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oldkhemaraa
Member Posts: 1,039 Arc User
Really, Honestly.
And this time think about trek... and think about diversity. The great bird of the galaxy would likely insist on giving the non federation factions a greater breadth of story, and epic story arcs. Making money is all well and good, but bowing to the almighty dollar is what ended up killing TOS by the end of its third season. Be a shame to see that happen to STO when there is no reason for this MMO not to have an indefinite web presence.
Don't loose the artistic vision, and the exploration of "We". You regularly "hit it out of the park" but you try too hard to force the story... and the story gets lost in the details of game mechanics... And, let me add, this stinks! Where is the Hero's journey? Where is finding the un winnable, and having to take those "Ultimate" risks?
Create missions/situations where players would absolutely have to team up with players from other factions to complete mission goals. Each of the factions should have clearly delineated faction goals and regularly added mission content that supports the faction arc, woof, and intent. And do it equally. Come on Dev's... win me back as a player.
Do something about the star ship combat system. I full realize that some folks do indeed love it, but the only place where the ship combat feels right is tier 3-4 under the current system. The ships are all different and there is some variety. One T-5 and beyond is hit the game goes nuts.
Vap builds... players can put together a combo of skills, weapons systems etc sufficient to destroy another player ship in one battle pass. Not just any ships either. Full on battleships type builds with amazing defensive capabilities... and they are still getting vaped in one pass..
Dudes! Did we miss something?
Star ships, especially large ones, are supposed to be VERY hard to kill! Damage, yes, drive out of action, or force to retreat, certainly, cripple and kill? not so easily done! (hello, the warp drive works, the shields are back up, weapons are out, Helm, Get us out of here. Maximum warp!.)
And on one other note.. the Picard Manuver is a console? The Picard Manuver was not a piece of equipment. You want to add a console? Here is one from TOS... The M5 Computer.
Next Gen? ahh, easy. Binar Crew section.. make that a console type power.. maybe you get to meet Solitaire?
Get started on STO-II and don't make the same mistakes. You want money? Here you got all this great ship art work. Give the ships fixed decks and bridge.. but oh please vary the deck plans.. and no more bridge fog on the Klingon ships... thats not fog, thats bad lighting!
(it hid the slapped together back rounds in a number of shots... hey, JJ's got his lens flare. It's really like that). And that's not even counting clothing options. And of course the normal plethora of leveling and crafting enhancements.
Oh, and fancy shmancy consoles. First, tone 'em down. Second, give ships "special" console slots. (A player ship upgrade could be as a simple and buying another special console slot for a ship.) Sets with synergy powers.. go for it, but watch them numbers CAREFULLY. Do not permit power creep.
Win me back as a player STO Dev's..
I stopped playing months ago now. I've poked and prodded at STO here and there since. But the game isn't very much fun to play. To much "game" (Vape builds, really, Vape builds?) and not nearly sufficient trek. Far far far to much combat as the ONLY way to progress the story. Very little puzzle solving (mini games are not puzzle solving.. even if they're a puzzle game.). A little bit of of brain game is needed. The detective story.. Oh. And players need to be able to get it wrong! (missions can be replayed... might even need to be to progress the story line if the player did poorly!)
There should be multiple branches to a story. Some obvious, some not obvious. A choice offer in an NPC dialog is one way. Not chasing down every last possible enemy target. It could be as simple as the more targets then absolutely needed killed, the less mission XP you get for lets say a federation player. Different factions, different choices. Players teamed could branch during play tofollow different paths and then rejoin later in the mission, with the story and rewards at that point reflecting the players joint actions. (Accolades for different results! Get them all!)
I don't see how the current incarnation of STO can get back to Trek. The games on rails heading away from that. It doesn't feel right to me any more. It really has become far to violent. Both in its play, and in the games social environment. The entertainment provided isn't very satisfying. I watched it turn that way since launch.
It's not just the current Delta Rising expansion. It's the very incomplete game universe.
The lack of Romulan Faction player content, and the not far better Klingon faction content.
I won't bother with specifics on ships. It been argued long and bitterly on these forums about whats the KDF faction has lacked since launch. The Romulans are in some way better shape ship wise. It is an issue. It's never going to go away until it is addressed some what more completely then it has been to date. I no longer believe its even feasible for the studio to even try.
Far better to start over, and build a new STO MMO thats doesn't have the flaws. Use the same base engine, and most if not all of the current assets. They're fine. Work on having a balanced experience for players no matter the faction of any specific avatar. A more interesting, engaging mission structure. And a massivly slowed down space combat system. Ground combat is kinda over done at this point. It feels... silly.
Good Luck Cryptic. I'll keep an eye on the game. But I don't expect to see what drove me away fixed. Miracles can happen though.
Khemaraa sends
And this time think about trek... and think about diversity. The great bird of the galaxy would likely insist on giving the non federation factions a greater breadth of story, and epic story arcs. Making money is all well and good, but bowing to the almighty dollar is what ended up killing TOS by the end of its third season. Be a shame to see that happen to STO when there is no reason for this MMO not to have an indefinite web presence.
Don't loose the artistic vision, and the exploration of "We". You regularly "hit it out of the park" but you try too hard to force the story... and the story gets lost in the details of game mechanics... And, let me add, this stinks! Where is the Hero's journey? Where is finding the un winnable, and having to take those "Ultimate" risks?
Create missions/situations where players would absolutely have to team up with players from other factions to complete mission goals. Each of the factions should have clearly delineated faction goals and regularly added mission content that supports the faction arc, woof, and intent. And do it equally. Come on Dev's... win me back as a player.
Do something about the star ship combat system. I full realize that some folks do indeed love it, but the only place where the ship combat feels right is tier 3-4 under the current system. The ships are all different and there is some variety. One T-5 and beyond is hit the game goes nuts.
Vap builds... players can put together a combo of skills, weapons systems etc sufficient to destroy another player ship in one battle pass. Not just any ships either. Full on battleships type builds with amazing defensive capabilities... and they are still getting vaped in one pass..
Dudes! Did we miss something?
Star ships, especially large ones, are supposed to be VERY hard to kill! Damage, yes, drive out of action, or force to retreat, certainly, cripple and kill? not so easily done! (hello, the warp drive works, the shields are back up, weapons are out, Helm, Get us out of here. Maximum warp!.)
And on one other note.. the Picard Manuver is a console? The Picard Manuver was not a piece of equipment. You want to add a console? Here is one from TOS... The M5 Computer.
Next Gen? ahh, easy. Binar Crew section.. make that a console type power.. maybe you get to meet Solitaire?
Get started on STO-II and don't make the same mistakes. You want money? Here you got all this great ship art work. Give the ships fixed decks and bridge.. but oh please vary the deck plans.. and no more bridge fog on the Klingon ships... thats not fog, thats bad lighting!
(it hid the slapped together back rounds in a number of shots... hey, JJ's got his lens flare. It's really like that). And that's not even counting clothing options. And of course the normal plethora of leveling and crafting enhancements.
Oh, and fancy shmancy consoles. First, tone 'em down. Second, give ships "special" console slots. (A player ship upgrade could be as a simple and buying another special console slot for a ship.) Sets with synergy powers.. go for it, but watch them numbers CAREFULLY. Do not permit power creep.
Win me back as a player STO Dev's..
I stopped playing months ago now. I've poked and prodded at STO here and there since. But the game isn't very much fun to play. To much "game" (Vape builds, really, Vape builds?) and not nearly sufficient trek. Far far far to much combat as the ONLY way to progress the story. Very little puzzle solving (mini games are not puzzle solving.. even if they're a puzzle game.). A little bit of of brain game is needed. The detective story.. Oh. And players need to be able to get it wrong! (missions can be replayed... might even need to be to progress the story line if the player did poorly!)
There should be multiple branches to a story. Some obvious, some not obvious. A choice offer in an NPC dialog is one way. Not chasing down every last possible enemy target. It could be as simple as the more targets then absolutely needed killed, the less mission XP you get for lets say a federation player. Different factions, different choices. Players teamed could branch during play tofollow different paths and then rejoin later in the mission, with the story and rewards at that point reflecting the players joint actions. (Accolades for different results! Get them all!)
I don't see how the current incarnation of STO can get back to Trek. The games on rails heading away from that. It doesn't feel right to me any more. It really has become far to violent. Both in its play, and in the games social environment. The entertainment provided isn't very satisfying. I watched it turn that way since launch.
It's not just the current Delta Rising expansion. It's the very incomplete game universe.
The lack of Romulan Faction player content, and the not far better Klingon faction content.
I won't bother with specifics on ships. It been argued long and bitterly on these forums about whats the KDF faction has lacked since launch. The Romulans are in some way better shape ship wise. It is an issue. It's never going to go away until it is addressed some what more completely then it has been to date. I no longer believe its even feasible for the studio to even try.
Far better to start over, and build a new STO MMO thats doesn't have the flaws. Use the same base engine, and most if not all of the current assets. They're fine. Work on having a balanced experience for players no matter the faction of any specific avatar. A more interesting, engaging mission structure. And a massivly slowed down space combat system. Ground combat is kinda over done at this point. It feels... silly.
Good Luck Cryptic. I'll keep an eye on the game. But I don't expect to see what drove me away fixed. Miracles can happen though.
Khemaraa sends
"I aim to misbehave" - Malcolm Reynolds
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http://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/10052253
Why are you not rejoicing?
what he said :rolleyes:
While STO is by far the closest i could get to the game of my dreams, it is far from what it could be.
Even a perfect STOII would not really reach that, (fully customizable ship interior with damage simulation and enough variety to be the host of as much drama as in the series, so sortof like starcitizen, but not that spacecombat focused) but it would definitely have a better go than STO now.
The problem with the current iteration is that way too much effort has gone into the combat system.
Everything is centered around it. The base game engine would need reworking if one wanted dialogue options for example to have a far bigger influence than they do at the moment. Everything is geared towards combat here.
A little shiny example of things done right is the Borg Cooperative, with their liberator weapon.
But that stuff is picked up and dropped after a single damn mission never to be heard of ever again.
I personally would want to equip it into a device slot and from then on use it on any borg ship. It will only cut down the time needed to defeat them by like 1/4, but it would be SUCH a major addition to the arsenal of the Allies.
It's just tedious now.
I've pretty much given up on that dream that cryptic will make STO more "Trek-like" and only hope that they at least tone down their money grabbing a bit (yeah right, like that's gonna happen :rolleyes:) and make this trainwreck of software at least properly playable again.
Half the mechanics in the game are either bugged, broken or useless (not sure where the crew machanic falls into, maybe all 3;)) so that would be a good thing to start with instead of making a whole new game.
Personally I think we should leave Cryptic to mess with STO. If someone were to make STO 2 then it should be a company with a better engine and more resources to do it justice.
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
'The game is too much game'.
They could also give escorts at least a full Y axis of movement (if not full 3D, I know there are reasons for that limitation) so one can loop and increase the range on the other ships so they can climb vertically rather than spiralling up and down to give better play quality.
As far as STO-II I highly doubt it, it's a nice idea but it would just be too much cost for too little return, at least if they just choose to rebuild what they've got now from the ground up they can fix a lot of things without having to remake too many assets and they can make proper documentation along the way so the devs of next month can make the adjustments they want to without breaking things.
It is simply human nature to wish and fantasize about something better than it is to actually dedicate oneself to improving what you currently have.
See: Santa Claus vs. Work
Don't forget that Tom, Jerry, and Spike have different desires as well...
I know it's the boys at the top causing the problems, but the engine is pretty outdated now (it was outdated when STO launched) and there are many better ones out there. A team of decent coders and designers with good resources and a decent EP would be a great combination for a second STO game. If you cut out the need for corporate greed as per the ST universe it would be even better. Not gonna happen with Cryptic or PW hence a different team is required and in turn a new engine that can support the necessary updates to optimise and make the game enjoyable.
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
I would like to know the specific names of these development teams that run entirely on rainbows and unicorn farts.
However there are quite a few Studio's going independent now, CD Projekt Red for one, Cloud Imperium Games, Frontier Developments, to name 3. It's an interesting scenario that the crowdfunding scene has thrown up, one which I wholeheartedly embrace. No need to pay stockholders dividends for just having had some money in the first place.
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
I'm pretty sure unicorns TRIBBLE out rainbows....
Anyway, there are and highly unlikely to be any said development teams that would even consider touching another Star Trek MMO. Another Star Trek game, maybe, but probably not as an MMO and/or F2P model.
Champs was never meant to be CoH2. It was meant to be Marvel Universe Online.
http://marvel.com/news/video_games/655/microsoft_takes_the_mu_to_a_whole_new_level
But the plug got pulled on it.
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/marvel-universe-online-officially-offline/1100-6185849/
They took what they had made, bought the Champs IP, and remade the game as Champions Online. Basically, it's a salvage effort to save what they had already made.
On topic, as much as I'd love to see STO 2, it won't happen. The base game we have here is decent enough, it just needs to be cleaned up a bit and a reverse course on the nonsense that DR gave us. I don't feel this game is beyond hope just yet.
Mine Trap Supporter
http://nicktoons.nick.com/videos/clip/the-mighty-b-episode-217-cart-b.html
You want to know what killed TOS? Low ratings. It didn't help that NBC had no idea what they had (a TV show with an audience so devout they'd even watch reruns raptly, and go to conventions, and cosplay as adults, was a brand-new concept then), and did their level best to cancel the show every season. (Trekkies invented the "write in to save the show" idea, too!). That last season the show was put on Fridays at 10pm - the "death slot". Roddenberry quit in frustration, because that was exactly what the network had promised him would not happen. Fred Frieberger, who by then had developed a rep as the person who oversaw last seasons, was hired to replace him, and it showed.
Had TOS been promoted the way shows are today, with commercial reminders and big toy pushes and conventions and whatnot, it might well have been able to garner the audience the network wanted to see. Sadly, that was not to be, because the network and the production company didn't know that the money was there to be squeezed. In short, the issue was precisely the opposite of what the OP supposes.
That was adorable and made my morning. Way more entertaining than this thread.
I've still found it funny that western players still blames an asian company... the so-called ''Evil Chinese-Overlords'' PWE as the root problem of whats going on in STO now instead of the real problem Cryptic.
Before Cryptic was bought by PWE from Atari, STO was not much of a good game like it still is now... bias for Fed faction, alot of bugs, poor mechanics and alot of this remains unchanged even to this day from the Atari era to the PWE era.
While PWE most likely did set guidlines to Cryptic to add lock boxes, it was Cryptic that introduces foreign alien ships to playable factions from which DStahl (a person use to work for Cryptic) ask CBS to add these foreign alien ships into Lock Box... which clearly shows that Cryptic making the decisions in terms what they're adding in their lock boxes... weather it's ships, traits, weapons, etc.
PWE is a marketer/publisher when it comes to STO, they do not make anything or decides what goes in STO that job goes to Cryptic... they're the ones that added all the broken mechanics, unbalanced factions, gimmicks, grinds and whatever else u can name, since after all Cryptic are the developers.
I personnally think that PWE did their part, unlike Cryptic... I will not deny the part that PWE wants more money... which all businesses do, and again if u guys want to blame sum1 for adding all the broken stuff thats been going into STO then blame the ppl who makes them and not the ones that promotes their product.
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/show/all/sCol/developerUC/sOrder/asc
...I'm curious who folks would prefer as the developer.
Curious, mainly because odds are that somebody will say X and somebody will say Hell No to X and suggest Y while somebody else will say Hell No to Y and suggest Z...etc, etc, etc.
It would provide a few brief moments of entertainment, no?