Nope, Windows is Subpar due to easily hackers, worms, virus, and other bad stuff to ruin your day. This was the reason why I went to Mac. I don't need any protection, hadn't ran any since the early 2000s.
Don't forget that famous OS Windows came out with. So bad that the customers was "upgrading" to older software cause it was more reliable.
Only use every second windows OS released, that's how microsoft seem to operate...
I also haven't been running antivirals and such for the past 5 years or so, on windows. No problems here because I know what not to touch to get hit by such things. Mac is hardly immune to these things either, its just windows is more wide spread so most script-kiddies and amature hackers work on windows rather than mac where they have a smaller target base.
ok so i got the wineskin wrapper working. Anyone know other than placing the display into fullscreen how to move the minimised game window away from where it currently sits
{That bootcamp showing is from my old 2009 iMac hard drive i saved and Windows doesn't work when trying to launch it wants to reinstall when attempted}
[*] We will be canceling and refunding any active recurring subscriptions purchased between October 1, 2015 and today, including Lifetime Subscriptions. If a payment was made other than a credit card or Paypal, the value of the subscription will be reimbursed to your Arc Account Balance.
[*] We will be reimbursing any Zen that was purchased through Arc or Steam between October 1, 2015 and today to your Arc Account Balance.
[*] We will be reimbursing the value of any Packs purchased through Arc or Steam between October 1, 2015 and today to your Arc Account Balance.
[/list]
[/list]
(bolded the important bits)
Silly Question.
This Arc Account Balance you mentioned, would this mean the refunded Zen would be usable with your other games?
You know, the ones that are windows only?, which oddly enough, with this announcement, is now all of them.
Also, why is this News buried in your twitter feed?
I only found it because I was looking for why I couldn't use the Zen-store after buying some Zen to get keys with.
Yeah, I'm really not sure what good having an Arc Account Balance does me as a Mac user.
if I cant use my Boot Camp to continue it will be a true waste of money.
I don't imagine that will be a problem. Boot Camp isn't really an acceptable solution for me, since I switch between the game and other applications on my Mac frequently, especially if I'm crafting. So in my case, if the $100 worth of Zen I purchased a month ago with the intent of some long-term use can't be refunded to my credit card, I'm going to be irked. Because there's literally nothing else I can do with it.
It is fortunate that there are ways on mac and linux to "emulate" windows environments (Virtualbox, Wine, etc.), so this is not a total loss.
Plus I am hoping that with this, the windows client will get extra attention from now, which may result in longer patch notes and an even smoother experience in the future.
Wishing the best of luck!
"Ad astra audacter eamus in alis fidelium."
-
"To boldly go to the stars on the wings of the faithful."
What I don't understand is why the refund on their stuff? When you should log on a different computer in the future or through another way once they find it. Either Bootcamp or Wine. Shouldn't their stuff should be there already? If not, then this worries me as later once I buy a new computer. What about my stuff, will it all be gone?
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
What I don't understand is why the refund on their stuff? When you should log on a different computer in the future or through another way once they find it. Either Bootcamp or Wine. Shouldn't their stuff should be there already? If not, then this worries me as later once I buy a new computer. What about my stuff, will it all be gone?
Thats a good question. Thats needs clarifying. I would be very annoyed if my 5 year account with the 18 toons are kitted out in nice mk xiv epic to very gear. all have a nice dil fund of between 500k-800k were suddenly gone if i logged in via a PC or Wine.
I also say that it is not important to refund my LTS if it came to the acc being closed, as i've had it 4 or more years and have had more than enough use and joy out of it for Cryptic to justify refunding my money.
What I don't understand is why the refund on their stuff? When you should log on a different computer in the future or through another way once they find it. Either Bootcamp or Wine. Shouldn't their stuff should be there already? If not, then this worries me as later once I buy a new computer. What about my stuff, will it all be gone?
Thats a good question. Thats needs clarifying. I would be very annoyed if my 5 year account with the 18 toons are kitted out in nice mk xiv epic to very gear. all have a nice dil fund of between 500k-800k were suddenly gone if i logged in via a PC or Wine.
Yes this needs to be answered. To me this is very troublesome. My computer is old, so I'm looking forward to a new one once I get the funds. I will be highly upset if all my stuff will be gone, just cause I upgraded to a new computer. They will automatically loose a customer real quick. So why bother playing all over again?
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
What I don't understand is why the refund on their stuff? When you should log on a different computer in the future or through another way once they find it. Either Bootcamp or Wine. Shouldn't their stuff should be there already? If not, then this worries me as later once I buy a new computer. What about my stuff, will it all be gone?
Thats a good question. Thats needs clarifying. I would be very annoyed if my 5 year account with the 18 toons are kitted out in nice mk xiv epic to very gear. all have a nice dil fund of between 500k-800k were suddenly gone if i logged in via a PC or Wine.
Yes this needs to be answered. To me this is very troublesome. My computer is old, so I'm looking forward to a new one once I get the funds. I will be highly upset if all my stuff will be gone, just cause I upgraded to a new computer. They will automatically loose a customer real quick. So why bother playing all over again?
Why would you think accessing an existing account on a new computer would do anything to your characters etc ? I've used this account on three different systems over the years, remember the account data is all server side. I'd think the refund is so that players who do not want to/are unable to set up a Windows system to play won't lose too much money, although they've likely had to set some sort of cutoff point.
What I don't understand is why the refund on their stuff? When you should log on a different computer in the future or through another way once they find it. Either Bootcamp or Wine. Shouldn't their stuff should be there already? If not, then this worries me as later once I buy a new computer. What about my stuff, will it all be gone?
Thats a good question. Thats needs clarifying. I would be very annoyed if my 5 year account with the 18 toons are kitted out in nice mk xiv epic to very gear. all have a nice dil fund of between 500k-800k were suddenly gone if i logged in via a PC or Wine.
Yes this needs to be answered. To me this is very troublesome. My computer is old, so I'm looking forward to a new one once I get the funds. I will be highly upset if all my stuff will be gone, just cause I upgraded to a new computer. They will automatically loose a customer real quick. So why bother playing all over again?
Why would you think accessing an existing account on a new computer would do anything to your characters etc ? I've used this account on three different systems over the years, remember the account data is all server side. I'd think the refund is so that players who do not want to/are unable to set up a Windows system to play won't lose too much money, although they've likely had to set some sort of cutoff point.
Ok, thanks that helps out. Most games save your data so you can come back. Glad you had experience getting newer computers and keeping your stuff. Its been a good long time since I got a new computer.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
How simple is it to download Wine and use it to run STO? Like, do we just download the binary package from the Wine website? Do we have to download both the development and staging branches? And then we just download the STO launcher?
I would definitely second the notion that it would be tremendously helpful to have a tutorial guide for those of us who've never dabbled with this kind of thing (and never thought we'd have to).
After only 4 months, 19 weeks, 134 days, it's here. It's real! U.S.S. Tempest
> @ironcaniac said: > How simple is it to download Wine and use it to run STO? Like, do we just download the binary package from the Wine website? Do we have to download both the development and staging branches? And then we just download the STO launcher? > > I would definitely second the notion that it would be tremendously helpful to have a tutorial guide for those of us who've never dabbled with this kind of thing (and never thought we'd have to).
I followed the link in the first post, doesn't tell you which one of several versions to use, doesn't tell you it needs another program to open either.
My friend tried it, ended up using a trial version of Crossover. You'll have to download the game all over again. Though to be honest why use windows on a Mac? It's like buying a bloody Ferrari, switching the engine out for a ford diesel to save on fuel bills. You'd be better off buying a ford car and saving hundreds of thousands. As for getting a PC, forget it. Once microsoft decided to get people to bug-test for them by selling unfinished software they lost all my business. It shouldn't take 5 years of patches to get a OS to the state they claimed it was when they sold it.
We've talked it over and decided that once we've got the anniversary ship we're gone.
Having to use a third party program that will cost £38 a year to use just to be able to use the Zen-store makes no sense to us. My friend had been eyeing the T6 galaxy, was going to get the T6 cruiser pack, 6000zen (so £40) he also regularly gets enough Zen to buy 2x key packs too (so another £16 a month, more then a subscription costs).
There was so much that cryptic could have done with this game.
There was so much that cryptic could have done with this game.
. . . if there were more paying OS X client users. PWE likes money. PWE giving back money and not letting you give them money with the OS X client should tell you that the OS X client users were losing them money.
There was so much that cryptic could have done with this game.
. . . if there were more paying OS X client users. PWE likes money. PWE giving back money and not letting you give them money with the OS X client should tell you that the OS X client users were losing them money.
To be clear, we are still unclear as to the nature of these "refunds." If they are simply refunding Zen to an Arc account, but there are no Mac games to play (let alone, an Arc client)... the refunds are worthless, in that case. This may not be as awesome as you portray.
There was so much that cryptic could have done with this game.
. . . if there were more paying OS X client users. PWE likes money. PWE giving back money and not letting you give them money with the OS X client should tell you that the OS X client users were losing them money.
It tells me that they are taking the easy way out by quitting.
Your claiming that its because Mac users aren't buying enough is daft, they're losing more money by cutting out a chunk of their player base.
Its like having a flock of 100x gold egg laying geese, you kill and eat say 10 of them, then the rest either stop laying altogether or lay so rarely (and the eggs are so tiny they make quail eggs look like a house). Then you start complaining about not having as much gold.
Also they are not refunding money, they're refunding Zen.
There was so much that cryptic could have done with this game.
. . . if there were more paying OS X client users. PWE likes money. PWE giving back money and not letting you give them money with the OS X client should tell you that the OS X client users were losing them money.
It tells me that they are taking the easy way out by quitting.
Your claiming that its because Mac users aren't buying enough is daft, they're losing more money by cutting out a chunk of their player base.
Its like having a flock of 100x gold egg laying geese, you kill and eat say 10 of them, then the rest either stop laying altogether or lay so rarely (and the eggs are so tiny they make quail eggs look like a house). Then you start complaining about not having as much gold.
Also they are not refunding money, they're refunding Zen.
Nope. You're ignoring the development costs for the Mac client.
- There are 92 geese, and it costs $1,000 a month to feed them.
- There are 6 other geese, and it costs $1,000 a month to feed just those 6 iGeese.
Each one provides $100 worth of eggs each month. The farmer makes $8,200 profit on the 92, but loses $400 a month on the iGeese.
So killing and eating the iGeese lets the farmer keep $400 extra per month.
I am confused... , as Mac user I sometime use wine to play on STO? Does this mean I can still use wine if I want to keep playing STO? I'm also confused about the reimbursement? I have bought a few things on the c store last month or so.. Does this mean I will get this back? Even if keep logging in via wine or similar?
I have to say I'm very sad for this to happen. I am a active player for years .. I still want to play this game .. but I only have a Mac ..
Can i also say what poor timing this announcement and decision is. I mean we are half way through celebrating the 6th year Anniversary launch and release of Star Trek Online and you decide to announce during this event, you are no longer going to be supporting the Mac Client and portion of your customer base.
Could you imagine the PR damage this was would do if this game had larger media exposure.
I don't think it would of hurt to get this event out of the way 1st and then say mid march or end of march make this announcement
There was so much that cryptic could have done with this game.
. . . if there were more paying OS X client users. PWE likes money. PWE giving back money and not letting you give them money with the OS X client should tell you that the OS X client users were losing them money.
To be clear, we are still unclear as to the nature of these "refunds." If they are simply refunding Zen to an Arc account, but there are no Mac games to play (let alone, an Arc client)... the refunds are worthless, in that case. This may not be as awesome as you portray.
It's not all that unclear.
Subscription Money: Refunded to Credit Card or Paypal if used, otherwise it's in your Arc Account balance.
Zen Purchases: Refund to your Arc Account Balance.
And if you're unhappy with that, you will need to contact customer support and see if there is some way to accomondate you better. (And if those results are still unsatisfying, you might need to resort to legal options, with unknown outcomes.)
We wanted to come back to follow up on where we currently are with the Mac version of Star Trek Online. As some of you are aware, we had issues in the recent past that affected our players from launching the client and playing Star Trek Online. We were able to work with our partners to bring the game back up and deliver all the previously available promotions that were unattainable by those players.
Following these issues, we looked at our Mac support overall and determined that we cannot promise to deliver an experience on Mac that meets our expectations of quality. After heavy consideration, we have decided to end support for the Mac version of Star Trek Online on February 5th. No other version of Star Trek Online is impacted.
Here are some important notes as we shut down Mac support:
The Mac client will be unavailable for download starting on February 5th.
Anyone with an existing Mac client will be able to play, but the game will become permanently unavailable via our mac client by Spring of this year.
We will be shutting off C-Store for all Mac users to prevent players from continuing to make purchases before it permanently shuts down.
We will be processing reimbursements and refunds over the next few weeks.
We will be canceling and refunding any active recurring subscriptions purchased between October 1, 2015 and today, including Lifetime Subscriptions. If a payment was made other than a credit card or Paypal, the value of the subscription will be reimbursed to your Arc Account Balance.
We will be reimbursing any Zen that was purchased through Arc or Steam between October 1, 2015 and today to your Arc Account Balance.
We will be reimbursing the value of any Packs purchased through Arc or Steam between October 1, 2015 and today to your Arc Account Balance.
For those looking ton continue to play our game after we shut down the Mac client, we would recommend using any of the popular programs to simulate a windows environment on your Mac, including the free software Wine.
We appreciate all the Mac Captains who have flown through the galaxy with us since 2014.
Perfect World Entertainment
If you have any questions regarding your accounts or subscriptions, please contact our support team through https://support.arcgames.com/
Cancelling your subscription, by the way, does not mean cancelling the account. Your characters will be left untouched. (Might be interesting to see how this works for C-Store ships you purchased since October 1st. The will likely stay in your possession, but normally you can reclaim these ships - will that still work?)
What's unclear to me is how they determine whether you're a Mac user who is eglible for a refund?
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
I think purchases made via Z-Store that transfer you to the ARC website identify what machine you are using. I know when i login to my ARC account here and its forgotten i'm using an authorised machine the ARC defender sends a auth code to me and seems to know i'm on a mac. Or at least know i'm using * Application: Macintosh, Safari
There was so much that cryptic could have done with this game.
. . . if there were more paying OS X client users. PWE likes money. PWE giving back money and not letting you give them money with the OS X client should tell you that the OS X client users were losing them money.
It tells me that they are taking the easy way out by quitting.
Your claiming that its because Mac users aren't buying enough is daft, they're losing more money by cutting out a chunk of their player base.
Its like having a flock of 100x gold egg laying geese, you kill and eat say 10 of them, then the rest either stop laying altogether or lay so rarely (and the eggs are so tiny they make quail eggs look like a house). Then you start complaining about not having as much gold.
Also they are not refunding money, they're refunding Zen.
Nope. You're ignoring the development costs for the Mac client.
- There are 92 geese, and it costs $1,000 a month to feed them.
- There are 6 other geese, and it costs $1,000 a month to feed just those 6 iGeese.
Each one provides $100 worth of eggs each month. The farmer makes $8,200 profit on the 92, but loses $400 a month on the iGeese.
So killing and eating the iGeese lets the farmer keep $400 extra per month.
I gets the golden goose was a little too clumsy of me.
Point I was trying to make is when you stop doing stuff it becomes a slippery slope.
Example?
How about the fact that the only faction specific content anymore is ships.
How long do you think it'll be before they turn round and say 'it costs too much to make RR and KDF ships so we're stopping'. Soon followed by removing the ability to make KDF characters and removing the KDF option for RR characters, then they lock the Zen-store for all KDF and KDF aligned RR characters too.
Do you know what happens with a locked Zen-store?
No ships, not even ones you've already got and unlocked for your account, same applies to all other account unlocks and promotions too..
So the only things you can get is the stuff that isn't character or account bound which is = Keys, Ship Upgrades, Fleet Ship Modules, Duty Officer packs, R&D packs, Bridge Officers etc.
Comments
Only use every second windows OS released, that's how microsoft seem to operate...
I also haven't been running antivirals and such for the past 5 years or so, on windows. No problems here because I know what not to touch to get hit by such things. Mac is hardly immune to these things either, its just windows is more wide spread so most script-kiddies and amature hackers work on windows rather than mac where they have a smaller target base.
{That bootcamp showing is from my old 2009 iMac hard drive i saved and Windows doesn't work when trying to launch it wants to reinstall when attempted}
https://i.imgur.com/pN7Pmay.png
Silly Question.
This Arc Account Balance you mentioned, would this mean the refunded Zen would be usable with your other games?
You know, the ones that are windows only?, which oddly enough, with this announcement, is now all of them.
Also, why is this News buried in your twitter feed?
I only found it because I was looking for why I couldn't use the Zen-store after buying some Zen to get keys with.
BootCamp with Windows as the boot = just like any other Windows PC = you can keep playing. Or native OS X + WINE to run the Windows client.
It's only the native OS X client that is going away this spring. They are not adding some new way to stop Mac hardware from being allowed.
I don't imagine that will be a problem. Boot Camp isn't really an acceptable solution for me, since I switch between the game and other applications on my Mac frequently, especially if I'm crafting. So in my case, if the $100 worth of Zen I purchased a month ago with the intent of some long-term use can't be refunded to my credit card, I'm going to be irked. Because there's literally nothing else I can do with it.
It is fortunate that there are ways on mac and linux to "emulate" windows environments (Virtualbox, Wine, etc.), so this is not a total loss.
Plus I am hoping that with this, the windows client will get extra attention from now, which may result in longer patch notes and an even smoother experience in the future.
Wishing the best of luck!
-
"To boldly go to the stars on the wings of the faithful."
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
Thats a good question. Thats needs clarifying. I would be very annoyed if my 5 year account with the 18 toons are kitted out in nice mk xiv epic to very gear. all have a nice dil fund of between 500k-800k were suddenly gone if i logged in via a PC or Wine.
I also say that it is not important to refund my LTS if it came to the acc being closed, as i've had it 4 or more years and have had more than enough use and joy out of it for Cryptic to justify refunding my money.
Yes this needs to be answered. To me this is very troublesome. My computer is old, so I'm looking forward to a new one once I get the funds. I will be highly upset if all my stuff will be gone, just cause I upgraded to a new computer. They will automatically loose a customer real quick. So why bother playing all over again?
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
Why would you think accessing an existing account on a new computer would do anything to your characters etc ? I've used this account on three different systems over the years, remember the account data is all server side. I'd think the refund is so that players who do not want to/are unable to set up a Windows system to play won't lose too much money, although they've likely had to set some sort of cutoff point.
Ok, thanks that helps out. Most games save your data so you can come back. Glad you had experience getting newer computers and keeping your stuff. Its been a good long time since I got a new computer.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
I would definitely second the notion that it would be tremendously helpful to have a tutorial guide for those of us who've never dabbled with this kind of thing (and never thought we'd have to).
U.S.S. Tempest
> How simple is it to download Wine and use it to run STO? Like, do we just download the binary package from the Wine website? Do we have to download both the development and staging branches? And then we just download the STO launcher?
>
> I would definitely second the notion that it would be tremendously helpful to have a tutorial guide for those of us who've never dabbled with this kind of thing (and never thought we'd have to).
I followed the link in the first post, doesn't tell you which one of several versions to use, doesn't tell you it needs another program to open either.
My friend tried it, ended up using a trial version of Crossover. You'll have to download the game all over again.
Though to be honest why use windows on a Mac? It's like buying a bloody Ferrari, switching the engine out for a ford diesel to save on fuel bills. You'd be better off buying a ford car and saving hundreds of thousands.
As for getting a PC, forget it. Once microsoft decided to get people to bug-test for them by selling unfinished software they lost all my business. It shouldn't take 5 years of patches to get a OS to the state they claimed it was when they sold it.
We've talked it over and decided that once we've got the anniversary ship we're gone.
Having to use a third party program that will cost £38 a year to use just to be able to use the Zen-store makes no sense to us. My friend had been eyeing the T6 galaxy, was going to get the T6 cruiser pack, 6000zen (so £40) he also regularly gets enough Zen to buy 2x key packs too (so another £16 a month, more then a subscription costs).
There was so much that cryptic could have done with this game.
. . . if there were more paying OS X client users. PWE likes money. PWE giving back money and not letting you give them money with the OS X client should tell you that the OS X client users were losing them money.
To be clear, we are still unclear as to the nature of these "refunds." If they are simply refunding Zen to an Arc account, but there are no Mac games to play (let alone, an Arc client)... the refunds are worthless, in that case. This may not be as awesome as you portray.
It tells me that they are taking the easy way out by quitting.
Your claiming that its because Mac users aren't buying enough is daft, they're losing more money by cutting out a chunk of their player base.
Its like having a flock of 100x gold egg laying geese, you kill and eat say 10 of them, then the rest either stop laying altogether or lay so rarely (and the eggs are so tiny they make quail eggs look like a house). Then you start complaining about not having as much gold.
Also they are not refunding money, they're refunding Zen.
Nope. You're ignoring the development costs for the Mac client.
- There are 92 geese, and it costs $1,000 a month to feed them.
- There are 6 other geese, and it costs $1,000 a month to feed just those 6 iGeese.
Each one provides $100 worth of eggs each month. The farmer makes $8,200 profit on the 92, but loses $400 a month on the iGeese.
So killing and eating the iGeese lets the farmer keep $400 extra per month.
I'm also confused about the reimbursement? I have bought a few things on the c store last month or so.. Does this mean I will get this back? Even if keep logging in via wine or similar?
I have to say I'm very sad for this to happen. I am a active player for years .. I still want to play this game ..
Could you imagine the PR damage this was would do if this game had larger media exposure.
I don't think it would of hurt to get this event out of the way 1st and then say mid march or end of march make this announcement
It's not all that unclear.
Subscription Money: Refunded to Credit Card or Paypal if used, otherwise it's in your Arc Account balance.
Zen Purchases: Refund to your Arc Account Balance.
And if you're unhappy with that, you will need to contact customer support and see if there is some way to accomondate you better. (And if those results are still unsatisfying, you might need to resort to legal options, with unknown outcomes.)
Emphasis Mine:
Cancelling your subscription, by the way, does not mean cancelling the account. Your characters will be left untouched. (Might be interesting to see how this works for C-Store ships you purchased since October 1st. The will likely stay in your possession, but normally you can reclaim these ships - will that still work?)
What's unclear to me is how they determine whether you're a Mac user who is eglible for a refund?
Vice Admiral Volmack ISS Thundermole
Brigadier General Jokag IKS Gorkan
Centurion Kares RRW Tomalak
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I gets the golden goose was a little too clumsy of me.
Point I was trying to make is when you stop doing stuff it becomes a slippery slope.
Example?
How about the fact that the only faction specific content anymore is ships.
How long do you think it'll be before they turn round and say 'it costs too much to make RR and KDF ships so we're stopping'. Soon followed by removing the ability to make KDF characters and removing the KDF option for RR characters, then they lock the Zen-store for all KDF and KDF aligned RR characters too.
Do you know what happens with a locked Zen-store?
No ships, not even ones you've already got and unlocked for your account, same applies to all other account unlocks and promotions too..
So the only things you can get is the stuff that isn't character or account bound which is = Keys, Ship Upgrades, Fleet Ship Modules, Duty Officer packs, R&D packs, Bridge Officers etc.