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Current Endgame vs. Delta Rising Endgame?
suaveks
Member Posts: 1,736 Arc User
I realise we'll be getting more official info as the time goes, but aside from the T6 ship drama I'm really wondering what's gonna happen with all the existing "endgame content", considering Cryptic's supposedly increasing the bar when it comes to difficulty.
Power creep is already a joke, and all the supposedly "Elite" endgame content is laughably easy as it is, to the point where No Win Scenario is a FM grind, while Elite STFs and such are a DPS race.
With the level cap increase, new advancement system, and the introduction of a new ship tier, all these missions will become an even bigger joke to play.
So, from purely speculative standpoint, what do you think is gonna happen, or what would you like to happen with all the existing "endgame" content? Should all PvE queued missions be buffed to Lvl 60? One could argue that the easiest way would be to introduce a new, third difficulty. But would that really help in the long run? Wouldn't three difficulties for the same queued mission basically split the community even more?
I'll be honest - I don't trust Cryptic, Geko especially. We've all seen by now that all the updates are mostly about the new stuff and new shinies - they've got to sell new stuff and they rarely care about the old one. So we can assume Cryptic'll want players to jump to all the brand new Lvl60 content, leaving Lvl50 behind. New stuff to do is always great, but not at the cost of the existing one.
I for one wouldn't mind some of these missions to become solo-able... considering most of them can already be completed by 1-2 people, aside from perhaps the ones that require co-operation. But that's surely not gonna happen. I'd like to say Cryptic's know what they're doing but... well... the past shows otherwise.
Your thoughts?
Power creep is already a joke, and all the supposedly "Elite" endgame content is laughably easy as it is, to the point where No Win Scenario is a FM grind, while Elite STFs and such are a DPS race.
With the level cap increase, new advancement system, and the introduction of a new ship tier, all these missions will become an even bigger joke to play.
So, from purely speculative standpoint, what do you think is gonna happen, or what would you like to happen with all the existing "endgame" content? Should all PvE queued missions be buffed to Lvl 60? One could argue that the easiest way would be to introduce a new, third difficulty. But would that really help in the long run? Wouldn't three difficulties for the same queued mission basically split the community even more?
I'll be honest - I don't trust Cryptic, Geko especially. We've all seen by now that all the updates are mostly about the new stuff and new shinies - they've got to sell new stuff and they rarely care about the old one. So we can assume Cryptic'll want players to jump to all the brand new Lvl60 content, leaving Lvl50 behind. New stuff to do is always great, but not at the cost of the existing one.
I for one wouldn't mind some of these missions to become solo-able... considering most of them can already be completed by 1-2 people, aside from perhaps the ones that require co-operation. But that's surely not gonna happen. I'd like to say Cryptic's know what they're doing but... well... the past shows otherwise.
Your thoughts?
Post edited by suaveks on
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ilickbatteries
Cryptic has the data for the average STO player, and that's who they should balance stuff for.
It's a temporary solution to the creep, this much I do know. Once everyone quickly catches up to the new level cap and have figured out the new endgame we'll come full circle.
My Captain is not going to be happy about this.
It doesn't need to be one or the other.
Normal difficulty content should be suited to average players. Elite difficulty content should be suited to elite players.
People have been demanding Cryptic make a new level of difficulty to deal with the power creep.
Id like to see some Heroic Special Task Forces at Level 60.
Doing umpteen bajillion DPS doesn't make one "elite". It just means that the person has wasted an inordinate amount of time calculating the "optimal" things to use to do ridiculous levels of damage that are in no way necessary (that or they found some build online that a person who did that posted).
These are not the players that should be catered to. Stuff is "laughably easy" to them because their builds are set up and monkeyed in such a way to make it that way.
Have you played against the Voth Dreadnaught?
Those elites arent built for the wishy washy builds the average player throws on their ship because they need to fill a slot.
I'm sorry to people who I, in the past, insulted, annoyed, etc.
a proper challenge like the old stfs would require that which the dev team have thrown under the bus amongst other things; teamwork, communication, trust are to name a few and combine it into the next design of content... instead what we have is half-baked solo team content that is just no good, completely sold out/gone native. you want to start somewhere, lose the instant gratification need to the community likes first, then get the dev team to get that crane of theirs to lift that bus up and get some of these things back for new content... assuming some of those devs even consider it in line with whatever their taskmasters expect.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
- Players will keep playing the first year Borg STF's .
- If the above will no longer be viable, then ... considering the "popularity" of the non-Gozer created queue content, I expect to see a mass exodus a month or so after X2 shows .
They need to create some content that presents a strategic challenge for players in that kind of level. What they've got now is either a spam fest, or its painfully easy.
i know overly simple, there are many questions besides this that need awnsers before anything acceptable can roll out to the community.
(Doesnt everyone wish they had a huge say when they change anything in sto? Its because you care about the game..apparently alot, do not worry i do to:))
So in other words. Unless you max out a character in February of 2016 youre not going to be able to play through the content as intended. All current Vice Admirals will be forced to grind through PvE Queues to get to the next Level Cap and Tier of ships.
Not all that surprising since they timegate everything these days to get the maximum life out of a piece of content, or a stopgap to the next release if you will..
Does it suck? Yes, but I doubt they will change anytime soon.
I'd expect the following to probably happen.
New difficulty setting for existing STFs etc, Normal, Elite, and lets call new one Extreme as an example.
Extreme for 60 captains only. Drops MK14 gear sparingly. Ramped up hp, damage, npc spawn numbers, and npc replacement.
An example would be how Infected Space is handled. On normal you got some probes/spheres at start ( I think it was that, been a lonnggg time since i played on normal. ) Spheres over the transformer. Elite you got a Cube at start with spheres, cube over transformers. Extreme will probably have something like Tact cube at start, 2 cubes in place of the spheres. Tact cubes voer transformers, 2 cubes spawn instead of 2 spheres. And final spawn after last transformer blows will be one of those super big whale ship borg ships. The long thing you see in red alerts and hive que. Possibly also choke them full of abilities that they activate more frequently.
Tbh it seems most logical. If they want to add new " content " for level 60. Cryptic is like, the king of the recycling. And its efficient use of dev time since they won't be having to make completely new maps for ques, etc. Just some alterations and coding.
I personally would look forward to this if this was in the pipe for 60. We might actually have to pay attention for once to complete a stf.
More of the same I suspect. New story sure, mechanically I've come to really lower my expectations when it comes to STO. More dumb AI, more shooting, even more shooting, some buckets to fill over and over, etc etc.
The problem is it is still too easy - I bet someone could still make a Scimitar solo that let alone a future T5.9 one, if not as easily as one can solo todays ISE. I mean most of us on here Id wager could take your proposed Tac Cube plus 2 cubes 1 vs 3, and really, basic Cubes are just a bit longer to kill than spheres, not actually harder as such.
But, it would provide a challenge for average STO players, so it would be better than current ISE.
Thats the point. You don't try to balance sto by what the min-max would find challenging, you have to balance for the majority.
I don't agree - if we are to label something as Elite Content, it must, by definition, be aimed at the min-maxers, and be too difficult for the average person to attempt - your suggestion, while more difficult, remains a slightly longer DPS Race; maybe 5 minutes instead of 1 minute. It is an improvement, but it is not enough to be classed as Elite.
Normal content should be balanced for the majority as you point out. (and should drop Borg neural processors and the like so that average players don't have to do Elite content like they do now...)
Itonically, it seems cryptic don't see it that way. Case in point current " Elite " content, even named Elite, is so easy all you need to do is hit space bar. Which people do.
Just being realistic. STO just isn't raider's paradise and never will be from the looks. Of course, X2 could come as a surprise and do a 180, you never know!
I'm ... still searching for the proper words for this ... -- especially considering that both Season 9 and Season 9.5 were lighter than usual on content in preparation for X2 .
....
... at least P1 will tell us how awesome this actually is ... , while I expect Mav's had on STOked to explode ...
(or just implode from apaty
Um, no? That's not what they said. They just said that there will be some content which will release in a trickle *after* the DR push to live. Existing players will be able to level up through the mass of new missions they will release when DR goes live.
How many missions did Legacy of Romulus add to the game? You can expect at least that many to come with Delta Rising.
Any meaningful content (like story missions) could probably be completed in 2-3 hours.
Star Trek: The Original Grind
Star Trek: The Next Grind
Star Trek: Deep Space Grind
Star Trek: Voyage to the Grind