Picard having retired from Starfleet to become an Ambassador? Check
STO Picard has no mention of Irumodic Syndrome. Which is a KEY element of the AGT storyline.
Beverly Crusher having Married Picard? Pretty sure that's a check
But STO Crusher didn't divorce STO Picard, like they did in AGT.
Data a professor? nope (unless it's a VERY recent occurance) that said he is emotional like in AGT
Just to clarify the Data timeline, for STO he's in B4's body. Not emotional anymore after Nemesis.
Geordie La Forge a writer? not sure. (it's possiable he is)
Nope. Not a writer. In the STO timeline he works with Miles O'Brien, head of Starfleet corps of engineers. He gets interviewed for an entire chapter of the STO novel by Jake Sisko though.
The Klingons having invaded the Romulan Star Empire and relations with the Federtion having deterioated to the point of war? Check
This is very different from STO. In AGT the Klingons took over the Romulan Star Empire. That decidedly did not happen in STO.
Worf serving with the Klingons? check
In STO Worf is an ambassador. In AGT Worf is in the Klingon High Council. Kind of different.
The two big things in the anti-time future that didn't occur is Worf and Riker having a falling out over Troi (Worf ended that in part BECAUSE of what he heard about the future from Picard)
You kind of gloss over the fact that in AGT timeline Troi is dead. In STO timeline she's alive.
and the Enterprise D still being around.
This is also kind of a key element here. In STO the D crashed. Is gone. The E went missing. The F exists. In AGT, the D IS THE GALAXY X, the ship in question, heh.
Now to clarify something about Data and his professorship and the two timelines.
In AGT he's a professor at Cambridge and awarded the Lucasian Chair of Mathematics. That suggests he's been there for a bit. It's a big honor. Dating back to the 1600s.
In STO Data was Captain of the Enterprise E. And was so in 2409 since the events of the Countdown Comics are incorporated into the STO timeline. Meaning when the E disappeared, in 2409, he wasn't a professor. He was still serving in Starfleet. And it's still 2409 in-game.
There's a distinct difference in AGT's data and STO's data.
Data, btw, I s a professor now as far as I know, became it just recently when the ent e retired, was mentioned in one of those ent f story cryptic publishes.
Ent-E is still missing. With all hands. Including its captain, Data.
Granted it's only been missing a short time since it's still 2409 in-game. But he's not been a professor at Cambridge at least, like he was shown to be in AGT.
Given the circumstances of the Enterprise's destruction in Generations, the easiest way for the Enterprise to survive would be if Geordi did not get captured (and thus not have the transmitter attached to his VISOR that allowed the Duras Sisters to learn the Enterprise's shield modulation pattern that allowed them to bypass the shields). If Picard or Riker or Worf had been with Geordi and Data on the Amagosa Observatory, then they might have been able to prevent Geordi's capture when Data was paralyzed by fear.
May be its quiet simple: Picard prevented Data from using the Emotion ship at this point in the AGT timeline, but since he saw data having emotions in the future he thought "what the hell"
Without data freaking out Geordie wouldnt have been captured ect ect.
Since we're taking a close look, let's really take a close look
STO Picard has no mention of Irumodic Syndrome. Which is a KEY element of the AGT storyline.
Not being mentioned =/= not happening.
But STO Crusher didn't divorce STO Picard, like they did in AGT.
Well they didn't even get married since in AGT Crusher had changed her name to Picard.
But well.... on the actual TNG crew the destruction of the D had certainly a heavy impact on how their lives went on after that.
Just to clarify the Data timeline, for STO he's in B4's body. Not emotional anymore after Nemesis.
Path to 2409 clearly mentions them building a new emotion ship.
This is very different from STO. In AGT the Klingons took over the Romulan Star Empire. That decidedly did not happen in STO.
In STO Worf is an ambassador. In AGT Worf is in the Klingon High Council. Kind of different.
Again, the impact on the TNG crew is significant. Worf would probably not have been on DS9 when gowron asked him to join, and he would not have faced the consequences of the refusal...
For the romulans... find kind of funny that the... much later established destruction of Romulus is a good explanation on how they could conquer it entirely in AGT.
However. Looking at the known changes: Worf (still probably) would not have gotten to DS9. Without him being there there I would not know how Worf and Martok would:
a. Know each other at all
b. Martok could have become chancellor.
So the Klingon empire probably had a more aggressive chancellor in that timeline at that time.
Still not seeing how the conclusion to that is that the GX-modification CAN NOT happen.
You kind of gloss over the fact that in AGT timeline Troi is dead. In STO timeline she's alive.
Actually I have no idea about Trois status in STO.
This is also kind of a key element here. In STO the D crashed. Is gone. The E went missing. The F exists. In AGT, the D IS THE GALAXY X, the ship in question, heh.
Now to clarify something about Data and his professorship and the two timelines.
In AGT he's a professor at Cambridge and awarded the Lucasian Chair of Mathematics. That suggests he's been there for a bit. It's a big honor. Dating back to the 1600s.
In STO Data was Captain of the Enterprise E. And was so in 2409 since the events of the Countdown Comics are incorporated into the STO timeline. Meaning when the E disappeared, in 2409, he wasn't a professor. He was still serving in Starfleet. And it's still 2409 in-game.
There's a distinct difference in AGT's data and STO's data.
Ent-E is still missing. With all hands. Including its captain, Data.
Granted it's only been missing a short time since it's still 2409 in-game. But he's not been a professor at Cambridge at least, like he was shown to be in AGT.
I'm pretty sure that is wrong. Those Ent-F stories are game canon.
And still, even if, nothing forces the conclusion the the Galaxy-X type upgrades have not been made.
We don't really know much about that upgrades. Have they been done to the ent-d only or to all galaxys in the AGT timeline? We don't know.
When have they been done? We don't know.
Why exactly have they been done? We don't know.
And that means its open to interpretation. And that means they can very well happen in the "Normal" timeline, too. Just like (again) the same uniform design was established in 3 completely different alternate futures.
I just don't see a hint to an argument in the fact that that was a alternate timeline that even indicates "there can not be a Galaxy X".
Well they didn't even get married since in AGT Crusher had changed her name to Picard.
?
You lost me. In AGT they got married. And then divorced. She kept his name.
In STO they get married. Have kids. Are still married by 2409.
For the romulans... find kind of funny that the... much later established destruction of Romulus is a good explanation on how they could conquer it entirely in AGT.
With the Romulans, it's just very different. In AGT the Klingons take over the empire. In STO, the empire did not get taken over by the Klingons. It splintered and half of it was taken on by the Iconians, the other half starts its own republic.
Actually I have no idea about Trois status in STO.
She's still alive according to the novel. The stuff from Nemesis, transferring to the Titan with Riker, all happens in STO. Is suggested to not have happened in AGT since she'd been dead for 20 years. Her recipe for hot chocolate is mentioned in-game at the Captain's Table.
I'm pretty sure that is wrong. Those Ent-F stories are game canon.
What Ent F stories? The Ent F happens during the return of the Dominion forces and Karukhan. Its captain is the captain of the Belfast. But the Ent-E, according to the in-game storyline had been missing.
This is the story of the Ent-E in the game:
In 2408 Starfleet loses contact with SB236 and sends the U.S.S. Enterprise-E, commanded by Captain Data, to investigate.
That's it.
They went missing in 2408. All hands.
They haven't picked that up. They weren't found. Data didn't retire. They're still missing.
And still, even if, nothing forces the conclusion the the Galaxy-X type upgrades have not been made.
I'm not really addressing any of that. All I was doing was looking at the timelines a bit closer than the first post did. The first post suggests that things are very similar. I don't see it that way. Little things like Troi still being alive, were glossed over to make things fit. Big things like Data being a starfleet captain by 2408, Geordi still being in starfleet by 2409, Picard and Crusher still being married, the Irumodic Syndrome not being mentioned, the Romulan Republic existing, there are quite a few differences. It's not the same timeline and they are pretty different.
That's all I'm looking at. The timelines.
The ship is what it is. I'm not even trying to think about how it exists. I just know that the STO timeline isn't the AGT timeline. They are different.
I just don't see a hint to an argument in the fact that that was a alternate timeline that even indicates "there can not be a Galaxy X".
I'm not arguing that the GX can't exist. It can and it does in STO.
I'm just looking at the timelines and seeing that they are different.
You lost me. In AGT they got married. And then divorced. She kept his name.
In STO they get married. Have kids. Are still married by 2409.
With the Romulans, it's just very different. In AGT the Klingons take over the empire. In STO, the empire did not get taken over by the Klingons. It splintered and half of it was taken on by the Iconians, the other half starts its own republic.
She's still alive according to the novel. The stuff from Nemesis, transferring to the Titan with Riker, all happens in STO. Is suggested to not have happened in AGT since she'd been dead for 20 years. Her recipe for hot chocolate is mentioned in-game at the Captain's Table.
Didn't read the needs of the many yet. So I didn't know those things.
For the romulans: again, Martoks would probably not have become chancellor without the ent d destruction.
Means another chancellor reacted to romulus destruction, possibly even still Gowron. He may have taken advantage of the situation immediately, which is why the romulans are conquered in that timeline.
Just saying that I think it fits in very well, I don't see how the Klingons could conquer the entire romulan empire without that incident.
What Ent F stories? The Ent F happens during the return of the Dominion forces and Karukhan. Its captain is the captain of the Belfast. But the Ent-E, according to the in-game storyline had been missing.
This is the story of the Ent-E in the game:
That's it.
They went missing in 2408. All hands.
They haven't picked that up. They weren't found. Data didn't retire. They're still missing.
Cryptic regulary publishes stories about the exploits/adventures of Captain Shon and the Enterprise F in the official Star Trek magazine.
Beeing only available in the us I didn't read any myself and they are not available online, still they are "game canon". But I have a frind who constantly annoys me with references to that so I picked up a few things, the return of the ent e beeing one of those.
I'm not really addressing any of that. All I was doing was looking at the timelines a bit closer than the first post did. The first post suggests that things are very similar. I don't see it that way. Little things like Troi still being alive, were glossed over to make things fit. Big things like Data being a starfleet captain by 2408, Geordi still being in starfleet by 2409, Picard and Crusher still being married, the Irumodic Syndrome not being mentioned, the Romulan Republic existing, there are quite a few differences. It's not the same timeline and they are pretty different.
That's all I'm looking at. The timelines.
The ship is what it is. I'm not even trying to think about how it exists. I just know that the STO timeline isn't the AGT timeline. They are different.
I'm not arguing that the GX can't exist. It can and it does in STO.
I'm just looking at the timelines and seeing that they are different.
Well I think it's prety similar all in all. Most differences can be explained. And especially the enterprise d crews personal story's are in my view a bit too similar sinc their lives had to be completely diffrent...
So generations is the split point leading to two futures?
If the ENT D wasn't destroyed we end up with AGT.
If it was we end up with STO?
All for want of a nail.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Ent-E is still missing. With all hands. Including its captain, Data.
Granted it's only been missing a short time since it's still 2409 in-game. But he's not been a professor at Cambridge at least, like he was shown to be in AGT.
Actually, no. The Ent-E was confirmed destroyed by the Undine in the short story "Unexpected Honor". Data and most of the crew escaped, and Data retired and recommended Va'Kel Shon for the Ent-F billet.
But do I wish Cryptic would put the stuff in-game.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Actually, no. The Ent-E was confirmed destroyed by the Undine in the short story "Unexpected Honor". Data and most of the crew escaped, and Data retired and recommended Va'Kel Shon for the Ent-F billet.
But do I wish Cryptic would put the stuff in-game.
I've been told it was retired not destroyed... but whatever^^
Comments
STO Picard has no mention of Irumodic Syndrome. Which is a KEY element of the AGT storyline.
But STO Crusher didn't divorce STO Picard, like they did in AGT.
Just to clarify the Data timeline, for STO he's in B4's body. Not emotional anymore after Nemesis.
Nope. Not a writer. In the STO timeline he works with Miles O'Brien, head of Starfleet corps of engineers. He gets interviewed for an entire chapter of the STO novel by Jake Sisko though.
This is very different from STO. In AGT the Klingons took over the Romulan Star Empire. That decidedly did not happen in STO.
In STO Worf is an ambassador. In AGT Worf is in the Klingon High Council. Kind of different.
You kind of gloss over the fact that in AGT timeline Troi is dead. In STO timeline she's alive.
This is also kind of a key element here. In STO the D crashed. Is gone. The E went missing. The F exists. In AGT, the D IS THE GALAXY X, the ship in question, heh.
Now to clarify something about Data and his professorship and the two timelines.
In AGT he's a professor at Cambridge and awarded the Lucasian Chair of Mathematics. That suggests he's been there for a bit. It's a big honor. Dating back to the 1600s.
In STO Data was Captain of the Enterprise E. And was so in 2409 since the events of the Countdown Comics are incorporated into the STO timeline. Meaning when the E disappeared, in 2409, he wasn't a professor. He was still serving in Starfleet. And it's still 2409 in-game.
There's a distinct difference in AGT's data and STO's data.
Ent-E is still missing. With all hands. Including its captain, Data.
Granted it's only been missing a short time since it's still 2409 in-game. But he's not been a professor at Cambridge at least, like he was shown to be in AGT.
May be its quiet simple: Picard prevented Data from using the Emotion ship at this point in the AGT timeline, but since he saw data having emotions in the future he thought "what the hell"
Without data freaking out Geordie wouldnt have been captured ect ect.
Not being mentioned =/= not happening.
Well they didn't even get married since in AGT Crusher had changed her name to Picard.
But well.... on the actual TNG crew the destruction of the D had certainly a heavy impact on how their lives went on after that.
Path to 2409 clearly mentions them building a new emotion ship.
Again, the impact on the TNG crew is significant. Worf would probably not have been on DS9 when gowron asked him to join, and he would not have faced the consequences of the refusal...
For the romulans... find kind of funny that the... much later established destruction of Romulus is a good explanation on how they could conquer it entirely in AGT.
However. Looking at the known changes: Worf (still probably) would not have gotten to DS9. Without him being there there I would not know how Worf and Martok would:
a. Know each other at all
b. Martok could have become chancellor.
So the Klingon empire probably had a more aggressive chancellor in that timeline at that time.
Still not seeing how the conclusion to that is that the GX-modification CAN NOT happen.
Actually I have no idea about Trois status in STO.
I'm pretty sure that is wrong. Those Ent-F stories are game canon.
And still, even if, nothing forces the conclusion the the Galaxy-X type upgrades have not been made.
We don't really know much about that upgrades. Have they been done to the ent-d only or to all galaxys in the AGT timeline? We don't know.
When have they been done? We don't know.
Why exactly have they been done? We don't know.
And that means its open to interpretation. And that means they can very well happen in the "Normal" timeline, too. Just like (again) the same uniform design was established in 3 completely different alternate futures.
I just don't see a hint to an argument in the fact that that was a alternate timeline that even indicates "there can not be a Galaxy X".
?
You lost me. In AGT they got married. And then divorced. She kept his name.
In STO they get married. Have kids. Are still married by 2409.
With the Romulans, it's just very different. In AGT the Klingons take over the empire. In STO, the empire did not get taken over by the Klingons. It splintered and half of it was taken on by the Iconians, the other half starts its own republic.
She's still alive according to the novel. The stuff from Nemesis, transferring to the Titan with Riker, all happens in STO. Is suggested to not have happened in AGT since she'd been dead for 20 years. Her recipe for hot chocolate is mentioned in-game at the Captain's Table.
What Ent F stories? The Ent F happens during the return of the Dominion forces and Karukhan. Its captain is the captain of the Belfast. But the Ent-E, according to the in-game storyline had been missing.
This is the story of the Ent-E in the game:
That's it.
They went missing in 2408. All hands.
They haven't picked that up. They weren't found. Data didn't retire. They're still missing.
I'm not really addressing any of that. All I was doing was looking at the timelines a bit closer than the first post did. The first post suggests that things are very similar. I don't see it that way. Little things like Troi still being alive, were glossed over to make things fit. Big things like Data being a starfleet captain by 2408, Geordi still being in starfleet by 2409, Picard and Crusher still being married, the Irumodic Syndrome not being mentioned, the Romulan Republic existing, there are quite a few differences. It's not the same timeline and they are pretty different.
That's all I'm looking at. The timelines.
The ship is what it is. I'm not even trying to think about how it exists. I just know that the STO timeline isn't the AGT timeline. They are different.
I'm not arguing that the GX can't exist. It can and it does in STO.
I'm just looking at the timelines and seeing that they are different.
Didn't read the needs of the many yet. So I didn't know those things.
For the romulans: again, Martoks would probably not have become chancellor without the ent d destruction.
Means another chancellor reacted to romulus destruction, possibly even still Gowron. He may have taken advantage of the situation immediately, which is why the romulans are conquered in that timeline.
Just saying that I think it fits in very well, I don't see how the Klingons could conquer the entire romulan empire without that incident.
Cryptic regulary publishes stories about the exploits/adventures of Captain Shon and the Enterprise F in the official Star Trek magazine.
Beeing only available in the us I didn't read any myself and they are not available online, still they are "game canon". But I have a frind who constantly annoys me with references to that so I picked up a few things, the return of the ent e beeing one of those.
Well I think it's prety similar all in all. Most differences can be explained. And especially the enterprise d crews personal story's are in my view a bit too similar sinc their lives had to be completely diffrent...
If the ENT D wasn't destroyed we end up with AGT.
If it was we end up with STO?
All for want of a nail.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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Actually, no. The Ent-E was confirmed destroyed by the Undine in the short story "Unexpected Honor". Data and most of the crew escaped, and Data retired and recommended Va'Kel Shon for the Ent-F billet.
But do I wish Cryptic would put the stuff in-game.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
Speculative. Its the first time we certainly know something went different.
Although... bummer.... its the first time we see the TNG crew after AGT^^
I've been told it was retired not destroyed... but whatever^^