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T6 BoP and KDF Science Vessels, a concept
wraith3
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
With the news that the Devs are working on a T6 Bird of Prey, but are reluctant to make KDF science ships due to poor sales I felt it was time I let a little idea of mine out for their consideration. You see, I have been thinking about KDF ships for a little while and I really think the Devs are missing a trick here.
Don't give us a T6 Bird of Prey!
Give us a Bird of Prey bundle!
Think about it, in cannon you already have the B'rel/K'vort distinction, just think where STO could go with this.
So here is my suggestion, a three ship Bird of Prey bundle where each ship is not just a rejig of a basic design like other bundles, but where each version is a proper, distinct ship type.
Escort version would be a standard raider type
Cruiser version would be a light cruiser (smaller and faster than other cruisers but less resilient)
And Science version being between the two and classed as a scout
I have a few ideas for consoles to go with these but would like to hear the opinions of others.
Now, there are some problems with this concept, the main one being the visual reading of these ships in pvp. This could be solved by having distinct weightings and exclusive elements to different ship types (though that would make more work).
And finally, as a bonus (and to make the bundle even more enticing) anyone who bought all three ships, either as the bundle or individually, could get a free small ship based on the D4 from Into Darkness!
Don't give us a T6 Bird of Prey!
Give us a Bird of Prey bundle!
Think about it, in cannon you already have the B'rel/K'vort distinction, just think where STO could go with this.
So here is my suggestion, a three ship Bird of Prey bundle where each ship is not just a rejig of a basic design like other bundles, but where each version is a proper, distinct ship type.
Escort version would be a standard raider type
Cruiser version would be a light cruiser (smaller and faster than other cruisers but less resilient)
And Science version being between the two and classed as a scout
I have a few ideas for consoles to go with these but would like to hear the opinions of others.
Now, there are some problems with this concept, the main one being the visual reading of these ships in pvp. This could be solved by having distinct weightings and exclusive elements to different ship types (though that would make more work).
And finally, as a bonus (and to make the bundle even more enticing) anyone who bought all three ships, either as the bundle or individually, could get a free small ship based on the D4 from Into Darkness!
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments
As far as science ships go. I do aprrove of your idea. It has potential. The BoP though is known for its hard hitting offensive capabilities. So the Tactical and Engineering setups I can agree with.
A Sciene BoP, while a good idea, would put it roughly about as useful as the Romulan Science Vessel. The one thats akin to the Romulan Scout Ship.
So for these three ships lets work out some stat block and see what we can come up with. Like we've done in the Syndicate Science Support Vessel(2 pack).
Bird of prey with universal and pilot or intelligence bridge officer seatings, with the option to use the skins of older ships, It should be KDF best-seller . If not that , then I do not know what.
A little to offset the disadvantage guns versus beam arrays, I would suggest starship trait : Advanced energy bolts: -50 % damage distance drop-off from cannons, +5% armor penetration from cannons, turrets + 5% damage.
I like the way you think.
No. The entire concept behind BoP Stations and Consoles are that they are universal and balanced.. Granted there are some slightly tac heavy or eng heavy birds, but that's mostly a symptom of not having any 12 console ships than it is a serious design commitment.
BoP was one half of the the KDF science ships at launch, along with the carrier. BoP really isn't designed to benefit from long science buffs like sensor analysis and inherent SST is really too weak for anyone. But they can get use out of slotting top level science boffs as well as having a science captain. I would suggest just leaving that alone.
If you want a real science ship, let them make one.
We've already started. IT may not get used. But we've been tossing ideas around for since ship in the Syndicate(2pack) Mainly right now we could really use some more input on things like traits and what to use in the hangar bay.
Feel free to offer input on any of the other stats as well.
Except in the KDF with the BOPs. We have them all over the place. Power Creep had long overtaken the BOP but it's still very widely flown.
If you want a real science ship, let them make one.[/QUOTE]
My thoughts exactly.
And that may be due to two main factors. The first is that BOPs have cloaks (and battle cloaks, to boot!) while the Kazon and Breen Raiders do not. The weak hull rates were suppose to off-set the benefit of the battlecloak. The Breen and Kazon ships are basically Escorts that traded hull for an unreliable flanking bonus against NPCs. The second reason is purely cosmetic. Many players fly BOPs simply because the BOP is a "classic" Klingon ship, never mind the fact that the Romulans were the first to field one.
Anyway I am curious to see what they think a T6 Bird-of-prey should look like.
Listen, there are more good ideas in the forums for ships than there is anywhere. Problem is, the cryptic devs think they know best (maybe they do idk) and they are not going to look at the forums and say to themselves hey "that guys' got a good idea for a klingon ship bundle" it just aint gonna happen. I'm sorry but somebody had to say something. I thought by know this would be common knowledge. For what its worth I love the idea. I've been looking for a T6 bop since delta released.
Yes this is why I said supposedly working on a T6 BoP. The one thing I know for certain about Geko and Cryptic is that they're after my wallet. Which they aren't getting because they aren't producing any product I am willing to buy.
And I know how bad the KDF are screwed on ships. I've spent over a week going over them, looking at stats and abilities. This is how I discovered most of our "new" ships are just reskins of ships already in the fleet yard, with some minor tweak, and new abilities.
Take the T6 Science Command Battlecruiser. Remove its T6 abilities. Then compare the base stat block to the Fleet Corsair. You'll find the only difference is that the T6 has 250 less crew, more hull, and the Lt Sci boff is now Universal. That's it. That is the only differences between the T6 Science Command Cruiser and the Fleet Corsair.
And then they wonder why noone buys the KDF ships. Perhaps if they all were not reskined shi... ok I'll stop here. getting to were the irritation of it all makes me want to cuss.
Oh, don't get me wrong. I have enough faith in their statements as if Baghdad Bob was giving Press Releases. That's why I had the "If" statement :P
Someone on one of these boards said Cryptic was making a T6 KDF BOP a priority. Sure. I didn't see an official source, but then again, guys like you and me that have been around long enough know better.
HELLO FLEET GURAMBA!
Also, even for someone retired from PVP like me, looking at the first official dev blog about the Pilot ships? On this initial news release, Escorts are taking a serious backseat to these Pilot ships. They take the things Escorts are known for and amplify it with immunities, escapes, and a Maverick style "Throw out the Speedbrakes and watch them fly on by" trick. My guess is that they will retain the same as or better Bonus Defense capability Escorts can. I can see these things being a menace in PVP. They would surely be a very dangerous thing for fragile Raiders to encounter.
How Pilot ships perform in PVE though is a different thing altogether. DPS dominates this game. And to have good DPS you need steady damage output and time on target to Pad the Parser. Looking at Pilot abilities, the likely emphasis on speed and maneuverability, these things aren't going to win the DPS race at all. Current Kings in that regard will still reign supreme. Pilot Spec, Pilot abilities emphasize speed with some spikes. DPS guys don't like Hit & Run. Hard to Pad the Parser when you're making slashing attack runs past the NPCs to prep your attacks and coming back for another.
If we get specialized BoP's, that may come at a price. Namely the universal boff stations we enjoy at the moment.
So, what is it going to be ?
Science/Intel version with built in sensor scan ?
Eng/Command version with extra hull ?
Tac/Pilot version with higher impulse mod ?
Plus the usual differences in consoles and bonus power levels.
Thinking about it again: wouldn't a 3 pack already include sensor scan for the sci version ? See Bortasq...
You dont need to give up the universal stations for what you propose. Just make the Commander slot Intel, Command or Pilot. And I cant imagine a BoP with sensor scan and intel abilities. It would be the KDF version of the Scryer. Just blowing things up everywhere.
@Desdecardo since 2008.
As for the devs not knowing what to do with it, that in of it self tells me, they do not understand that ship class. To me a Bird of prey is a ship that can pull allot of tricks out of its hat, and in the star trek universe, can be as big as a cruiser, or as small as a B'rel. Though DS9, and other star trek shows/movies have made it appear weak. This class of ship to me is the klingon version of the Defiant but built a whole lot better. A expert at tactical missions/strikes. Currently obsolete given the new elite skill level, again a opinion only.
Now if I was a dev I would use the Hegh'ta Heavy Bird of Prey template, seen here http://sto.gamepedia.com/Hegh%27ta_Heavy_Bird-of-Prey. For the artwork I would expand the wingspan somewhat. Then I would remove the blaster cannons under the nose and wings. At the tip of the expanded wings I would put a cluster of four heavy disruptor cannons at each wing. Then behind the nose I would add a bulk to the hull, to give the look of a expanded payload of torpedo's. On the top aft section between the nacelles I would place a disruptor looking turret. For points of attack all forward disruptor cannon/beam fire should come from the clusters at the end of the wing span. All forward and aft turret fire should come from the disruptor turret between the nacelles. All aft Beam fire should also come from said turret. Last but not least I would then put on a outer hull look of solid armor, similar to that of a tactical cube. This I think would portray the words "everlasting death" correctly
As for stats.
Hull strength should be no less then 33k.
If special console needed it should have to do with hull armor/kinetic resists
Equipped with battle cloak
Five forward weapon slots with three aft weapon slots.
Base turn rate should be 22
Bridge officer slots should be Commander Universal, LT commander Universal, Lt Commander Universal, and LT Universal-possibly change the LT universal to ensign of overpowering.
As for consoles this is pure guess work here
Three engineering
One sci
Six Tactical- Don't think that's ever been done.
Crew compliment 100
This type of tier six bird of prey would be unique to say the least, and in the extreme unlikely hood they do do something like this, for the love of mercy do not make a carbon copy for the Feds/Romulans. As I have learned over the years through discussion and playing the game the Bird of prey is one of the only remaining unique traits to the KDF.
If you want to make a BoP a Tactical ship, seat Tactical Boffs in the Cmdr and Lt. Cmdr, want Science? Slot science Boffs there. Engineering? Same thing, Slot Engineering officers,...
One ship, multi uses. That's kind of the point of BoP's after all.
"There... are... four... lights!" ~Jean Luc Picard