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9.5 and Exploration Accolades

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  • psiameesepsiameese Member Posts: 1,650 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    I hate seeing stuff getting the Axe without replacement. Even more if its such a big part that I occasional like to do. :(

    What the exploration system needed was some polish & a few new variables thrown into the pot & in time a season dedicated to it to make it a exploration 2.0; not a complete removal.

    I concur with this.
    STOwiki wrote:

    The Genesis Engine is a unique in-game content creator built by Cryptic Studios. The Genesis Engine will effectively create new mission quickly for the game developers.

    These new planets are randomly generated during development, meaning, that the Genesis Engine is not part of the server or client software and that missions are not created during runtime. Instead, the missions created by the Genesis Engine have to be manually reviewed by a developer before they are added to the game. Currently, there are more than 3775 such pre-rendered missions in the game as exploration content in star clusters.

    The 3775 figure had been offered by Dan Stahl during the summer of 2010. These are missions spread out across all the star clusters currently in our game. Missions that our player-created Captain's can actually participate in directly. I grant that there were (are) buggy maps to be found in some missions. I've reported my fair share over time. But to remove 3000+ exploration missions - no matter how basic some may present - is downright ridiculous.

    I got no problem with player's being free to drive up and park briefly at the star cluster to assign some Doffs to collecting any anomalies therein for them. Our potential, career, crafter's need their time to, well, craft.
    (/\) Exploring Star Trek Online Since July 2008 (/\)
  • mightybobcncmightybobcnc Member Posts: 3,354 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    No accolades for you!

    Joined January 2009
    Finger wrote:
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  • kiralynkiralyn Member Posts: 1,576 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    Hmm. And what's going to replace Strange New Worlds as a source of low-level dilithium?
  • lordhavelocklordhavelock Member Posts: 2,248 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    I posted the below in the Livestream Q & A from Forum Fans! thread. Several others posted similar questions. I'm glad I'm not alone in wondering about the Clusters.
    If the Exploration Clusters are removed with S9.5, what will happen to the <Cluster Name> Nomad, Wanderer, and Explorer Accolades? Do we need to rush to complete them before they un-finishable at S9, don't bother because they're being removed entirely (docking hundreds of accolade points from those that already have them), or will there be alternate way to finish them?

    What's happening to the daily Explore Strange New Worlds and We Need Breathing Room wrapper missions that pay Dilithium for exploring the Clusters?

    I still enjoyed running them from time-to-time, especially when leveling an alt, but mostly for nostalgia sake. I won't miss them too much. I do look forward to getting some sort of Exploration in STO.

    You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
  • angrytargangrytarg Member Posts: 11,009 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    mvp333 wrote: »
    Sure, the Exploration Cluster system sucks, but it's one of the only attempted simulations of actual mildly-unique Star Trek-themed gameplay that I've seen in this game... Everything else is just pew pew, grind grind, pew pew some more.

    This. And now they removing that in favour of more grind and doff nonsense. I am baffled.
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  • mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    Maybe it's just wishful thinking, but if they choose to replace them now, it could imply that exploration will come back in another form in the expansion.



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  • centaurianalphacentaurianalpha Member Posts: 1,150 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    Removing the Exploration system is simply unacceptable; it is the very CORE of the franchise, "..to boldly go..."! For that matter reducing the number of material samples for crafting is also illogical; the "we'll save you storage space" argument falls flat, especially when Cryptic just gave everyone free storage space a couple of months ago. If the dev's are too lazy to create a workable crafting algorithm, why not solicit submissions from the fan base, who actually play the game?

    Players would absolutely have more long-term investment in the game if they could participate in its development. Cryptic could have a more robust game to market if they were not limited by their own personnel budget, and player participation could go a long way to expanding their skill pool. :rolleyes:
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  • kiralynkiralyn Member Posts: 1,576 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    angrytarg wrote: »
    This. And now they removing that in favour of more grind and doff nonsense. I am baffled.


    Is it really "more doff nonsense", or just a simple interface to access the already-existing nebula doff missions? And what grind are they adding to the nebulas?


    (Note: this doesn't mean I agree with the removal of exploration, just curious about the details of the changes)
  • skk1701jskk1701j Member Posts: 243 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    For a long time I run the daily wrapper Mission + Academy Event to get my daily ore on low lvl. Now it is too easy to get a lot of dil in a short time. SB24, Gorn... suffer under this conditions. Even STFs... because with ISE, CSE, Dyson Ground you have high payout area. Daily foundry is nice, because of the 960 + 1440 extra ore. They will keep the minigame, so there is no need to remove the missions. Well programmed, it's just little search and replace.

    These Missions where the only random part in the game. I would like to see more random ingame. Horga'hn hunt has two patterns with fixed spots. Think about the challenge, when 20 Horga'hn are "random" distributed on the map for each run/zone. A lot of things shouldn't be predictable (where to place mines on defera).
  • baddmoonrizinbaddmoonrizin Member Posts: 11,028 Community Moderator
    edited June 2014
    capnmanx wrote: »
    *sigh* Well, I won't argue with that.

    Still, they didn't remove crafting at the start of season 9 to make room for the revamp in 9.5 now did they? So if we are talking about a new exploration system in X2, why are they taking out the clusters in 9.5?

    How about this? They are being taken out because the clusters play a role in resource collection, and they didn't want to go through all the exploration stuff replacing old things with new things in time for the crafting revamp. Too much trouble; especially considering that in its present state it's not a very popular feature.

    It's easy to see why they might think to take them out; the obvious reason doesn't have anything to do with a replacement exploration system though. That's why I'm worried.

    The reason that seems to make the most sense for removing the Star Cluster maps is this:

    The Star Cluster maps were replete with Anomalies to scan and acquire Data Samples and Particle Traces with the occasional Unknown System to explore. With Data Samples and Particle Traces being replaced by the new R&D Materials, players could just sit in the nebulae all day and farm Materials for Crafting. This is apparently not the way Cryptic wants us to acquire said R&D Materials, so they're removing those maps to prevent large-scale farming. So, I think it's more that they DON'T want the Star Clusters to play a role in resource collecting.
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  • capnmanxcapnmanx Member Posts: 1,452 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    The reason that seems to make the most sense for removing the Star Cluster maps is this:

    The Star Cluster maps were replete with Anomalies to scan and acquire Data Samples and Particle Traces with the occasional Unknown System to explore. With Data Samples and Particle Traces being replaced by the new R&D Materials, players could just sit in the nebulae all day and farm Materials for Crafting. This is apparently not the way Cryptic wants us to acquire said R&D Materials, so they're removing those maps to prevent large-scale farming. So, I think it's more that they DON'T want the Star Clusters to play a role in resource collecting.

    Also possible.

    No less depressing.
  • yellowalertyellowalert Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    hypl wrote: »
    They're not up to the "standard of quality" according to Cryptic. And let's face it, they've all been TRIBBLE since launch. Warp in, scan or destroy 5 things, then leave.

    I dunno, I get a metric ****ton of "Aid the Planet" that ends up costing an arm and a leg in EC over time.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • yellowalertyellowalert Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    This is apparently not the way Cryptic wants us to acquire said R&D Materials, so they're removing those maps to prevent large-scale farming. So, I think it's more that they DON'T want the Star Clusters to play a role in resource collecting.

    Then why not drop the % of resources in the clusters? I've gone 4 or 5 times in a row several times of nothing but scans in clusters, while trying to find a mission.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • gazurtoidgazurtoid Member Posts: 423 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    I keep telling Cryptic this but there is a 30 year old game called Starflght (it ran off pre-Pentium computers, that's how old) and it had literally 1000x more exploration than STO ever had. There are fans that made a recreation that you can find on the net. I would suggest the Devs actually play it and know what exploration feels like for a game.
    :)



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  • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,556 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    Removing the Exploration system is simply unacceptable; it is the very CORE of the franchise, "..to boldly go..."! For that matter reducing the number of material samples for crafting is also illogical; the "we'll save you storage space" argument falls flat, especially when Cryptic just gave everyone free storage space a couple of months ago. If the dev's are too lazy to create a workable crafting algorithm, why not solicit submissions from the fan base, who actually play the game?

    Players would absolutely have more long-term investment in the game if they could participate in its development. Cryptic could have a more robust game to market if they were not limited by their own personnel budget, and player participation could go a long way to expanding their skill pool. :rolleyes:

    Agreed. Exploration is the core of the franchise, but it needs a major revamp which is what I expect will be one of the major features of Expansion 2. Supposedly we are headed to the Delta Quadrant in Expansion 2 and not having some Exploration system as part of the Delta Quadrant would be extremely short-sighted.

    As someone else mentioned, the reason why they removed the current Exploration system now and instead of in Expansion 2 is due to the Crafting revamp. Cryptic could have removed all the anomalies from the Exploration Clusters and just leave the planets there if they weren't going to do an Exploration Revamp. If they are going to do the Exploration Revamp in Expansion 2, then it doesn't make sense to waste resources on removing the anomalies from the Exploration Cluster in Season 9.5 and completely revamp the Exploration system in Expansion 2.

    Cryptic didn't reduce the number of crafting resources. They actually increased the amount significantly. There are different rarities of crafting resources and crafting components. How crafting works on Tribble is you create components from resources and create equipment from components. Instead of wasting our inventory slots on crafting items, there is a completely new inventory tab that stores all your crafting resources and components. Now Cryptic just needs a Vanity Inventory Tab to store our pets, event items, and other superficial items.
  • frtoasterfrtoaster Member Posts: 3,354 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    Sorry, they are being removed. It was my favorite part of the game, but soon they will be gone forever.
    I NEED to say that exploration of the various belts, clusters, expanses, and nebulas is one of my favorite things about STO in spite of the opinions of the detractors. My main, A FEDTAC did them all. Seventy (70) times each for the accolades. Now I'm sad because I did'nt finish them on my three Alts. I don't know when this is happening but I am about to leave Risa and get back to "work". I have seen all the negative comments but I only have one...there are too many Gorgans.

    I feel sorry that your favorite part of the game is being removed. Cryptic should take note that no matter how unpopular a part of the game may be, there is always someone who really enjoys it. It takes a lot of dedication to explore each cluster 70 times.
    Waiting for a programmer ...
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  • kiralynkiralyn Member Posts: 1,576 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    Honestly, the only thing that bothered me about the Explore missions was how damn long they took to load. :rolleyes:



    And yeah, it seems odd to just remove large amounts of content for no obvious reason. So there has to be some sort of hidden rationale - was it taking up too much server resources, are they going to add something better in 2.0, too easy to farm materials (you'd think it'd be easier to just adjust drop rates & node quantity), etc.... there's something we're missing here. There has to be.
  • baddmoonrizinbaddmoonrizin Member Posts: 11,028 Community Moderator
    edited June 2014
    I'm going to miss the hundreds of Diplomacy XP I could get each day from running Diplomatic Investigations. Not to mention First Contact missions. Hey! What's the point of Ambassador Jiro Sugihara now?!
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  • lordhavelocklordhavelock Member Posts: 2,248 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    I'm going to miss the hundreds of Diplomacy XP I could get each day from running Diplomatic Investigations. Not to mention First Contact missions. Hey! What's the point of Ambassador Jiro Sugihara now?!
    Well, there's that one mission where they make a joke about how talkative he is (to the point of being annoyingly verbose), and then that other mission where he's surprisingly succinct (such that they point out just how concise he's being).

    lol

    :rolleyes:

    You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
  • capnmanxcapnmanx Member Posts: 1,452 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    Well, my question regarding the fate of exploration got picked during today's livestream. Captainsmirk couldn't actually give an answer, but he did urge keeping an eye on upcoming blogs; specifically mentioning the 3rd of July as being significant.

    So, hopefully our questions will be answered in the next couple of weeks or there abouts. For now, I'll just hope that it's good news.
  • azurianstarazurianstar Member Posts: 6,985 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    capnmanx wrote: »
    Well, my question regarding the fate of exploration got picked during today's livestream. Captainsmirk couldn't actually give an answer, but he did urge keeping an eye on upcoming blogs; specifically mentioning the 3rd of July as being significant.

    So, hopefully our questions will be answered in the next couple of weeks or there abouts. For now, I'll just hope that it's good news.

    This isn't something Cryptic should joking around with us on.

    The players need to know if we are wasting our efforts right now! There are tons of players who are uncertain of the fate of the exploration accolades, so they are grinding their hearts out (on top of normal grinding) trying to finish the exploration accolades. And it very well might be for nothing.

    That's why they need to respond, now. Not tell us on July 3rd that these just wasted 2 weeks of hard grinding for nothing, because the accoaldes would be going away.
  • kavasekavase Member Posts: 771 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    capnmanx wrote: »
    Well, my question regarding the fate of exploration got picked during today's livestream. Captainsmirk couldn't actually give an answer, but he did urge keeping an eye on upcoming blogs; specifically mentioning the 3rd of July as being significant.

    So, hopefully our questions will be answered in the next couple of weeks or there abouts. For now, I'll just hope that it's good news.

    So hopefully they'll remove exploration and replace it with something else instead?

    I hope so, last thing they need to do is remove stuff and not replace it with something else. Although, I wouldn't be all that upset anyway if they just removed exploration and let it be that, it never was really all that exciting.
    Retired. I'm now in search for that perfect space anomaly.
  • baddmoonrizinbaddmoonrizin Member Posts: 11,028 Community Moderator
    edited June 2014
    This isn't something Cryptic should joking around with us on.

    The players need to know if we are wasting our efforts right now! There are tons of players who are uncertain of the fate of the exploration accolades, so they are grinding their hearts out (on top of normal grinding) trying to finish the exploration accolades. And it very well might be for nothing.

    That's why they need to respond, now. Not tell us on July 3rd that these just wasted 2 weeks of hard grinding for nothing, because the accoaldes would be going away.

    Well, I know they've discontinued some Accolades and made them unobtainable, but I've not heard of them removing discontinued Accolades that have already been earned. I think those that have earned the Star Cluster Exploration Accolades will be safe. It's those of us who won't have them finished in time that I'm concerned about. So I'd like to know if they'll be making a way for the Accolades to still be earned, or will the Accolades indeed be retired for good.
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  • ralphgraphiteralphgraphite Member Posts: 628 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    I find the removal of the exploration clusters, if it goes through, unfortunate. I know the missions are seen as relatively subpar, but they are an easy way to earn some dilithium at low levels (much like other things that were removed, like the academy event), AND they break up the monotony of the STF queues once in a while. For those of us who RP (I don't even consider myself serious at it), it could be fun to switch to a science ship and do some more random stuff and farming once in a while. Made me feel more Starfleet than slaughtering people across the galaxy.

    Besides, REMOVAL of game content sucks, even if it is used less than other content. It means less things to do. I hope they add a pile of missions in 9.5 to make up for this (not just a single FE and see you in 5 to 6 months). I doubt that's on the table though.

    If they are going to revamp exploration as well, that'd be great - but no sense yanking stuff until you're ready to do it.
  • capnmanxcapnmanx Member Posts: 1,452 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    kavase wrote: »
    So hopefully they'll remove exploration and replace it with something else instead?
    ...

    Maybe. His response was to that very question, so he seems to be expecting some kind of news regarding that. We'll just have to see.
    This isn't something Cryptic should joking around with us on.

    The players need to know if we are wasting our efforts right now! There are tons of players who are uncertain of the fate of the exploration accolades, so they are grinding their hearts out (on top of normal grinding) trying to finish the exploration accolades. And it very well might be for nothing.

    That's why they need to respond, now. Not tell us on July 3rd that these just wasted 2 weeks of hard grinding for nothing, because the accoaldes would be going away.

    Oh yeah, the accolades.

    Someone else asked about those specifically, and... well as far as I can remember, he said that the community team hadn't been given any info about that, so he quite simply didn't know.

    There were a couple of other questions that were kind of in the same ball park though, so I'm afraid it's possible I'm getting the answers mixed up. But it definitely did come up, so check the transcript when it becomes available just in case.
  • azurianstarazurianstar Member Posts: 6,985 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    Well, I know they've discontinued some Accolades and made them unobtainable, but I've not heard of them removing discontinued Accolades that have already been earned.

    They have removed many accolades over the years. There were accolades like with the old DS9 episodes that were pulled, some from the old Romulan missions too. And recently with the Tier 1 mission revamp.
    I think those that have earned the Star Cluster Exploration Accolades will be safe. It's those of us who won't have them finished in time that I'm concerned about. So I'd like to know if they'll be making a way for the Accolades to still be earned, or will the Accolades indeed be retired for good.

    That's what we would like to know.

    Are people wasting their time on something that's about to be removed? Are Exploration accolades going to be incompleteable? Are they going to grandfather incomplete exploration accolades and so that you get full credit? Or exploration is temporarily going away and they are revamping the clusters so it's easier (like the DSEs)? This is the million credit question.

    capnmanx wrote: »
    Oh yeah, the accolades.

    Someone else asked about those specifically, and... well as far as I can remember, he said that the community team hadn't been given any info about that, so he quite simply didn't know.

    There were a couple of other questions that were kind of in the same ball park though, so I'm afraid it's possible I'm getting the answers mixed up. But it definitely did come up, so check the transcript when it becomes available just in case.

    Almost feels like we are the White House press, asking questions to the Press Secretary. :P

    IBesides, REMOVAL of game content sucks, even if it is used less than other content. It means less things to do. I hope they add a pile of missions in 9.5 to make up for this (not just a single FE and see you in 5 to 6 months). I doubt that's on the table though.

    Reminds me of how they prided themselves that they wouldn't be removing content, yet they removed more content than they added on in the past few years.

    Terrordrome, several Fleet Actions. the Space Assault PvP map, couple of PvE missions, and now Exploration Clusters. And if people forgot, Exploration Clusters were originally 1 of the 3 methods they said people could level (the other two being storyline and PvP). So we lost one of the foundations of the original STO.

    (Wonder if they going to pull the DSE's soon as well?)
  • macroniusmacronius Member Posts: 2,526
    edited June 2014
    We need a "It's dead Jim" accolade for exploration too. Limited time availability requires that you grind every exploration zone 100 times before Season 9.5 starts.

    Make it so Cryptic!
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  • skk1701jskk1701j Member Posts: 243 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    Well, I know they've discontinued some Accolades and made them unobtainable, but I've not heard of them removing discontinued Accolades that have already been earned. I think those that have earned the Star Cluster Exploration Accolades will be safe. It's those of us who won't have them finished in time that I'm concerned about. So I'd like to know if they'll be making a way for the Accolades to still be earned, or will the Accolades indeed be retired for good.

    This may not the case. During revamp of the borg missions obtained accolades where removed.
    I find the removal of the exploration clusters, if it goes through, unfortunate. I know the missions are seen as relatively subpar, but they are an easy way to earn some dilithium at low levels (much like other things that were removed, like the academy event), AND they break up the monotony of the STF queues once in a while. For those of us who RP (I don't even consider myself serious at it), it could be fun to switch to a science ship and do some more random stuff and farming once in a while. Made me feel more Starfleet than slaughtering people across the galaxy.

    They should have added a dili reward to the missions. Klingon empire defence missions reward 1440 ore for 15 mins of work. If nebula rewards 960 (because it's easier), they would be more popular.
  • bemlegabemlega Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    *pop*

    So, who's frantically exploring and who's betting on accolades beeing dropped?
  • baddmoonrizinbaddmoonrizin Member Posts: 11,028 Community Moderator
    edited June 2014
    skk1701j wrote: »
    This may not the case. During revamp of the borg missions obtained accolades where removed.

    So, you're saying that you no longer have Accolades that you had already completed?
    bemlega wrote: »
    *pop*

    So, who's frantically exploring and who's betting on accolades beeing dropped?

    I haven't the time right now. Too busy trying to earn everything I can on Risa for all my toons before the event ends. :D

    Unfortunately, I'm thinking the Accolades will go away. I'm hopeful that they will remain obtainable in some fashion, but I don't think it's very likely.
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