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A general request to Foundry authors regarding rank
sophlogimo
Member Posts: 6,507 Arc User
There are people who like to play admirals; most people I know find it weird, though. Most want to play captains or (in case of Romulans) commanders. Most pretend to not be anything but that, and try to ignore the whole Admiral nonsense.
However, rank in STO is linked to level, so when you, as Foundry authors, put a [rank] variable in your Foundry dialogues, we are constantly reminded that the game for inexplicable reasons makes our Star Trek captains... Admirals.
Thus, my request would be: Please leave [rank] variables out of your dialogue boxes. It helps a lot with immersion for little to no cost.
Thank you.
However, rank in STO is linked to level, so when you, as Foundry authors, put a [rank] variable in your Foundry dialogues, we are constantly reminded that the game for inexplicable reasons makes our Star Trek captains... Admirals.
Thus, my request would be: Please leave [rank] variables out of your dialogue boxes. It helps a lot with immersion for little to no cost.
Thank you.
Remember, STO is nothing but a cosmetics game, where only the rule of cool matters. The game mechanics are intentionally out of balance, don't try to "optimize" anything, as it would just frustrate you.
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I agree with you - I am definitely one of those who is firmly in the camp that ranks for players should have been capped at Captain (the true 'hero' rank of Star Trek) with only Fleet leaders able to gain the title Admiral.
Sadly, for Foundry authors, the system is set up in a way that leaves very little room to 'address' a character playing a mission other than by rank. You can only use, "Hey...you" only so many times before it becomes silly.
I really wish the dev team would put in a system that replaces [Rank] with [Title] in the dialog boxes. That way if you choose your Title as 'Captain' that is how the NPCs would address you - regardless of what level you are. (Or MACO Specialist, or Doctor, or Ambassador, or, yes, even Moist :P)
arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1203368/pve-content-a-list-of-gamewide-polishing-pass-suggestions
Anyone not part of the player's crew should address them by rank or just by name.
That said, one thing that vexes me is when trying to write dialogue for Romulan-friendly Fed (or KDF) missions, which rank to use, Captain or Commander?
My Foundry missions | My STO Wiki page | My Twitter home page
But that's the player's choice. If he/she chooses to have the title "Moist" or whatever, so be it. They are the only one who will ever see it in the dialog.
The Title system would open up WAY more options for characters to be addressed by AND take pressure off authors - because we don't have to try and guess what people want to be called - -the PLAYER chooses it.
arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1203368/pve-content-a-list-of-gamewide-polishing-pass-suggestions
And you can either please half the players and use 'captain', or please the other half and use (RANK). Neither choice will please everyone. An author should make their mission how they choose to.
The way i choose is to have Boffs and ship crew refer to a player as captain, as the player IS their captain (i make Fed missions) and when others address the player more formally, i use RANK, as the player is not their captain.
And, no, i won't be changing my method.
If you have a non-rank related title, then [Player Title - Rank] would use [Rank] as default.
Just an idea.
This. Besides, most people probably use rank and to go back and change thousands of lines of dialogue to "captain" would take way too long just to please some. I never get complaints about being called whatever in-game rank they are in my series, so it's not an issue for me.
Such as "Missile Commander" or "Tal Shiar's most wanted".
My character Tsin'xing
He's dead, "Fatality".
"Task Force Omega" we need to set a course for Task Force Omega.
"Crash Test Tribble" on the bridge!
'xcuse me?
An officer is always referred to by their rank, except for crew members, who refer to the commanding officer of their ship as captain. I'm not going to change my mission dialogues just for you. If you're really so worried about being called by your rank as you would be in a military (Starfleet is a military), then I invite you to not play my missions.
If the OP is really this bothered by not being called captain, I think he needs a reality check.
It is kind of a trip looking through a list of some of the titles: http://sto.gamepedia.com/Title
And you just proved why titles will not work.
Personally I prefer [Rank], only because it fits internal Rank consistency (I was a captain what, 30 levels ago?). I know that naval tradition says otherwise, but Starfleet isn't 1:1 with the US Navy, you know?
And people gotta learn to accept a game's limitations.
There is essentially only one mention of it in canon. Dax takes over on the Defiant for Sisko during the war, O'Brien says there's a tradition (he does not say it is a rule) for the commander of a ship to be called "captain" regardless of rank. They proceed to call her captain until she steps down in Favor the Bold.
At the end of the day there is no way to know what the player's preference is and no way to automatically follow it, thus it defaults to the author's preference.
Again, this is the PLAYERS choice to use that Title....AND...they are the only ones who ever see it in the dialog box.
Why throw out the baby with the bath water because of a few non-sequitors in the Title lists? I would like to point out ALL ranks are on that list so a player could be called any rank they wanted. Professional/formal titles are also there as well - - 'Doctor' anyone? How about 'Ambassador'?, etc.
Replacing the current MANDITORY [rank] address system with the much more customizable [title] tag just makes sense. Players would be a lot happier if THEY got to chose how NPCs addressed them...as opposed to 'Fleet Admiral' every where they went regardless of their character background.
arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1203368/pve-content-a-list-of-gamewide-polishing-pass-suggestions
No offense, Hunter and everyone else, but this is no solution.
First Ranks and Titles are totally different things. To give an example, in Stargate SG-1, when they introduced Sam Carter they brought this up. Sam's title is Doctor of Theoretical Physics. Her RANK was Captain/Major/Colonel. When she was on duty, she was univerally referred to by her rank, not title. She was Captain/Major/Colonel Carter, not Dr. Carter. But in more informal circumstances, she preferred her title. Then she was Dr. Carter, but only because she wasn't acting as an Airforce Officer at those times, just a scientist.
The same thing applies to your STO Character. You are an Admiral because that's what Cryptic has decided, regardless of your roleplay. My character's title is MACO Strike Force Commander, because that's his roleplay position (double entendres aside). But I don't want to be referred to by that. At the same token, my Character is currently roleplayed as a Captain, not an Admiral. But, I would rather be called Admiral because thats what CRYPTIC missions use.
And this tag is there precisely SO that Foundry Authors can call the [RANK] Tag for the player's rank. We're not going to self-nerf because one in 20 or one in 100 people don't like it.
And by the way, the game used to call player titles waaaay back in Season 1 & 2. Then you got stuff like "Moist Lady" running around and Cryptic disabled it because of much higher negative reaction to it than being overranked.
So please, if it bothers you this much that the game calls you admiral, why are you still here? Because Cryptic missions will continue to call you Admiral. I'm not changing all my foundry dialogue for a handful of people who don't like it. Sorry. If you can ignore it for a Featured Episode, you can ignore it for the Foundry. And if you can't ignore it for an FE, then I question why you are still here if it affects ya'll this much.
This entire conversation is throwing the baby out with the bath water because you don't like a decision Cryptic made that WE have no control over. You're asking us to stop using Foundry functionality for the sake of your roleplay. That's not fair to Foundry Authors, who already have limited functionality.
And hunter, as an off-topic aside. You also left me a review on my latest mission about how you don't like authors picking the player's lower deck crew for them. That's fine if you don't enjoy it. But I'm not limiting my storytelling opportunities because a small handful of people don't like it. Same thing with the rank tag. I'm not making things harder on myself because a minority of people don't like it.
TRIBBLE Hydra! Hail Janeway!
You gotta love the people who think that foundry authors are supposed to do as they demand.
Is this complaining because you don't want someone to be referred to as an Admiral, and want the player to be called a specific rank? I've never seen the Foundry subforums in such turmoil before and it's seriously concerning.
You're not going to force people to change their ranks just because you want them to. If it concerns you so much, just do it for your missions and hope others take the example.
If it offends you so much for some weird reason, just don't play their missions?
Why is this a subject, again?
It's not a matter of proving anything, but a matter of making humorous examples of what could happen if it was used. and really... it'd be a nickname more than anything else.
Especially since Beast Master and Heretic are options. :P
My character Tsin'xing
I don't necessarily think it's turmoil. It's definitely a legitimate Foundry authoring issue.
Just don't let the topic run away with you. :cool:
Actually it is kinda on topic. :P
The OP was about player immersion and how getting called Admiral constantly when he roleplays a Captain takes him out of that.
I thought your mission was very good, and said as much. I certainly recommend others check it out.
But back to the OP...being limited to what a character can addressed as in game to Level Rank only is also kind of throwing player's backstories under the bus. Cryptic is famous for customization - why haven't they extended that to the dialog options? Let the player choose how his or her character is addressed.
arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1203368/pve-content-a-list-of-gamewide-polishing-pass-suggestions