Friendly fire makes no sense in STO
1. Most direct attacks, and likewise a great number of attacks via powers, all target one ship. There would be no way to accidentally hit a friendly ship during such attack.
2. When it comes to AOE based attacks, given that we are all part of the Alliance, and we all, in canon, have access to these wide varieties of powers, it would be odd if our allied ships couldn't negate most of our AOE powers, so long as we tell them what frequency or w/e we are using for the attack, all of which would be handled instantly via ship to ship computer requests.
It makes more sense with the use of computers. Those can be screwed with in so many ways. especially targeting ones. Like it was Sensor Scramble, your computer can't identify a friendly target from enemy target. the computers can be TRIBBLE, or hit with a virus, thus the targeting coordinates and such can be changed to target a friendly as a enemy.
If anything, this makes more sense for STO, than grav well or tykin's rift does, or any of the other space magic abilities.
It makes more sense with the use of computers. Those can be screwed with in so many ways. especially targeting ones. Like it was Sensor Scramble, your computer can't identify a friendly target from enemy target. the computers can be ****, or hit with a virus, thus the targeting coordinates and such can be changed to target a friendly as a enemy.
If anything, this makes more sense for STO, than grav well or tykin's rift does, or any of the other space magic abilities.
We already have skills like scramble sensors to account for that though, so the game is playing as it would.
Also, creating an artificial gravity well or tykin's rift shouldn't b e that difficult for Trek science.
i get that. But, the next time you're playing. Count the number of times an NPC actually uses any of those abilities. They aren't used often by the NPCs. Where as this kind of ability should actually be one of the main staples for them.
Especially in the RA's and STF's where this kind of thing would be considered normal. Where as right now, running on to any enemy in space that has these abilities ranks is a very rare occurrence.
Would love this more then enough idiots who I would love to friendly fire.
And this is exactly why we don't have it.
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid." - Q
Would love this more then enough idiots who I would love to friendly fire.
And this is exactly why we don't have it.
True, the NPC's are given certain abilities per species. Then the rest are drawn at random from the basic abilities. So Scramble Sensors is really the only one they can get here.
I'm not saying that these should be a standard hard coded ability for the NPCs. But it definitely should be one of the more common ones that we see. Since the basic list of abilities comes from what you can buy from the Boff trainer. I wouldn't mind seeing this opened up to include some of the lock box abilities.
This is just enabling the NPCs to use the same abilities and items, including consoles, that the players can use.
OK, let's curtail the name calling and inflammatory statements. I don't want to shut down a discussion, because it got out of hand again.
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I can see how it might be nice to see friendly fire implemented, since it would make players use more tactical thought to using some abilities, but also to address damage that might come from such sources players could need to restructure their builds to take into account for any new sources of damage. Though i am not sure this is the only method that could be used to implement such a fact into the game, as you could see a similar change in mentality via adding other non-damage objectives, mechanics, as well as shifting away from a swamp enemy style to a more small group or singular enemy style of combat that makes single target abilties better.
No thanks, my 500 EPG ship would wipe out my entire team. A game that uses this much AoE is not suitable for friendly fire imo.
But that's part of the point. If you make AOE effects dangerous to you and your team, you will be less inclined to use them. That in turn will make content harder, as you have to pick off the foes one at a time, using AOE only when you get a chance to.
It only makes combat harder by basically telling everyone they should never use those powers ever. No one is going to play the game more tactically because of it, they are just simply going to stop using them altogether.
At which point, the devs will just remove the powers, and readjust enemy HP in response, resulting in the game being exactly the way it is now, just with less stuff you can do.
No, it doesn't make combat harder.
No, it won't cause those abilities to be less used, or removed.
Cryptic is likely to adjust the HP of the NPC's just for the TRIBBLE and giggles of it.
All this would mean is, check your target before using. If you can't handle something as simple as looking to see what you're targeting. Then, I really don't know what to say here.
You want friendly fire... heheh... just try using Call Emergency Artillery III in Command Spec - say if it's not actually hitting you it sure seems like it is even if it isn't.
Friendly fire used to be in STO and it was a dark time. There was a good reason why it was removed from game and I do not see it getting re added after last time.
I think it's clear in the post that I'm referring to different niche groups. Trennan's list doesn't exactly reflect the same player niches that I would, but he's correct in his interpretation of my post. In 2013/2014 we saw a much wider variety of types of players frequenting STO. There was a robust ground and space PVP community, niche build/DPS types (still some around but very much reduced), and more what I suppose Trennan refers to as "hardcore" player groups. There were even subniches centered around the No Win Scenario queue alone.
"STO is a CASUAL MMO..." -- Ok, got it. That doesn't mean the Devs can't initiate an optional hardcore mode, on/off toggles for Friendly Fire, or just restrict Elite queues to players who can "unlock" them through certain conditions (levels of DPS, number of successful advanced runs, etc).
Note above I specifically mentioned optional settings, on/off toggles, so there is no reason for the Lollipop Guild to get bent out of shape. If they're not on board, they can continue to run their normal queues and pretend to be good players in their own circles.
There must be more difficult endgame options for those who request -- and have been requesting -- them for years.
Thank you Nabreeki. So there are more groups in groups.. hmm. you seem a bit more plugged into this community than i could of guessed which is nice to know. I will have to be a bit more careful making sure to take your points of view a bit more carefully than before.
Would also like to point out that a certain Community Manager, Branflakes, did host player PvP matches. While PvP was never placed on a pedestal, it was still cultivated via the participation of PWE staff. Those ended when Branflakes temp banned several players who blew him up during those matches, but at one time they were big events.
Brandon was good with the community like Trendy, i wonder if we will see others like them? not to belittle the efforts of Kael and Smirk previously, but an engaging community is a healthy community. it helps with PvP as well.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Unfortunately, this would become, for the persistent Party Ball (aka 'Memorial Sphere') crowd, the in-game equivalent of said Subspace Party Amplifiers.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Since the majority of players in this game can't seem to get their DPS above 2,500 or so, how exactly would Blue on Blue (Or Red on Red for that matter) add to the game? PUGing STFs might become a little more interesting, though. lol
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
Although it might have already been suggested, (I might have lost it somewhere amongst all this), if, and it's a big if, enough players want friendly fire available, why not just add a new version of STFs. Besides having normal, advanced and elite STFs, just add an FF version of each. Players who want the challenge of friendly fire can que the FF version, those that don't can que for the current ones.
The reason I said "if enough players..." is that I am sure it would take the Devs a bit more work then just changing a 0 to a 1 in a single line of code and I don't want the Devs spending time (IOW money) on something that will never pay for itself.
Adding it as an extra option for those who are interested could be a good idea. It might also help in terms of data-collection so that they can figure out whether it's popular enough and, if so, if it makes sense to implement it completely.
With rare exceptions space magic powers have always been able to be countered just as soon as the current space magic wizard on the ship figured out how it was generated to begin with. In keeping with that, for any space magic being generated by an ally, the counter would already be well known by all allies. Even ignoring the examples set in the various series, unless the ship generating the space magic is also affected by it, then there obviously is a counter to it, and again, all allied ships would either already know, or be given, the counter (by any Captain with a shred of common sense).
Adding it as an extra option for those who are interested could be a good idea. It might also help in terms of data-collection so that they can figure out whether it's popular enough and, if so, if it makes sense to implement it completely.
Well, sure. As an option in private queue if the players want to engage in such things, it's ok. But not in public queue.
Friendly fire makes no sense in STO
1. Most direct attacks, and likewise a great number of attacks via powers, all target one ship. There would be no way to accidentally hit a friendly ship during such attack.
2. When it comes to AOE based attacks, given that we are all part of the Alliance, and we all, in canon, have access to these wide varieties of powers, it would be odd if our allied ships couldn't negate most of our AOE powers, so long as we tell them what frequency or w/e we are using for the attack, all of which would be handled instantly via ship to ship computer requests.
The OP's request was not to make EVERYTHING FF. So things like CSV and BFAW would still have FoF targeting as it does now. That said, to say that you can technobabble a way to not get affected by a grav well because a friendly made it makes very little sense and it would be more logical if these things did do FF. That said, it is still a terrible idea because griefers and this game has no GM to deal with them.
But of course you can. There are bunch of abilities that make you immune to pull/repel, even if cast by an enemy. It may not be realistic, but the whole thing is an entirely fantastic construct to begin with. And they just made it even more fantastic when it was nerfed to magically pick only 5 enemies to pull instead of all in range, and whatever else they did to it.
Although it might have already been suggested, (I might have lost it somewhere amongst all this), if, and it's a big if, enough players want friendly fire available, why not just add a new version of STFs. Besides having normal, advanced and elite STFs, just add an FF version of each. Players who want the challenge of friendly fire can que the FF version, those that don't can que for the current ones.
The reason I said "if enough players..." is that I am sure it would take the Devs a bit more work then just changing a 0 to a 1 in a single line of code and I don't want the Devs spending time (IOW money) on something that will never pay for itself.
It shouldn't take that much coding as friendly fire is already in the game its just turned off after all the major problems it caused due to player abuse last time it was on.
Comments
It makes more sense with the use of computers. Those can be screwed with in so many ways. especially targeting ones. Like it was Sensor Scramble, your computer can't identify a friendly target from enemy target. the computers can be TRIBBLE, or hit with a virus, thus the targeting coordinates and such can be changed to target a friendly as a enemy.
If anything, this makes more sense for STO, than grav well or tykin's rift does, or any of the other space magic abilities.
i get that. But, the next time you're playing. Count the number of times an NPC actually uses any of those abilities. They aren't used often by the NPCs. Where as this kind of ability should actually be one of the main staples for them.
Especially in the RA's and STF's where this kind of thing would be considered normal. Where as right now, running on to any enemy in space that has these abilities ranks is a very rare occurrence.
And this is exactly why we don't have it.
True, the NPC's are given certain abilities per species. Then the rest are drawn at random from the basic abilities. So Scramble Sensors is really the only one they can get here.
I'm not saying that these should be a standard hard coded ability for the NPCs. But it definitely should be one of the more common ones that we see. Since the basic list of abilities comes from what you can buy from the Boff trainer. I wouldn't mind seeing this opened up to include some of the lock box abilities.
This is just enabling the NPCs to use the same abilities and items, including consoles, that the players can use.
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No, it doesn't make combat harder.
No, it won't cause those abilities to be less used, or removed.
Cryptic is likely to adjust the HP of the NPC's just for the TRIBBLE and giggles of it.
All this would mean is, check your target before using. If you can't handle something as simple as looking to see what you're targeting. Then, I really don't know what to say here.
Edit:
Spelling error. Forum don't eat my post.
Only for a few aoe skills like Timeline Collapse, Gravity well, tyken's rift, photonic shockwave and tractor beam repulsors (non-doffed).
And groundwise just for Paradox Bomb, hyperonic radiation and Graviton spike.
The whole point is to make realistic assumed decisions when you throw skills of aoe cc.
And upon 5 friendly fire attempts, banned to join queues for 1h.
Upon 5 bans of 1h on a character, you cannot join queues for an entire day.
After than, on your toon you get kicked on each 2nd friendly fire attempt, with the kick resulting in afk kick (therefore 2h of non-joining penalty).
Thank you Nabreeki. So there are more groups in groups.. hmm. you seem a bit more plugged into this community than i could of guessed which is nice to know. I will have to be a bit more careful making sure to take your points of view a bit more carefully than before.
Brandon was good with the community like Trendy, i wonder if we will see others like them? not to belittle the efforts of Kael and Smirk previously, but an engaging community is a healthy community. it helps with PvP as well.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
The reason I said "if enough players..." is that I am sure it would take the Devs a bit more work then just changing a 0 to a 1 in a single line of code and I don't want the Devs spending time (IOW money) on something that will never pay for itself.
But of course you can. There are bunch of abilities that make you immune to pull/repel, even if cast by an enemy. It may not be realistic, but the whole thing is an entirely fantastic construct to begin with. And they just made it even more fantastic when it was nerfed to magically pick only 5 enemies to pull instead of all in range, and whatever else they did to it.