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The Easiest Way to Nerf Loot-o-Matic Missions
kirksplat
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
Anyone else like this solution?
Problem: There is a static fx in the foundry that makes the minimap fuzzy and drops the shields of all ships inside of it. People use this fx to create a "fence" in space, where the player sits on one side of the fence and shoots defenseless ships as if they were fish in a barrel. They do this for 300k + ECs from vendor trash in 10 minutes.
This should be treated as an exploit, IMO. And there is a very, very simple solution that takes almost nothing away from foundry authors who want to use that fx for legit reasons.
Solution: Make the fx a map-wide effect, so that a "fence" isn't possible. We could still have a player "enter" it by setting it to trigger visible with a reach marker. If we really need something with little shields, we can reskin a weak mob as a Borg cube.
/signed by Foundry Cabal.
Problem: There is a static fx in the foundry that makes the minimap fuzzy and drops the shields of all ships inside of it. People use this fx to create a "fence" in space, where the player sits on one side of the fence and shoots defenseless ships as if they were fish in a barrel. They do this for 300k + ECs from vendor trash in 10 minutes.
This should be treated as an exploit, IMO. And there is a very, very simple solution that takes almost nothing away from foundry authors who want to use that fx for legit reasons.
Solution: Make the fx a map-wide effect, so that a "fence" isn't possible. We could still have a player "enter" it by setting it to trigger visible with a reach marker. If we really need something with little shields, we can reskin a weak mob as a Borg cube.
/signed by Foundry Cabal.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Post edited by kirksplat on
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Comments
Why am I not making any EC!?
If I wasn't a guy I'd love you and I'd want to have your babies.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
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Um, it wouldn't make a difference. Players put out enough damage that they'd take very little damage...NPCs would already be dead before having to worry about it themselves, and even if they were a little concerned - it would be easy enough for them to build with enough hull tanking that they wouldn't be concerned.
Hell, even with their shields - Foundry NPCs are such a joke that even without the special areas folks could still easily farm them.
It's simply not a fix for the perceived issue.
If folks wanted to remove EC grinding from the Foundry, you've basically got to remove EC from the Foundry. Either that, or Cryptic needs to lay out what they believe is a reasonable EC reward for their 15 minute period and simply reward that at the end while removing drops from the maps themselves.
Why not cut to the heart of the matter? Remove loot drops from all mobs in the foundry. Cryptic already has a cut off switch after a certain amount that seems to only effect the foundry, all right I don't know their code, but you would think it would be possible to set that amount to zero.
All this change would do is require higher end escorts to be used for the DPS to destroy enemy battleships either before they managed to fire and damage your ship without shields, or damage them in a similar amount of time through their shields. And you lose a tool in the foundry.
Nouveau riche LTS member
Only captain level mobs drop loots, and with both the player ship and enemy ship defenseless, it is not that easy. I have not seen a single farming mission that sets all of it up like a normal battle between a player and captain-level ships. It would taken a long time to do 25 back-to-back battles with captain level mobs, without something like the fx or friendly ships assisting the player.
So, I'd say it's a pretty effective fix.
I don't think so. I could use the fx with triggers and preserve the functionality of it.
Um, see...you can fly into it now and it's not a problem and you can let them fly out of it and it's not a problem. Foundry NPCs are a joke given the current state of power players have. Hell, go back a couple of years and there were some well known grinders that didn't make use of the special area/FX...they were easy then - it's even easier now, players massively outclass NPCs in Elite content...Foundry mobs don't stand a chance.
I still find Foundry captain mobs challenging, and I have lots of fleet gear on my Avenger. Taking on 25 captain mobs one after the other would be tedious and time consuming.
If you want, I can make a test mission for you to play. Tell me how long it takes you to fight 25 captain level mobs. I'll assume that loot is better for level 41+ "Captain 03" mobs. I'll set it up for you to get the best loot possible.
Sure. Will have to be something that I don't run until later though, getting ready to eat before watching The Last Ship, Falling Skies, and The Strain - basically the only night I watch more than an hour if that of TV.
Honestly, I don't care about loot grinders anymore. The last thing we need is another Foundry War. I say just throw the grinders into a separate mission category and ignore them.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
Meh, I'm not a fan of them because of the likely role they played in the "normalization" of vendor trash. I run a solo fleet (it gives me a reason to continue logging in) and was able to remain comfortably poor while doing that through the normal course of play. Running PVE queues here and there, some DOFFing, and just regular run of the mill stuff...think there was only a single toon that had more than a mil EC on him - everybody else was in the 200-300k range. Just living comfortably poor. Since the "normalization", lol - just the other day I went to do a mission transwarp and I didn't have the 100 EC on the toon to do it.
The "normalization" actually has created the desire to hit up grinders now - cause stuff that might have provided toons with 100-150k EC before isn't even providing 30-50k EC.
Never had any desire for any of the high priced items - no Lock Box ships, no expensive DOFFs, etc, etc...I just muddled along at a casual pace while comfortably poor.
For me, it's not about the "image" of the Foundry and the role that grinders may have on that - folks still did awesome stuff in Mission Architect in CoH even with all the grinders there. It's about how that "normalization" of vendor trash, where the grinders likely played a part, and screwed up the laid back way I play that ticks me off about them...even as I'm faced with the possibility of having to start running them or just quit the game. Which in turn just ticks me off about them even more...
Someone already did this, its called Battleship Royal Rumble. Takes me about 15 minutes and I get dilithium every hour for it. Got a bit nasty with the Undine updates but not impossible.
But go ahead, set up a mission that has 25 battleships spawn one by on after you destroy the first one. Give me the name and I'll tell you how long I take to vape it. Just make sure you do it right for a farming mission. They spawn one at a time, facing away from the player. And spawn quickly enough that they get caught in the warp core explosion of the last one if you do it right, no warp in's or anything.
Nouveau riche LTS member
The mission you speak of relies on enemy ships to weaken each other, before you come in and clean house. I wonder if the most recent change to how loot works affected the mission, since you now have to do the majority of damage yourself for the loot to drop.
It's been a few years since I played that mission.
I got a fair amount of loot from it when I played it about an hour ago. But you're right, that is because I didn't wait for the battleships to blow each other up. I just charged in. Compared to NPCs its not hard to do the majority of the damage. I probably would have gotten more loot if I was in a FAW boat.
Nouveau riche LTS member
Even so, at least with this mission the mobs aren't artificially crippled by having no shields while the player has full combat ability because of the 'exploit' layed out in the OP. :rolleyes:
arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1203368/pve-content-a-list-of-gamewide-polishing-pass-suggestions
** Loot Crate is like a R&D Boxes or DOFF Boxes where you are awarded one or two really good rewards (Engines, Deflectors, Shields, Cores), and a bunch of "junk".
A variation would be a reward token for completing a Foundry mission. And the token then either goes to an NPC or be used in a DOFF turn-in mission. That way the rewards would be on a timer and make it difficult to farm. (Spotlighted missions get a better version of the loot box). That way, it should weed out the bad apples.
Could we expand on that idea , Make it like the PvE choice , you want a loot box, have that, want fleet marks have that, want R and D box, pick that
Flexible rewards may increase Foundry uptake? Not sure opinions?
I like this.
Hmmmm, what if they reorganize it so that missions that dont qualify for rewards, get axed from the list, and have their own list
Example, when you first open the mission search window, you get a number of different buttons, one says "story" one says "combat" one says "puzzle" etc. You click on one, and it takes you to a list of missions that fit that description. That way you only ever see the missions you want to play. If you want to play story missions the list is not cluttered with loot grinders and if you want to play loot grinders the list is not cluttered with story missions. Everyone is happy.
Yes. This is what I want. Not more nerfing.
Remember how happy we all were when Timid Creature was added? Remember how disappointed we were when it was killed to slow down the looters?
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
With all due respect, I doubt hiding the problem is going to solve it.
Even if you categorize these farm missions as "combat", farmers will still go to those known farming missions and it will not solve the problem of proper Foundry missions not being played. So you have to hit them where it hurts - the pocketbook! That's why I suggested the loot box. With nothing to farm, they will leave the Foundry and head to other spots in STO. Like returning to Ker'rat.
If Cryptic doesn't want to go that route, the only other alternative is an active moderation force that finds and eliminates missions that abuse the Foundry.
I don't want loot missions nerfed or axed. And neither do a great many others. Let me repeat. Nerfing lot missions will not force people to pay your missions. It will drive them away.
You seen what happened when a couple leet pvp players complained about how easy end game content was and we all get whoped by the nerf bat.
Let the flames begin. s
I completely agree with you. More ways to browse available missions are really all we need to combat the problem.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone