test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Fridays: Let's Talk About Fixing Mechanics
sevenat
Member Posts: 34 Arc User
(note: sorry not good at formatting tried to keep it clean)
Hello everyone,
Lets talk about beloved game, its mechanics and so on. A discussion, a chance to share thoughts.
Here's what im thinking:
I've been on and off with this game for years. Its a love/hate thing.
As a result I've come to the following conclusions about the game as it relates to PVE content...
First Item: Starship Maneuvers, flying your ship and so on!
Idea
The game is based on the idea that moving fast, increases your defense (defense vrs Accuracy), I would agree with this on the idea that, often in the tv shows/movies they miss at smaller targets or fast moving targets, even firing torpedoes at 'normal sized ships' can miss too for example.
Result in game
In terms of PVE i feel that many of the PVE instances aren't fun because you no longer need to maneuver as much as you should. To me the entire ST universe is about rotating through your phaser arcs, shields, clever flying and use of "heat of the moment things' ( like a nearby nebula, the riker maneuver, cleaver science exploit etc)
On the flip side a few 'oddities take place to: when i fly my fed fleet-AC it feels sluggish, and thus breaks my immersion, i feel the enterprise-e moves better than it does in game.
(Im not fully maxed for gear, to be fair however.)
Another example is watching small escorts move at top speeds while tractor'beamin someone is... funny.... but so immersion breaking... that needs to slow down. Speaking of slowing down, when multiple gravity wells open near each other, borg spheres (and other ships) suddenly act like yo-yo's gone crazy.
Suggestions
- make 'flying your ship' important, cutting engines and hovering while you 'dps a target down' ... should not work... this isn't WOW after all.
- make enemy NPC's move! The borg instances are the worst for this, get those ships moving to defend thier stuff!
- because of the graphics limitations that occur, remove the magical "invisible one-hit-kills-npc-torpedo" (its not always invisible to be fair) and replace it with reduced damage versions or maybe for the borg, make it a subsystem off line type thing, I think it would be neat if the borg could adapt and 'temporarily disable your ship" in some fashion, maybe you go a drift? ( I know that the borg boarding parties do this to some extent)
- reduce npc damage in favor of the above, the idea being, because everyone is moving now, give players a bit of a break so they can line up and destroy targets, I guess I'm talking about that that super strong borg shield drain from the transphaisc hub or other such "gameplay mechanic npc skills" ... To be honest Im not sure what thier role is at times...
Second Item: Which ship do I fly? Why can't I use "X" ship in the end game?
Idea
I think its fair to say that the federation has a variety of ships on hand. And that perhaps a good portion of those ships are not "up-to-date" with current technology. However ships of all sizes and shapes have roles to full-fill. Maybe its transporting a diplomat (like we see in TNG) maybe its a resource hauler, a long range science ship, a reconnaissance ship, patrol ship, exploration ship or the myrmidon of other ships and uses we know about.
That being said. Lets look at the Adv Research Vessel for the FEDs.
http://sto.gamepedia.com/Advanced_Research_Vessel
Can we agree that this ship is not for front-line combat, I think we can! Now remember that episode of TNG were data was the captain of this ship? They deployed this ship along with several others as a task force along the neutral zone border.
Meaning, that although this ship was not a combat ship, it still could provide meaningful support to the other ships and also had some combat capability. No doubt starfleet has to send ships in the area to respond quickly, and cant wait for the best ships for the mission to arrive.
Thus, they cobble a fleet together, and it either succeeds or fails with what it has available to work with.
Result in game
You can't fly all the ships, some will just blow up after taking one volley from an enemy.
Science ships aren't effective support for various reasons so we only play ENG and TAC ships...
You are limited to the upper tier ships to "be able to survive and play effectively"
Is that wrong? Is that unfair? Does it follow the ST universe's "science" ...
... Yes, it does... and I'm not sure that creating a new version of an old ship design actually benefits anyone both in "universe" and in game. How does it support itself? other ships? the fleet?
Because what would happen is the same thing that does now. You go into an elite STF, and that giant borg tactical cube will shoot you once with a borg phaser for 2,500 damage, which is the most shields you can have on your tiny ship and its tiny warp core. The second volley kills you outright before you can do anything.
I feel that's a fair assessment of what happens currently in game more or less. new technology or not, the ship will simply have less hull hp and shield hp, less crew, less stations and therefore, less ability to mitigate combat damage quickly.
Think about it. Remember in TNG the battle of wolf 359
Basically, by sending in lots of ships, knowing that many of them will not be able to take many hits before they blow up, starfleet was counting on the fact that the surviving ships could in fact deal enough damage.
The idea of death by one-thousand-stings more or less.
Suggestions
BUT WAIT!!! THERE IS HOPE!
Remember our beloved little combat ship the defiant?!(Tactical Escort)
:eek:
The missing item here, I feel that has been over looked is that by installing a warp-core designed for larger ships into smaller ones, you now provide the power requirements necessary to maintain shields, weapons and combat systems and general ship systems in order to preform at levels during combat that are comparable to larger ships.
There is always a cost however...the cost being of other areas of federation ship design themes like :
The key thing to draw attention to here is the word "powerful" Nobody says that it has great armor, its a tank, it can last forever. I feel that the defiant that sisko flew benefited from the secret upgrades he preformed on the ship, regardless the ship can only take so much damage, and arguably less than larger ships with the same warp core.
The defiant can dish out damage, it can one shot dominion escorts, but several times during combat, when the combat is either prolonged or they are under attack from multiple ships, they simply can't mitigate and defend themselves from all that damage, during the battle for cardassia prime, lets be honest, they would have been blown up right along side my beloved life changing ever since i saw it on screen akira class that was escorting them... if it wasnt a tv show.
So!!
In conclusion, i feel that these two major changes to the game, both of which may require some reworking of the mechanics but I don't feel utterly break the game in its current state, would vastly improve the game for everyone!
So, what do you guys think?
Rework
1 - defense versus accuracy
2 - Ship movement, both player and NPC
3 - and consider that some kind of "retrofit" rework for smaller ships /older in game ships that do not get used because they are not viable, can be fixed by "changing out the warp core and bring the ship in line with newer design specs" - this will make them not equivalent to larger T5 ships, rather bring them into the same ballpark! If the defiant can do it so can other ships!
Thanks!
Edited: for spelling and clairty
Hello everyone,
Lets talk about beloved game, its mechanics and so on. A discussion, a chance to share thoughts.
Here's what im thinking:
I've been on and off with this game for years. Its a love/hate thing.
As a result I've come to the following conclusions about the game as it relates to PVE content...
First Item: Starship Maneuvers, flying your ship and so on!
Idea
The game is based on the idea that moving fast, increases your defense (defense vrs Accuracy), I would agree with this on the idea that, often in the tv shows/movies they miss at smaller targets or fast moving targets, even firing torpedoes at 'normal sized ships' can miss too for example.
Result in game
In terms of PVE i feel that many of the PVE instances aren't fun because you no longer need to maneuver as much as you should. To me the entire ST universe is about rotating through your phaser arcs, shields, clever flying and use of "heat of the moment things' ( like a nearby nebula, the riker maneuver, cleaver science exploit etc)
On the flip side a few 'oddities take place to: when i fly my fed fleet-AC it feels sluggish, and thus breaks my immersion, i feel the enterprise-e moves better than it does in game.
(Im not fully maxed for gear, to be fair however.)
Another example is watching small escorts move at top speeds while tractor'beamin someone is... funny.... but so immersion breaking... that needs to slow down. Speaking of slowing down, when multiple gravity wells open near each other, borg spheres (and other ships) suddenly act like yo-yo's gone crazy.
Suggestions
- make 'flying your ship' important, cutting engines and hovering while you 'dps a target down' ... should not work... this isn't WOW after all.
- make enemy NPC's move! The borg instances are the worst for this, get those ships moving to defend thier stuff!
- because of the graphics limitations that occur, remove the magical "invisible one-hit-kills-npc-torpedo" (its not always invisible to be fair) and replace it with reduced damage versions or maybe for the borg, make it a subsystem off line type thing, I think it would be neat if the borg could adapt and 'temporarily disable your ship" in some fashion, maybe you go a drift? ( I know that the borg boarding parties do this to some extent)
- reduce npc damage in favor of the above, the idea being, because everyone is moving now, give players a bit of a break so they can line up and destroy targets, I guess I'm talking about that that super strong borg shield drain from the transphaisc hub or other such "gameplay mechanic npc skills" ... To be honest Im not sure what thier role is at times...
Second Item: Which ship do I fly? Why can't I use "X" ship in the end game?
Idea
I think its fair to say that the federation has a variety of ships on hand. And that perhaps a good portion of those ships are not "up-to-date" with current technology. However ships of all sizes and shapes have roles to full-fill. Maybe its transporting a diplomat (like we see in TNG) maybe its a resource hauler, a long range science ship, a reconnaissance ship, patrol ship, exploration ship or the myrmidon of other ships and uses we know about.
That being said. Lets look at the Adv Research Vessel for the FEDs.
http://sto.gamepedia.com/Advanced_Research_Vessel
Known as the new "workhorse" of the Federation, this ship type has been in Starfleet service since 2363. This class of vessel replaced the Miranda class as the multi-purpose mission vessel, taking on various tasks from patrols to humanitarian or diplomatic missions, exploration and research duties.
Can we agree that this ship is not for front-line combat, I think we can! Now remember that episode of TNG were data was the captain of this ship? They deployed this ship along with several others as a task force along the neutral zone border.
Meaning, that although this ship was not a combat ship, it still could provide meaningful support to the other ships and also had some combat capability. No doubt starfleet has to send ships in the area to respond quickly, and cant wait for the best ships for the mission to arrive.
Thus, they cobble a fleet together, and it either succeeds or fails with what it has available to work with.
Result in game
You can't fly all the ships, some will just blow up after taking one volley from an enemy.
Science ships aren't effective support for various reasons so we only play ENG and TAC ships...
You are limited to the upper tier ships to "be able to survive and play effectively"
Is that wrong? Is that unfair? Does it follow the ST universe's "science" ...
... Yes, it does... and I'm not sure that creating a new version of an old ship design actually benefits anyone both in "universe" and in game. How does it support itself? other ships? the fleet?
Because what would happen is the same thing that does now. You go into an elite STF, and that giant borg tactical cube will shoot you once with a borg phaser for 2,500 damage, which is the most shields you can have on your tiny ship and its tiny warp core. The second volley kills you outright before you can do anything.
I feel that's a fair assessment of what happens currently in game more or less. new technology or not, the ship will simply have less hull hp and shield hp, less crew, less stations and therefore, less ability to mitigate combat damage quickly.
Think about it. Remember in TNG the battle of wolf 359
Ultimately, thirty-nine starships were lost, with a total loss of nearly 11,000 lives. Many people were assimilated.
Basically, by sending in lots of ships, knowing that many of them will not be able to take many hits before they blow up, starfleet was counting on the fact that the surviving ships could in fact deal enough damage.
The idea of death by one-thousand-stings more or less.
Suggestions
BUT WAIT!!! THERE IS HOPE!
Remember our beloved little combat ship the defiant?!(Tactical Escort)
(http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Defiant_class)
The Defiant-class was heavily-armored and incorporated the latest in Starfleet weaponry and defensive technology and was equipped with a class-7 warp drive. The Defiant was considerably smaller than most other Federation starships...The class-7 warp drive was extremely powerful for a ship of this size, and as such, Defiant-class vessels put out a warp signature equivalent to much larger starships.
:eek:
The missing item here, I feel that has been over looked is that by installing a warp-core designed for larger ships into smaller ones, you now provide the power requirements necessary to maintain shields, weapons and combat systems and general ship systems in order to preform at levels during combat that are comparable to larger ships.
There is always a cost however...the cost being of other areas of federation ship design themes like :
It was Starfleet's first dedicated combat vessel, and therefore did not include provisions for families or diplomatic missions, nor science labs or recreational facilities.
Well, we'll make it really small and really powerful, that it would be so powerful and scary, nobody would mess with it."
The key thing to draw attention to here is the word "powerful" Nobody says that it has great armor, its a tank, it can last forever. I feel that the defiant that sisko flew benefited from the secret upgrades he preformed on the ship, regardless the ship can only take so much damage, and arguably less than larger ships with the same warp core.
The defiant can dish out damage, it can one shot dominion escorts, but several times during combat, when the combat is either prolonged or they are under attack from multiple ships, they simply can't mitigate and defend themselves from all that damage, during the battle for cardassia prime, lets be honest, they would have been blown up right along side my beloved life changing ever since i saw it on screen akira class that was escorting them... if it wasnt a tv show.
So!!
In conclusion, i feel that these two major changes to the game, both of which may require some reworking of the mechanics but I don't feel utterly break the game in its current state, would vastly improve the game for everyone!
So, what do you guys think?
Rework
1 - defense versus accuracy
2 - Ship movement, both player and NPC
3 - and consider that some kind of "retrofit" rework for smaller ships /older in game ships that do not get used because they are not viable, can be fixed by "changing out the warp core and bring the ship in line with newer design specs" - this will make them not equivalent to larger T5 ships, rather bring them into the same ballpark! If the defiant can do it so can other ships!
Thanks!
Edited: for spelling and clairty
0