasn't anything to do with your flying or build that led to that single experience.
It's like you could have entered a car race and have been in the best car you could afford and still get beaten by a guy turning up in an F1 car. That's just how these things go sometimes. Now the errot there is not with you, it's with the race itself, those two different "classes" of player/racer should never really be going against each other in the same race.
Just the same with STO. The issue is not so much with the mechanics being broken as it is to do with there not really being a way to separate the top 1% from the rest of the pack. Eventually you will end up with matches where someone like @tunebreaker comes along to "steal" the match from everyone else. It's not his intention to do so, he after all is stuck with the same end-game random TFO system we all are. So what's he to do? Sit and not play? Only run endless HSE matches as he's too good to be allowed anywhere else?
I know when i go into a mission with him I'm going to be pretty far down the ladder as his ability is way above mine. But i don't let it ruin my run. I try my best and if i fail then i'll just try again. Unless Tune was bragging in chat afterwards about how he stole my DPS or how much i sucked then i'd have no real issue with the run.
Oh I agree though I feel that most of the damage has already been done. Players that don’t manage either because they feel teamed PvE is too hard or too easy will give that content a wide berth. They will either enjoy the rest of what this game offers or leave.
In my almost 7 years into STO I have lost countless in game friends from both extremes. I found it prudent to avoid either via my social in game network (fleets, league and friends).
I cross my fingers that SRS will be able to do the same for you because I know that the developers of this title wont.
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GW and other means of crowd control can have three purposes in PvE and you can always decide for which one of them to go for (for example in isa).
1) tend to game sided criticals as in mission objectives (weak team: nanite spheres are in danger to move in to regenerators)
2) support others (teamed run: spheres use EPtE, round them up for the others to go for the kill faster)
3) you’r own DPS (competitive run: funnel as much exotics in the GW as you can and do so well ahead of the team)
While you master 1) already and feel annoyed by 2) learn from the video I mentioned in your thread to work on 3). It’s not as if you could not ruin other’s DPS nubers when you catch them by surprise in a public match as well.
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Well they also have metrics to read and quotas to meet. In any case for those who play the game they offered the option to slot 15 new and completely free reputation traits yesterday, each of them 25% more effective than the previous ones. Speaks volumes on how they feel.
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you have that with counterpoint as example. shooting the infinite respawn there is just the dumbest thing you could do, its about transporting teams, closing rifts and shoot terok nor below 50%. but every time if i get this mission during random tfos 2-3 people are normaly just shooting the infinite respawn and not doing anything for the mission
ingame: @Felisean
I felt the same in PvP for a long time but given how the game even evolved in teamed PvE the past 4 years I arrived at the conclusion that they simply care less about you than they care about me as I learned to make do with what I got in game.
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Excluding Foundry, I don't know, nor do I care that much about solo-and-solo-only-without-any-outside-influences-at-all DPS to do any research on that.
Including Foundry, Borg Infestation by spencerb96 is an excellent map, but again, I actually run it pretty rarely (even at times when we do have access to foundry).
U.S.S. Buteo Regalis - Brigid Multi-Mission Surveillance Explorer build
R.R.W. Ri Maajon - Khopesh Tactical Dreadnought Warbird build
My Youtube channel containing STO videos.
My build is in my forum signature, RRW Ri Maajon.
But tl;dr version - tacrom master race, combined with favourable RNG.
U.S.S. Buteo Regalis - Brigid Multi-Mission Surveillance Explorer build
R.R.W. Ri Maajon - Khopesh Tactical Dreadnought Warbird build
My Youtube channel containing STO videos.
Let me be absolutely clear here: playing this game isn't about assigning fault. And if I've given you the impression that I'm trying to dismiss your opinion based on your DPS numbers, then that wasn't, and will never be, my intention. I don't DPS shame; it would be a silly thing to do anyway. We all started somewhere.
I'm glad you got some experience in HSE. I would be interested to see how the whole team's performance panned out in that run, whether you had a tank, etc. There's no shame in failing HSE; my entire point this whole time is that it's a very difficult queue.
WRT the power imbalance among ship builds, someone nailed it earlier: this is a problem in all Cryptic games. Recently I've been messing around in Neverwinter again, and if anything the problem (if you want to call it that) seems worse over there: not only is there a huge divide between the best geared players and new 70s, but there are a series of daily bonuses encouraging the highest geared players to run leveling queues. In other words, you could be level 12, running the only level-appropriate dungeon instance, and there'll be someone from the top of the end game grind one-shotting everyone. That's one of the ways they get their version of Dil every day.
I don't disagree with you that it can be frustrating to have top-end players roflstomping easy queues, but that isn't necessarily a fault in the game's progression. We can all complain about power creep, but the game needs progression to give players purpose. So whether you think the performance gap should be 200% or 1000%, it has to be fairly big. The developers aren't going to nerf the progression significantly, unless, as Peter said, it's so they can start the cycle again, a la Season 13.
There are no incentives to run elite content. We run it for fun, and/or to test builds. Usually we reset the queue before even taking the rewards, so we can run it again immediately - but almost no one's pugging HSE, because the difficulty is absurdly disproportionate to the rewards. Instead, when we're not with a good team of buddies, we run things like ISA. And yeah, that can frustrate the newer or less experienced players - but it can also give them something to strive towards.
STO Builds Wiki
U.S.S. Pale Horse, a Jem'Hadar Warship build
Rough comparison of different damage types on high-end cannon builds
What you're suggesting is basically like demanding that the rules of ice hockey be changed to allow little kids to compete with NHL stars. Which is obviously impossible.
STO's problem with this is not the inevitable existence of differently skilled and equipped players. But the encouraging, by whatever means, of all people of different skill to play the same content in the same instances. Essentially, inviting NHL stars into little kids' games in the first place (and, via the poorly-designed AFK penalty, punishing the bottom end of the performance scale for a mismatch that wasn't any of their fault).
1) There's little actual in-game incentive to push your build harder, to achieve those big numbers, or fast times on missions. Outside of earning more resources to buy more powercreep what do ou gain from having a big DPS score, or completing Korfez or even HSE? Nothing. You don't gain a special title, or a nice shield cosmetic, or a unique boff for pushing yourself.
STO consists of dungeons with no prizes at the end, so no wonder people don't feel the need to really push themselves.
2) Everyone (top 1% and newbies alike) get dumped into the exact same content and instances. There's no real place for most players to run TFO's these days with dead channels and lack of good players to run and help in missions. So everyone is lumped into the Adv TFO's using the random system. That's like putting go-carts on the same track as F1 cars and expecting everyone to be in the same situation.
In cooperative mode, the goal is for the team to win, without need to measure who's got the biggest number. Or be embarassed for the lack of same.