I think the drop rate of the very rare crafting mats is definitely too low, and the crafting mats haven't convinced people yet that they need to run the other queued events more. And if the Elite Queues will end up being as hard as they promise, then extra rewards there won't help many people. But on the plus side - it would be an extra reward for managing to beat Elite, because you can use or sell those drops. If you consider this a plus side.
Well, I finally decided to give the revamped crafting system a shot on two of my toons. I figure it is not worth doing on my other three toons since that would simply make it too much of a grind. I guess I will get to level 15 sometime in January or February 2015 if I more or less do the daily project on a regular basis.
Level half of the skills on one toon, and the other on another toon. That way, you can use all the Crafting Slots and advance reasonably fast. Of course, you could also split it across more characters, not utilizing all slots, but in turn being able to level every school at max.
Now, if you want the trait unlock, you're out of luck, but if you only want to be able to craft everything that could be interesting to craft, this will get you covered. And it doesn't take an effort, unless you're not already playing daily (then you either have to start doing that, or accept that it will take longer for you).
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
Level half of the skills on one toon, and the other on another toon. That way, you can use all the Crafting Slots and advance reasonably fast. Of course, you could also split it across more characters, not utilizing all slots, but in turn being able to level every school at max.
Now, if you want the trait unlock, you're out of luck, but if you only want to be able to craft everything that could be interesting to craft, this will get you covered. And it doesn't take an effort, unless you're not already playing daily (then you either have to start doing that, or accept that it will take longer for you).
Maybe I will loop in my Fed Science and KDF Engineer toons later, but for now the above two toons should be fine since they only have blue and purple Doffs. Fed has 400 Doffs while KDF has 300 Doffs, however I have contemplated boosting them both to 500 Doff slots over that last couple of months so that I can collect more Doffs.
I'll get around to unlocking the trait on both toons since I plan on having them master all the schools... assuming I do not abandon the crafting system out of boredom / frustration like I did with the previous crafting system.
Try making a few MK X's daily along with the 6k project.
Lets say, you can make 2x each project daily and the 6K one, and you have 5 slots (in the beginning you will have less, but you catch up fast).
6000 + (4*1800) + (4*1800) = 20400 daily.
630000 / 20400 = 30 days
so in 105 days, you can finish 3 schools like this instead, and be more than half through the 4'th... Not a single dil or catalyst spend.
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll try it out once I more open slots.
I suppose I should keep some of the Resource Box from the STFs rather than selling 'em all... which has made me some decent EC. Except for my Romulan toon all boxes will be sold to raise EC to buy a Plasmonic Leech because I really hate the fact that 40 power points are sacrificed for singularity abilities which I find are at best gimmicky... Unless I get really, really frustrated at which point I will strip anything of value then delete the Romulan toon to create another Fed or KDF toon.
Actually, I have had a few of the VR materials show up in the academy doff assignment. If you are able to do this on any alts, they can help add to your stockpile.
I've been doing this religiously and, so far, it's actually been my best source of very rare materials, not to mention it's pretty common to receive very rare components as well...
Its not a grind. If you can't grind for something. Like the OP said, they are just way,way,way,way too rare. The other day I ran the Borg stfs 6 times for very rare crafting materials. I did not get one. So I got frustrated and bought them off the exchange. I talked to a few ppl and came to the conclusion that most ppl are buyihg the 1000zen R&D pack and selling the items from it. Cryptic has made the drop rate of very rare R&D items so rare, to have any, you need to buy them. Unless of course your very lucky. They need to go back and redo the drop rate. I feel sorry for ppl who can't afford to spend money on the game.
P.S. You know what they say about ppl who use the word assume don't you?
You have your answer. In building the crafting system the way they have, Cryptic has managed to find another avenue to "reward" zen purchasers over the common player and turn a nifty profit. Business basics - the customer isn't always right, but the paying customers are!
I hate to be pessimistic about it all but lets look at the facts: a sudden drive in a NEW CRAFTING SYSTEM gets everyone giddy they race out and start building up their skills finally! A way to earn REAL in-game currency and feel good about producing something on your own! But wait those genuinely valuable items, the ones that everyone wants, those require substantial rare particles/components which, as it just happens, has a low drop rate on specific STFs only. Good luck.
OR spend some zen, get the packs and your chances of getting these components goes way up!
It comes down to the fact of life: money rules.
Unless anyone can provide a logical argument that this is not the case?
You have your answer. In building the crafting system the way they have, Cryptic has managed to find another avenue to "reward" zen purchasers over the common player and turn a nifty profit. Business basics - the customer isn't always right, but the paying customers are!
I hate to be pessimistic about it all but lets look at the facts: a sudden drive in a NEW CRAFTING SYSTEM gets everyone giddy they race out and start building up their skills finally! A way to earn REAL in-game currency and feel good about producing something on your own! But wait those genuinely valuable items, the ones that everyone wants, those require substantial rare particles/components which, as it just happens, has a low drop rate on specific STFs only. Good luck.
OR spend some zen, get the packs and your chances of getting these components goes way up!
It comes down to the fact of life: money rules.
Unless anyone can provide a logical argument that this is not the case?
So, in your mind, the 'common players' are those people who refuse to spend money on the Zen store, seemingly expecting everything be provided free of charge (and usually free of effort) and Cryptic can do this how?
Cryptic are not a charity... They are a business... They exist to make money for their owner/share holders... Without that profit, they do not exist...
If STO consisted merely of 'common players' (using your definition) it would have closed it's servers a long time ago as no one would be spending a cent on STO...
Yet, it seems when ever Cryptic make a move to generate revenue (and in doing so keep the servers running) the 'common players' come out in droves to attack them for it...
I'm sorry, but your entitlement is showing through...
So, in your mind, the 'common players' are those people who refuse to spend money on the Zen store, seemingly expecting everything be provided free of charge (and usually free of effort) and Cryptic can do this how?
Cryptic are not a charity... They are a business... They exist to make money for their owner/share holders... Without that profit, they do not exist...
If STO consisted merely of 'common players' (using your definition) it would have closed it's servers a long time ago as no one would be spending a cent on STO...
Yet, it seems when ever Cryptic make a move to generate revenue (and in doing so keep the servers running) the 'common players' come out in droves to attack them for it...
I'm sorry, but your entitlement is showing through...
No, and I apologize if that was what you gleaned from my comment, although you really shouldnt leap to judge someone you obviously dont know nor slap labels onto things you do not fully understand.
The Common Player, in my mind, doesnt mind paying for some zen every once and again. They know that in order for Cryptic to keep the game available they must make some income to do so. I, myself, have bought zen on occasion.
However, the difference between the common player and what we may assume is Cryptics target audience with the crafting shenanigans is that they are those who HAVE to be leet in everything STO, including crafting and wealth. They dont have a problem dropping hundreds of dollar, if not more, to accomplish this. Now, we cant blame them for this; its their money to do with as they please. To assume that this faction represents the common player is a misconception at its finest.
If you prefer to follow what you have essentially defined as trickle-down economics that is, again your prerogative (despite the fact it has been proven to fail repeatedly). However, do not instantly assume that we, the true common players have any misgivings concerning entitlement. We pay our dues (zen), but may not lay down obnoxious amounts of cash to do so nor rush out to buy every new thing the instant it hits the store all we ask for is a balanced system where we are not penalized for choosing NOT to spend cash so freely. I really dont see how that can be considered a sense of entitlement. If you want to keep an edge so that the zen player gets more components, fine, but raise the drop rate for the rest of us so we arent forced to spend that cash just to compete.
But wait those genuinely valuable items, the ones that everyone wants, those require substantial rare particles/components which, as it just happens, has a low drop rate on specific STFs only. Good luck.
"Rare" and "Very Rare" are terms that are open to interpretation to a certain degree.
Rare could be 1 in 25k. Very Rare could be 1 in 75k. Ultra rare could be 1 in 150k. It is a lottery and like all lotteries are is only a small change of winning the jackpot. The larger the jackpot the smaller your chances. Unlike the lottery, in STO and many other MMOs real cash can help attain the jackpot now instead of hoping that the next box you open will have what you need.
Crafting is an optional game element you either do it or you don't. If you want to craft then you need to accept the fact there is a grind because you are not going to be able to get all the components necessary to craft whatever. The fast track to purchase the items from the Exchange if you have enough EC to cover the asking price. The very fast track is to purchase said items from the C-Store. However, purchasing from the Exchange or C-Store are both optional. Cryptic is not forcing the players to purchase items from the C-Store. It is their decision.
Would it make you feel any better if Cryptic did not sell any crafting related items in the C-Store? That basically means you are reliant on luck to get the rare components or hope that others are lucky and decide to put them up on the Exchange for sale.
At the end of the day STO is a business for Cryptic / PWE. That means they need to make money to keep the game going. Offering rare / very rare crafting material is one way to generate money from impatient people who wants everything 5 minutes ago. Trust me there are a lot of people like that. However, at the end of the day Cryptic is not forcing you to do anything against your will because they have not taken away your right to say, "No".
Yeah but the difference between the lottery and STO is that the lottery cost me about $1-2 dollars and takes me all of five minutes to get a ticket and play.
Trying to get Very Rare materials on the other hand, I can spend six hours playing STF's and not get one; case and point one of my fleet mates today had this such bad luck. In all honesty that is way to rare for a "game".
Fleet Admiral Thomas Winston James a.k.a. The Grayfox Fleet Leader of:
Liberty Task Force/Liberty Honor Guard
Pride of the Federation/Pride of the Empire
Liberty Guardians U.S.S. Liberty, NX-42813-L, T-6 Legendary Odyssey Class
No, and I apologize if that was what you gleaned from my comment, although you really shouldn’t leap to judge someone you obviously don’t’ know nor slap labels onto things you do not fully understand.
The “Common Player”, in my mind, doesn’t mind paying for some zen every once and again. They know that in order for Cryptic to keep the game available they must make some income to do so. I, myself, have bought zen on occasion.
However, the difference between the ‘common player’ and what we may assume is Cryptic’s target audience with the crafting shenanigans is that they are those who HAVE to be ‘leet’ in everything STO, including crafting and wealth. They don’t have a problem dropping hundreds of dollar, if not more, to accomplish this. Now, we can’t blame them for this; it’s their money to do with as they please. To assume that this faction represents the ‘common player’ is a misconception at its finest.
Apologies if that was not your intention in relation to 'common players', I'm also well aware that those who drop large amounts of zen are far from 'common players'...
However, the attitude that everything should be free (the entitlement mentality) is also far too prevalent and is quite a common perception...
I do not drop large amounts of zen, yet at the same time, I do not expect to be spoon-fed the benefits I could glean by dropping zen, as this devalues those purchases making them less appealing...
If you prefer to follow what you have essentially defined as trickle-down economics that is, again your prerogative (despite the fact it has been proven to fail repeatedly). However, do not instantly assume that we, the true ‘common players’ have any misgivings concerning entitlement. We pay our dues (zen), but may not lay down obnoxious amounts of cash to do so nor rush out to buy every new thing the instant it hits the store – all we ask for is a balanced system where we are not penalized for choosing NOT to spend cash so freely. I really don’t see how that can be considered a sense of entitlement. If you want to keep an edge so that the zen player gets more components, fine, but raise the drop rate for the rest of us so we aren’t forced to spend that cash just to compete.
And this is why I do not believe Cryptic should be spoon-feeding those who insist on everything in a F2P being free, and avoid spending money at all costs...
If obtaining the same bonuses as those people who choose to spend zen was too easy, it removes the incentive to spend real money, in which case we're back at the situation where revenue suffers and servers close...
Trickle-down economics may fail in relation to a country's economy, but in relation to F2P, that is the very essence of the F2P system as I see it...
Since in-game currency has no basis for it's value, it's an infinite resource, unlike the value of real-world currencies, which have their foundation in resources of one form or another...
In this situation, Trickle-down Economics works perfectly well and is in-fact a good incentive to generate purchases through the in-game store, by even average players, who are looking for a leg up on EC or their game experience...
For many, the motivation is not pure elitism... Outside of dedicated PVPers, the 'advantage' of CStore items is purely convenience and improved game experience...
Again, if those advantages were too easily obtained, it removes the incentive to drop some Zen for the added convenience and overall revenue suffers...
"Rare" and "Very Rare" are terms that are open to interpretation to a certain degree.
Rare could be 1 in 25k. Very Rare could be 1 in 75k. Ultra rare could be 1 in 150k. It is a lottery and like all lotteries are is only a small change of winning the jackpot. The larger the jackpot the smaller your chances. Unlike the lottery, in STO and many other MMOs real cash can help attain the jackpot now instead of hoping that the next box you open will have what you need.
Crafting is an optional game element you either do it or you don't. If you want to craft then you need to accept the fact there is a grind because you are not going to be able to get all the components necessary to craft whatever. The fast track to purchase the items from the Exchange if you have enough EC to cover the asking price. The very fast track is to purchase said items from the C-Store. However, purchasing from the Exchange or C-Store are both optional. Cryptic is not forcing the players to purchase items from the C-Store. It is their decision.
Would it make you feel any better if Cryptic did not sell any crafting related items in the C-Store? That basically means you are reliant on luck to get the rare components or hope that others are lucky and decide to put them up on the Exchange for sale.
At the end of the day STO is a business for Cryptic / PWE. That means they need to make money to keep the game going. Offering rare / very rare crafting material is one way to generate money from impatient people who wants everything 5 minutes ago. Trust me there are a lot of people like that. However, at the end of the day Cryptic is not forcing you to do anything against your will because they have not taken away your right to say, "No".
Believe it or not, I understand what you are saying. I simply do not agree with it.
Yes, crafting is optional and yes, those who opt to spend real $ should receive a little more than those who dont. This makes perfect sense to me. What doesnt is to penalize those who opt to hunt out and earn those rare components the hard way by making them so incredibly difficult to collect that it essentially forces people to spend real $ in the C Store.
Yes, what you say is true; one does not have to craft to play. Therefore, Cryptic is not forcing anyone to actually spend real $ to play. However, this is also a misnomer given that there is no competition with those who spend real $. Even if the drop rate was 1:100 for those who opt to go through the STFs and 1:50 for those who pay cash I can see as justifiable. To have 1:100 vs 1:2, on the other hand, is abuse to the player. (please note: all ratios are hypothetical and purely for the purpose of making a point)
This isnt an issue of entitlement. Nor is it an issue of merely wanting something for free. It is a matter of balance to the players regardless of whether or not they dump more money into the C store or less (or none at all).
On a side note, I would like to know what the actual drop ratios are, both for elite STFs and C store packs. I think that would settle a lot of arguments.
Once again, I agree with many of your points and believe we are actually arguing along the same lines and towards the same goals, if not perfectly parallel.
Yes, a F2P game is anything but free to produce. A company (such as Cryptic, PWE etc) requires codewriters, administration, beta testers, etc. to be able to offer new content, fix bugs, resolve issues, etc. and these people do not do it out of the goodness of their hearts they have to get paid. Ergo, the company needs to make income to cover their overheads and pay these people so they can keep bringing content, etc.
No one is refuting this. This is where the C store items come in we, the players, opt to make purchases of digital content for real dollars. Those real dollars then contribute to the income generation of the company and, as such, we receive slightly more unique or specialized gear and/or items. However, and I think this is the crutch of this argument, to penalize the average players who either spend their real dollars conservatively or not at all by sliding the scales so far against their favour in terms of collectable in-game content that is part of the F2P universe by making these items such a rare drop trumpets should sound and angels should weep should we actually get ONE while, at the same time, packing them into C-Store packs in an unveiled attempt to steer players to donate their hard-earned cash is, in a word, unscrupulous.
Yes a business, ANY business, exists for one purpose only: to generate a profit. However, to make this so unbalanced seems greedy and egregious to me. Sure, give the advantage to those who opt to pay cash. There is nothing wrong with that. However, at the same time dont make it nearly impossible for others to earn those items as well.
No one is refuting this. This is where the C store items come in we, the players, opt to make purchases of digital content for real dollars. Those real dollars then contribute to the income generation of the company and, as such, we receive slightly more unique or specialized gear and/or items. However, and I think this is the crutch of this argument, to penalize the average players who either spend their real dollars conservatively or not at all by sliding the scales so far against their favour in terms of collectable in-game content that is part of the F2P universe by making these items such a rare drop trumpets should sound and angels should weep should we actually get ONE while, at the same time, packing them into C-Store packs in an unveiled attempt to steer players to donate their hard-earned cash is, in a word, unscrupulous.
Yes a business, ANY business, exists for one purpose only: to generate a profit. However, to make this so unbalanced seems greedy and egregious to me. Sure, give the advantage to those who opt to pay cash. There is nothing wrong with that. However, at the same time dont make it nearly impossible for others to earn those items as well.
I've not encountered this problem... Since my latest 50 hit 50 about a week ago, I've been doing the bare minimum STF's to get marks in order to keep Rep projects running - barely 1 every 2 -3 days per faction... In that time I've received at least 3 Very Rare material rewards from the R&D box...
Additionally to this, I repeatedly receive Very Rare materials and components from the 48 hour (plus 48 hour CD) Request R&D Assistance assignment...
Yes, I'm not getting flooded with materials, nor should I be, however the rate at which I am receiving them, since I'm really making no effort to 'farm' for them, I feel is quite reasonable...
Perhaps this is all a matter of perception? I feel the current RNG chances of receiving Very Rare materials (and components from said Request R&D Assistance assignment) to be very reasonable for no expense of mine, outside of the time taken to literally do nothing more than 'play the game'...
One thing I will concede though, I would like to see a chance, albeit a VERY small one, of receiving Very Rare materials when gathering resource nodes, as something like a critical success etc... I have also noticed, that since they do vary from play-through to play-through of each episode/patrol, perhaps another approach to this would be, again a very small chance, of finding Very Rare material resource nodes...
I've not encountered this problem... Since my latest 50 hit 50 about a week ago, I've been doing the bare minimum STF's to get marks in order to keep Rep projects running - barely 1 every 2 -3 days per faction... In that time I've received at least 3 Very Rare material rewards from the R&D box...
Additionally to this, I repeatedly receive Very Rare materials and components from the 48 hour (plus 48 hour CD) Request R&D Assistance assignment...
Yes, I'm not getting flooded with materials, nor should I be, however the rate at which I am receiving them, since I'm really making no effort to 'farm' for them, I feel is quite reasonable...
Perhaps this is all a matter of perception? I feel the current RNG chances of receiving Very Rare materials (and components from said Request R&D Assistance assignment) to be very reasonable for no expense of mine, outside of the time taken to literally do nothing more than 'play the game'...
One thing I will concede though, I would like to see a chance, albeit a VERY small one, of receiving Very Rare materials when gathering resource nodes, as something like a critical success etc... I have also noticed, that since they do vary from play-through to play-through of each episode/patrol, perhaps another approach to this would be, again a very small chance, of finding Very Rare material resource nodes...
Perhaps you are one of the fortunate ones. Dont let that get out or people will be following you everywhere! LOL
In all honesty, Ive been scrounging in STFs, etc. and have had MAYBE 2 rares drop so yes, it could be a matter of perception (fuelled by ones personal drop rate)
Things are only get worse for ver rare crafting stuff once everyone works out what u need to do upgrades. Start hording now if i was u if u have not all ready.
Well, I finally decided to give the revamped crafting system a shot on two of my toons. I figure it is not worth doing on my other three toons since that would simply make it too much of a grind. I guess I will get to level 15 sometime in January or February 2015 if I more or less do the daily project on a regular basis.
You can save yourself the heartache.
Keep leveling your crafting schools to get Lv15 to get the combat traits, some of them are quite nice. Doing that costs you nothing but tying down DOFFs for these missions, as long as you let it run its full course in completion without dumping Dil.
Then say "F-You" to actual crafting and make money selling those precious mats.
The very fundamental idea that our Crafting results are RNG sits wrong with me, considering now expensive it is to even roll the dice and the likeliness of getting something with all the wrong mods.
Keep leveling your crafting schools to get Lv15 to get the combat traits, some of them are quite nice. Doing that costs you nothing but tying down DOFFs for these missions, as long as you let it run its full course in completion without dumping Dil.
Then say "F-You" to actual crafting and make money selling those precious mats.
The very fundamental idea that our Crafting results are RNG sits wrong with me, considering now expensive it is to even roll the dice and the likeliness of getting something with all the wrong mods.
I have thought of doing this. If the crafting stuff or upgrading stuff turns out way too costly or not achievable on what I can do at lv15. So far its not costing me nothing to do it.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
I have thought of doing this. If the crafting stuff or upgrading stuff turns out way too costly or not achievable on what I can do at lv15. So far its not costing me nothing to do it.
Upgrading your existing stuff is more predictable in results compared to dumping ungodly resources for endgame crafting and praying to Gene Rodenberry and the RNG Gods of Laughter in hoping you get something good.
Valkyrie. VF-22S, Max-Type. I got it for, like, a hundred and twenty bucks US. It's worth around twelve times that much now. I did not foresee that happening.
I didn't even know that was there until today. I haven't been looking for R&D Materials, though. I used the original one a ton in the beginning but then stopped when it took on the dilithium cost. So when the new R&D came out I had two characters' banks full of the old materials.
I don't get Very Rare materials or components every time, but often enough to more than justify 1,000 dilithium, especially since doing the Lore question only 2 of the 4 days (2 days for the assignment and 2 days for the CD) between assignments covers the cost in dilithium...
I should have perhaps used the term 'frequently' rather than 'repeatedly'...
Valkyrie. VF-22S, Max-Type. I got it for, like, a hundred and twenty bucks US. It's worth around twelve times that much now. I did not foresee that happening.
Nice. I HAD an original SDF-1 still in the box in the early 90's and like the idiot kid I was, got rid of it.
Comments
Level half of the skills on one toon, and the other on another toon. That way, you can use all the Crafting Slots and advance reasonably fast. Of course, you could also split it across more characters, not utilizing all slots, but in turn being able to level every school at max.
Now, if you want the trait unlock, you're out of luck, but if you only want to be able to craft everything that could be interesting to craft, this will get you covered. And it doesn't take an effort, unless you're not already playing daily (then you either have to start doing that, or accept that it will take longer for you).
Yeah, I have already split up the schools.
Fed Engineer = Beams & Engineering
KDF Tactical = Cannons & Projectiles
Maybe I will loop in my Fed Science and KDF Engineer toons later, but for now the above two toons should be fine since they only have blue and purple Doffs. Fed has 400 Doffs while KDF has 300 Doffs, however I have contemplated boosting them both to 500 Doff slots over that last couple of months so that I can collect more Doffs.
I'll get around to unlocking the trait on both toons since I plan on having them master all the schools... assuming I do not abandon the crafting system out of boredom / frustration like I did with the previous crafting system.
Just slotting the basic research projects on four schools.
I've made sure that the toons in the same faction have someone developing each school.
When they reach 15, I shall switch them over to the neglected schools to level those up.
One left over, and I'll pick a speciality for each toon.
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll try it out once I more open slots.
I suppose I should keep some of the Resource Box from the STFs rather than selling 'em all... which has made me some decent EC. Except for my Romulan toon all boxes will be sold to raise EC to buy a Plasmonic Leech because I really hate the fact that 40 power points are sacrificed for singularity abilities which I find are at best gimmicky... Unless I get really, really frustrated at which point I will strip anything of value then delete the Romulan toon to create another Fed or KDF toon.
I've been doing this religiously and, so far, it's actually been my best source of very rare materials, not to mention it's pretty common to receive very rare components as well...
You have your answer. In building the crafting system the way they have, Cryptic has managed to find another avenue to "reward" zen purchasers over the common player and turn a nifty profit. Business basics - the customer isn't always right, but the paying customers are!
I hate to be pessimistic about it all but lets look at the facts: a sudden drive in a NEW CRAFTING SYSTEM gets everyone giddy they race out and start building up their skills finally! A way to earn REAL in-game currency and feel good about producing something on your own! But wait those genuinely valuable items, the ones that everyone wants, those require substantial rare particles/components which, as it just happens, has a low drop rate on specific STFs only. Good luck.
OR spend some zen, get the packs and your chances of getting these components goes way up!
It comes down to the fact of life: money rules.
Unless anyone can provide a logical argument that this is not the case?
So, in your mind, the 'common players' are those people who refuse to spend money on the Zen store, seemingly expecting everything be provided free of charge (and usually free of effort) and Cryptic can do this how?
Cryptic are not a charity... They are a business... They exist to make money for their owner/share holders... Without that profit, they do not exist...
If STO consisted merely of 'common players' (using your definition) it would have closed it's servers a long time ago as no one would be spending a cent on STO...
Yet, it seems when ever Cryptic make a move to generate revenue (and in doing so keep the servers running) the 'common players' come out in droves to attack them for it...
I'm sorry, but your entitlement is showing through...
No, and I apologize if that was what you gleaned from my comment, although you really shouldnt leap to judge someone you obviously dont know nor slap labels onto things you do not fully understand.
The Common Player, in my mind, doesnt mind paying for some zen every once and again. They know that in order for Cryptic to keep the game available they must make some income to do so. I, myself, have bought zen on occasion.
However, the difference between the common player and what we may assume is Cryptics target audience with the crafting shenanigans is that they are those who HAVE to be leet in everything STO, including crafting and wealth. They dont have a problem dropping hundreds of dollar, if not more, to accomplish this. Now, we cant blame them for this; its their money to do with as they please. To assume that this faction represents the common player is a misconception at its finest.
If you prefer to follow what you have essentially defined as trickle-down economics that is, again your prerogative (despite the fact it has been proven to fail repeatedly). However, do not instantly assume that we, the true common players have any misgivings concerning entitlement. We pay our dues (zen), but may not lay down obnoxious amounts of cash to do so nor rush out to buy every new thing the instant it hits the store all we ask for is a balanced system where we are not penalized for choosing NOT to spend cash so freely. I really dont see how that can be considered a sense of entitlement. If you want to keep an edge so that the zen player gets more components, fine, but raise the drop rate for the rest of us so we arent forced to spend that cash just to compete.
Isn't that the definition of rare?
Yes, you have a point.
But how rare is rare? 1 in 10? In 100? 1000?
Are these equally rare items more common in zen purchases?
Hence the ongoing debate.
Rare could be 1 in 25k. Very Rare could be 1 in 75k. Ultra rare could be 1 in 150k. It is a lottery and like all lotteries are is only a small change of winning the jackpot. The larger the jackpot the smaller your chances. Unlike the lottery, in STO and many other MMOs real cash can help attain the jackpot now instead of hoping that the next box you open will have what you need.
Crafting is an optional game element you either do it or you don't. If you want to craft then you need to accept the fact there is a grind because you are not going to be able to get all the components necessary to craft whatever. The fast track to purchase the items from the Exchange if you have enough EC to cover the asking price. The very fast track is to purchase said items from the C-Store. However, purchasing from the Exchange or C-Store are both optional. Cryptic is not forcing the players to purchase items from the C-Store. It is their decision.
Would it make you feel any better if Cryptic did not sell any crafting related items in the C-Store? That basically means you are reliant on luck to get the rare components or hope that others are lucky and decide to put them up on the Exchange for sale.
At the end of the day STO is a business for Cryptic / PWE. That means they need to make money to keep the game going. Offering rare / very rare crafting material is one way to generate money from impatient people who wants everything 5 minutes ago. Trust me there are a lot of people like that. However, at the end of the day Cryptic is not forcing you to do anything against your will because they have not taken away your right to say, "No".
Trying to get Very Rare materials on the other hand, I can spend six hours playing STF's and not get one; case and point one of my fleet mates today had this such bad luck. In all honesty that is way to rare for a "game".
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Apologies if that was not your intention in relation to 'common players', I'm also well aware that those who drop large amounts of zen are far from 'common players'...
However, the attitude that everything should be free (the entitlement mentality) is also far too prevalent and is quite a common perception...
I do not drop large amounts of zen, yet at the same time, I do not expect to be spoon-fed the benefits I could glean by dropping zen, as this devalues those purchases making them less appealing...
And this is why I do not believe Cryptic should be spoon-feeding those who insist on everything in a F2P being free, and avoid spending money at all costs...
If obtaining the same bonuses as those people who choose to spend zen was too easy, it removes the incentive to spend real money, in which case we're back at the situation where revenue suffers and servers close...
Trickle-down economics may fail in relation to a country's economy, but in relation to F2P, that is the very essence of the F2P system as I see it...
Since in-game currency has no basis for it's value, it's an infinite resource, unlike the value of real-world currencies, which have their foundation in resources of one form or another...
In this situation, Trickle-down Economics works perfectly well and is in-fact a good incentive to generate purchases through the in-game store, by even average players, who are looking for a leg up on EC or their game experience...
For many, the motivation is not pure elitism... Outside of dedicated PVPers, the 'advantage' of CStore items is purely convenience and improved game experience...
Again, if those advantages were too easily obtained, it removes the incentive to drop some Zen for the added convenience and overall revenue suffers...
Believe it or not, I understand what you are saying. I simply do not agree with it.
Yes, crafting is optional and yes, those who opt to spend real $ should receive a little more than those who dont. This makes perfect sense to me. What doesnt is to penalize those who opt to hunt out and earn those rare components the hard way by making them so incredibly difficult to collect that it essentially forces people to spend real $ in the C Store.
Yes, what you say is true; one does not have to craft to play. Therefore, Cryptic is not forcing anyone to actually spend real $ to play. However, this is also a misnomer given that there is no competition with those who spend real $. Even if the drop rate was 1:100 for those who opt to go through the STFs and 1:50 for those who pay cash I can see as justifiable. To have 1:100 vs 1:2, on the other hand, is abuse to the player. (please note: all ratios are hypothetical and purely for the purpose of making a point)
This isnt an issue of entitlement. Nor is it an issue of merely wanting something for free. It is a matter of balance to the players regardless of whether or not they dump more money into the C store or less (or none at all).
On a side note, I would like to know what the actual drop ratios are, both for elite STFs and C store packs. I think that would settle a lot of arguments.
Once again, I agree with many of your points and believe we are actually arguing along the same lines and towards the same goals, if not perfectly parallel.
Yes, a F2P game is anything but free to produce. A company (such as Cryptic, PWE etc) requires codewriters, administration, beta testers, etc. to be able to offer new content, fix bugs, resolve issues, etc. and these people do not do it out of the goodness of their hearts they have to get paid. Ergo, the company needs to make income to cover their overheads and pay these people so they can keep bringing content, etc.
No one is refuting this. This is where the C store items come in we, the players, opt to make purchases of digital content for real dollars. Those real dollars then contribute to the income generation of the company and, as such, we receive slightly more unique or specialized gear and/or items. However, and I think this is the crutch of this argument, to penalize the average players who either spend their real dollars conservatively or not at all by sliding the scales so far against their favour in terms of collectable in-game content that is part of the F2P universe by making these items such a rare drop trumpets should sound and angels should weep should we actually get ONE while, at the same time, packing them into C-Store packs in an unveiled attempt to steer players to donate their hard-earned cash is, in a word, unscrupulous.
Yes a business, ANY business, exists for one purpose only: to generate a profit. However, to make this so unbalanced seems greedy and egregious to me. Sure, give the advantage to those who opt to pay cash. There is nothing wrong with that. However, at the same time dont make it nearly impossible for others to earn those items as well.
And that's how you had to get your MACO/Omega/Honor Guard sets previously. Interesting design choice.
Welcome to WoW style crafting! Where mats cost way more than the items you make!
I've not encountered this problem... Since my latest 50 hit 50 about a week ago, I've been doing the bare minimum STF's to get marks in order to keep Rep projects running - barely 1 every 2 -3 days per faction... In that time I've received at least 3 Very Rare material rewards from the R&D box...
Additionally to this, I repeatedly receive Very Rare materials and components from the 48 hour (plus 48 hour CD) Request R&D Assistance assignment...
Yes, I'm not getting flooded with materials, nor should I be, however the rate at which I am receiving them, since I'm really making no effort to 'farm' for them, I feel is quite reasonable...
Perhaps this is all a matter of perception? I feel the current RNG chances of receiving Very Rare materials (and components from said Request R&D Assistance assignment) to be very reasonable for no expense of mine, outside of the time taken to literally do nothing more than 'play the game'...
One thing I will concede though, I would like to see a chance, albeit a VERY small one, of receiving Very Rare materials when gathering resource nodes, as something like a critical success etc... I have also noticed, that since they do vary from play-through to play-through of each episode/patrol, perhaps another approach to this would be, again a very small chance, of finding Very Rare material resource nodes...
No. I got a rare Macross Model over on my table and it didn't come from an STF; it came from Japan.
Perhaps you are one of the fortunate ones. Dont let that get out or people will be following you everywhere! LOL
In all honesty, Ive been scrounging in STFs, etc. and have had MAYBE 2 rares drop so yes, it could be a matter of perception (fuelled by ones personal drop rate)
Nice. SDF or Valkyrie?
Really?
This is what I got. Not sure if I should keep throwing away refined dilithium on another slot machine:
http://oi58.tinypic.com/30vg1ac.jpg
You can save yourself the heartache.
Keep leveling your crafting schools to get Lv15 to get the combat traits, some of them are quite nice. Doing that costs you nothing but tying down DOFFs for these missions, as long as you let it run its full course in completion without dumping Dil.
Then say "F-You" to actual crafting and make money selling those precious mats.
The very fundamental idea that our Crafting results are RNG sits wrong with me, considering now expensive it is to even roll the dice and the likeliness of getting something with all the wrong mods.
I have thought of doing this. If the crafting stuff or upgrading stuff turns out way too costly or not achievable on what I can do at lv15. So far its not costing me nothing to do it.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
Upgrading your existing stuff is more predictable in results compared to dumping ungodly resources for endgame crafting and praying to Gene Rodenberry and the RNG Gods of Laughter in hoping you get something good.
Valkyrie. VF-22S, Max-Type. I got it for, like, a hundred and twenty bucks US. It's worth around twelve times that much now. I did not foresee that happening.
I didn't even know that was there until today. I haven't been looking for R&D Materials, though. I used the original one a ton in the beginning but then stopped when it took on the dilithium cost. So when the new R&D came out I had two characters' banks full of the old materials.
I don't get Very Rare materials or components every time, but often enough to more than justify 1,000 dilithium, especially since doing the Lore question only 2 of the 4 days (2 days for the assignment and 2 days for the CD) between assignments covers the cost in dilithium...
I should have perhaps used the term 'frequently' rather than 'repeatedly'...
Nice. I HAD an original SDF-1 still in the box in the early 90's and like the idiot kid I was, got rid of it.
Still kicking myself for that one.
Aw, man. That sucks. I had a cheapy Robotech version of the SDF-1 as a kid. But I mostly just played with it until it broke.