From my observation you are completely right here. Most of the season players of the communities Im in stayed far shorter than ever after a major release. I cant even blame them because only if u approach STO as some weird full time gaming job now you have a chance to experience this game to its full potential (e.g. best gear, max spec tree, alts) if at all.
Could be that the publisher doesnt care about the money input of season players that much though. Perhaps the DR release encourages whales and/or hardcore players simply to spend much more than season players ever would.
you know what the real kicker here is?
they could have had multiple populations ingame and spending, (whales and ... less-whales?) by implementing more alternative gear paths
but no? who flushes customers out of their business? very strange
Or most of those people are just levelling their toons and don' spend so mich time on the queues. It's what I do, can't be the only one.
Outside of perhaps BNPs and APCs, Cryptic has done a "fantastic" job of reducing the need to go anywhere near the queues. Everything else is pretty much either easier or faster (or easier and faster) to get elsewhere. How many of the folks that do enjoy hitting them have moved to various channels to find groups to avoid leechers? Honestly, with all the solo-friendly changes Cryptic has made...I just don't find the queue situation to be in the least bit surprising. Then you add in Skill Point gain...and meh, yeah...queues...meh.
they could have had multiple populations ingame and spending, (whales and ... less-whales?) by implementing more alternative gear paths
but no? who flushes customers out of their business? very strange
Yep I feel the same way but we already had that b4 DR and it really worked just fine for everybody, except the publisher it would seem.
Me as enthusiastic STO-Only player never had any problem with season players catching on quickly whenever they returned for a moth or three. Also didnt matter much how long they were gone. Totally new players to the game were coached quickly in our Fleets to be on par with veterans ready to hit end game.
Now everybody faces:
1) Minimum of 3-6 month input in a crafting system in order to upgrade former end game gear to previous standards. There is a direct sky is the limit option for instant progression if one invests RL money. Even the richest whales should feel that hurting with the rarity stuff.
2) levelcap with massive necessary input to cope with compared to before with a post lvl 60 system only being able by a very small group of players ever to be experienced to its full potential (not even me as far as its worth). No money will help you there. Just a huge time investment into a single game at the cost of other games one would occasionally run.
3) Enhanced pressure! An entire list of endgame PVEs simply removed and replaced by something more difficult compared to all pre-DR settings to underline that 1) & 2) are much more important than one would like to think.
To be honest this is a very clear direction and well thought through system introduced by the publisher. Your idea is a good one OP, however Im afraid it is in contradiction to what they try to do here.
They only want a certain kind of customer. And thats those who 1) bring in cash, 2) bring in time and 3) take this game seriously. Sure everybody else is welcome to hop in for some fun. Hope they have that seeing that everybody else is better than they are.
It is sad. But I havent seen ANYTHING post the DR release what would make me think differently on topic. If I would be a publisher or a developer of something like this I probably would also lack a bit in communicating to my customers what I have done and what my intentions were. Ok I probably would not declare victory as well. Watch my sig.
- Connor
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
We'll see mk XIV drops, when they someday raise the cap to 70, and we... er... um, guess we become Federation President, or something. In dunno. That's when we'll see those drops commonly. We didn't see mk XII drops anyway, until after DR hit. At least not common ones anyway.
We'll see mk XIV drops, when they someday raise the cap to 70, and we... er... um, guess we become Federation President, or something. In dunno. That's when we'll see those drops commonly. We didn't see mk XII drops anyway, until after DR hit. At least not common ones anyway.
Lol, Federation President. It would probably be 'Military Dictator' or Emperor in that case.. >.>
I would love more Mirror Universe Episodes.. >.>
Yeah it will probably take til Lv 70 or Lv 80... >.>
The Rising of the Delta is the best expansion ever, and people love it to death because it is a good day to die in the endless struggle for supremacy of your own conviction. (A spin off of the Delta Rising is the best expansion ever and all the players love it.)
This would go a long way to reduce the Pay To Win situation. Even though they cannot compete with upgraded gear they would level the playing field a little. And allow non-grinders to run STFs.
This would go a long way to reduce the Pay To Win situation. Even though they cannot compete with upgraded gear they would level the playing field a little. And allow non-grinders to run STFs.
I doubt it. Think of the odds of finding any piece of equipment that could work for a given build. Not only would someone who absolutely refuses to upgrade (who BTW can get by just fine in all STF's. Elite PVE's on the other hand, no, but you can chop that one to "by design, won't fix." The level cap increase has to mean something after all.) would have to hope for an appropriate XIII or XIV item but one of a high enough rarity value that it could beat out whatever XI or XII equivalents they have now.
Anyone who spends enough time with the game to make random loot drops an acceptable alternative to upgrades probably has earned enough resources through their long playtime to operate freely with the upgrade system. All XIII and XIV drops would achieve then is to give some players a lucky break, unreliably and infrequently.
For that reason though, sure let's have the drops (it'd be nice on occasion) but let's not pretend that it'll let people live on their gifts from the right side of the probability distribution curve. Upgrades are still going to be a more desirable alternative (which does say something positive for their design. You know how much you have to do to get exactly what you want. No indeterminate grinding.)
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
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I had already been getting Mk XIII drops before I started any DR content. I think all my alts were at lvl 57-58 before they started dropping, but even sector patrols in the Alpha Quadrant were dropping common & uncommons, not to mention STF's. I actually started getting rare Mk XIII's once I got into DR missions...
Expendables Fleet: Andrew - Bajoran Fed Engineer Ken'taura - Rom/Fed Scientist Gwyllim - Human Fed Delta Tac Savik - Vulcan Fed Temporal Sci Dahar Masters Fleet: Alphal'Fa - Alien KDF Engineer Qun'pau - Rom/KDF Engineer D'nesh - Orion KDF Scientist Ghen'khan - Liberated KDF Tac Welcome to StarBug Online - to boldly Bug where no bug has been before!
STO player since November 2013
Outside of perhaps BNPs and APCs, Cryptic has done a "fantastic" job of reducing the need to go anywhere near the queues. Everything else is pretty much either easier or faster (or easier and faster) to get elsewhere. How many of the folks that do enjoy hitting them have moved to various channels to find groups to avoid leechers? Honestly, with all the solo-friendly changes Cryptic has made...I just don't find the queue situation to be in the least bit surprising. Then you add in Skill Point gain...and meh, yeah...queues...meh.
heh, I can't tell what level of sarcasm you are working in
I would say
"well good luck participating in the rep system then"
(without que token drop, there is no rep system)
but then, that might be exactly what you are saying
Whilst this has probably already been said, Argala appears to have started dropping MkXIII items; I was in a team earlier, and picked up a MkXIII (blue) Resilient shield that dropped.
There were a few other MkXIII items, but none of them were of consequence (sensor probe console for example, and most of these were uncommon.
Haven't seen any MkXIII purple items drop yet though.
well that's different
but unless they are dropping with a frequency that generates some exchange traffic, it's not enough.
that exchange trade would aid players that don't have access to the crafting system, upgrade system, and rep system yet. which is everyone at the start
EDIT: and, odd numbered gear doesn't count, it rarely gets bought, why buy mk 9 when the best you can equip is mk 10
that exchange trade would aid players that don't have access to the crafting system, upgrade system, and rep system yet. which is everyone at the start
They want players, one way or another, to burn Dil to get better than mk XII. Rep mk XII already requires Dil.
If mk XIII were more common as drops there'd be even less reason to grind the queues to get the components to craft the upgrades to make mk XIII and better.
This is my Risian Corvette. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
heh, I can't tell what level of sarcasm you are working in
I would say
"well good luck participating in the rep system then"
(without que token drop, there is no rep system)
but then, that might be exactly what you are saying
To reach T5 in any of the Reps, you do not need to do a single queue because Cryptic introduced the daily bonus rewards which cover a day's required Marks...provides more than required. You actually begin building up a nest egg of Marks. Those daily bonus rewards also don't go away once you have reached T5 - you can keep on collecting Marks.
Technically you don't have to hit any queues for the particular tokens either, though for BNPs and APCs it's playing the RNG game. Then again, BHA/BHE is so easy - it's fine getting APCs. Just leaves the BNPs as a bit of a pickle. But then again yet, just how many of them total are you going to need - so just how many queues would you have to hit up, yeah? As for the Isos and Implants, Cryptic decided also to reward those from the Dyson Space and Ground Battlezones...so there's no need at all to hit those associated queues. Neither Romulan nor Nukara Reps have special items.
Almost everything provides more loot drops than hitting the queues and with the introduction of the revamped R&D system, those "special" loot drops one might have gotten from time to time just aren't that "special" anymore...they're just not a place to make EC.
There are countless threads discussing the acquisition of Dilithium...and...the queues aren't mentioned.
Skill Points for trying to get those Specialization Points...and...yeah, the Delta Quadrant is that way.
The queues are basically obsolete...and...for those that enjoy them, how many are avoiding the public queues like the plague? There are all sorts of channels for folks looking to run them, whether they're in fleets, doing the DPS thing, not doing the DPS thing, etc.
Yes, Cryptic killed the queues, imho. But there have been so many requests for the game to be more solo-friendly over the years...and...it's just a case they listened.
~ Yes, Cryptic killed the queues, imho. But there have been so many requests for the game to be more solo-friendly over the years...and...it's just a case they listened.
Good points. Actually even BNP's aren't impossible to get hold of. You get 10 of them just getting to T5 on the reputation, and there is a random chance of getting one from one of those boxes. I think once I hit T5 on my latest Captain I had something like 13 of them, and I've not touched an advanced STF.
Now I think about it the entire endgame is a real mess.
With no queues running frequently there is little point in investing in reputation gear since you really don't need the survivability for normal queues and everything under. I doubt you'd even need traits.
Also when the rep system was first introduced it replaced the RNG gamble of loot drops in STF's, which I would agree is a good thing. Yet RNG is back and badder than ever with gear upgrades, at least last time you didn't lose resources. You would just play the mission again.
I mentioned this a long time ago when they decided to pull all the [Borg] weapons from the STF store on DS9. That system actually worked quite well. You could run a few normal stfs and pick up enough borg neurals to outfit your ships with either purple X or XI gear. When they brought in the new system you basically were at the mercy of the exchange if you didn't want to join a fleet. I guess you could use the rep system and unlock a store to pick up weapons, but at well over 20K dilithium each most new players are not going to have that laying around to use. Personally, I wouldn't step foot in a normal STF with white or green gear (even at XIII or XIV) since the new changes rolled out, but to each their own. Point is, new players need to have access to decent affordable gear and they don't. The cost of getting my gear to XIII has taken a huge toll. I doubt I will ever upgrade to XIV unless the costs come down some.
Why do new players need everything now? If folks have everything, what reason is there to play? Just to play a random thing here or there? So perhaps folks log in for a week every three months or so, and during those three months they might pop in once or twice a week for a few minutes?
What's wrong with having some goals - some things to work toward?
What's wrong with having some goals - some things to work toward?
Do you consider logging in just long enough to hit the 20 hour science research project button for three months to be working towards something or even playing the game?
This is my Risian Corvette. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
Do you consider logging in just long enough to hit the 20 hour science research project button for three months to be working towards something or even playing the game?
So there I am, logged in anyway, playing the game anyway, and as part of my logging in and playing anyway, I can also order crew to research a particular R&D school, where along the way new items open up to me...yeah, that's working toward something while I'm playing the game.
If somebody just wants to log in for a few moments to queue stuff and then log out...I don't think it makes a difference at all with how the R&D system is done. They're not playing the game anyway, are they?
If somebody just wants to log in for a few moments to queue stuff and then log out...I don't think it makes a difference at all with how the R&D system is done. They're not playing the game anyway, are they?
So game play doesn't need to be interesting, you just have to be logged in and participating in a timegated system that creates haves and have nots?
Player A having been clicking a button, and nothing more, for a year longer than Player B seems a weak argument to keep Player B from things.
This is my Risian Corvette. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
So game play doesn't need to be interesting, you just have to be logged in and participating in a timegated system that creates haves and have nots?
Player A having been clicking a button, and nothing more, for a year longer than Player B seems a weak argument to keep Player B from things.
Interesting is very subjective. What Tom finds interesting might bore Jerry to tears. That Jerry would turn around and say Tom needs to find it boring too...is a Jerry problem. Tom doesn't think Jerry needs to find it interesting too...different folks find different things interesting.
I'm already playing the game. Cause, I was already playing the game before they added a bunch of the stuff. So uh, them adding these things hasn't changed anything. I'm still playing the game. I'm still doing what I do because I enjoy it. That other stuff happens and I'm rewarded for doing what I was already doing anyway is just a bonus.
I'm not playing for rewards, I'm playing because playing is rewarding. I enjoy it. I absolutely freaking loathe all the bugs and that TRIBBLE...I sit here like a mad man TRIBBLE at the screen at times when I come across yet another bug. But I'm playing the game because I find it to be fun for the most part. It's an entertaining way to pass some of my free time. So again, that they've added other stuff I can do while I'm playing anyway...how is that a bad thing?
As for the rest, Player B just sounds a wee bit entitled...and that's no argument for Player B having anything aside from perhaps having their diaper changed. Stuff will happen when it happens.
Prior to S7, I deleted all my guys. I added more guys after that and even added more guys after LoR. I deleted all but one guy at the end of 2013. Guess what I did just before DR? I deleted everybody again. Oh noes, all the stuff lost over the years - all that progress...meh, whatever? It will just build up again as I continue to play the game. Cause it's a game...simple as that. It's no reason to grab a pair of the girlfriend's panties, try to put them on, so I can bunch them up.
Like I said earlier, it really just sounds like you don't like the game anyway - so none of the stuff that you're complaining about would actually matter...
Comments
you know what the real kicker here is?
they could have had multiple populations ingame and spending, (whales and ... less-whales?) by implementing more alternative gear paths
but no? who flushes customers out of their business? very strange
Outside of perhaps BNPs and APCs, Cryptic has done a "fantastic" job of reducing the need to go anywhere near the queues. Everything else is pretty much either easier or faster (or easier and faster) to get elsewhere. How many of the folks that do enjoy hitting them have moved to various channels to find groups to avoid leechers? Honestly, with all the solo-friendly changes Cryptic has made...I just don't find the queue situation to be in the least bit surprising. Then you add in Skill Point gain...and meh, yeah...queues...meh.
Yep I feel the same way but we already had that b4 DR and it really worked just fine for everybody, except the publisher it would seem.
Me as enthusiastic STO-Only player never had any problem with season players catching on quickly whenever they returned for a moth or three. Also didnt matter much how long they were gone. Totally new players to the game were coached quickly in our Fleets to be on par with veterans ready to hit end game.
Now everybody faces:
1) Minimum of 3-6 month input in a crafting system in order to upgrade former end game gear to previous standards. There is a direct sky is the limit option for instant progression if one invests RL money. Even the richest whales should feel that hurting with the rarity stuff.
2) levelcap with massive necessary input to cope with compared to before with a post lvl 60 system only being able by a very small group of players ever to be experienced to its full potential (not even me as far as its worth). No money will help you there. Just a huge time investment into a single game at the cost of other games one would occasionally run.
3) Enhanced pressure! An entire list of endgame PVEs simply removed and replaced by something more difficult compared to all pre-DR settings to underline that 1) & 2) are much more important than one would like to think.
To be honest this is a very clear direction and well thought through system introduced by the publisher. Your idea is a good one OP, however Im afraid it is in contradiction to what they try to do here.
They only want a certain kind of customer. And thats those who 1) bring in cash, 2) bring in time and 3) take this game seriously. Sure everybody else is welcome to hop in for some fun. Hope they have that seeing that everybody else is better than they are.
It is sad. But I havent seen ANYTHING post the DR release what would make me think differently on topic. If I would be a publisher or a developer of something like this I probably would also lack a bit in communicating to my customers what I have done and what my intentions were. Ok I probably would not declare victory as well. Watch my sig.
- Connor
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
allow them to drop from playing and for the rep system and fleet shops to sell them also
I just want it so I can complete the game, even if it is just the lower grades ones. Obviously I am not going to win any dps contests.
One man's trash is another's treasure, and my mk 12 very rares are bested by mk 14 commons.
Lol, Federation President. It would probably be 'Military Dictator' or Emperor in that case.. >.>
I would love more Mirror Universe Episodes.. >.>
Yeah it will probably take til Lv 70 or Lv 80... >.>
I doubt it. Think of the odds of finding any piece of equipment that could work for a given build. Not only would someone who absolutely refuses to upgrade (who BTW can get by just fine in all STF's. Elite PVE's on the other hand, no, but you can chop that one to "by design, won't fix." The level cap increase has to mean something after all.) would have to hope for an appropriate XIII or XIV item but one of a high enough rarity value that it could beat out whatever XI or XII equivalents they have now.
Anyone who spends enough time with the game to make random loot drops an acceptable alternative to upgrades probably has earned enough resources through their long playtime to operate freely with the upgrade system. All XIII and XIV drops would achieve then is to give some players a lucky break, unreliably and infrequently.
For that reason though, sure let's have the drops (it'd be nice on occasion) but let's not pretend that it'll let people live on their gifts from the right side of the probability distribution curve. Upgrades are still going to be a more desirable alternative (which does say something positive for their design. You know how much you have to do to get exactly what you want. No indeterminate grinding.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Savik - Vulcan Fed Temporal Sci
Dahar Masters Fleet: Alphal'Fa - Alien KDF Engineer Qun'pau - Rom/KDF Engineer D'nesh - Orion KDF Scientist Ghen'khan - Liberated KDF Tac
Welcome to StarBug Online - to boldly Bug where no bug has been before!
STO player since November 2013
heh, I can't tell what level of sarcasm you are working in
I would say
"well good luck participating in the rep system then"
(without que token drop, there is no rep system)
but then, that might be exactly what you are saying
well that's different
but unless they are dropping with a frequency that generates some exchange traffic, it's not enough.
that exchange trade would aid players that don't have access to the crafting system, upgrade system, and rep system yet. which is everyone at the start
EDIT: and, odd numbered gear doesn't count, it rarely gets bought, why buy mk 9 when the best you can equip is mk 10
They want players, one way or another, to burn Dil to get better than mk XII. Rep mk XII already requires Dil.
If mk XIII were more common as drops there'd be even less reason to grind the queues to get the components to craft the upgrades to make mk XIII and better.
To reach T5 in any of the Reps, you do not need to do a single queue because Cryptic introduced the daily bonus rewards which cover a day's required Marks...provides more than required. You actually begin building up a nest egg of Marks. Those daily bonus rewards also don't go away once you have reached T5 - you can keep on collecting Marks.
Technically you don't have to hit any queues for the particular tokens either, though for BNPs and APCs it's playing the RNG game. Then again, BHA/BHE is so easy - it's fine getting APCs. Just leaves the BNPs as a bit of a pickle. But then again yet, just how many of them total are you going to need - so just how many queues would you have to hit up, yeah? As for the Isos and Implants, Cryptic decided also to reward those from the Dyson Space and Ground Battlezones...so there's no need at all to hit those associated queues. Neither Romulan nor Nukara Reps have special items.
Almost everything provides more loot drops than hitting the queues and with the introduction of the revamped R&D system, those "special" loot drops one might have gotten from time to time just aren't that "special" anymore...they're just not a place to make EC.
There are countless threads discussing the acquisition of Dilithium...and...the queues aren't mentioned.
Skill Points for trying to get those Specialization Points...and...yeah, the Delta Quadrant is that way.
The queues are basically obsolete...and...for those that enjoy them, how many are avoiding the public queues like the plague? There are all sorts of channels for folks looking to run them, whether they're in fleets, doing the DPS thing, not doing the DPS thing, etc.
Yes, Cryptic killed the queues, imho. But there have been so many requests for the game to be more solo-friendly over the years...and...it's just a case they listened.
Good points. Actually even BNP's aren't impossible to get hold of. You get 10 of them just getting to T5 on the reputation, and there is a random chance of getting one from one of those boxes. I think once I hit T5 on my latest Captain I had something like 13 of them, and I've not touched an advanced STF.
Now I think about it the entire endgame is a real mess.
With no queues running frequently there is little point in investing in reputation gear since you really don't need the survivability for normal queues and everything under. I doubt you'd even need traits.
Also when the rep system was first introduced it replaced the RNG gamble of loot drops in STF's, which I would agree is a good thing. Yet RNG is back and badder than ever with gear upgrades, at least last time you didn't lose resources. You would just play the mission again.
What's wrong with having some goals - some things to work toward?
Do you consider logging in just long enough to hit the 20 hour science research project button for three months to be working towards something or even playing the game?
So there I am, logged in anyway, playing the game anyway, and as part of my logging in and playing anyway, I can also order crew to research a particular R&D school, where along the way new items open up to me...yeah, that's working toward something while I'm playing the game.
If somebody just wants to log in for a few moments to queue stuff and then log out...I don't think it makes a difference at all with how the R&D system is done. They're not playing the game anyway, are they?
So game play doesn't need to be interesting, you just have to be logged in and participating in a timegated system that creates haves and have nots?
Player A having been clicking a button, and nothing more, for a year longer than Player B seems a weak argument to keep Player B from things.
Interesting is very subjective. What Tom finds interesting might bore Jerry to tears. That Jerry would turn around and say Tom needs to find it boring too...is a Jerry problem. Tom doesn't think Jerry needs to find it interesting too...different folks find different things interesting.
I'm already playing the game. Cause, I was already playing the game before they added a bunch of the stuff. So uh, them adding these things hasn't changed anything. I'm still playing the game. I'm still doing what I do because I enjoy it. That other stuff happens and I'm rewarded for doing what I was already doing anyway is just a bonus.
I'm not playing for rewards, I'm playing because playing is rewarding. I enjoy it. I absolutely freaking loathe all the bugs and that TRIBBLE...I sit here like a mad man TRIBBLE at the screen at times when I come across yet another bug. But I'm playing the game because I find it to be fun for the most part. It's an entertaining way to pass some of my free time. So again, that they've added other stuff I can do while I'm playing anyway...how is that a bad thing?
As for the rest, Player B just sounds a wee bit entitled...and that's no argument for Player B having anything aside from perhaps having their diaper changed. Stuff will happen when it happens.
Prior to S7, I deleted all my guys. I added more guys after that and even added more guys after LoR. I deleted all but one guy at the end of 2013. Guess what I did just before DR? I deleted everybody again. Oh noes, all the stuff lost over the years - all that progress...meh, whatever? It will just build up again as I continue to play the game. Cause it's a game...simple as that. It's no reason to grab a pair of the girlfriend's panties, try to put them on, so I can bunch them up.
Like I said earlier, it really just sounds like you don't like the game anyway - so none of the stuff that you're complaining about would actually matter...