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Who Should Have Been Shot in STID?

collegepark2151collegepark2151 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
edited December 2014 in Ten Forward
I watched both JJTreks Christmas Eve and during the fight scene involving the Starfleet senior staff after the London incident had a thought:

The movie would have been so much better if Khan had shot Kirk instead of Pike.

Let the wailing and gnashing of teeth begin...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

Porthos is not amused.
Post edited by collegepark2151 on

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    jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 10,371 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    Who should have been shot?

    The writers.

    Oh, not fatally, I'm not that vindictive; just wounded badly enough that they couldn't write the script, and someone else had to be brought in. Since the Trekverse had already been reset to something more grim and gritty, can you imagine if the basic plot of STID had been used for a script by, say, Harlan Ellison?
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    jorantomalakjorantomalak Member Posts: 7,133 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    who shouldve been shot?

    the writers

    especially the idiot who came up with the magic blood idea
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    mirrorchaosmirrorchaos Member Posts: 9,844 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    jorantomalak wrote: »
    who shouldve been shot?

    the writers

    especially the idiot who came up with the magic blood idea

    my exact thoughts on the subject. magic blood, pah.
    T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW.
    Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
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    neoakiraiineoakiraii Member Posts: 7,468 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    Yeah magic blood is so stupid that's why I hate voyager so much...wait we are not talking about when Voyager did magic blood? Oh never mind
    GwaoHAD.png
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    mhall85mhall85 Member Posts: 2,852 Arc User1
    edited December 2014
    neoakiraii wrote: »
    Yeah magic blood is so stupid that's why I hate voyager so much...wait we are not talking about when Voyager did magic blood? Oh never mind

    LOL. :D You win. :)
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    mhall85mhall85 Member Posts: 2,852 Arc User1
    edited December 2014
    collegepark2151 wrote: »
    I watched both JJTreks Christmas Eve and during the fight scene involving the Starfleet senior staff after the London incident had a thought:

    The movie would have been so much better if Khan had shot Kirk instead of Pike.

    Let the wailing and gnashing of teeth begin...

    Hmm... any reason why you think this?
    d87926bd02aaa4eb12e2bb0fbc1f7061.jpg
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    collegepark2151collegepark2151 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    mhall85 wrote: »
    Hmm... any reason why you think this?

    Bruce Greenwood made a much more believable captain than Chris Pine.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Porthos is not amused.
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    mhall85mhall85 Member Posts: 2,852 Arc User1
    edited December 2014
    collegepark2151 wrote: »
    Bruce Greenwood made a much more believable captain than Chris Pine.

    Well, I do agree that Greenwood was an excellent choice for Christopher Pike, and he had a presence about him while on the bridge.

    IMO, they should have never given the Enterprise to Kirk at the end of Star Trek [2009]. I think that would have made the transition to the second film easier... it should have been like the Nolan Batman films. Jim Gordon wasn't made commissioner at the end of Batman Begins, and Jim Kirk shouldn't have been made captain at the end of Star Trek.
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    hartzillahartzilla Member Posts: 1,177 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    mhall85 wrote: »
    IMO, they should have never given the Enterprise to Kirk at the end of Star Trek [2009]. I think that would have made the transition to the second film easier... it should have been like the Nolan Batman films. Jim Gordon wasn't made commissioner at the end of Batman Begins, and Jim Kirk shouldn't have been made captain at the end of Star Trek.

    Except Kirk is the main character so it would have been more like Bruce Wayne not being Batman at the end of Batman Begins. Which probably wouldn't have worked.

    Not to mention that if Star Trek 2009 flopped the whole thing would have ended there until the next reboot.
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    warmaker001bwarmaker001b Member Posts: 9,205 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    LOL, the Khan Magic Blood was the worst of STID. There's other dumb things about it, but the Magic Blood was epic.

    Still... I cannot decide if STID Magic Blood is worse or equal to Star Wars Midichlorians B.S.
    XzRTofz.gif
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    starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,963 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    hartzilla wrote: »
    Except Kirk is the main character so it would have been more like Bruce Wayne not being Batman at the end of Batman Begins. Which probably wouldn't have worked.

    Here's Chuck Sonnenburg's solution: End the film on a montage of Kirk's career rising through the ranks and gaining experience to temper his natural skill (not to mention his arrogance), and have an older and wiser Kirk gaining permanent command of the Enterprise several years down the road.

    But then it's hard to have a sequel because you have to make Chris Pine look way older in every scene. It's one of those things that works best in a literary medium or in a movie you weren't planning to have a sequel to.
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
    — Sabaton, "Great War"
    VZ9ASdg.png

    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
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    warmaker001bwarmaker001b Member Posts: 9,205 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    starswordc wrote: »
    Here's Chuck Sonnenburg's solution: End the film on a montage of Kirk's career rising through the ranks and gaining experience to temper his natural skill (not to mention his arrogance), and have an older and wiser Kirk gaining permanent command of the Enterprise several years down the road.

    But then it's hard to have a sequel because you have to make Chris Pine look way older in every scene. It's one of those things that works best in a literary medium or in a movie you weren't planning to have a sequel to.

    Off-topic: There's a TRIBBLE version with a crossover of TOS & JJ Trek, and the TOS Kirk comes over boots the JJ Trek Kirk and takes over the ship :cool:
    XzRTofz.gif
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    neoakiraiineoakiraii Member Posts: 7,468 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    warmaker001b wrote: »
    LOL, the Khan Magic Blood was the worst of STID. There's other dumb things about it, but the Magic Blood was epic.

    Still... I cannot decide if STID Magic Blood is worse or equal to Star Wars Midichlorians B.S.

    No the worst thing was using Magic Borg blood to bring Neelix back to life, and then have him ask me to do him Favors in this game... THAT IS THE GREATEST OF ALL JANEWAY'S CRIMES!!
    GwaoHAD.png
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    jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 10,371 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    No, the worst thing was "cold fusion". They could technobabble the magic blood, because maybe someone did figure out a way to engineer Cure Death into Khan's blood. But cold fusion is a real concept, and is merely a fusion reaction that takes place at temperatures of less than millions of degrees - not a process that starts a fusion reaction that makes thing cold!!
    starswordc wrote: »
    Here's Chuck Sonnenburg's solution: End the film on a montage of Kirk's career rising through the ranks and gaining experience to temper his natural skill (not to mention his arrogance), and have an older and wiser Kirk gaining permanent command of the Enterprise several years down the road.

    But then it's hard to have a sequel because you have to make Chris Pine look way older in every scene. It's one of those things that works best in a literary medium or in a movie you weren't planning to have a sequel to.
    I had that idea as well - and the aging process could simply be glossed over, the way they glossed over how gravity works at the end of the '09 movie. (Short version: a black hole is a place where the escape velocity exceeds the speed of light - and, until they stupidly threw away their warp core, their ship was equipped with a drive that could go faster than light. It was a total non-issue.)
    Lorna-Wing-sig.png
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    warmaker001bwarmaker001b Member Posts: 9,205 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    jonsills wrote: »
    I had that idea as well - and the aging process could simply be glossed over, the way they glossed over how gravity works at the end of the '09 movie. (Short version: a black hole is a place where the escape velocity exceeds the speed of light - and, until they stupidly threw away their warp core, their ship was equipped with a drive that could go faster than light. It was a total non-issue.)

    It's a good thing they didn't go in the Black Hole. Darth Vader and the Death Star were waiting for them.
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    psycoticvulcanpsycoticvulcan Member Posts: 4,160 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    Great. Another "Abramsverse sucks" thread. Just what the forums need. :rolleyes:
    Save the Foundry!
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    "Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
    -Thomas Marrone
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    starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,963 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    jonsills wrote: »
    words

    [offtopic]Hey, jon, as long as you're here, any chance of us seeing that maiden voyage of the Latinum Princess anytime soon?[/offtopic]
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
    — Sabaton, "Great War"
    VZ9ASdg.png

    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
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    bioixibioixi Member Posts: 764 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    In the first film they make star fleet useless with the transwarp teleport (something only starfleet has, I don't know why did they have problems with Nero, just teleport 200 photon torpedoes inside his ship from anywhere and problem solved, also, wtf happened with Earth's defenses? they are attacking San Francisco and not a single person in the academy decides to take any of the hundreds of shuttles they have to destroy the plasma drill, where are the fighter ships? where are the training starships that never leave the solar system? orbital defenses? ground defenses? the Mars supercannon? Moon fighter squadrons and ground defenses?

    In the second they cure death (also, why the hell do they need khan's blood? they have other 72 guys with the same blood in stasis, plus the first film makes the need to create better ships unnecessary, again, you have the transwarp teleport you can beam torpedoes from earth to anywhere, fleet approaching? start beaming torpedoes either inside or in front of them, problem solved.

    Oh and the enterprise falling into Earth? well, at least I'm not the only one pissed about it http://blogs.uoregon.edu/4dbio/2013/05/23/a-note-on-gravity-in-star-trek-into-darkness-spoilers/

    Yep, definitely, shoot the writers.
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    jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 10,371 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    They didn't have transwarp beaming during the Nero incident - Scotty finished his work on it as the Enterprise hid in Titan's atmosphere. And apparently in the next movie, Section 31 only built the one transwarp beamer, and it was destroyed by "John Harrison" when Kirk took his ride down with a fire hose. (I could see them doing that, too, secure in the knowledge that they had all the files hidden away - until their files were purged, which was probably set to happen automatically if they were discovered, as happened in the wake of the murder of Adm. Marcus. It's what I would have done, in their place.)
    Lorna-Wing-sig.png
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    shevetshevet Member Posts: 1,667 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    jonsills wrote: »
    They didn't have transwarp beaming during the Nero incident - Scotty finished his work on it as the Enterprise hid in Titan's atmosphere. And apparently in the next movie, Section 31 only built the one transwarp beamer, and it was destroyed by "John Harrison" when Kirk took his ride down with a fire hose. (I could see them doing that, too, secure in the knowledge that they had all the files hidden away - until their files were purged, which was probably set to happen automatically if they were discovered, as happened in the wake of the murder of Adm. Marcus. It's what I would have done, in their place.)
    That doesn't really matter, though - transwarp beaming can be done, people know it can be done, so by now some scientists and engineers somewhere are working on replicating the device.

    Very probably, some of them are Klingons, too, since the arrival of "John Harrison" on their planet must have given them furiously to think. In any case, Starfleet can't afford to assume the Klingons aren't working on it, so they have to be working on it too.
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    bioixibioixi Member Posts: 764 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    jonsills wrote: »
    They didn't have transwarp beaming during the Nero incident - Scotty finished his work on it as the Enterprise hid in Titan's atmosphere. And apparently in the next movie, Section 31 only built the one transwarp beamer, and it was destroyed by "John Harrison" when Kirk took his ride down with a fire hose. (I could see them doing that, too, secure in the knowledge that they had all the files hidden away - until their files were purged, which was probably set to happen automatically if they were discovered, as happened in the wake of the murder of Adm. Marcus. It's what I would have done, in their place.)

    The transwarp beaming does not require an special equipment it's just a formula.

    With this formula, Scott was able to beam himself and Kirk from Delta Vega to the USS Enterprise, which was traveling at high warp towards the Laurentian system, then, on Titan, he used the formula to beam into the Nerada, but instead of beaming himself he could just have beamed a lot of Torpedoes.

    Khan's transwarp transporter was just a portable transporter designed to utilize the transwarp beaming equation, it burned itself out to avoid being followed.
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    giveroffacialsgiveroffacials Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    warmaker001b wrote: »
    LOL, the Khan Magic Blood was the worst of STID. There's other dumb things about it, but the Magic Blood was epic.

    Still... I cannot decide if STID Magic Blood is worse or equal to Star Wars Midichlorians B.S.

    I'd have to say the worst was where the Klingon home world was 10 minutes away from earth, withing torpedo range of the border, and the enterprise falls almost 250,000 miles in 5 minutes propelled only by gravity which at that distance is a lot less than 1 ft/sec squared.

    Oops..almost forgot they hit the atmosphere at what would be 600,000 an hour given the distance they accelerated over and the time and even at 150 miles a second they are able to recover the ship and don't burn up like a meteor using just thrusters.
    Space the final frontier. These are the voyages of [your name here] on a five year mission to gain one level after the delta rising xp nerf.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    neoakiraiineoakiraii Member Posts: 7,468 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    giveroffacials wrote: »
    I'd have to say the worst was where the Klingon home world was 10 minutes away from earth, withing torpedo range of the border, and the enterprise falls almost 250,000 miles in 5 minutes propelled only by gravity which at that distance is a lot less than 1 ft/sec squared.

    Yeah, that was pretty stupid, I mean WTF is next? Someone is gonna tell me it takes an hour to get to the center of the galaxy, and it's protected by a barrier, and god lives there.
    GwaoHAD.png
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    giveroffacialsgiveroffacials Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    neoakiraii wrote: »
    Yeah, that was pretty stupid, I mean WTF is next? Someone is gonna tell me it takes an hour to get to the center of the galaxy, and it's protected by a barrier, and god lives there.

    Enterprise was almost as bad, it took about a day at warp 4 to get to the Klingon empire when in TOS it takes 3 months at warp 6 to get from earth to either the Klingon or Romluan empires.
    Space the final frontier. These are the voyages of [your name here] on a five year mission to gain one level after the delta rising xp nerf.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    sander233sander233 Member Posts: 3,992 Arc User
    edited December 2014
    neoakiraii wrote: »
    Yeah, that was pretty stupid, I mean WTF is next? Someone is gonna tell me it takes an hour to get to the center of the galaxy, and it's protected by a barrier, and god lives there.

    Yeah, and God needs your starship to get out. :rolleyes:
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    ...Oh, baby, you know, I've really got to leave you / Oh, I can hear it callin 'me / I said don't you hear it callin' me the way it used to do?...
    - Anne Bredon
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