Lies! Everybody agrees with me all the time...except me, sometimes I just don't agree with some of the things I say.
But yeah, it's one thing for folks to complain about censorship and it's another to break out the freedom of speech thing. It's such a fundamental misunderstanding of the concept, one is left to wonder if folks weren't invoking their 'freedom to sleep' during any of the classes that were covering freedom of speech.
Yeah and it appears your post count won't be climbing as fast anymore.
And to the freedom speech issue people keep bringing up, Cryptic is not a government agency and are not required to uphold our freedom of speech rights by law. They can pretty much do whatever they like but with that comes the backlash of the community. In most previous cases of, well any entity trying to censor some group of people, it never goes well for said entity.
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And someone who has you handcuffed to a radiator can hit you with a shovel. The irrelevant facts are irrelevant in a discussion of whether something is right or wrong, whether it reflects well or poorly, whether it earns business or earns scorn, whether it should be rewarded or punished.
There is a difference between right and wrong which is completely seperate from what someone "has the right," or worse, "has the power" to do.
Actually that would be against the law on both counts. This forum is classed as the private property of Cryptic/PWE and they can set what rules they want and to shut it down.
I do not agree with their actions, I am hoping the 300sec cooldown is a mistake. If not then they really need to look at who is making these decisions as they have no concept of PR or how powerful word of mouth is as a form of advertising, expecially on the negative side. If it was the EP I will say I won't be suprised given his poor attempt at "explaining" what happened recently.
I have said things against decisions made by the higher ups and I don't think I have ever been moderated for doing so. I wasn't affected by the recent "problem" but I found their actions a tad over the top and they made the wrong decision there.
If nothing else it's kind of funny they decide to start all these pointless conflicts in a community with die-hard fans.
I've come to wonder if it is because they operate on bitter memories like when al rivera got upset people didn't compliment his extra inventory window but flamed the doff UI instead, and then resented the players and started flaming them.
What else can explain it?
Just seems to me the majority of star trek geeks, no offense anyone, are pretty mild tempered and rational, minus the choice of words, and so you'd actively have to go out of your way to try and make them displeased with your star trek game.
For example, yeah let's go ahead and just delete exploration - it's not like anyone ever held a flag up for exploration at any point like wtf was that about, did that really happen
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
First off, I had no idea that Cryptic was Congress, or that their mods were the government.
Secondly, some of you haven't exactly been peaceably assembling.
The gripping hand is, the First Amendment applies only to actions of the United States government, and by extension all levels of government in the US. Cryptic Studios is not a level of government, they are a private corporation, and they can decide who gets to say what here in their forums. They would be perfectly within their rights to decree that any posting that doesn't sing the praises of the entire dev team in every sentence be deleted from these pages. It might be ethically questionable, but it would hardly be legally actionable.
If you want the freedom to say whatever you want, go start your own forum. Who knows - it might even get as popular as the Champions Proboard. Because you might also note in the text of the First Amendment above that while the government can't abridge your freedom of speech, neither are they required to provide you with a soapbox. And neither is Cryptic.
At least in America, there is freedom to speak out if you do so without "insulting" others. Shouldn't that concept hold true still in any business practice since it owes it that much to their customers?
The Bill of Rights is a restriction on the Federal Government only.
The 14th applies it to the states, but the 14th is not in the Bill of Rights.
(McDonald v. Chicago, District of Columbia v. Heller, etc.)
you have proof that they arnt or are you just making assumptions?
does cryptic have prrof that they ALL were? has cryptic ever and i mean EVER been able to throw together a script in a few days that could be as accurate as they claim? has cryptic not lied before? experience with cryptic, the fact tht there are a ton of posts decrying players complicity in a NON EXPLOIT. it was cryptics broken stuff that caused it in the first place...but typically cryptic 'it's not our fault it's the players'
so even if they managed to throw together something the entire exploit business is complete BS. players weren't playing the way cryptic wanted, and got punished...a few innocents in there? they don't care. did they actually check by hand as the EP claimed? hundreds of tickets? rofl cryptic/pwe customer service works no where near that fast. so unless you have your head firmly entrenched in certain nether regions...it's kind of obvious it's a white wash.
unless of course you're one of those that thinks cryptics perfect and never BS's the players...
and who is forcing you to buy a T5 ship now, you may have paid for it before but that like buying a chair and seeing it half price a year later and demanding you get some of your money back.
that analogy blows, try buying a car and a year later having to upgrade that car to to APPROXIMATELY the new versions specs for more money. there's nothing 'half price' you pay full price, and then pay over a fifth of the price again vs buying the new model which is cheaper.
if you buy one now you know it will cost more to upgrade so if you do its your own fault, and many people expected the T6 ships to be 3k.
uh, news flash, me...and most likely quite a few people on these forums aren't newbs. i bought my t5's ages ago, kar'fi, bort command cruiser, armi, avenger, mogh, and the falchion. the mogh and the avenger being the 2 latest additions but still before info about rising hit...so care to explain to me how it's my own or any others players fault that cryptic changed the game? /facepalm you should give up white knighting...you suck at it and i'm not even half way through replying yet.
i wont lie this is a TRIBBLE thing hell rommies doesnt even get to play a Talaxian
that never works and if you looked at other threds many people arnt interested in making one for their hatred of the species.
Dil is not hard to get granted you cant get it all in one day but it has made me think that many of the cry babies about dil nerf just want it all and want it now.
dil isn't hard to get...there's 2 halves to dil, getting it and refining it...so you missed a key point. fed side it is difficult to accrue, sure you can hit the cap per day refinement on one character, but that 8k is a drop in a vast bucket when you add up everything you need dil FOR. and that's it, you have 8k a day IF you farm for that 8k every day.
but hey...you can buy zen and throw it up on the exchange to get around the refinement cap...
They are far from perfect after all i agree that advanced it to elite, but unless they quote saying "we are not doing anything about it" then this is just wild speculation, i have played mmos for a long time and i know that the most toxic threads are from either lack of communication from devs about something or players making wild assumptions about a company.
finally, if cryptic was actually doing something about it they'd be announcing it as it would calm several of the forum fires. they aren't. they are how ever trying to distract players with shinys, events, bonuses, extra playable races, etc. they even locked the thread the EP posted in.
they're hoping this all just goes away without them doing anything to modify any of it. and they have good reason to believe that it will since there has been minor uproars in the past that slowly faded.
players remember though, cryptic can think we're helmet wearing window lickers that will tolerate anything, remember nothing of previous fiascos and will keep playing and spending regardless. not all of us are like that though. i remember S7 when cryptic discovered the dil<>zen teat. and they have continuously added more and more dil costs since then. oh, they also reduced the dil rewards..that they did reverse later.
which was in their own best interests...reducing dil rewards is a bad BAD idea as it directly effects the exchange economy especially with everything costing so much dil to advance in the game.
Dr. Patricia Tanis ~ "Bacon is for sycophants and products of incest."
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
First off, I had no idea that Cryptic was Congress, or that their mods were the government.
Secondly, some of you haven't exactly been peaceably assembling.
The gripping hand is, the First Amendment applies only to actions of the United States government, and by extension all levels of government in the US. Cryptic Studios is not a level of government, they are a private corporation, and they can decide who gets to say what here in their forums. They would be perfectly within their rights to decree that any posting that doesn't sing the praises of the entire dev team in every sentence be deleted from these pages. It might be ethically questionable, but it would hardly be legally actionable.
If you want the freedom to say whatever you want, go start your own forum. Who knows - it might even get as popular as the Champions Proboard. Because you might also note in the text of the First Amendment above that while the government can't abridge your freedom of speech, neither are they required to provide you with a soapbox. And neither is Cryptic.
You're right, Cryptic is not bound by the constitution to uphold the freedom of speech as I have already mentioned earlier, however is it a good idea what Cryptic has done here?
To the peaceably assemble issue, I think this statement is irrelevant, unless you can point to some damning post that exists where harm was threatened by a poster. The use of curse words is perfectly legal in the right context but back to your earlier point Cryptic is not a government agency so they can silence whoever they like and enforce bans, lock threads as they see fit.
The peaceably assemble clause is part of the constitution and applies only to government agencies and how they interact with the people. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too.
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Disturbing trend from those who wish to silence public opinion here in the forums. Yes, I know this is a private company and Cryptic can do whatever they want with your freedom.
At least in America, there is freedom to speak out if you do so without "insulting" others. Shouldn't that concept hold true still in any business practice since it owes it that much to their customers?
While creating websites for my various clients, I encourage them to not include a comment section and/or forums. Since consumer feedback can be a blessing and a curse, the only way to control public relations is to not provide a comment section.
*shrugs*
Websites are 'privately' owned property. Even though the internet is 'technically' free, the reality is that each website is a privately owned pieces of real estate. Cryptic has a right to include or remove the forums and/or comment sections.
I own several pieces of online real estate. I 'intentionally' leave out a comment section. Sure, I attach a Twitter account to all of my sites; however, I can delete the account without affecting the core sites.
While creating websites for my various clients, I encourage them to not include a comment section and/or forums. Since consumer feedback can be a blessing and a curse, the only way to control everything is to not provide a comment section.
*shrugs*
To that I say, man up Cryptic! If they can't handle a little criticism that's their problem. It's suited them just fine to ignore us consistently in the past, so what's changed this time? Are they trying to break up with us and it's just easier to do if they get us upset with them first?
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To that I say, man up Cryptic! If they can't handle a little criticism that's their problem. It's suited them just fine to ignore us consistently in the past, so what's changed this time? Are they trying to break up with us and it's just easier to do if they get us upset with them first?
Negative comments can damage a company's brand. If the negative comments are causing any damage, Cryptic may be trying to retake the overall message.
Remember, 'Star Trek: Online' is not owned by Cryptic.
Someone in Cryptic's marketing department is only looking out for the brand.
Even though I disagree with the new upgrades, I can fully understand why Cryptic is cracking down.
Everyone is reacting to information at a hundred miles per hour.
Negative comments can damage a company's brand. If the negative comments are causing any damage, Cryptic may be trying to retake the overall message.
Remember, 'Star Trek: Online' is not owned by Cryptic.
Someone in Cryptic's marketing department is only looking out for the brand.
Even though I disagree with the new upgrades, I can fully understand why Cryptic is cracking down.
Everyone is reacting to information at a hundred miles per hour.
We all have to breath and slowdown.
you understand why cryptic is cracking down...even though it's the worst thing to do. all it does it tick players with grievances off even more. worse...it's been tried by other publishers/developers of mmo's before, many times and has always been an outright failure..worse than a failure actually because if players can't talk about what bugs them here they do it elsewhere, and word of mouth (or text of hand) spreads. keeping it contained in the forums is a better solution. cryptic having a straight up convo rather than talking down to players or throwing out what they consider absolute figures of authority (the EP's post) which only the sycophants consider a god.
@cryptic/pwe
players aren't employees, they don't care about your rank within a company unless you can get things done. players are your employers, we pay you and you work for us.
Dr. Patricia Tanis ~ "Bacon is for sycophants and products of incest."
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
Negative comments can damage a company's brand. If the negative comments are causing any damage, Cryptic may be trying to retake the overall message.
Remember, 'Star Trek: Online' is not owned by Cryptic.
Someone in Cryptic's marketing department is only looking out for the brand.
Even though I disagree with the new upgrades, I can fully understand why Cryptic is cracking down.
Everyone is reacting to information at a hundred miles per hour.
We all have to breath and slowdown.
I get that the Cryptic Marketing Team are in effect trying to control the fall out by putting place bans, 5 minute response timers etc etc and i would do the same thing here if i was to be honest.
The bigger problem with all of this though is they are not controlling this at the source, we have Devs rage posting and EP's posting complete garbage slandering their community, enforced roll backs etc etc
It is of my opinion that if you want to control any fall out then do not let these people make posts as they come across as somewhat aggressive and arrogant without any forethought put in, it should be the community managers and their teams job to post this stuff as it falls on them to post it in a way without causing a total nuclear reaction.
Granted some people will go up in arms about it but the theory is with a well constructed post that number will be a lot less than has currently been over the past week.
I am not saying i am not accountable to any of this as some of my posts have been on that thin line in with the rage club but i honestly doubt i would have made any comments if the original posts had actually been any where near an acceptable rage less standard.
This has all been a complete shambles from the outset and posts saying Devs have feelings etc that is great but they are meant to be professional, don't like something don't post throwing your toys out of the pram.
I mean really it is just raging at those that pay their wages at the end of the day, i don't know about in the US but in the UK a lot of company's will take a very dim view of this behaviour.
We have a saying "The customer is always right" we all know that simply is not the case but you do not go into battle with them head strong you make them see reason.
I worked in retail one time and had to deal with people like me and wow was that a really [insert lots of expletives here] type of job, NEVER AGAIN!
I get that the Cryptic Marketing Team are in effect trying to control the fall out by putting place bans, 5 minute response timers etc etc and i would do the same thing here if i was to be honest.
Cryptic does have a Facebook and Twitter account. While there may be a forum response timer, people can put a comment on Facebook and Twitter. Everyone's voice can still be heard.
At this point in the game, Cryptic has heard everyone's concerns.
Maybe they are working on something?
*shrugs*
We have to give Cryptic time to react and respond. One simple forum post is not going to solve everything. I would give Cryptic some time to think.
Cryptic does have a Facebook and Twitter account. While there may be a forum response timer, people can put a comment on Facebook and Twitter. Everyone's voice can still be heard.
At this point in the game, Cryptic has heard everyone's concerns.
Maybe they are working on something?
*shrugs*
We have to give Cryptic time to react and respond. One simple forum post is not going to solve everything. I would give Cryptic some time to think.
We all need to think with a clear mind.
wtf? where to even start...
cryptics had time and they have responded for one
secondly...get off it, or are you trying to say that everyone who is posting their grievances are lunatics? unable to think clearly? that somehow you are one of the only voices of reason and the rest of us can't think straight? what an egotistical insulting assumption. just wow.
Dr. Patricia Tanis ~ "Bacon is for sycophants and products of incest."
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
sorry, but the OP is wrong in the sense that this is NOT a public space for discussion. This is the official STO forum, owned by cryptic.
There is a distinct difference between a public and privately owned forum.
If you opinion doesn't "please" the owner of this private forum, he/she has every right to pull it off the forum.
At least in America, there is freedom to speak out if you do so without "insulting" others. Shouldn't that concept hold true still in any business practice since it owes it that much to their customers?
I'm gonna stop you right there.
What are the first five words of the First amendment?
"Congress shall make no law..."
The Freedom of speech you find in the constitution is not absolute. It is a protection against government limitations on speech. A privately run website is considered private property, and it's owners can control speech all it wants.
For example, the website Angie's List. If you are a paid advertiser on Angie's list and someone writes a bad review about you, you can have that review taken down.
Everywhere I look, people are screaming about how bad Cryptic is.
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
Negative comments can damage a company's brand. If the negative comments are causing any damage, Cryptic may be trying to retake the overall message.
Remember, 'Star Trek: Online' is not owned by Cryptic.
Someone in Cryptic's marketing department is only looking out for the brand.
Even though I disagree with the new upgrades, I can fully understand why Cryptic is cracking down.
Everyone is reacting to information at a hundred miles per hour.
We all have to breath and slowdown.
Well maybe instead of trying to silence its player base because they might hurt the brand, why don't they fix their problems in game, that is the root cause of any damage to the brand.
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sorry, but the OP is wrong in the sense that this is NOT a public space for discussion. This is the official STO forum, owned by cryptic.
There is a distinct difference between a public and privately owned forum.
I somewhat disagree, only because I think we don't agree on the purpose of this particular forum. You see it as property of the company, which is fine, but I see it as a public relations part of the company that encourages conversation with its player base. Otherwise, having a forum is a waste of time.
We ran into this in the old days of Ultima Online, where I used to be a huge poster in that forum. At some point, the company made some bad decisions that caused people to quit. The discussion became heated. The mods started shutting down the conversation, using the "we own the forums" mentality. What happened was that the majority of the player base went to alternative forums and continued the conversation, and the mods no longer even had an input on the conversation. Eventually, as their own forums died, they started creating identities on the alternative forums because that was the only place they could get their word out. Eventually, a new set of devs/mods took over and appealed to the people to join their "new" forum, which is eventually what happened. New rules were instituted, and conversation was continued, but it was a less "we own these forums" approach until about the time that the game developers made some horrific decisions and the game lost the majority of its diehard population.
We're kind of there now with STO. Sure, the devs/mods can turn all anti-player if they want, but that's just going to cause the players to revolt by either discussing the game elsewhere, or leaving the game completely. World of ******** ran into that problem a few years ago and never really got passed it.
IGN ran into that a few years back, turning draconian on its message boards until the people who posted on those boards left and formed their own boards. I was one of their mods back then and jumped ship with the players to a new forum where I became a moderator there instead. Sometimes, that just happens because people aren't on message boards to toe the company line. They are there to discuss the product, and hopefully interject with things they hope will make the game better. Some do it better than others; others are horrible at it. That's a consensus and a community.
As for the problems this game is having right now, I assume the people who run the company are not stupid but will start to realize they've alienated a lot of their player base and will then respond to alleviate these problems. Otherwise, they fail and will be looking for other jobs.
My issues are not as strong as others, but as someone who spends a LOT of money on this game, I have decided to abstain from further spending until they decide to provide some value for the things I'm spending on. $30 for a top tier ship is a ripoff, to me, especially when a lifetime membership no longer gives me an automatic top end ship once I achieve the top level in the game. That's something that changed, and no amount of "it's a free to play game unless it's not" is going to make me feel better about realizing that I"m now being told I have to pay money in order to have the higher end ship. The original reasons for buying ships were mostly cosmetic, then they became slightly functional. Now, it's imperative. The alternative is to go into stand by mode and do nothing until the company tries to make things right. And if not, then they will lose a lot of people who are comfortable with spending a lot of money on this game. We're just not comfortable whenever we feel we're being taken advantage of or ripped off.
On a message board where the devs are paying attention to the player base, you'd hope they'd listen rather than just dictate and close threads.
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Comments
Yeah and it appears your post count won't be climbing as fast anymore.
And to the freedom speech issue people keep bringing up, Cryptic is not a government agency and are not required to uphold our freedom of speech rights by law. They can pretty much do whatever they like but with that comes the backlash of the community. In most previous cases of, well any entity trying to censor some group of people, it never goes well for said entity.
[SIGPIC]Click here to visit my STO YouTube channel[/SIGPIC]
Actually that would be against the law on both counts. This forum is classed as the private property of Cryptic/PWE and they can set what rules they want and to shut it down.
I do not agree with their actions, I am hoping the 300sec cooldown is a mistake. If not then they really need to look at who is making these decisions as they have no concept of PR or how powerful word of mouth is as a form of advertising, expecially on the negative side. If it was the EP I will say I won't be suprised given his poor attempt at "explaining" what happened recently.
I have said things against decisions made by the higher ups and I don't think I have ever been moderated for doing so. I wasn't affected by the recent "problem" but I found their actions a tad over the top and they made the wrong decision there.
Question is if they ought to or not.
If nothing else it's kind of funny they decide to start all these pointless conflicts in a community with die-hard fans.
I've come to wonder if it is because they operate on bitter memories like when al rivera got upset people didn't compliment his extra inventory window but flamed the doff UI instead, and then resented the players and started flaming them.
What else can explain it?
Just seems to me the majority of star trek geeks, no offense anyone, are pretty mild tempered and rational, minus the choice of words, and so you'd actively have to go out of your way to try and make them displeased with your star trek game.
For example, yeah let's go ahead and just delete exploration - it's not like anyone ever held a flag up for exploration at any point like wtf was that about, did that really happen
First off, I had no idea that Cryptic was Congress, or that their mods were the government.
Secondly, some of you haven't exactly been peaceably assembling.
The gripping hand is, the First Amendment applies only to actions of the United States government, and by extension all levels of government in the US. Cryptic Studios is not a level of government, they are a private corporation, and they can decide who gets to say what here in their forums. They would be perfectly within their rights to decree that any posting that doesn't sing the praises of the entire dev team in every sentence be deleted from these pages. It might be ethically questionable, but it would hardly be legally actionable.
If you want the freedom to say whatever you want, go start your own forum. Who knows - it might even get as popular as the Champions Proboard. Because you might also note in the text of the First Amendment above that while the government can't abridge your freedom of speech, neither are they required to provide you with a soapbox. And neither is Cryptic.
Well you do, since you posting
And that's kind of strange since all you developer apologist don't hesitate to praise every element of the game - why are you caring?
If anyone should be not posting, not caring and just playing it should be you
So "who cares" well that's a really odd question in several ways
I only say this out of concern for the well-being of my fellow players...
The Bill of Rights is a restriction on the Federal Government only.
The 14th applies it to the states, but the 14th is not in the Bill of Rights.
(McDonald v. Chicago, District of Columbia v. Heller, etc.)
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finally, if cryptic was actually doing something about it they'd be announcing it as it would calm several of the forum fires. they aren't. they are how ever trying to distract players with shinys, events, bonuses, extra playable races, etc. they even locked the thread the EP posted in.
they're hoping this all just goes away without them doing anything to modify any of it. and they have good reason to believe that it will since there has been minor uproars in the past that slowly faded.
players remember though, cryptic can think we're helmet wearing window lickers that will tolerate anything, remember nothing of previous fiascos and will keep playing and spending regardless. not all of us are like that though. i remember S7 when cryptic discovered the dil<>zen teat. and they have continuously added more and more dil costs since then. oh, they also reduced the dil rewards..that they did reverse later.
which was in their own best interests...reducing dil rewards is a bad BAD idea as it directly effects the exchange economy especially with everything costing so much dil to advance in the game.
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
You're right, Cryptic is not bound by the constitution to uphold the freedom of speech as I have already mentioned earlier, however is it a good idea what Cryptic has done here?
To the peaceably assemble issue, I think this statement is irrelevant, unless you can point to some damning post that exists where harm was threatened by a poster. The use of curse words is perfectly legal in the right context but back to your earlier point Cryptic is not a government agency so they can silence whoever they like and enforce bans, lock threads as they see fit.
The peaceably assemble clause is part of the constitution and applies only to government agencies and how they interact with the people. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too.
[SIGPIC]Click here to visit my STO YouTube channel[/SIGPIC]
*shrugs*
Websites are 'privately' owned property. Even though the internet is 'technically' free, the reality is that each website is a privately owned pieces of real estate. Cryptic has a right to include or remove the forums and/or comment sections.
I own several pieces of online real estate. I 'intentionally' leave out a comment section. Sure, I attach a Twitter account to all of my sites; however, I can delete the account without affecting the core sites.
To that I say, man up Cryptic! If they can't handle a little criticism that's their problem. It's suited them just fine to ignore us consistently in the past, so what's changed this time? Are they trying to break up with us and it's just easier to do if they get us upset with them first?
[SIGPIC]Click here to visit my STO YouTube channel[/SIGPIC]
Remember, 'Star Trek: Online' is not owned by Cryptic.
Someone in Cryptic's marketing department is only looking out for the brand.
Even though I disagree with the new upgrades, I can fully understand why Cryptic is cracking down.
Everyone is reacting to information at a hundred miles per hour.
We all have to breath and slowdown.
Either way I don't give a damn anymore....or a dollar to PWE.
you understand why cryptic is cracking down...even though it's the worst thing to do. all it does it tick players with grievances off even more. worse...it's been tried by other publishers/developers of mmo's before, many times and has always been an outright failure..worse than a failure actually because if players can't talk about what bugs them here they do it elsewhere, and word of mouth (or text of hand) spreads. keeping it contained in the forums is a better solution. cryptic having a straight up convo rather than talking down to players or throwing out what they consider absolute figures of authority (the EP's post) which only the sycophants consider a god.
@cryptic/pwe
players aren't employees, they don't care about your rank within a company unless you can get things done. players are your employers, we pay you and you work for us.
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
I get that the Cryptic Marketing Team are in effect trying to control the fall out by putting place bans, 5 minute response timers etc etc and i would do the same thing here if i was to be honest.
The bigger problem with all of this though is they are not controlling this at the source, we have Devs rage posting and EP's posting complete garbage slandering their community, enforced roll backs etc etc
It is of my opinion that if you want to control any fall out then do not let these people make posts as they come across as somewhat aggressive and arrogant without any forethought put in, it should be the community managers and their teams job to post this stuff as it falls on them to post it in a way without causing a total nuclear reaction.
Granted some people will go up in arms about it but the theory is with a well constructed post that number will be a lot less than has currently been over the past week.
I am not saying i am not accountable to any of this as some of my posts have been on that thin line in with the rage club but i honestly doubt i would have made any comments if the original posts had actually been any where near an acceptable rage less standard.
This has all been a complete shambles from the outset and posts saying Devs have feelings etc that is great but they are meant to be professional, don't like something don't post throwing your toys out of the pram.
I mean really it is just raging at those that pay their wages at the end of the day, i don't know about in the US but in the UK a lot of company's will take a very dim view of this behaviour.
We have a saying "The customer is always right" we all know that simply is not the case but you do not go into battle with them head strong you make them see reason.
I worked in retail one time and had to deal with people like me
At this point in the game, Cryptic has heard everyone's concerns.
Maybe they are working on something?
*shrugs*
We have to give Cryptic time to react and respond. One simple forum post is not going to solve everything. I would give Cryptic some time to think.
We all need to think with a clear mind.
wtf? where to even start...
cryptics had time and they have responded for one
secondly...get off it, or are you trying to say that everyone who is posting their grievances are lunatics? unable to think clearly? that somehow you are one of the only voices of reason and the rest of us can't think straight? what an egotistical insulting assumption. just wow.
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
There is a distinct difference between a public and privately owned forum.
If you opinion doesn't "please" the owner of this private forum, he/she has every right to pull it off the forum.
I'm gonna stop you right there.
What are the first five words of the First amendment?
"Congress shall make no law..."
The Freedom of speech you find in the constitution is not absolute. It is a protection against government limitations on speech. A privately run website is considered private property, and it's owners can control speech all it wants.
For example, the website Angie's List. If you are a paid advertiser on Angie's list and someone writes a bad review about you, you can have that review taken down.
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
Well maybe instead of trying to silence its player base because they might hurt the brand, why don't they fix their problems in game, that is the root cause of any damage to the brand.
[SIGPIC]Click here to visit my STO YouTube channel[/SIGPIC]
I somewhat disagree, only because I think we don't agree on the purpose of this particular forum. You see it as property of the company, which is fine, but I see it as a public relations part of the company that encourages conversation with its player base. Otherwise, having a forum is a waste of time.
We ran into this in the old days of Ultima Online, where I used to be a huge poster in that forum. At some point, the company made some bad decisions that caused people to quit. The discussion became heated. The mods started shutting down the conversation, using the "we own the forums" mentality. What happened was that the majority of the player base went to alternative forums and continued the conversation, and the mods no longer even had an input on the conversation. Eventually, as their own forums died, they started creating identities on the alternative forums because that was the only place they could get their word out. Eventually, a new set of devs/mods took over and appealed to the people to join their "new" forum, which is eventually what happened. New rules were instituted, and conversation was continued, but it was a less "we own these forums" approach until about the time that the game developers made some horrific decisions and the game lost the majority of its diehard population.
We're kind of there now with STO. Sure, the devs/mods can turn all anti-player if they want, but that's just going to cause the players to revolt by either discussing the game elsewhere, or leaving the game completely. World of ******** ran into that problem a few years ago and never really got passed it.
IGN ran into that a few years back, turning draconian on its message boards until the people who posted on those boards left and formed their own boards. I was one of their mods back then and jumped ship with the players to a new forum where I became a moderator there instead. Sometimes, that just happens because people aren't on message boards to toe the company line. They are there to discuss the product, and hopefully interject with things they hope will make the game better. Some do it better than others; others are horrible at it. That's a consensus and a community.
As for the problems this game is having right now, I assume the people who run the company are not stupid but will start to realize they've alienated a lot of their player base and will then respond to alleviate these problems. Otherwise, they fail and will be looking for other jobs.
My issues are not as strong as others, but as someone who spends a LOT of money on this game, I have decided to abstain from further spending until they decide to provide some value for the things I'm spending on. $30 for a top tier ship is a ripoff, to me, especially when a lifetime membership no longer gives me an automatic top end ship once I achieve the top level in the game. That's something that changed, and no amount of "it's a free to play game unless it's not" is going to make me feel better about realizing that I"m now being told I have to pay money in order to have the higher end ship. The original reasons for buying ships were mostly cosmetic, then they became slightly functional. Now, it's imperative. The alternative is to go into stand by mode and do nothing until the company tries to make things right. And if not, then they will lose a lot of people who are comfortable with spending a lot of money on this game. We're just not comfortable whenever we feel we're being taken advantage of or ripped off.
On a message board where the devs are paying attention to the player base, you'd hope they'd listen rather than just dictate and close threads.
Fleet Admiral Ventaxa Proxmire, U.S.S. Shaka Walls Fell
Blog: http://www.sarbonn.com/?page_id=1990
Foundry series: Bob From Accounting & For the Sake of the Empire