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Forums > Home› Feedback› Feature Episodes, Events and PvE Content

Xindi weapons

gp86gp86 Member Posts: 22 Arc User
edited July 2014 in Feature Episodes, Events and PvE Content
I heard manny times already than the new Xindi waepons are weaker than the lastest ones like undine weapons or for example the Protonic weapons...and thats sucks.
Althought i did not see any Space weapons for them yet but the ground weapons a not so good hope the space ones are way better and with slightly better proc chance.

Im curious about how others think about this. Maybe STO Team upgrade/fix this at some point.
Post edited by gp86 on

Comments

  • sohtohsohtoh Member Posts: 620 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    As far as the space weapons, they are essentially blue Phasers with a different proc. They get three modifiers and a 2.5% chance to do phaser damage up to 5 targets (primary target plus up to 4 others).

    The phaser damage from the proc is boosted by everything that would boost phasers. Drawback is it is also affected by Weapons Power which can weaken the proc.

    The damage of the proc is slightly weaker than the radiation proc from the Bio-Molecular weapons.
    "I'm not big on telepaths myself. I'm not big on guns either. But if everyone else has them, I want to make sure I can get my hands on the biggest one I can."
  • dahminusdahminus Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Do we know if it's per cycle or per shot yet?
    Chive on and prosper, eh?

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  • angrytargangrytarg Member Posts: 11,008 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Plus the weapons have a terrible audio/visual effect. I bought four for my Nebula because I loved the idea of having teal-blueish phasers and the promo pictures showed they will exactly be that. The problem is, I should ave bought one off the exchange and tested them.

    They fire a very wavy beam which doesn't look phaser-like at all and they sound lke a rubber band. It's a little bit... disappointing XD
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  • warmaker001bwarmaker001b Member Posts: 9,205 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    sohtoh wrote: »
    As far as the space weapons, they are essentially blue Phasers with a different proc. They get three modifiers and a 2.5% chance to do phaser damage up to 5 targets (primary target plus up to 4 others).

    The phaser damage from the proc is boosted by everything that would boost phasers. Drawback is it is also affected by Weapons Power which can weaken the proc.

    The damage of the proc is slightly weaker than the radiation proc from the Bio-Molecular weapons.

    I have not bought the weapons, but from looking at the stats:

    The issue to me is that the phaser damage proc gets distributed among nearby targets. Which sucks, IMO. From what I gathered though, if the target is single then the dmg stacks up decently. That last part may be the saving grace, but I'm not quite sold on it yet.

    It reminds me of the Refracting Tetryon Proc, but that doesn't get weaker with more targets around.
    XzRTofz.gif
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    warmaker001b wrote: »
    The issue to me is that the phaser damage proc gets distributed among nearby targets. Which sucks, IMO. From what I gathered though, if the target is single then the dmg stacks up decently. That last part may be the saving grace, but I'm not quite sold on it yet.

    Viewing one on the Exchange (on Ground)...

    2.5% chance: 1km radius at target: 142.1 - 710.5 Phaser Damage (Split among primary target and up to 4 other foes)

    So it should follow something along the lines of...

    1x Target: 710.5
    2x Target: 355.2/3 each
    3x Target: 236.8 each
    4x Target: 177.6 each
    5x Target: 142.1 each

    ...keeping in mind, those are Exchange stats and not equipped stats.

    Eh, what the Hell...I bought one for my Phaser toon. Let's see...

    It's boosted by...wait, that's odd. Hrmmm, was going to say it's boosted by all the standard things but Tac Team doesn't boost it. Tac Team boosts the damage of the PBM itself, but it doesn't boost the proc damage. APO, APA, EPtW, Damage Consoles, the 2pc Phaser Bonus...they're all working, but TT only boosts the non-proc damage - not the proc damage. Hrmm, leaves me to wonder if it is not being boosted by Starship Energy Weapons (which TT boosts)...

    ...but anyway, yeah - even my crappy geared Phaser toon can get that proc to 2500 with a decloak, APA3, APO3, EPtW1, with 1x VR Mk XI - 1x Rare Mk XI - the Multi-Relay, and the 2pc Phaser Bonus. Wonder if Flanking applies to it?

    Hrmm, let me do an ISE with my failboat here and see what it says/how it compares...

    Enhanced Bio-Molecular Photon Torpedo - High Yield III: 440132 / 1073.493 / 23 / 19136.193
    Cutting Beam: 326116 / 795.405 / 226 / 1442.993
    Experimental Proton Weapon: 314711 / 767.588 / 443 / 710.409
    Enhanced Bio-Molecular Photon Torpedo: 274480 / 669.463 / 30 / 9149.338
    Dual Phaser Cannons - Rapid Fire I: 193701 / 472.441 / 159 / 1218.244
    Dual Phased Biomatter Cannons - Rapid Fire I: 182939 / 446.193 / 155 / 1180.252
    Dual Phaser Cannons: 159702 / 399.517 / 146 / 1093.851
    Dual Phased Biomatter Cannons: 158383 /386.3 / 141 / 1123.283
    Refracting Tetryon Cascade: 137590 / 335.585 / 20 / 6879.5
    Heavy Bio-Molecular Phaser Turret - Rapid Fire I: 124840 / 304.488 / 85 / 1468.709
    Heavy Bio-Molecular Phaser Turret: 93119 / 227.12 / 79 / 1178.716
    Bio-Molecular Incubation: 73294 / 178.766 / 38 / 1928.789
    Proton Particle Burn: 16929 / 41.29 / 54 / 313.499
    Biomatter Needle Burst: 7182 / 17.517 / 2 / 3590.935

    Where that's Damage / DPS / Attacks / Avg Damage per Attack...

    That average damage for the Needle Burst wasn't bad, but with a two procs out of 74 cycles for the single PBM...heh, just didn't stand out. Might be nifty on a boat with a bunch of them where you see more procs.

    The weapon loadout on that failbuild was...

    Fore: E-Bio Torpedo Launcher, VR Phaser Dual Cannons Mk XII [Acc]x3, VR Phased Bio Dual Cannons Mk XII [Acc]x3, Experimental Proton Weapon
    Aft: Heavy Bio-Phaser Turret, Kinetic Cutting Beam

    edit: What's really sad, is that was that toon's highest parse...lmfao, /facepalm, meh.
  • sohtohsohtoh Member Posts: 620 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    dahminus wrote: »
    Do we know if it's per cycle or per shot yet?

    It looks like per cycle.
    warmaker001b wrote: »
    I have not bought the weapons, but from looking at the stats:

    The issue to me is that the phaser damage proc gets distributed among nearby targets. Which sucks, IMO. From what I gathered though, if the target is single then the dmg stacks up decently. That last part may be the saving grace, but I'm not quite sold on it yet.

    It kind of gets distributed, see below.
    virusdancer wrote: »
    2.5% chance: 1km radius at target: 142.1 - 710.5 Phaser Damage (Split among primary target and up to 4 other foes)

    Take that 142.1 and multiply it by 5 and you get the 710.5. It looks like each target (primary then each additional up to 4) gets the 142.1. At least that is how I read it.
    "I'm not big on telepaths myself. I'm not big on guns either. But if everyone else has them, I want to make sure I can get my hands on the biggest one I can."
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    sohtoh wrote: »
    Take that 142.1 and multiply it by 5 and you get the 710.5. It looks like each target (primary then each additional up to 4) gets the 142.1. At least that is how I read it.

    It would be the 710.5 to a single target, then half to two targets, a third to three targets, a fourth to four targets, and a fifth to five targets to get down to the 142.1 amount. Otherwise it couldn't have parsed the average amount it did for the two procs I had. Where the average damage of each was 3590.935...
  • sohtohsohtoh Member Posts: 620 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    virusdancer wrote: »
    It would be the 710.5 to a single target, then half to two targets, a third to three targets, a fourth to four targets, and a fifth to five targets to get down to the 142.1 amount. Otherwise it couldn't have parsed the average amount it did for the two procs I had. Where the average damage of each was 3590.935...

    Glad to be wrong, your way it doesn't suck as much. :)
    "I'm not big on telepaths myself. I'm not big on guns either. But if everyone else has them, I want to make sure I can get my hands on the biggest one I can."
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    They do make an odd sound...could see somebody doing some trolling with some Phased Bio, Fluidic AP, AP, the Experimental, and the KCB...maybe work in the grunt of one of the Quads. I'd end up turning the sound off, lol...
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Really? that's what they're like in combat? I must have them!
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  • ddesjardinsddesjardins Member Posts: 3,056 Media Corps
    edited July 2014
    On another note, I do find the Xindi ground weapons a lot of fun to use with romulans. Sure you lose the innate Plasma weapon bonus, but the rifle's grenade is a glory to behold as all of your crit modifiers kick in.
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Decided that I would copy the lines from the log, when I noticed that I wasn't the only one that had used Phased Bio in that ISE...

    14:07:20:17:21:54.4::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[120843 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Sphere,C[120827 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-6499.03,-7242.84
    14:07:20:17:21:54.4::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Sphere,C[120827 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,804.76,8047.6
    14:07:20:17:22:00.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[120843 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Sphere,C[120828 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-6917.72,-7300.27
    14:07:20:17:22:00.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Sphere,C[120828 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,811.142,8111.41
    14:07:20:17:23:48.0::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Sphere,C[120940 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode_No_Loot],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,6942.52,0
    14:07:20:17:24:25.7::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[120954 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Sphere,C[120935 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode_No_Loot],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-62.0267,-66.1943
    14:07:20:17:24:25.7::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Nanite Sphere,C[120943 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Sphere,C[120935 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode_No_Loot],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,2456.7,2522.9
    14:07:20:17:24:25.7::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Nanite Sphere,C[120943 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Nanite Sphere,C[120942 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,1960.66,0
    14:07:20:17:24:25.7::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[120954 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Nanite Sphere,C[120943 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-1223.01,-1405.31
    14:07:20:17:24:25.7::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Nanite Sphere,C[120943 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,922.354,2155.36
    14:07:20:17:25:42.4::Nivuh,P[5261992@4209758 Nivuh@virusdancer],Nanite Generator,C[120830 Mission_Cure_Healer_Mini_Trans_02],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,3460.81,0
    14:07:20:17:26:11.4::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Nanite Transformer,C[120820 Mission_Borgraid1_Comm_Array],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,4274.66,0
    14:07:20:17:26:19.3::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Nanite Transformer,C[120820 Mission_Borgraid1_Comm_Array],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,6867.2,4876.79
    14:07:20:17:26:47.3::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[121067 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Nanite Sphere,C[121052 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-2060.73,-2341.01
    14:07:20:17:26:47.3::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Sphere,C[121053 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode_No_Loot],Nanite Sphere,C[121052 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,260.113,2601.13
    14:07:20:17:26:47.4::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[121067 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Nanite Sphere,C[121061 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-1916.39,-2177.04
    14:07:20:17:26:47.4::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Sphere,C[121053 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode_No_Loot],Nanite Sphere,C[121061 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,241.893,2418.93
    14:07:20:17:26:47.4::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[121067 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Sphere,C[121053 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode_No_Loot],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-1769.67,-1997.49
    14:07:20:17:26:47.4::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Sphere,C[121053 Space_Borg_Cruiser_Raidisode_No_Loot],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,221.943,2219.43
    14:07:20:17:26:55.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[121067 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Nanite Sphere,C[121052 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-1316.75,-1510.45
    14:07:20:17:26:55.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Nanite Sphere,C[121055 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Nanite Sphere,C[121052 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,167.828,1678.28
    14:07:20:17:26:55.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[121067 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Nanite Sphere,C[121055 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-1517.09,-1740.27
    14:07:20:17:26:55.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Nanite Sphere,C[121055 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,193.363,1933.63
    14:07:20:17:26:55.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[121067 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Nanite Sphere,C[121061 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-1550.34,-1778.4
    14:07:20:17:26:55.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Nanite Sphere,C[121055 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Nanite Sphere,C[121061 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,197.6,1976
    14:07:20:17:26:55.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Xindi-Aquatic Mobulai Frigate,C[121067 Space_Xindi_Frigate_Player_Carrier_Pet_1],Nanite Sphere,C[121064 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Shield,,-1599.09,-1834.32
    14:07:20:17:26:55.1::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Nanite Sphere,C[121055 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Nanite Sphere,C[121064 Mission_Infected_Healer_Sphere],Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,203.814,2038.14
    14:07:20:17:27:23.5::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Gateway,C[120822 Mission_Borgraid1_Transwarp_02],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,10110.3,0
    14:07:20:17:27:30.8::Nivuh,P[5261992@4209758 Nivuh@virusdancer],Gateway,C[120822 Mission_Borgraid1_Transwarp_02],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,3721.06,0
    14:07:20:17:27:35.4::Darcone,P[1341815@977905 Darcone@Darksha],Gateway,C[120822 Mission_Borgraid1_Transwarp_02],,*,Biomatter Needle Burst,Pn.Mvpeyi1,Phaser,,10106,0

    ...so at a cursory glance, it looks like my wee Nivuh, Darcone, and Darcone's Xindi pets were using Phased Bio.

    But that's not the case. Darcone was using AP. All of the Needle hits attributed to Darcone were actually just the hull hits from the Xindi pets. Take a look at the first pair. You've got the timestamp, you can see the shield line and the hull line. Yet, the hull damage is being attributed to Darcone instead of the pet.

    Then, perhaps like me, you get curious looking at the damage amounts, eh? A 10k Needle from a pet? You can see that the smaller Needle damage is from the burst hit multiple targets and thus was split.

    Those are some heinous pets, eh? Tempted to wonder if their Needle Bursts are working as intended...

    Cause here were the single target Needles from them...

    8047.6
    8111.41
    6942.52
    4274.66
    4876.79
    10110.3
    10106

    ...is it a case that the pets are running with some of the Captain's buffs, a little APA/GDF worked in there to separate those ~4k and the 8-10k hits?

    Meh, I need to stop looking at stuff like this...I never end up happy about any of it.
  • kimmymkimmym Member Posts: 1,317 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    virusdancer wrote: »
    Meh, I need to stop looking at stuff like this...I never end up happy about any of it.

    Hehe, welcome to the club. We meet on Thursdays, during server maintenance :P

    I just say to hell with things and crush now.
    I once again match my character. Behold the power of PINK!
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  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    kimmym wrote: »
    Hehe, welcome to the club. We meet on Thursdays, during server maintenance :P

    I just say to hell with things and crush now.

    It's usually a case of what happened there...I'm looking at X and then Y shows up to say hello. Meh...
  • warmaker001bwarmaker001b Member Posts: 9,205 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    ddesjardins wrote: »
    On another note, I do find the Xindi ground weapons a lot of fun to use with romulans. Sure you lose the innate Plasma weapon bonus, but the rifle's grenade is a glory to behold as all of your crit modifiers kick in.

    The Xindi weapon that shoots a biomatter grenade is pure awesome.
    XzRTofz.gif
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    So, I had to buy some Phased Bio DBBs for another toon (had to, lol, the sound is just trippy).

    An Eng, 3x Rare Mk XI, APO1, doesn't have the 2pc (have to grind out the marks for the turret)...and he got a total of 5 procs with each doing an average of 3308 damage. That's with 3x DBBs...145 cycles...5 procs.
  • bendalekbendalek Member Posts: 1,781 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    virusdancer wrote: »
    They do make an odd sound...could see somebody doing some trolling with some Phased Bio, Fluidic AP, AP, the Experimental, and the KCB...maybe work in the grunt of one of the Quads. I'd end up turning the sound off, lol...

    You forgot the 'Tinkle, Tinkle" of Tetryon, the 'Zoich, Zoich" of the Retro-Phasers, and to top it off .. The "Chiung, Chiung" of a Transphasic Torpedo Spread ...

    One could conceivably create a symphony of STO with weapons fire ... And make everyone's ears bleed for days after ...
    Oh, hoho hohhhhh, Oh,, hoho, hohhhhh
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  • tarastheslayertarastheslayer Member Posts: 1,541 Bug Hunter
    edited July 2014
    We've tested the ground weapons quite extensively and have to say they're actually pretty good, especially when they're used by people with high crit chance and severity, the blob gun eats through things quite nicely.

    The only one I'd say is bad is the pistol, which is a shame because with a bit of a damage buff that would be on par with the rifle.
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    I no longer do any Bug Hunting work for Cryptic. I may resume if a serious attempt to fix the game is made.
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Hrmm, so that would be two things...

    1) TT doesn't buff the Burst damage, raising the question of whether skills buff the damage at all. TT buffed the main Phaser damage, just not the Needle Burst.

    2) What's going on with the Xindi pet Bursts and the damage they can do with it? Is that just from the way they're set up or are they picking up on some Captain goodies unintentionally again?
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