The heart of the Federation is a dangerous dictatorship under a thin veil of freedom.
Sure, Fed citizens can do whatever they want, and never go hungry.
But who has all the money? The government. Who runs the massive [crossout] military [/crossout] exploratory force? The government. Who has the authority to randomly sell people to the Cardassians, of all things? The government.
So yes, the Federation is a paradise.
As long as the government sees fit to keep it that way.
Anyway, they also possess that uniquely bureaucratic paradox of both being iron-fisted and completely incompetent.
The heart of the Federation is a dangerous dictatorship under a thin veil of freedom.
Sure, Fed citizens can do whatever they want, and never go hungry.
But who has all the money? The government. Who runs the massive [crossout] military [/crossout] exploratory force? The government. Who has the authority to randomly sell people to the Cardassians, of all things? The government.
So yes, the Federation is a paradise.
As long as the government sees fit to keep it that way.
Anyway, they also possess that uniquely bureaucratic paradox of both being iron-fisted and completely incompetent.
and as the government of the federation is the will of the people, these things are all under popular control, directly or indirectly. if the people want to throw away their paradise, they are free to do so (like tasha yar's homeworld did). with the slight application of basic observation, your iron fist arguement vanishes like fog in a strong breeze.
now lets compare this to the klingon empire, a feudal state were only a handful of powerful house leaders have any say in anything at all, and everyone else follows government orders and government defined honor or is shunned socially to the point of effective banishment. (those that are not killed for their disobedience to the will of the state that is).
Apologies, I read your post and misread it to say it was the last episode, not the last with Wesley.
As for the episode. Ignoring the native americans in space theme. This was still a case of during a war(?) (Seriously when was the Federation/Cardassian war?) a group of people settled a world in a conflicted area. And now that treaties are going into effect with those former enemies, those settlements are on the wrong side of the border.
The solution of, if you do not leave then you are under Cardassian rule, makes sense. Them becoming Maquis because the Federation abandoned them however does not.
That is not why the colonies became the Maquis. They became the Maquis because the Cardiassans started killing/terrorizing the colonists and The Federation did nothing to help them, even siding against it's own colonists for fighting back and not rolling over and dieing because the Federation will often go to ludicrous lengths to preserve peace treaties (even if it clearly doesn't work).
Also I'm not sure if realize that the Son'a are a dying people in Insurrection having been exiled for disagreeing with the Bak'us idiotic "this far and no further line" when it comes to technology. Starfleet is helping the Son'a cause the needs of the many out way the needs of the few and are hoping to use the technology to save lives given how many people are dying due to the Dominion war and the Son'a need to do this because they would need ten years of normal exposure to the metaphasic radiation and most of them will die before that. So yeah, Picards "noble Insurrection" is to help a bunch of self righteous hippy elf jerks stop the Sona and Starfleet building the Alpha quadrants greatest hospital because they don't want to move.
That is not why the colonies became the Maquis. They became the Maquis because the Cardiassans started killing/terrorizing the colonists and The Federation did nothing to help them, even siding against it's own colonists for fighting back and not rolling over and dieing because the Federation will often go to ludicrous lengths to preserve peace treaties (even if it clearly doesn't work).
Also I'm not sure if realize that the Son'a are a dying people in Insurrection having been exiled for disagreeing with the Bak'us idiotic "this far and no further line" when it comes to technology. Starfleet is helping the Son'a cause the needs of the many out way the needs of the few and are hoping to use the technology to save lives given how many people are dying due to the Dominion war and the Son'a need to do this because they would need ten years of normal exposure to the metaphasic radiation and most of them will die before that. So yeah, Picards "noble Insurrection" is to help a bunch of self righteous hippy elf jerks stop the Sona and Starfleet building the Alpha quadrants greatest hospital because they don't want to move.
Yay, someone brought it up here instead of the Klingon section. Thank you!
Now, I need to say I disagree.
The Son'a want to punish their elders and cast them out. Do not give them noble aspirations. The sit and study the phenomenon was ignored because. Who would want to live/work in the briar patch?
The Baku were not asked to pack up for a new medicine and they started a sit in. They were told "We are the Federation. Your world has something we want. You will be removed. Resistance is Futile." They were there long before the Federation annexed the space around them, and are not members of the Federation. But some felt this makes it alright to take their world from them.
Also, the plan is foolish. Because, as I have said else where, the Federation does not understand the technology a group of 'thugs' who are allies of the Dominion. (Known to manufacture vast quantities of Ketracel White) And are just taking their word for it that it will collect all these miracle particles. They will then let you use as much as you want, how ever you want. Oh and while doing this will kill the planet, the natural source of the particles will be alright, right?
Never mentioned.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
That is not why the colonies became the Maquis. They became the Maquis because the Cardiassans started killing/terrorizing the colonists and The Federation did nothing to help them, even siding against it's own colonists for fighting back and not rolling over and dieing because the Federation will often go to ludicrous lengths to preserve peace treaties (even if it clearly doesn't work).
Also I'm not sure if realize that the Son'a are a dying people in Insurrection having been exiled for disagreeing with the Bak'us idiotic "this far and no further line" when it comes to technology. Starfleet is helping the Son'a cause the needs of the many out way the needs of the few and are hoping to use the technology to save lives given how many people are dying due to the Dominion war and the Son'a need to do this because they would need ten years of normal exposure to the metaphasic radiation and most of them will die before that. So yeah, Picards "noble Insurrection" is to help a bunch of self righteous hippy elf jerks stop the Sona and Starfleet building the Alpha quadrants greatest hospital because they don't want to move.
I keep needing to apologize to you. I failed to reply to your first point. Sorry.
First. The settlement that Picard made was that the Cardassians near the Federation would be under Federation rule, and that the humans now in Cardassian space would be under Cardassian rule. IE not Federation citizens. We jump to DS9 and we hear that the two sets of colonies are at war with one another. The Cardassian colonies getting some support from sympathetic members of their government. But nothing official or widely known. Hence Dukat being in the dark on it. When Sisko tries to settle things, they do not want Federation help anymore. They want to fight. Period. So really have a hard time blaming the Federation for the Maquis. At least from what I saw from Sisko's point of view.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Comments
Plus we have the best food hands down.
Sure, Fed citizens can do whatever they want, and never go hungry.
But who has all the money? The government. Who runs the massive [crossout] military [/crossout] exploratory force? The government. Who has the authority to randomly sell people to the Cardassians, of all things? The government.
So yes, the Federation is a paradise.
As long as the government sees fit to keep it that way.
Anyway, they also possess that uniquely bureaucratic paradox of both being iron-fisted and completely incompetent.
and as the government of the federation is the will of the people, these things are all under popular control, directly or indirectly. if the people want to throw away their paradise, they are free to do so (like tasha yar's homeworld did). with the slight application of basic observation, your iron fist arguement vanishes like fog in a strong breeze.
now lets compare this to the klingon empire, a feudal state were only a handful of powerful house leaders have any say in anything at all, and everyone else follows government orders and government defined honor or is shunned socially to the point of effective banishment. (those that are not killed for their disobedience to the will of the state that is).
That is not why the colonies became the Maquis. They became the Maquis because the Cardiassans started killing/terrorizing the colonists and The Federation did nothing to help them, even siding against it's own colonists for fighting back and not rolling over and dieing because the Federation will often go to ludicrous lengths to preserve peace treaties (even if it clearly doesn't work).
Also I'm not sure if realize that the Son'a are a dying people in Insurrection having been exiled for disagreeing with the Bak'us idiotic "this far and no further line" when it comes to technology. Starfleet is helping the Son'a cause the needs of the many out way the needs of the few and are hoping to use the technology to save lives given how many people are dying due to the Dominion war and the Son'a need to do this because they would need ten years of normal exposure to the metaphasic radiation and most of them will die before that. So yeah, Picards "noble Insurrection" is to help a bunch of self righteous hippy elf jerks stop the Sona and Starfleet building the Alpha quadrants greatest hospital because they don't want to move.
Yay, someone brought it up here instead of the Klingon section. Thank you!
Now, I need to say I disagree.
The Son'a want to punish their elders and cast them out. Do not give them noble aspirations. The sit and study the phenomenon was ignored because. Who would want to live/work in the briar patch?
The Baku were not asked to pack up for a new medicine and they started a sit in. They were told "We are the Federation. Your world has something we want. You will be removed. Resistance is Futile." They were there long before the Federation annexed the space around them, and are not members of the Federation. But some felt this makes it alright to take their world from them.
Also, the plan is foolish. Because, as I have said else where, the Federation does not understand the technology a group of 'thugs' who are allies of the Dominion. (Known to manufacture vast quantities of Ketracel White) And are just taking their word for it that it will collect all these miracle particles. They will then let you use as much as you want, how ever you want. Oh and while doing this will kill the planet, the natural source of the particles will be alright, right?
Never mentioned.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
I keep needing to apologize to you. I failed to reply to your first point. Sorry.
First. The settlement that Picard made was that the Cardassians near the Federation would be under Federation rule, and that the humans now in Cardassian space would be under Cardassian rule. IE not Federation citizens. We jump to DS9 and we hear that the two sets of colonies are at war with one another. The Cardassian colonies getting some support from sympathetic members of their government. But nothing official or widely known. Hence Dukat being in the dark on it. When Sisko tries to settle things, they do not want Federation help anymore. They want to fight. Period. So really have a hard time blaming the Federation for the Maquis. At least from what I saw from Sisko's point of view.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.