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Heavy Turret: No CrtD Bonus?
reginamala78
Member Posts: 4,593 Arc User
Dual Heavy Cannons get a +10% crtd bonus over regular Dual Cannons, but the new Heavy Turret from the 8472 Rep doesn't get that same bonus? Lame.
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Waits in suspense.....Soooo what does it get?
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
I will tell you, It gets a set piece bonus, barrage (which attacks up to 10 targets at once and they all get an auto bio incubation proc) ! what more does that dude want ?
And you get this awesome active gemmick by sacrificing a tac slot.:D
We can only hope they remove the +10% CrtD from other "heavy" weapons and add a small bonus to the lower performing "non-heavy" variants (only applies to cannons since there are no heavy beam arrays...yet).
It looks better firing alongside DHCs than normal turrets. Sold me.
Well, not exactly. the "Gimmick" is the same as the "Point Defense" console, without the console. So, by using the set bonus.. I am using 2 consoles and no torpedo, you can consider the tac console as:
1) Heavy Barrage = "Point Defense" by another name
2) 20.5% boost to the turret (s)... and any/other Phaser / Disruptor Weapon
3) 26% boost to any Radiation damage, including ALL Bio-Molecular weapons
4) 26% boost for Photon Torps, that is if your using them.
Not a bad set of boosts for using a tac slot, since Fleet consoles are 31.9 for one weap type only.
Systems Designer - Cryptic Studios
Twitter: @JeffAHamilton
hey a dev worked out why most ppl dont use DC shocking :eek:
But isn't that kind of the tradeoff between DHCs and DCs, dependent upon the build? For the person running the per pulse procs/effects, they'd favor the DCs with the 4/3 cycle over the 2/3 cycle - while the person not going that route, they're going DHCs for that +10% CrtD they have. And you guys have been adding more per pulse procs/effects...
Though, I did notice that the Heavy Crescent Wave Cannon doesn't get that +10% CrtD for being Heavy either.
Most people also consider the firing cycle of DHCs to have superior power drain properties.
more so than any other factor, the required time on target is what makes the DHC so much better then the DC. with DHC you need your target in your firing arc for about a second, and have 2 seconds to maneuver and get them back in arc to fire again, and you deal 100% DPS. that's why they are best, no arm chair number crunching is gonna factor in fireing arc related down time. for a DC, your target can never leave your fireing arc, ever, or you lose 1/4 of your DPS ever shot in the cycle you miss out on. and not just for 1 weapons cycle, if they are out of arc ever, your DPS is in the toilet. and, it takes the entire 3 seconds for all that DPS to be applied, time in which there can be regeneration tics, reaction to the attack with TT and other active countermeasures, and plenty of manual redistribution all that working against it. CRF DHC, every cycle is spike that if you didn't have defenses up before they hit, will remove chunks of you before you can react.
single cannons, dispute their lower DPS, are dramatically better. a full 180 degree fireing arc overcomes the DC's insurmountable time on target problem. anything your trying to milk number of shots out of, you will find singles working better agienst anything but borg structures, and those don't even have shields, so glider's no use, the only other one is DEM really. borticus even said elachi weapons aren't per shot proc, but that wouldn't make any sense.
taking away DHC's built in crit D wont make them even, oh not by a long shot. should probably do that though, remove it. the only way you could make DCs worth using with their shots per cycle and fireing arc, is to give them at least like 25% higher DPS then DHCs have. in the EPtE age, even then it would be damn hard to use them to their potential against anything.
if you increased DC fireing arc to like 90, then you just marginalize the already underpowered single cannons. turning singles into single heavies at the same time though, that would be for the best, and make all cannon types useful in their own niche. right now DHCs are best, singles barely have a reason to exist, and DCs are as big a joke as the galaxy R. but ya, lets fuss over a crtD mod lol
VR "special" item...
Proc
Proc
Mod
Would appear to be short a proc/mod for a VR "special" item.
Might have an unlisted [Dmg] mod built in, though - comparing its DPS to another turret.
edit: Meh, wasn't clear. Even with a built in [Dmg], would still be short one for a "special" item. VR normal items have 4 total, while VR "special" items tend to have 5. The Spiral Wave Disruptors are an exception to this with 6.
That's my guess. Normal weapons are 1 proc and 3 mods. Hybrids are usually 2 proc and 2 mods. This has 2 procs, so it should have 2 mods, one [Acc] is listed, nothing else shows up so its probably an inherent [Dmg]
I think in the long run, for both diversity of play and balance, you need more distinct resource systems and the subsystem energy levels don't cut it in part because of how arcane they are and in part because the subsystems function identically.
If DHCs and other weapons operated differently, ala Rage/Fury/Mana/Skill/Combo in other games, you'd see more gameplay diversity, more opportunities to make sense of things, and a bit more balance.
One of the big things I feel could use a ground up revamp is energy/resource systems, with crew thrown into that for good measure.
Problem being they are ALREADY superior to DC's in every single way. The only slight way in which DC are superior is in using per pulse effects which are rare and not often usable to great effect with them...
I still am waiting for the Proton Dual Heavy cannons on the Science Destroyers to have their proper critical damage boost considering they are affixed.
"Heavy" denotes +10% critD included 'free' at the cost of lower firing rate. Either remove "heavy" from title of the turret and increase fire rate, or put in +10% critD. Make things consistent.
Want to fix up DC's? Give them innate CritH. Their high fire rates already suggest they're better for proc rate, giving innate proc chance boost would solidify it.
Whether that brings them up to par with innate CritD I'll leave that to the math pros around here.
If still not up to scratch, increase innate to 2x CritH maybe or switch for CritX.
That's the thing, the Elachi Cannon doesn't have it. The Heavy Crescent Wave Cannon, part of the Lobi weapon set, doesn't have an additional +10% CrtD...it's sporting +60% CrtD, the equivalent of [CrtD]x3...it's not +70%.
The Elachi cannon from the lobi store, is a rare item which might effect the over all MODS.
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
For it to have the +10%, it would have to have an odd number. +10%, +30%, +50%, +70%...it's sporting +60%.
Well virus I don't put nothing past these Dev's, to do something like that, but because it is a rare item, and not a VR one it may not gain the innate +10% CRTD, making it simply a CRTDX3 weapon.
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
Yes the Dev's make odd decisions when it comes to certain things.
Also you are confusing the heck out of me, when you keep changing your avatar constantly.
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
Have to admit that I'm a fan of consistency...and...the lack of it is something I tend to grumble about.
What are the chances the PvP revamp will change any of this? lol
I guess the only thing "heavy" seems to be consistent with is drawing -12 power per volley and slower (half?) firing rate.
Pretty much, the only thing heavy about them, is simply it being in the name.
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
The ROF is consistent. 2/3 instead of 4/3. They do twice the DPV while doing the same DPS...relatively speaking. It's "half" the shots for "twice" the damage...
All in all, it gets into one of those balance pass things - did things keep up with each other? You know, say taking a look at AP DHCs vs. other energy weapons, eh? Two years back, the value of the +30% CrtD there was nowhere near the value it has today. Can the same be said about the rest? Did they have an equal gain? Does there need to be a tweak down or is this perhaps a case for a tweak up elsewhere?
FINALLY someone acknowledges it. You should buff dual cannons to compensate both for this one, and the power level/spike damage superiority. Having actual choices would be really nice.