I think the ship is beautiful the way it is. I still don't see, in any way how this looks like the old Jupiter either. Well done Cryptic. I give you +10 for this ship. It does what it's supposed to be. As a player of 5 yrs+ in this game, it's finally a Federation Carrier. It's still slightly worse than the Kar'Fi, which is by far the best carrier in the game, but the trait makes up for that!
"You don't want to patrol!? You don't want to escort!? You don't want to defend the Federation's Starbases!? Then why are you flying my Starships!? If you were a Klingon you'd be killed on the spot, but lucky for you.....you WERE in Starfleet. Let's see how New Zealand Penal Colony suits you." Adm A. Necheyev.
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Complaining about the fact that a ship with eight other versions that were done, costs the same amount as other ships which all come with variant parts to customize the ship with is understandable. More often then not a ship of this cost will have at least one additional part set associated with it, and for the price they put it up as warrant a little annoyance or feeling of being ripped off. I highly doubt it would have been that much more work to make one of two more set's of parts from the other designs, that would have interested the parties that preferred thee other designs to purchase the ship thus increasing the profitability of the ship as a whole.
Actually from the way things were worded during the voting process the other ships were NOT fully done. During round one just a basic model, round two a little more refined, and round three even more refined. If they had it all done, why did they have to wait for the art team to actually finish modeling the winner before releasing it?
That depends on if you mean a full mock-up or mere concept designs, which is more what i meant is that they had many concept art designs drawn up by a few images that shows a general idea of how the ships might look. To me for the money i would have thought it would have been a good idea to just model some of those losing ship's parts to add more customization options as the process went on, even if it was just from the second stage on that is a lot of refined concept art that could have been further put forth to add more appeal to the player-base. That is the fact though you have this large carrier costing 3k zen having just one set of parts, when an equal or even some less costly ships can have two or three sets of parts on purchase (an some not even because of previous designs from lower tiers) feels rushed an even a let down (with eight ships in concept an then four that were refined i would have thought some of the parts of the refined ones could have been used as additional part variations). Though i also just think it is a over-sight on the part of the devs to create a ship that could have appealed to more players by giving them parts from the losing ships, thinking more of a mix-bag of random parts from the four finalists, which could have at least use these to model the winning in a more appealing design for themselves via these parts.
And I agree, they should have just modeled the top 3-4 winners and released it all as one, and called it the Omega class. I do not think they should have named it the Jupiter, that just reinforces the idea that the whole thing was rigged and the Jup wannabe was pre-picked.
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Complaining about the fact that a ship with eight other versions that were done, costs the same amount as other ships which all come with variant parts to customize the ship with is understandable. More often then not a ship of this cost will have at least one additional part set associated with it, and for the price they put it up as warrant a little annoyance or feeling of being ripped off. I highly doubt it would have been that much more work to make one of two more set's of parts from the other designs, that would have interested the parties that preferred thee other designs to purchase the ship thus increasing the profitability of the ship as a whole.
Actually from the way things were worded during the voting process the other ships were NOT fully done. During round one just a basic model, round two a little more refined, and round three even more refined. If they had it all done, why did they have to wait for the art team to actually finish modeling the winner before releasing it?
That depends on if you mean a full mock-up or mere concept designs, which is more what i meant is that they had many concept art designs drawn up by a few images that shows a general idea of how the ships might look. To me for the money i would have thought it would have been a good idea to just model some of those losing ship's parts to add more customization options as the process went on, even if it was just from the second stage on that is a lot of refined concept art that could have been further put forth to add more appeal to the player-base. That is the fact though you have this large carrier costing 3k zen having just one set of parts, when an equal or even some less costly ships can have two or three sets of parts on purchase (an some not even because of previous designs from lower tiers) feels rushed an even a let down (with eight ships in concept an then four that were refined i would have thought some of the parts of the refined ones could have been used as additional part variations). Though i also just think it is a over-sight on the part of the devs to create a ship that could have appealed to more players by giving them parts from the losing ships, thinking more of a mix-bag of random parts from the four finalists, which could have at least use these to model the winning in a more appealing design for themselves via these parts.
And I agree, they should have just modeled the top 3-4 winners and released it all as one, and called it the Omega class. I do not think they should have named it the Jupiter, that just reinforces the idea that the whole thing was rigged and the Jup wannabe was pre-picked.
I can agree yet with how similar at least spiritually the ship is to the Jupiter class, being in many ways a evolution of the design an how the later designs of ships went with the more stream-lined as well as elongated profile, as such i can understand how it would actually make sense to name it the Jupiter class (most of all that many have wanted the ship for along while would appeal to that group more.). I could have seen it that each would have taken names from the ship classes they are designed after, and so the Omega would most likely have still been named the Jupiter class. Though i would say they should have just called the omega the Jupiter in "" design during the competition, even though it was pretty clear it had taken alot of inspiration from the Jupiter itself.
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Storytime !
Customer: I want a burger !
Underpaid person: Here is your burger, it is three days old and a cat slept on it. Enjoy !
Customer: Thank you. I wanted to complain about the mold and the cat hair, but you know what ? I ordered a burger, I got one. No reason for me to complain....
That comparison doesn't make any sense. The Jupiter is everything that was advertised in the stats. Nothing less. Nowhere was it mentioned that there would be multiple customisation options. Indeed, one might argue that it was reasonable to expect NO customisation options since the entire design was subject to input from the playerbase.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
No we got a skin that was voted on...
When we this whole designed by the community thing started.. I thought they were going to let us vote on every aspect... such as:
It was rushed out the door for the Black Friday Sale and before they had to start getting out the Stats for the Winter Ship.
Yeah, I had some expectation that there would be more than the Appearance for Community input.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Storytime !
Customer: I want a burger !
Underpaid person: Here is your burger, it is three days old and a cat slept on it. Enjoy !
Customer: Thank you. I wanted to complain about the mold and the cat hair, but you know what ? I ordered a burger, I got one. No reason for me to complain....
That comparison doesn't make any sense. The Jupiter is everything that was advertised in the stats. Nothing less. Nowhere was it mentioned that there would be multiple customisation options. Indeed, one might argue that it was reasonable to expect NO customisation options since the entire design was subject to input from the playerbase.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
This is true there was implied fact of there being, or not being for that matter, customization options in the cards for the ship design contest. Though i can see where people would hope an even see that putting some flexibility into the design via using concept art from other models to make some variation parts would make sense.
Also if you look at the above picture it shows they had alot of possible design choices that could fit into the omega design as variant parts to be used for customization without feeling too different. Like for me the Sixth ship design's rear pylons/nacelles/mission pod would have been a great variant part to use without taking much away from the whole design. Even though these are rough designs an not completely done, man-hours went into them so what not use some of it to get some use out of it.
I don't know why you bring up lock box ships.. they are not CASH ships.. let me explain.. they are RNG rewards.. you gamble.. you some times win, promo ships are free.. so there not even in the same category as zen ship
Zen ships are paid for directly by cash.. no other way to get them.. and are a direct buy... and normally have some from of customization either there looks or like the odyssey different boff layouts...
Lock box ships aren't cash ships? Funny, the game would probably be dead if that were true.
.
Reading comprehension took a nose dive...
No they are not cash ships.. you can not in any way what so ever directly buy a lock box ship.
Lockbox ships are a gambling reward... there is a difference..
One is like going to a car dealer ship.. where you pick out and buy the car you want.. up till now those cars had different options in styles and features.
The other is you go to Vegas.. there is a Car reward for a grand prize at the slot machines.. you play the slots that have many different rewards for a chance to win that one style/type car.
So what? What does it matter whether you buy a lobi or lockbox ship directly with Zen or indirectly? They both cost Zen, and Cryptic gets Zen from both types of ships, in the end. Which means, in the end, that cash, and generally a lot more cash, is needed to buy and earned from them.
You are focussing on irrelevant details while implying that, because the Jupiter costs 3000 zen, it's reasonable to demand more customisation options while there's ships out there that generally cost a lot more that don't have them.
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Storytime !
Customer: I want a burger !
Underpaid person: Here is your burger, it is three days old and a cat slept on it. Enjoy !
Customer: Thank you. I wanted to complain about the mold and the cat hair, but you know what ? I ordered a burger, I got one. No reason for me to complain....
That comparison doesn't make any sense. The Jupiter is everything that was advertised in the stats. Nothing less. Nowhere was it mentioned that there would be multiple customisation options. Indeed, one might argue that it was reasonable to expect NO customisation options since the entire design was subject to input from the playerbase.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
This is true there was implied fact of there being, or not being for that matter, customization options in the cards for the ship design contest. Though i can see where people would hope an even see that putting some flexibility into the design via using concept art from other models to make some variation parts would make sense.
Also if you look at the above picture it shows they had alot of possible design choices that could fit into the omega design as variant parts to be used for customization without feeling too different. Like for me the Sixth ship design's rear pylons/nacelles/mission pod would have been a great variant part to use without taking much away from the whole design. Even though these are rough designs an not completely done, man-hours went into them so what not use some of it to get some use out of it.
(Pic snipped to reduce the size of my message)
I guess that if they had included more design options, people would have complained that Cryptic did their own thing and ignore the Community's wishes by adding several random varieties that were never voted for.
Besides, it's still not entirely clear why people are expecting multiple different options at all. Beside the lock box ships, there's plenty of Zen-ships that don't have multiple options. The Vesta or Kumari for example. You need to have more than 1 variant to change those ships, and having more than 1 is more expensive than buying the Jupiter.
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Storytime !
Customer: I want a burger !
Underpaid person: Here is your burger, it is three days old and a cat slept on it. Enjoy !
Customer: Thank you. I wanted to complain about the mold and the cat hair, but you know what ? I ordered a burger, I got one. No reason for me to complain....
That comparison doesn't make any sense. The Jupiter is everything that was advertised in the stats. Nothing less. Nowhere was it mentioned that there would be multiple customisation options. Indeed, one might argue that it was reasonable to expect NO customisation options since the entire design was subject to input from the playerbase.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
This is true there was implied fact of there being, or not being for that matter, customization options in the cards for the ship design contest. Though i can see where people would hope an even see that putting some flexibility into the design via using concept art from other models to make some variation parts would make sense.
Also if you look at the above picture it shows they had alot of possible design choices that could fit into the omega design as variant parts to be used for customization without feeling too different. Like for me the Sixth ship design's rear pylons/nacelles/mission pod would have been a great variant part to use without taking much away from the whole design. Even though these are rough designs an not completely done, man-hours went into them so what not use some of it to get some use out of it.
(Pic snipped to reduce the size of my message)
I guess that if they had included more design options, people would have complained that Cryptic did their own thing and ignore the Community's wishes by adding several random varieties that were never voted for.
Besides, it's still not entirely clear why people are expecting multiple different options at all. Beside the lock box ships, there's plenty of Zen-ships that don't have multiple options. The Vesta or Kumari for example. You need to have more than 1 variant to change those ships, and having more than 1 is more expensive than buying the Jupiter.
It is still uncommon on the Fed side, since most new ships on the Fed side had interchangeable parts with either a lower tier version, or across a pack. And even the Guardian had options. I think the Dauntless is the only one that doesn't have variants parts.
The KDF and RR side also were mostly lucky, except for the Delta Rising pack ships, where several ships don't have variation options. (The Qib and Faeth have them, the Math'a and the Alehal do not.)
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
About the only customization I would have expected was nacelle/pylon customization. Allowing for 4 long nacelles, or 4 short nacelles, or reversing the layout so the short nacelles are on top and the big nacelles are on the bottom if you want to make the nacelles end around the same point at the aft, rather than having one pair extend out further.
Aside from that, I wouldn't have minded if the second and 3rd or 4th place winners also got picked and were made secondary to the Jupiter. That would probably have been the Alpha and Gamma, since they share similar overall setup. Epsilon would be the odd one out.
It's not a big deal for me though; Cryptic got a lot of feedback into what general ship designs the majority of players love. Of the top 4:
- None had a circular saucer
- None followed classic design (saucer attached to neck attached to body attached to pylons attached to nacelles) or the altered classic design (Command cruiser nacelles/pylons attached to saucer rather than body)
- All had 4 nacelles
- All had a blended body/saucer setup
- All had a chevron/trapezoidal saucer
Alpha or Gamma can easily be reused as a T6 Constellation. Epsilon can be reused as another original ship of the cruiser line; maybe even a non-Specialist ship of a new Specialization, similar to how the Guardian was for Intel.
As to the concepts, 17 would have been fun. A Federation take on the Obelisk Carrier.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
I think you hit the nail right on the head. This was a ship made to look exactly like the players wanted, not another 'You can dice and slice it any which way you want' ship. That was the purpose of the whole exercise.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
I think you hit the nail right on the head. This was a ship made to look exactly like the players wanted, not another 'You can dice and slice it any which way you want' ship. That was the purpose of the whole exercise.
Yep and the way it is going now, there will likely never be another experiment in this again.
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Storytime !
Customer: I want a burger !
Underpaid person: Here is your burger, it is three days old and a cat slept on it. Enjoy !
Customer: Thank you. I wanted to complain about the mold and the cat hair, but you know what ? I ordered a burger, I got one. No reason for me to complain....
That comparison doesn't make any sense. The Jupiter is everything that was advertised in the stats. Nothing less. Nowhere was it mentioned that there would be multiple customisation options. Indeed, one might argue that it was reasonable to expect NO customisation options since the entire design was subject to input from the playerbase.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
This is true there was implied fact of there being, or not being for that matter, customization options in the cards for the ship design contest. Though i can see where people would hope an even see that putting some flexibility into the design via using concept art from other models to make some variation parts would make sense.
Also if you look at the above picture it shows they had alot of possible design choices that could fit into the omega design as variant parts to be used for customization without feeling too different. Like for me the Sixth ship design's rear pylons/nacelles/mission pod would have been a great variant part to use without taking much away from the whole design. Even though these are rough designs an not completely done, man-hours went into them so what not use some of it to get some use out of it.
(Pic snipped to reduce the size of my message)
I guess that if they had included more design options, people would have complained that Cryptic did their own thing and ignore the Community's wishes by adding several random varieties that were never voted for.
Besides, it's still not entirely clear why people are expecting multiple different options at all. Beside the lock box ships, there's plenty of Zen-ships that don't have multiple options. The Vesta or Kumari for example. You need to have more than 1 variant to change those ships, and having more than 1 is more expensive than buying the Jupiter.
I think it is like myself most players do expect more verity in their ship looks, as there are just as many ships with option parts an those without option parts. An honestly i think they should not have taken the ship contest to just having one winning ship design, but instead did a three pack (one for each spec) using the top three ships as variant ships, and with how many people voted for these ships with quite a strong camp-mentality in how people liked each of the three finalists. (i will say this epsilon would have been left out most likely as it was the most different from the others.) Doing this would have been very nice given more players options, and also given us less of a feeling of alot of the designs being wasted, and each of the finalists having quite well fit the specialties we have.
I will agree that most likely many others might have seen it as going against the spirit of us choosing a design, but than you will always have a group that descents from others complaining. In the end i think that more would have liked an enjoyed the additional part customization options, as well as more verity in spec seats on the ships, maybe even giving us a three piece set that could have given us more of a feel of a carrier an improved pets. An it feels like a missed opportunity as well.
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Storytime !
Customer: I want a burger !
Underpaid person: Here is your burger, it is three days old and a cat slept on it. Enjoy !
Customer: Thank you. I wanted to complain about the mold and the cat hair, but you know what ? I ordered a burger, I got one. No reason for me to complain....
That comparison doesn't make any sense. The Jupiter is everything that was advertised in the stats. Nothing less. Nowhere was it mentioned that there would be multiple customisation options. Indeed, one might argue that it was reasonable to expect NO customisation options since the entire design was subject to input from the playerbase.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
This is true there was implied fact of there being, or not being for that matter, customization options in the cards for the ship design contest. Though i can see where people would hope an even see that putting some flexibility into the design via using concept art from other models to make some variation parts would make sense.
Also if you look at the above picture it shows they had alot of possible design choices that could fit into the omega design as variant parts to be used for customization without feeling too different. Like for me the Sixth ship design's rear pylons/nacelles/mission pod would have been a great variant part to use without taking much away from the whole design. Even though these are rough designs an not completely done, man-hours went into them so what not use some of it to get some use out of it.
(Pic snipped to reduce the size of my message)
I guess that if they had included more design options, people would have complained that Cryptic did their own thing and ignore the Community's wishes by adding several random varieties that were never voted for.
Besides, it's still not entirely clear why people are expecting multiple different options at all. Beside the lock box ships, there's plenty of Zen-ships that don't have multiple options. The Vesta or Kumari for example. You need to have more than 1 variant to change those ships, and having more than 1 is more expensive than buying the Jupiter.
One this is not a gambling reward.. this was a direct bought ship.. so there is a difference... as a lock box ship you could get the ship for 125zen or no zen at all.. if your lucky.. and lock box ships have never come with custom options.
Zen ships normally come with some sort of customization be it looks or like the Kumari 3 different boff/console layouts... the vesta has a 3 pack... so yes in fact it does have customizations.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
I think you hit the nail right on the head. This was a ship made to look exactly like the players wanted, not another 'You can dice and slice it any which way you want' ship. That was the purpose of the whole exercise.
Yep and the way it is going now, there will likely never be another experiment in this again.
I don't think it will not happen again, as both sides learned an participated in the experience quite well, and overall with just some very minor grips it is quite well received by most. We as players in such a contest should have asked an requested even that more options were created for customization, and i think the devs realized that many players do like having options for how their ships look even in this kind of contest. Chalk it up to a learning experience to expand how another such project will be handed, not so much as a experience of how this type of project is flawed. I mean the first project for a "design your own ship" was quite broad an harder to define making it have quite the verity yet also harder to judge, while this contest/project was quite restricted an confined making for a similar issue that you leave out a large group of players, but a contest/project in the middle that we vote on aspects in each of category for creating the ship might work better.
The other factor is that many of us as much as we might like the addition of more parts for customization, are more so making our own feelings of that the ship to us could have been better with such things added, or more input to how the ship was designed after the general ship concept ship design. Feed-back from the players as a whole is never a bad thing, many might not put forth their feedback in the best of ways, that feedback none the less is good for the devs to hear. This is how they improve the game an other such contest in the future, just like us telling them that it would have made sense to add a update to the hanger/separation pet system alongside (or even a short while after) this release of a hanger-pet using starship.
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Storytime !
Customer: I want a burger !
Underpaid person: Here is your burger, it is three days old and a cat slept on it. Enjoy !
Customer: Thank you. I wanted to complain about the mold and the cat hair, but you know what ? I ordered a burger, I got one. No reason for me to complain....
That comparison doesn't make any sense. The Jupiter is everything that was advertised in the stats. Nothing less. Nowhere was it mentioned that there would be multiple customisation options. Indeed, one might argue that it was reasonable to expect NO customisation options since the entire design was subject to input from the playerbase.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
This is true there was implied fact of there being, or not being for that matter, customization options in the cards for the ship design contest. Though i can see where people would hope an even see that putting some flexibility into the design via using concept art from other models to make some variation parts would make sense.
Also if you look at the above picture it shows they had alot of possible design choices that could fit into the omega design as variant parts to be used for customization without feeling too different. Like for me the Sixth ship design's rear pylons/nacelles/mission pod would have been a great variant part to use without taking much away from the whole design. Even though these are rough designs an not completely done, man-hours went into them so what not use some of it to get some use out of it.
(Pic snipped to reduce the size of my message)
I guess that if they had included more design options, people would have complained that Cryptic did their own thing and ignore the Community's wishes by adding several random varieties that were never voted for.
Besides, it's still not entirely clear why people are expecting multiple different options at all. Beside the lock box ships, there's plenty of Zen-ships that don't have multiple options. The Vesta or Kumari for example. You need to have more than 1 variant to change those ships, and having more than 1 is more expensive than buying the Jupiter.
One this is not a gambling reward.. this was a direct bought ship.. so there is a difference... as a lock box ship you could get the ship for 125zen or no zen at all.. if your lucky.. and lock box ships have never come with custom options.
Zen ships normally come with some sort of customization be it looks or like the Kumari 3 different boff/console layouts... the vesta has a 3 pack... so yes in fact it does have customizations.
It doesn't matter if it's directly bought or not. It takes Zen to get it, the company receives (on average, instead of focussing on one lucky case, let's talk about the whole picture that's more interesting to the general public, shall we?) more (Edit:) money per sold ship and yet they didn't spend resources on completing the interiors of these ships or add customisation options. So is it really that surprising that they didn't do it for a ship that was supposed to have a standardised, because voted on by the community, look?
As for the Vesta and Kumari (and a bunch of other Z-ships) : They're only 'customisations' once you have more than 1 of these ships. It's not a 'customisation' if you only have one option, which is the case if you own only one of them. If you own two or more, then yes, you get customisation options. Did you buy two different Jupiter variants for 6000 Zen (or 4800 with the sale going on) ? I don't think you did.
If I buy a Vesta, I get one costume that I can use. If you buy a Jupiter, you get one constume you can use on that ship. (Ok, it's a couple hundred Zen more expensive, but that's because it's a T6-ship.) It's really not that difficult. The whole 'Z-ships used to get more different options' reasoning is only partly true. It simply doesn't hold for all cases and it therefore isn't usable as explanation why you expected (or wanted) more options for the Jupiter.
Now... I think I'm done repeating myself. I'm not a native speaker (nor typer) of the English language, but I didn't realise it was that hard to understand what I'm saying here...
Jupiter fanboys wanted it, they got it, and now they complain about it. I give up on it.
Storytime !
Customer: I want a burger !
Underpaid person: Here is your burger, it is three days old and a cat slept on it. Enjoy !
Customer: Thank you. I wanted to complain about the mold and the cat hair, but you know what ? I ordered a burger, I got one. No reason for me to complain....
That comparison doesn't make any sense. The Jupiter is everything that was advertised in the stats. Nothing less. Nowhere was it mentioned that there would be multiple customisation options. Indeed, one might argue that it was reasonable to expect NO customisation options since the entire design was subject to input from the playerbase.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
No we got a skin that was voted on...
When we this whole designed by the community thing started.. I thought they were going to let us vote on every aspect... such as:
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
I think you hit the nail right on the head. This was a ship made to look exactly like the players wanted, not another 'You can dice and slice it any which way you want' ship. That was the purpose of the whole exercise.
Yep and the way it is going now, there will likely never be another experiment in this again.
Indeed. And I'm actually a bit annoyed about that.
The 'demos' is so self-entitled these days, that they forget that part of a democracy means accepting the vote, once it's been cast. Cryptic made a nice gesture here, showing their willingness to listen to the playerbase -- something which, IMHO, threads like these undermine. And if it's not the looks, ppl complain about not having had a say in the boff-layout and such as well. If someone offers you a finger, don't immediately try and take the whole hand.
I just want to take this opportunity to thank Cryptic, and hope threads like these won't dissuade them from doing similar things in the future.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
I think you hit the nail right on the head. This was a ship made to look exactly like the players wanted, not another 'You can dice and slice it any which way you want' ship. That was the purpose of the whole exercise.
Yep and the way it is going now, there will likely never be another experiment in this again.
Indeed. And I'm actually a bit annoyed about that.
The 'demos' is so self-entitled these days, that they forget that part of a democracy means accepting the vote, once it's been cast. Cryptic made a nice gesture here, showing their willingness to listen to the playerbase -- something which, IMHO, threads like these undermine. And if it's not the looks, ppl complain about not having had a say in the boff-layout and such as well. If someone offers you a finger, don't immediately try and take the whole hand.
I just want to take this opportunity to thank Cryptic, and hope threads like these won't dissuade them from doing similar things in the future.
What vote? the only one we had was the looks.. nothing else
No vote on boffs
No vote on Consoles
No vote on uni console
No vote on customization options
Seems to be that maybe when they say "design your own ship" what they should say is "vote for the one you like the look of".
Seems to me a lot of the things people are criticizing are things that we had no control over in a supposed "design your own ship" experiment.
I was surprised the Jupiter came out so fast. Then I saw the 0 options and saw why.
I will be really unhappy if they come out a month later w/ the ship options as extras in the C-store.
I was surprised the Jupiter came out so fast. Then I saw the 0 options and saw why.
I will be really unhappy if they come out a month later w/ the ship options as extras in the C-store.
I don't know honestly i would not mind seeing them put some parts into the c-store (for this ship or packages for several ships) for us to buy, maybe with a discount if you own the ship (maybe limit it to if you bought it on release of the ship), but if I had a choice i would have rather had it included with the ship. With how much people liked the other designs i think alot might look into buying the ship if they could also get the look they like/prefer via such a package.
The 'demos' is so self-entitled these days, that they forget that part of a democracy means accepting the vote, once it's been cast.
So just because you find it inconvenient, those that disagree with you should just keep their mouths shut? There's a different term for that you know...
And on a sidenote, it'd be a lot more acceptable if only people who actually bought the ship could vote. The current implementation had a number irregularities. For example:
-People with more STO accounts could cast more votes on the forums.
-People with more friends could generate more Facebook/Twitter votes.
-People with no affiliation to Star Trek (Online) could vote too.
-etc.
Basically everything that could invalidate official elections applied to this 'vote' too.
And on a sidenote, it'd be a lot more acceptable if only people who actually bought the ship could vote. The current implementation had a number irregularities.
So people should pay for the ship in advance to get access to voting. Then the ship's specifications are decided by the majority and the others are stuck with a ship that they never wanted. Sounds perfect.
-People with more friends could generate more Facebook/Twitter votes.
-People with no affiliation to Star Trek (Online) could vote too.
-etc.
And why would people who have absolutely no interest in STO vote on the design of an STO ship? I have played since the open beta, I took a look at the ship designs at the beginning, decided that I liked none of the bathtubs (sorry to the designers) and ignored the whole thing.
Basically everything that could invalidate official elections applied to this 'vote' too.
And this never was an "official election", it was a fun way of deciding how a new ship in a game is supposed to look.
FKA K-Tar, grumpy Klingon/El-Aurian hybrid. Now assimilated by PWE.
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
What are the two red double bars on the back of the ship in that picture, the Jupiter has something simular, but its double turqoise smaller rectangles on the back.
Are they shuttle bay doors or something, a landing pad of some sort?
The 'demos' is so self-entitled these days, that they forget that part of a democracy means accepting the vote, once it's been cast.
So just because you find it inconvenient, those that disagree with you should just keep their mouths shut? There's a different term for that you know...
Disagree with me?! LOL. I didn't even vote. :P (I was kinda taking a break from the forums at the time). More like, well, pretty much what I said: that being part of a democracy is not just about having an endless say in something, but also a matter of accepting the outcome of a vote, once it has been cast.
And on a sidenote, it'd be a lot more acceptable if only people who actually bought the ship could vote.
That sort of census suffrage was widely abadoned in the early 19th century already. Let's not even go there.
And on a sidenote, you managed to get yourself entangled in a bit of 'the chicken and the egg' logic: you can't buy a ship whose design is yet to be voted on! Silly man.
The Jupiter only having the one variation was pretty much a dead giveaway that kitbashing wasn't going to be an option. Same goes for the Odyssey and Atrox.
The whole idea was to make a ship that was 'designed' by the community. That's what we got.
I think you hit the nail right on the head. This was a ship made to look exactly like the players wanted, not another 'You can dice and slice it any which way you want' ship. That was the purpose of the whole exercise.
Yep and the way it is going now, there will likely never be another experiment in this again.
My guess is they will probably see past that and it'll happen again due to the draw in interest from within and outside the game itself. The forums really don't count for much around here anyway, unless there is backlash on other social media outlets.
Anyway, as for the customization, it would be nice considering this is something they had/have with other ship models.
Retired. I'm now in search for that perfect space anomaly.
Honestly an idea I think would be interesting to see them do in the future for a "Design your own ship" contest, would be not having it be designing a ship for the three main factions (Kederation, KDF, Romulan), but more choosing a race in the Star trek series that has yet to be seen with their own ship in most cannon materials. So like me i would love to see what the Bynars, which were the race of twin looking humanoids that were linked to a massive computer on their home world an were seen in a ST:NG episode, would make as a race for a star ship design like would it be a twin linked type vessel. This would give the players alot more space to be creative, but without die-hard fans going crazy over how un-federation/Klingon/romulan the design was.
Comments
And I agree, they should have just modeled the top 3-4 winners and released it all as one, and called it the Omega class. I do not think they should have named it the Jupiter, that just reinforces the idea that the whole thing was rigged and the Jup wannabe was pre-picked.
We come in peace, SHOOT TO KILL!
I can agree yet with how similar at least spiritually the ship is to the Jupiter class, being in many ways a evolution of the design an how the later designs of ships went with the more stream-lined as well as elongated profile, as such i can understand how it would actually make sense to name it the Jupiter class (most of all that many have wanted the ship for along while would appeal to that group more.). I could have seen it that each would have taken names from the ship classes they are designed after, and so the Omega would most likely have still been named the Jupiter class. Though i would say they should have just called the omega the Jupiter in "" design during the competition, even though it was pretty clear it had taken alot of inspiration from the Jupiter itself.
No we got a skin that was voted on...
When we this whole designed by the community thing started.. I thought they were going to let us vote on every aspect... such as:
Phase 1: the look
Phase 2: Boff layout
Phase 3: console layout
Phase 4: uni console
Phase 5: traits
Phase 6: finished..
In stead we got.. vote for your look.... they will pick the rest.
Even after release.. we got no options at all.. like I said.. feels rushed.
Yeah, I had some expectation that there would be more than the Appearance for Community input.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
This is true there was implied fact of there being, or not being for that matter, customization options in the cards for the ship design contest. Though i can see where people would hope an even see that putting some flexibility into the design via using concept art from other models to make some variation parts would make sense.
Also if you look at the above picture it shows they had alot of possible design choices that could fit into the omega design as variant parts to be used for customization without feeling too different. Like for me the Sixth ship design's rear pylons/nacelles/mission pod would have been a great variant part to use without taking much away from the whole design. Even though these are rough designs an not completely done, man-hours went into them so what not use some of it to get some use out of it.
So what? What does it matter whether you buy a lobi or lockbox ship directly with Zen or indirectly? They both cost Zen, and Cryptic gets Zen from both types of ships, in the end. Which means, in the end, that cash, and generally a lot more cash, is needed to buy and earned from them.
You are focussing on irrelevant details while implying that, because the Jupiter costs 3000 zen, it's reasonable to demand more customisation options while there's ships out there that generally cost a lot more that don't have them.
(Pic snipped to reduce the size of my message)
I guess that if they had included more design options, people would have complained that Cryptic did their own thing and ignore the Community's wishes by adding several random varieties that were never voted for.
Besides, it's still not entirely clear why people are expecting multiple different options at all. Beside the lock box ships, there's plenty of Zen-ships that don't have multiple options. The Vesta or Kumari for example. You need to have more than 1 variant to change those ships, and having more than 1 is more expensive than buying the Jupiter.
The KDF and RR side also were mostly lucky, except for the Delta Rising pack ships, where several ships don't have variation options. (The Qib and Faeth have them, the Math'a and the Alehal do not.)
-3rd Commmandment of Chivalry
Aside from that, I wouldn't have minded if the second and 3rd or 4th place winners also got picked and were made secondary to the Jupiter. That would probably have been the Alpha and Gamma, since they share similar overall setup. Epsilon would be the odd one out.
It's not a big deal for me though; Cryptic got a lot of feedback into what general ship designs the majority of players love. Of the top 4:
- None had a circular saucer
- None followed classic design (saucer attached to neck attached to body attached to pylons attached to nacelles) or the altered classic design (Command cruiser nacelles/pylons attached to saucer rather than body)
- All had 4 nacelles
- All had a blended body/saucer setup
- All had a chevron/trapezoidal saucer
Alpha or Gamma can easily be reused as a T6 Constellation. Epsilon can be reused as another original ship of the cruiser line; maybe even a non-Specialist ship of a new Specialization, similar to how the Guardian was for Intel.
As to the concepts, 17 would have been fun. A Federation take on the Obelisk Carrier.
I think you hit the nail right on the head. This was a ship made to look exactly like the players wanted, not another 'You can dice and slice it any which way you want' ship. That was the purpose of the whole exercise.
Yep and the way it is going now, there will likely never be another experiment in this again.
We come in peace, SHOOT TO KILL!
I think it is like myself most players do expect more verity in their ship looks, as there are just as many ships with option parts an those without option parts. An honestly i think they should not have taken the ship contest to just having one winning ship design, but instead did a three pack (one for each spec) using the top three ships as variant ships, and with how many people voted for these ships with quite a strong camp-mentality in how people liked each of the three finalists. (i will say this epsilon would have been left out most likely as it was the most different from the others.) Doing this would have been very nice given more players options, and also given us less of a feeling of alot of the designs being wasted, and each of the finalists having quite well fit the specialties we have.
I will agree that most likely many others might have seen it as going against the spirit of us choosing a design, but than you will always have a group that descents from others complaining. In the end i think that more would have liked an enjoyed the additional part customization options, as well as more verity in spec seats on the ships, maybe even giving us a three piece set that could have given us more of a feel of a carrier an improved pets. An it feels like a missed opportunity as well.
One this is not a gambling reward.. this was a direct bought ship.. so there is a difference... as a lock box ship you could get the ship for 125zen or no zen at all.. if your lucky.. and lock box ships have never come with custom options.
Zen ships normally come with some sort of customization be it looks or like the Kumari 3 different boff/console layouts... the vesta has a 3 pack... so yes in fact it does have customizations.
I don't think it will not happen again, as both sides learned an participated in the experience quite well, and overall with just some very minor grips it is quite well received by most. We as players in such a contest should have asked an requested even that more options were created for customization, and i think the devs realized that many players do like having options for how their ships look even in this kind of contest. Chalk it up to a learning experience to expand how another such project will be handed, not so much as a experience of how this type of project is flawed. I mean the first project for a "design your own ship" was quite broad an harder to define making it have quite the verity yet also harder to judge, while this contest/project was quite restricted an confined making for a similar issue that you leave out a large group of players, but a contest/project in the middle that we vote on aspects in each of category for creating the ship might work better.
The other factor is that many of us as much as we might like the addition of more parts for customization, are more so making our own feelings of that the ship to us could have been better with such things added, or more input to how the ship was designed after the general ship concept ship design. Feed-back from the players as a whole is never a bad thing, many might not put forth their feedback in the best of ways, that feedback none the less is good for the devs to hear. This is how they improve the game an other such contest in the future, just like us telling them that it would have made sense to add a update to the hanger/separation pet system alongside (or even a short while after) this release of a hanger-pet using starship.
It doesn't matter if it's directly bought or not. It takes Zen to get it, the company receives (on average, instead of focussing on one lucky case, let's talk about the whole picture that's more interesting to the general public, shall we?) more (Edit:) money per sold ship and yet they didn't spend resources on completing the interiors of these ships or add customisation options. So is it really that surprising that they didn't do it for a ship that was supposed to have a standardised, because voted on by the community, look?
As for the Vesta and Kumari (and a bunch of other Z-ships) : They're only 'customisations' once you have more than 1 of these ships. It's not a 'customisation' if you only have one option, which is the case if you own only one of them. If you own two or more, then yes, you get customisation options. Did you buy two different Jupiter variants for 6000 Zen (or 4800 with the sale going on) ? I don't think you did.
If I buy a Vesta, I get one costume that I can use. If you buy a Jupiter, you get one constume you can use on that ship. (Ok, it's a couple hundred Zen more expensive, but that's because it's a T6-ship.) It's really not that difficult. The whole 'Z-ships used to get more different options' reasoning is only partly true. It simply doesn't hold for all cases and it therefore isn't usable as explanation why you expected (or wanted) more options for the Jupiter.
Now... I think I'm done repeating myself. I'm not a native speaker (nor typer) of the English language, but I didn't realise it was that hard to understand what I'm saying here...
That was my belief as well.
Indeed. And I'm actually a bit annoyed about that.
The 'demos' is so self-entitled these days, that they forget that part of a democracy means accepting the vote, once it's been cast. Cryptic made a nice gesture here, showing their willingness to listen to the playerbase -- something which, IMHO, threads like these undermine. And if it's not the looks, ppl complain about not having had a say in the boff-layout and such as well. If someone offers you a finger, don't immediately try and take the whole hand.
I just want to take this opportunity to thank Cryptic, and hope threads like these won't dissuade them from doing similar things in the future.
What vote? the only one we had was the looks.. nothing else
No vote on boffs
No vote on Consoles
No vote on uni console
No vote on customization options
Seems to be that maybe when they say "design your own ship" what they should say is "vote for the one you like the look of".
Seems to me a lot of the things people are criticizing are things that we had no control over in a supposed "design your own ship" experiment.
I will be really unhappy if they come out a month later w/ the ship options as extras in the C-store.
I don't know honestly i would not mind seeing them put some parts into the c-store (for this ship or packages for several ships) for us to buy, maybe with a discount if you own the ship (maybe limit it to if you bought it on release of the ship), but if I had a choice i would have rather had it included with the ship. With how much people liked the other designs i think alot might look into buying the ship if they could also get the look they like/prefer via such a package.
And on a sidenote, it'd be a lot more acceptable if only people who actually bought the ship could vote. The current implementation had a number irregularities. For example:
-People with more STO accounts could cast more votes on the forums.
-People with more friends could generate more Facebook/Twitter votes.
-People with no affiliation to Star Trek (Online) could vote too.
-etc.
Basically everything that could invalidate official elections applied to this 'vote' too.
So people should pay for the ship in advance to get access to voting. Then the ship's specifications are decided by the majority and the others are stuck with a ship that they never wanted. Sounds perfect.
So? If that bothers you, you can get multiple STO accounts too.
And why would people who have absolutely no interest in STO vote on the design of an STO ship? I have played since the open beta, I took a look at the ship designs at the beginning, decided that I liked none of the bathtubs (sorry to the designers) and ignored the whole thing.
And this never was an "official election", it was a fun way of deciding how a new ship in a game is supposed to look.
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
Are they shuttle bay doors or something, a landing pad of some sort?
Disagree with me?! LOL. I didn't even vote. :P (I was kinda taking a break from the forums at the time). More like, well, pretty much what I said: that being part of a democracy is not just about having an endless say in something, but also a matter of accepting the outcome of a vote, once it has been cast.
That sort of census suffrage was widely abadoned in the early 19th century already. Let's not even go there.
And on a sidenote, you managed to get yourself entangled in a bit of 'the chicken and the egg' logic: you can't buy a ship whose design is yet to be voted on! Silly man.
My guess is they will probably see past that and it'll happen again due to the draw in interest from within and outside the game itself. The forums really don't count for much around here anyway, unless there is backlash on other social media outlets.
Anyway, as for the customization, it would be nice considering this is something they had/have with other ship models.