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Bortasqu' or Mogh
moonshadowdark
Member Posts: 1,899 Arc User
Quapla, warriors! I'm Moonshadow Dark, also known as Captain Elijah Lowe of the U.S.S. Sierra E! I come to you today to ask for your expert advice on Klingon cruisers! As you know, the Crystalline Cataclysm event is going on now and it pays 50k in dil. I have 3 characters at max level, so my end payout results in 150k in dil! That kind of crystal transfers very well into Zen. Last time we had an event like that, I bought an Oddy for my Federation captain. This time, however, I'm feeling a bit...savage and honorable. So I am in the market to buy my Klingon a nice cruiser with this events dil/zen.
So my question to you is: Which cruiser is better? The Bortasqu' War Cruiser or the Mogh Battle Cruiser?
Thanks for your advice, input and discussions!
So my question to you is: Which cruiser is better? The Bortasqu' War Cruiser or the Mogh Battle Cruiser?
Thanks for your advice, input and discussions!
"A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. LLAP"
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
Post edited by moonshadowdark on
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so whats wrong with the bort? here is a current thread that touches on that very issue.
so to answer your question, the mogh is the better ship to buy, although i question the wisdom of buying anything at all this close to x2 and the t6 ship release. but if you really want to buy a ship anyway, go with the mogh. i have little doubt you would regret the bortasqu.
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The Moth is an awesome ship, and has better survivability than the Neg'Var. Also, with its boff setups, you can run different types of builds.
I love the ship, and wouldn't trade it for another Klink ship we now have. However, as tehbubbaloo said, it might be best to wait a few months to see what the new T6 ships will be like. They may offer something that will fit your play style better, or might just have better overall stats that may make them worth investing into.
If you just want something new to play with for now, I would recommend the Mirror Meg'Var. It is a pretty good ship to play with.
Good luck, have fun, and happy gaming.
"There... are... four... lights!" ~Jean Luc Picard
Personally I have an issue with the Mogh's inertia, I love how my Vor'cha drifts and if I buy a new KDF Cruiser it has to Drift.
But since the Mogh is a Cloaking copy of the Avenger and my Fed has that, I do like the ship, it's got a lot of forward fire power, the turn rate to use the DHC mounts it has and it looks fantastic (the Mogh to be clear). It can also make a great Beam Boat or use the all powerful A2B builds that are all the rage.
Like everyone is saying about ship purchases these days, hold off until we at least know how they intend to upgrade them.
We don't know what T6 is yet, it will definitely involve a new unique ability, but will they have the same amount console slots and BOFF powers?
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Its comparable to the Fleet Tor'Kaht Battle Cruiser Retrofit, which has even less focus on science, only 4 forward weapons (but also 4 in the back) and a little (1 point) better turn rate.
It can dish out, as well as take damage (cruiser commands). It may very well be the case, and i know everybody has preferences - but that is just a personal opinion, we are looking at THE best ship the KDF is currently fielding.
The Rommy Scimitar may have a tac console more and a battle cloak but inertia and turn make it a bit unwieldy (which is precisely why it has to use its battle cloak). Also it lacks cruiser commands.
And yes, BoPs have also a very strong offense and are nimble, but also very fragile, especially if the speed goes down for some reason.
The Kumari has 1 Tac console more and thus more firepower, but as an escort lacks cruiser commands and a cloak and one rear weapon slot in comparison. Basically the Mogh is the KDF counterpart to the Kumari.
Bortasqu... i will here discuss the command cruiser only. Why? Well, because THIS is the viable variant. I will explain:
There are three variants. Each brings another gadget to the three piece set. The idea is that, if you buy the pack, you can put the components together. Except... its really not that great.
And... it can't be fit on the Bortas. The Bortas is another not so great incarnation, btw. Not because of the gadgets... i am getting there...
And the ship is clumsy. For PvE that is not a big issue. It can mount cannons. It is, however, a very big issue in PvP. It means beam broadsiding (4 mounts fore and aft, btw). So... not that great, hmm?
Well... not really. There is one thing you have to realize about this ship. And i mean here the command cruiser. There is one thing you absolutely have to understand about the Bortasqu command cruiser:
four engineering consoles (yes, it can carry ver heavy armor) and... the most important detail: four tactical consoles AND sensor analysis.
Yes! That is right! It comes with sensor analysis! That is some serious firepower when broadsiding with eight beam banks! FAW!
That is its one redeeming quality and there are no contestants whatsoever. And it cloaks.
All of these ships have access to cruiser commands btw, bestowing either increased maneuverability, reduced weapon energy drain or (my favorite) 10% damage resist (can be stacked with other flat DR boni from faction rewards, shield modifiers and abilities DR).
Also notable is, that whilst both ships come with a cloaking device, its a standard cloak. A little out of fashion with all those Romulan battle cloak cruisers. You will surprise and fight not hit&run. Realize that.
The 190th rule...excellent advice, sir.
The reason why I'm looking for a T5 is because they did mention something about making the T5's still relevant and I would like to keep using my Oddy/Mogh for the Delta storyline.
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
The Mogh is copy of the Federation Avenger class Battlecruiser.
Same BOFFs, Same Stats, Same Consoles, Same 5/3 Layout.
There are some minor differences like we have a Cloak, more crew and cooler looking ship.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
The Bortasq IMO loses all Lore points as a Flag ship, it's nothing like any other Klingon Cruiser it has more in common with the Space Whale that is the Odyssey than the other Klingon Behemoth that is the Vo'quv. At least the Vo'quv can make up for it's low turn with it's BoPs.
When you do a Starbase Defense against Klingons it's the Vo'quv that warps in for the final assault not the Bortasq.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
All these are true except for one point: The Inertia. The Inertia is a great flaw of the Mogh. Rather than the loose handling that is the hallmark of KDF battlecruisers, enabling a wicked powerslide that allows you to strafe your targets, the Mogh handles like a clumsy escort.
And your speed will immediately hit zero if you faceplant into your target instead of being able to orbit and strafe. At the point at which you either faceplant or are forced to resort to the yo-yo maneuver, you've lost the point of flying a battlecruiser instead of an Escort.
For what you want a Battlecruiser to do, the Mogh is superior in every way, shape or form than the Bortasqu'.
There is one thing that absolutely kills the Bortasqu': Ponderous movement. It's extremely low turn rate and terrible inertia.
The Bortasqu' is a very ponderous ship that dislikes you making changes to your course of flight in combat. God help you if you use her in PVP. There have been ways in the last year, year and a half to improve speed and turn rates, but that has not helped the Bortasqu' as much. You REALLY have to go out of your way to make her move better. Build space that could have been used to making her more survivable or hit harder, or both.
The Mogh on the other hand handles like any of the traditional KDF Battlecruisers like the Vor'Cha, K'T'inga, Negh'Var. It has a good turn rate, capable of using both cannons or beams well. Favorable TAC oriented layout. You point a direction, the ship goes there. It hits hard. It has good staying power. I handles well. It has a built in cloaking device. You cannot ask much more out of a Battlecruiser.
That said, someone mentioned a warning about buying current ships in light of the impending expansion. I also agree with this and say to wait it out before buying any ships. Sure, Cryptic says that T5 ships will be upgradable to T6, but I highly, HIGHLY doubt that it will match the true, newly designed T6 ships. The point of any expansion is to get you to BUY. If the game allows you to possess the same level of power and capability of the newest T6 ships with your old ships, then there is no incentive to BUY the new stuff.
That's wishful thinking, just like the guys going around these boards expecting Cryptic to upgrade even their existing equipment to Mk XIV or whatever.
Wait I say, just wait.
All this news makes me laugh at all the guys that bought expensive ships recently LOL
I have both. I have run similar configs on each and the mogh is superior in nearly every way in comparison, except in a couple of ways.
Tac bort can be deadlier to a single target in a DHC setup.
Tac Bort has a tough hull.
Both of these advantages are outclassed by everything else the Mogh does better.
While Cryptic did say that T5.5 can be upgradeable to be competitive with T6 ships; it is unknown what they actually mean by "competitive". There is also a question of what must be done to upgrade T5.5 ships. Is it going to be expensive from a resource / time perspective? I don't know...
Between the two ships I prefer the Mogh because it is more agile. I was actually thinking about buying it a few months back until I realized it was basically an Avenger with innate cloaking abilities. At that point my interest in that ship more or less died.
My advice is to continue to grind for dil after the event has ended and just wait until Delta Rising is released. Assuming you collect all your dil from the event on Sept 4th, and assuming you max out your dil refinement for each toon every day and assuming Delta Rising is released on Oct 1st, you will have another 648,000 refined dilithium that can be converted to Zen.
Assuming an exchange rate of 170:1 that works out to about 3,812 Zen with all three toon maxing out refinement every day; 24,000 refined dilithium. Refining a total of 16,000 dil per day you would get about 2,541 Zen. If you only have the time to refine 8,000 dilithium per day for all toons combined, that that works out to an additional 1,270 Zen by the time Delta Rising is released; assuming it is Oct 1st.
All that additional Zen can be used towards a T6 starship.
I've heard this in a number of threads on related topics, be it fleet weapons, rep gear, c-store items, etc. I'm more and more in total agreement with it. If you can soldier on with your current gear (and I don't see why you couldn't), do so until the new release is out. At the very least you will have knowledge and information about you options. If you still want a ship that's in the C-store now, there's no harm in waiting. If you decide you want one of the new ones, you'll have saved yourself some trouble.
Actually it was fully viable and extremely deadly in PvP until Legacy of Romulus and also these ridiculous a2b doffs came along and ruined any semblance of balance in the game.
Thanks to those updates, escorts and the like can maintain nearly constant uptime with speed buffs like EptE1 and easily stay out of firing arcs.
Still, the command cruiser is an absolute beast in PvE.
A barrage of DHC's/Turrets and the autocannon is pretty devestating, and Sensor Analysis makes it a a serious asset in a team.
Trick to the Bortas is being able to think ahead and anticipate, and start preparing for a potential maneuver far ahead of time.