How many people does it take to keep a secret? Two. Neither is talking and one of them is dead.
Also remember, this is the game company which cannot find bugs without outside assistance, which cannot repair bugs they do find, which managed to completely TRIBBLE off the One Captain Who Binds Us All, which created the 17x Fiasco and then punished players who had done nothing wrong, which has a Lead Dev who once referred to players as 'spoiled 14 year olds', which...
...I can credit PWE/Cryptic with a lot of things. Them being smart enough to successfully manipulate the Zen-Dilithium Exchange without getting caught out or breaking it beyond repair doesn't make the cut.
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
Read my second post. I always buy Dilithium, with one exception. I did buy a bit at the end of the the last Phoenix when the price was 275. My hope was to buy Dilithium when it went back to 430-something. It never went back up more than 300 or so. So, my one experiment was a bit of a flop.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
They manage it when needed. if they need to boost sales, they turn on some events to drive it.
What I just did with this post is strip the colorful language. Everything about hands, masters, casinos is emotional fluff. Here is the meat of your information content. "If Crytpic notices the market is out of whack, they do an event to bring things back into line." This is like adjusting interest rates at the Federal Reserve or Bank of Japan but with supply-demand dynamics still operating directly on the rate (which in our case helps optimize exchange activity with player interest at the expense of variability which key interest rates [IRL] can't afford.)
I don't expect people to actually understand what I just said but the point is to show how well this case fits in with normal economics. I won't say it's normal business since that word is so broadly entrenched in the popular consciousness that anyone can make anything they want of it. The Dilithium/Zen exchange is a free-market system managed by a central authority, analogous to a central bank in world finance. Cryptic influences it but only towards promoting as much activity as possible. If we (buyer/sellers alike) use it, they profit. If we don't use it, they don't profit. So they adjust things and we use the system as much as possible (under all constraints and competing interests.) The relationship is mutually beneficial in almost an ideal case of how economics should work. It doesn't need a constant dialog (ie. Cryptic explaining at length why certain events are happening when), it just needs to work and everyone makes out (as optimally as they can.)
That's it. Colorful language isn't necessary to explain what's going on.
@ltminns you know there are also ppsl from EU and asia playing the game?
for EU its evening aka prime playtime
Really? I thought the EU was something they invented for Top Gear.
Actually it was created by the BBC for a set of Monty Python skits. Where the BBC came from is an even greater mystery though...
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
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Personally, I suspect it's just supply and demand, but if Cryptic were to put a "hidden hand" in, it certainly would be to lower the zen-Dil ratrio. The more Dil you can get for a Zen, the less Zen folks wqho pay real money need to buy. Financiually, it is in Cryptics interest to have as low a Dil cost to Zen as the market will bear, to 'encourage' an increase in Zen purchases.
Cryptic doesn't really need to hide anything.
They release somethnig awesme you need Zen for? The demand for Zen will rise, people will get more Dilithium for their Zen.
They release something awesome you need Dilithium for? The demand for dilithium will rise, people will get more Zen for their Dilithium.
The challenge for them at some point might have been identifiyng what the "awesome thing" would be. The Phoenix Box seemed to have more of an effect than the Fleet holdings lately. (It might be different if the Fleet Holdings were still needed to unlock fleet ships, but maybe not.)
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
What I just did with this post is strip the colorful language. Everything about hands, masters, casinos is emotional fluff.
Actually, you added way more.
*Sigh*
You didn't even bothered to read the snipped part. Here's the kicker you might want to review again,
Emotional
Do you really want to throw that word at plonkingly dull economics lecture? Kind of a "nya uh!" moment for you there. My point is that you're working from a charged perspective which takes a grain of truth and sends it careening through a filter of self-affirming truisms. Casinos, mysterious hands, none if it's actually demonstrable or even an appropriate analogy but boy does it sound good to an emotional audience.
I gave you the compliment to that. No fluff, just elaboration on the mechanics of the dilithium/zen economy with real-world examples to describe how things actually are (as best as we can work out). Macro-economics is a complex thing but neither is it fluff or emotional. It involves a lot of words but you are on a forum. There's going to be words. Try approaching them earnestly.
Apologies if this sounds snarky, it's more a "take it or leave it" point for the previous post.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Yeeah... It is abundantly clear that you got emotional as soon as you read my post, and are continuing your crusade to refute it.
Your use language, tone, & the arguments you typed against my analogy was fraught with emotion & rife with the "transgressions" you were accusing me of.
Whatever.
It is a distinction without a difference. You see the Federal Reserve, and I see Vegas. I really don't understand why that bothers you so much. I could not care less if you want to hold an economic workshop, just have at it & if you cite a post of mine leave the negativity out of it, please!
So, are you accusing Cryptic of intentionally de-valuing Zen?
Just curious why you think they would do that? What would they gain from making the game easier on those that don't spend money?
When these events are on, there is a frenzy of interest and activity. A four day "2 for 1" sale on zen is what is happening right now (dropped for 400 to 200, more or less) during which time STO's metrics will skyrocket. They aren't losing anything by having a sale. Retailers do it all the time, and people flock to the store.
Edit: It actually might compel those who are most likely to be buyers of zen to get some more & stock up on refined dil.
Edit: It actually might compel those who are most likely to be buyers of zen to get some more & stock up on refined dil.
Unless you actually meant stock up on dil and then buy zen, I doubt it. A low dil/zen ratio has the complete opposite effect; if you want to buy zen and exchange it for dil you want the ratio to be high. In fact, I was of a mind to buy a bit more zen and exchange it for dil to buy some more phoenix boxes, that is until I saw where the exchange was.
Zen itself is not on sale. It's cheaper if you buy it with dil, but that doesn't earn the company any money. Only people buying zen with real currency does and people who talk about zen being devalued would do well to remember that. The only way this can affect profits is from people trading dil for zen (which is more attractive now when the ratio is low) who would normally have bought it directly.
Edit: It actually might compel those who are most likely to be buyers of zen to get some more & stock up on refined dil.
Unless you actually meant stock up on dil and then buy zen, I doubt it. A low dil/zen ratio has the complete opposite effect; if you want to buy zen and exchange it for dil you want the ratio to be high. In fact, I was of a mind to buy a bit more zen and exchange it for dil to buy some more phoenix boxes, that is until I saw where the exchange was.
But if people in general want to buy Zen and exchange it for dil, the rate will go down.
The market isn't about what you want, it's about what everyone else wants. And clearly, during phoenix events everyone wants dil.
Unless you actually meant stock up on dil and then buy zen, I doubt it.
Actually, I said it the way I meant it. People with more money (to buy zen; the "likely buyers" I mentioned) than time (with which to earn to earn loads of dil). The "half price sale" is only occurring for those who get their zen from the dil exchange. For the others, it's not so much.
I forget who's post I read, but they seemed quite happy to be hoarding dil even though they had to load more zen. Like a zen oligarch letting peasents sweat it out grinding. LOL.
Since I am currently still trying to get everthing epic on one particular ship, I am buying boxes like mad for the upgrade. Otherwise, I'd be hoarding zen...peasant that I am.
Comments
How many people does it take to keep a secret? Two. Neither is talking and one of them is dead.
Also remember, this is the game company which cannot find bugs without outside assistance, which cannot repair bugs they do find, which managed to completely TRIBBLE off the One Captain Who Binds Us All, which created the 17x Fiasco and then punished players who had done nothing wrong, which has a Lead Dev who once referred to players as 'spoiled 14 year olds', which...
...I can credit PWE/Cryptic with a lot of things. Them being smart enough to successfully manipulate the Zen-Dilithium Exchange without getting caught out or breaking it beyond repair doesn't make the cut.
Really? I thought the EU was something they invented for Top Gear.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Would be so much better for me to have a dilithium exchange at 25
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
What I just did with this post is strip the colorful language. Everything about hands, masters, casinos is emotional fluff. Here is the meat of your information content. "If Crytpic notices the market is out of whack, they do an event to bring things back into line." This is like adjusting interest rates at the Federal Reserve or Bank of Japan but with supply-demand dynamics still operating directly on the rate (which in our case helps optimize exchange activity with player interest at the expense of variability which key interest rates [IRL] can't afford.)
I don't expect people to actually understand what I just said but the point is to show how well this case fits in with normal economics. I won't say it's normal business since that word is so broadly entrenched in the popular consciousness that anyone can make anything they want of it. The Dilithium/Zen exchange is a free-market system managed by a central authority, analogous to a central bank in world finance. Cryptic influences it but only towards promoting as much activity as possible. If we (buyer/sellers alike) use it, they profit. If we don't use it, they don't profit. So they adjust things and we use the system as much as possible (under all constraints and competing interests.) The relationship is mutually beneficial in almost an ideal case of how economics should work. It doesn't need a constant dialog (ie. Cryptic explaining at length why certain events are happening when), it just needs to work and everyone makes out (as optimally as they can.)
That's it. Colorful language isn't necessary to explain what's going on.
Actually it was created by the BBC for a set of Monty Python skits. Where the BBC came from is an even greater mystery though...
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Cryptic doesn't really need to hide anything.
They release somethnig awesme you need Zen for? The demand for Zen will rise, people will get more Dilithium for their Zen.
They release something awesome you need Dilithium for? The demand for dilithium will rise, people will get more Zen for their Dilithium.
The challenge for them at some point might have been identifiyng what the "awesome thing" would be. The Phoenix Box seemed to have more of an effect than the Fleet holdings lately. (It might be different if the Fleet Holdings were still needed to unlock fleet ships, but maybe not.)
Actually, you added way more.
Then why did you use so many of these words yourself to try and make your point? There must be 5 times as many...
"The HOUSE always WINS."
*Sigh*
You didn't even bothered to read the snipped part. Here's the kicker you might want to review again,
Do you really want to throw that word at plonkingly dull economics lecture? Kind of a "nya uh!" moment for you there. My point is that you're working from a charged perspective which takes a grain of truth and sends it careening through a filter of self-affirming truisms. Casinos, mysterious hands, none if it's actually demonstrable or even an appropriate analogy but boy does it sound good to an emotional audience.
I gave you the compliment to that. No fluff, just elaboration on the mechanics of the dilithium/zen economy with real-world examples to describe how things actually are (as best as we can work out). Macro-economics is a complex thing but neither is it fluff or emotional. It involves a lot of words but you are on a forum. There's going to be words. Try approaching them earnestly.
Apologies if this sounds snarky, it's more a "take it or leave it" point for the previous post.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Your use language, tone, & the arguments you typed against my analogy was fraught with emotion & rife with the "transgressions" you were accusing me of.
Whatever.
It is a distinction without a difference. You see the Federal Reserve, and I see Vegas. I really don't understand why that bothers you so much. I could not care less if you want to hold an economic workshop, just have at it & if you cite a post of mine leave the negativity out of it, please!
When these events are on, there is a frenzy of interest and activity. A four day "2 for 1" sale on zen is what is happening right now (dropped for 400 to 200, more or less) during which time STO's metrics will skyrocket. They aren't losing anything by having a sale. Retailers do it all the time, and people flock to the store.
Edit: It actually might compel those who are most likely to be buyers of zen to get some more & stock up on refined dil.
Zen itself is not on sale. It's cheaper if you buy it with dil, but that doesn't earn the company any money. Only people buying zen with real currency does and people who talk about zen being devalued would do well to remember that. The only way this can affect profits is from people trading dil for zen (which is more attractive now when the ratio is low) who would normally have bought it directly.
The market isn't about what you want, it's about what everyone else wants. And clearly, during phoenix events everyone wants dil.
I agree. I'm arguing against those people who think a low dil/ratio is nothing but a good thing; for whales it's anything but.
Actually, I said it the way I meant it. People with more money (to buy zen; the "likely buyers" I mentioned) than time (with which to earn to earn loads of dil). The "half price sale" is only occurring for those who get their zen from the dil exchange. For the others, it's not so much.
I forget who's post I read, but they seemed quite happy to be hoarding dil even though they had to load more zen. Like a zen oligarch letting peasents sweat it out grinding. LOL.
Since I am currently still trying to get everthing epic on one particular ship, I am buying boxes like mad for the upgrade. Otherwise, I'd be hoarding zen...peasant that I am.