i think u missed where i agreed with you that more hull hp is good for the game. you should be talking about how uncounterable rom cloak alphas just doubled in frequency.
rom cloak tet cascade = tears.
dont go looking at the dmg side of things blaming that, cus there are other solutions to just "taking the load". but in the end, plenty of room for more hp. when the proton barrage can kill people in one hit unbuffed (****ty people maybe) somethigns wrong (not with proton barrage tho)
You make some sense, but aren't looking at it from the other side of the fence. For those that rely on survivability, the damage appears to be the problem. For those that rely on damage, the survivability is the issue.
With all this power boost out there now Cryptic really needs to boost the hulls of all ships except for the escorts (Fed, Klingon, Rom).
There is so much bleedthrough now its ridiculous, I can kill someone with my vaper (romi escort) in 2 seconds no matter what ship they are flying. Should 1 escort really be able to one shot a sci vessel, cruiser or carrier ? no it should not.
Did a spitfire manage to destroy a battleship in one pass by ? no
those ships really need much more hull.
You are just whining because you got blown up by me consistently ;P
Gali'O
I will take your challenge tho you can vape me in 2 seconds in my recluse k?
i think u missed where i agreed with you that more hull hp is good for the game. you should be talking about how uncounterable rom cloak alphas just doubled in frequency.
rom cloak tet cascade = tears.
dont go looking at the dmg side of things blaming that, cus there are other solutions to just "taking the load". but in the end, plenty of room for more hp. when the proton barrage can kill people in one hit unbuffed (****ty people maybe) somethigns wrong (not with proton barrage tho)
What Vet cant kill players in kerrat all day long? Getting 100K hits on Kerrat pugs isnt that hard these as most of them have literally no clue what you are doing to them.
Try again against good players
Im surprised you're still not bored of it after so many years. lol
What Vet cant kill players in kerrat all day long? Getting 100K hits on Kerrat pugs isnt that hard these as most of them have literally no clue what you are doing to them.
Try again against good players
Im surprised you're still not bored of it after so many years. lol
you hide in fvf. who the f u again? i mean i know galileos, hes been around for years. meet me any time kerrat cracked planet (where alot of real good players actually test their builds against hordes of enemies, as opposed to pugstomp arenas... ), or holla in opvp for 1v1. ANY MONEY says a proton crit/ bo3 crit will instant vape you. prolly vape without, non crit even 2 of 3 iso/proton/bo3. with my kdf. wont happen every time, but it will happen eventually. rinse repeat hit n run tactics ftw. making it as easy as possible for you to kill me (as opposed to how most roms play)
but keep your eyes away from the potential for that 100k instant proton crit that will kill anyone. until YOU can reproduce it non stop, i dont see that as the issue. the issue in terms of the GAME BEING FUN is that crappy heal heavy console loaded panda/other noob roms can get vapes 90% vs the noobs/lighter tanks/ post snb. the few uber recluses who demand mega dmg from a truly dedicated spiker are too few and far between and dont factor into the discussion. they SHOULD NEED TWO PEOPLE TO KILL THEM, which is what would happen if they had x2-x4 hull (or really if they have voth shield up/backstep/whatever other hax they can pull when ur first shot didnt kill them instantly).
i dont see ANY problem raising the bar so that i need to shoot more than one weapon, and crappy undedicated heal heavy tank roms cant attain the spike necessary, to kill in one pass. ya dig?
lets really take a look at what could actually happen, if u really tried
200k ion beam crit
200k+ kumari cannon shot crits
500k ramming speeds (now with no self damage!)
2-300k destabil torp crits
150k bo3 on the regs
75k+ single q torp crits
iso charge 80k first hit - 200k 4th hit
proton aoe 75k+ crits
etc etc
dedicated for one particular maximum effect creates potential to generate instant kill damage, many different paths result in the same outcome.
that outcome being a <30k base hull kdf bop or 35k hull fed sci ship SEVERELY AT RISK OF INSTANT DEATH
(while they 65k cruiser with armor consoles, a great heal spec/boff layout, and lightning fast reaction times will live vs even the best alpha (not me, mt tie) 90% +.)
while back trinity uber tank tsi legend 4 yr veteran said hey kill me ! and challenged people to get him. took me over 20 minutes(i used ion), and even mt tie over 6 minutes of non stop aphas to "get lucky (iso crit for mt) and instant vape him.
so the change is going to hurt someone, as any change does, considering this game isnt a 1v1 game, i dont see why that guy who really cant kill the alpha bop anyway, needs to be held up as the reason why hulls shouldnt be increased......
If everyone is given a buff the high end will gain more of course, but the relevance of the gain is so little. If the tank can be killed, you will be able to generate the wee bit more damage. It isnt often they are "just barely killed". So if you can beat his defense cycle, reaction time, or team with snb / debuffs. The bonus hull will not prevent that guy form dying.
BUT IT WILL PREVENT THE REGULAR PLAYERS AND PEOPLE IN 90% OF BATTLE PREPAREDNESS MODES from the potential to be VAPED EASILY
Again, coming from someone who maximizes the possible damage outcome across multiple attacks, the change would simply be more of the weapons i am actually shooting being needed for a kill. Not that they wont die, Id just actually deliver a bit more damage.
Raising hull would punish hybrids/non torp users/ those reliant on one off console powers.
Frankly the more i think about it, the more i agree wholeheartedly, hulls for all ships could be raised up to 4x current values. Its time for people to actually have to try, to dedicate their console slots, and to really push to get kills, not just simply "be rom"
The problem with this suggestion Gali is that this pushes standard damage platforms further from being competitive.
So you are trying to address a problem, spike builds, that capitalize on cloak ambushes by negatively affecting the rest of the gamut of available damage options that visible ships use through increasing the lifespan of only some ships.
Cryptic has created this issue, and players have responded to it.
> Players respond with escalating from old 4x DHC to double tap spike builds. They Eschew Torpedos because Torpedos work off of outdated mechanics, are generally sub-par if you don't have a cloak, and require heavy investment for what amounts to a dead weapon slot for 80% of a match on a visible Escort.
> Then we get Romulans, with Battle Cloaks for everyone and Crit values skyrocket - these builds obviously gravitate to double tap spike builds.
> Complaints reach a peak, devs nerf double tap.
> Players escalate, respond with adding torpedoes and any one of a huge selection of large "one shot" capable clickies like ION beam, Isometric Charge, etc.
> We get another round of escalating crit values.
What you're requesting is the next escalation, the next inflation.
All this will do is force the builds only using 1 or 2 spike weapons into loading even more of them and dropping them on APA cycles only.
It will also further push standard escort builds out of the metagame.
Which if you notice cryptic continues to implement new spike weapons.
A.Hawk didn't like specifically how double tap BO worked around the typical cooldown mechanics for BOFF abilities - but the powers team has had no issue adding other (primarily monetized) items that basically do the same thing but usually in a more dramatic way, with higher damage output & longer cooldown.
The problem with this suggestion Gali is that this pushes standard damage platforms further from being competitive.
So you are trying to address a problem, spike builds, that capitalize on cloak ambushes by negatively affecting the rest of the gamut of available damage options that visible ships use through increasing the lifespan of only some ships.
Cryptic has created this issue, and players have responded to it.
> Players respond with escalating from old 4x DHC to double tap spike builds.
> Then we get Romulans, with Battle Cloaks for everyone and Crit values skyrocket - these builds obviously gravitate to double tap spike builds.
> Complaints reach a peak, devs nerf double tap.
> Players escalate, respond with adding torpedoes and any one of a huge selection of large "one shot" capable clickies like ION beam, Isometric Charge, etc.
> We get another round of escalating crit values.
What you're requesting is the next escalation, the next inflation.
All this will do is force the builds only using 1 or 2 spike weapons into loading even more of them and dropping them on APA cycles only.
It will also further push standard escort builds out of the metagame.
Which if you notice cryptic continues to implement new spike weapons.
A.Hawk didn't like specifically how double tap BO worked around the typical cooldown mechanics for BOFF abilities - but the powers team has had no issue adding other (primarily monetized) items that basically do the same thing but usually in a more dramatic way, with higher damage output & longer cooldown.
the next escalation will come regardless, whether its the form of a +100 structural integrity p2w console or proper dev action is out of our hands. we could however agree to agree that a certain situation that is occurring more than ever (seemingly unfair instant kills) should be addressed. I for one agree a solution that seems acceptable would be a flat rate across the board increase of ship hp. some of my ships have less hull than a shuttle ffs!
you hide in fvf. who the f u again? i mean i know galileos, hes been around for years. meet me any time kerrat cracked planet (where alot of real good players actually test their builds against hordes of enemies, as opposed to pugstomp arenas... ), or holla in opvp for 1v1. ANY MONEY says a proton crit/ bo3 crit will instant vape you. prolly vape without, non crit even 2 of 3 iso/proton/bo3. with my kdf. wont happen every time, but it will happen eventually. rinse repeat hit n run tactics ftw. making it as easy as possible for you to kill me (as opposed to how most roms play)
but keep your eyes away from the potential for that 100k instant proton crit that will kill anyone. until YOU can reproduce it non stop, i dont see that as the issue. the issue in terms of the GAME BEING FUN is that crappy heal heavy console loaded panda/other noob roms can get vapes 90% vs the noobs/lighter tanks/ post snb. the few uber recluses who demand mega dmg from a truly dedicated spiker are too few and far between and dont factor into the discussion. they SHOULD NEED TWO PEOPLE TO KILL THEM, which is what would happen if they had x2-x4 hull (or really if they have voth shield up/backstep/whatever other hax they can pull when ur first shot didnt kill them instantly).
i dont see ANY problem raising the bar so that i need to shoot more than one weapon, and crappy undedicated heal heavy tank roms cant attain the spike necessary, to kill in one pass. ya dig?
lets really take a look at what could actually happen, if u really tried
200k ion beam crit
200k+ kumari cannon shot crits
500k ramming speeds (now with no self damage!)
2-300k destabil torp crits
150k bo3 on the regs
75k+ single q torp crits
iso charge 80k first hit - 200k 4th hit
proton aoe 75k+ crits
etc etc
dedicated for one particular maximum effect creates potential to generate instant kill damage, many different paths result in the same outcome.
that outcome being a <30k base hull kdf bop or 35k hull fed sci ship SEVERELY AT RISK OF INSTANT DEATH
(while they 65k cruiser with armor consoles, a great heal spec/boff layout, and lightning fast reaction times will live vs even the best alpha (not me, mt tie) 90% +.)
while back trinity uber tank tsi legend 4 yr veteran said hey kill me ! and challenged people to get him. took me over 20 minutes(i used ion), and even mt tie over 6 minutes of non stop aphas to "get lucky (iso crit for mt) and instant vape him.
so the change is going to hurt someone, as any change does, considering this game isnt a 1v1 game, i dont see why that guy who really cant kill the alpha bop anyway, needs to be held up as the reason why hulls shouldnt be increased......
If everyone is given a buff the high end will gain more of course, but the relevance of the gain is so little. If the tank can be killed, you will be able to generate the wee bit more damage. It isnt often they are "just barely killed". So if you can beat his defense cycle, reaction time, or team with snb / debuffs. The bonus hull will not prevent that guy form dying.
BUT IT WILL PREVENT THE REGULAR PLAYERS AND PEOPLE IN 90% OF BATTLE PREPAREDNESS MODES from the potential to be VAPED EASILY
Again, coming from someone who maximizes the possible damage outcome across multiple attacks, the change would simply be more of the weapons i am actually shooting being needed for a kill. Not that they wont die, Id just actually deliver a bit more damage.
Raising hull would punish hybrids/non torp users/ those reliant on one off console powers.
Frankly the more i think about it, the more i agree wholeheartedly, hulls for all ships could be raised up to 4x current values. Its time for people to actually have to try, to dedicate their console slots, and to really push to get kills, not just simply "be rom"
/end indecipherable rant
Well said, I would agree and add in battle fatigue, no ship that takes damage should be able to heal back 100% of the damage. Why you ask if you give more HP that can be healed back 100% matches will take forever as with everything in this game healing in a PvP match should have a diminishing return based on damage received. 10K in damge received in one volley you can only get back 9500 of the hps, take another 10K in damage you can only get back 9000 in HPs eventually the heals would do nothing with the absolute lowest would be 50% of damage received being restored.
Hey I Used to be Captain Data, well I guess I still am in game but the account link really screwed everything up :rolleyes:
Global Cooldowns on things like BO and Iso/TetCascade/Ion Beam/Proton Barrage would be a good place to start.
CritH bonuses granted by Operative/Superior Operative could stand a nerf. So could the Infiltrator stats.
I think you are on the right track. Though instead of GCD, which is a little too harsh, I suggest a shared lock out period similar to how activating a copy of BO locks out all other BO for 5 sec.
As it stands, it's easy to quadruple tap someone using the abilities you named above. To think the Dev removed Double tap only to permit Quadruple tap is just :rolleyes:
they boost shields thats it, shields are pretty much irrelevant now with all the bleedthrough and damage boost. the new dyson ship will never see the light of day in pvp with a base hull of only 28-30k
I can see my Dyson Ship in PVP just to record the Explosion Animation it'll be SWEET!
Of course I'll probably stay in Tactical mode since everyone thinks Escorts/Destroyers are Overpowered :-)
Love
Soleta
Founding member of Alliance for Science
I think you are on the right track. Though instead of GCD, which is a little too harsh, I suggest a shared lock out period similar to how activating a copy of BO locks out all other BO for 5 sec.
As it stands, it's easy to quadruple tap someone using the abilities you named above. To think the Dev removed Double tap only to permit Quadruple tap is just :rolleyes:
it was heavily discussed by me and others (altho pandas were notoriously silent about it) that the "double tap" was never the issue, or an issue at all. The rom decloak tet cascade/ iso u will learn to fear, if u havent alredy (or realized what actually killed you)
(while they 65k cruiser with armor consoles, a great heal spec/boff layout, and lightning fast reaction times will live vs even the best alpha (not me, mt tie) 90% +.)
uh...your success rate is super low based on what I can see in Kerrat. More likely than not, your alpha ended with you being vaped. Take last night for example, you alpha someone, he dodged it, I subnuked you, you rammed me but you went kaboom. Minutes later, you again tried to alpha someone else. He dodged it, 2 others fired at you, then you went kaboom again.
Then you switched instance out of frustration. Not sure how you go to the 90%+ number, it bears no resemblance to reality whatsoever.
the next escalation will come regardless, whether its the form of a +100 structural integrity p2w console or proper dev action is out of our hands. we could however agree to agree that a certain situation that is occurring more than ever (seemingly unfair instant kills) should be addressed. I for one agree a solution that seems acceptable would be a flat rate across the board increase of ship hp. some of my ships have less hull than a shuttle ffs!
Of course you would support a solution that strictly benefits your style of play, that's pretty much par for the course.
The wiser solution would be to put hard global cooldowns across all clicky consoles/gear set clicky powers, forcing players to use 1 and not be able to stack all of them on a target at once.
Like that ION beam? Go for it, but it should put a hard CD onto Iso-charge, Proton Barrage, etc.
Also curbing many of these new exotic one-shots from ignoring standard resistances or ignoring shields as a few of them do would be smart design and prevent nearly instant TTKs.
Much like ground kit swapping, they also need to put an end to being able to cloak up and just re-slot a second clone console for 0 CD time. (a mechanic, the kit one, A. Hawk has stated is not working as intended)
We'll never see it because cryptic sells us this stuff, and it appeals to a large segment of their playerbase to buy and slot a fun power.
uh...your success rate is super low based on what I can see in Kerrat. More likely than not, your alpha ended with you being vaped. Take last night for example, you alpha someone, he dodged it, I subnuked you, you rammed me but you went kaboom. Minutes later, you again tried to alpha someone else. He dodged it, 2 others fired at you, then you went kaboom again.
Then you switched instance out of frustration. Not sure how you go to the 90%+ number, it bears no resemblance to reality whatsoever.
So an update on the so called "90%+ successful ambush rate" from Mini. We are in Kerrat right now, Mini is trying hard to ambush a couple of German Fed cruisers. He died 5 times in under 10 minutes, not a single successful ambush, not even once.
At one point, he almost got away after successfully jam sensored me. But my mines still found him and he went boom!!! Did I forget to mention I already bought the new space trait for mines, they work like a charm now.
uh...your success rate is super low based on what I can see in Kerrat. More likely than not, your alpha ended with you being vaped. Take last night for example, you alpha someone, he dodged it, I subnuked you, you rammed me but you went kaboom. Minutes later, you again tried to alpha someone else. He dodged it, 2 others fired at you, then you went kaboom again.
Then you switched instance out of frustration. Not sure how you go to the 90%+ number, it bears no resemblance to reality whatsoever.
too bad when theres even a close to even amount of feds to kdf u log out/change zones. that same night i left that zone to join where there were more feds. ur fail doesnt really warrant a response, as u are the definition of a troll, u aggravate and elicit responses to get peoples accounts banned. thats what duck dynasty said anyway
So an update on the so called "90%+ successful ambush rate" from Mini. We are in Kerrat right now, Mini is trying hard to ambush a couple of German Fed cruisers. He died 5 times in under 10 minutes, not a single successful ambush, not even once.
At one point, he almost got away after successfully jam sensored me. But my mines still found him and he went boom!!! Did I forget to mention I already bought the new space trait for mines, they work like a charm now.
I don't keep track of peoples success rates but I know Mini attacks a lot under overwhelming odds and does succeed, might want to keep that in perspective. its high risk high reward, you get a very vulnerable ship that is screwed if the attack doesn't succeed right away, but sometimes very spectacular results like 5 kills at once.
too bad when theres even a close to even amount of feds to kdf u log out/change zones. that same night i left that zone to join where there were more feds. ur fail doesnt really warrant a response, as u are the definition of a troll, u aggravate and elicit responses to get peoples accounts banned. thats what duck dynasty said anyway
He made a big deal the other day when he joined in for the finishing blow as I was already being ganged up on by 5 people.
We are in Kerrat right now, Mini is trying hard to ambush a couple of German Fed cruisers. He died 5 times in under 10 minutes, not a single successful ambush, not even once.
At one point, he almost got away after successfully jam sensored me. But my mines still found him and he went boom!!! Did I forget to mention I already bought the new space trait for mines, they work like a charm now.
I don't always see eye to eye with mini on a lot of issues, but you are using an example where he is going up against 2 cruisers, which basically have a huge advantage vs. Decloakers right now through no-target needed 360 degree FAW-spam as a sign of something?
I was in a match, quite some time ago, where mini was repeatedly trying to, singlehandedly, decloak strike on our panda team.
He died a lot, but the point is he never once quit, never once raged and continued to try repeatedly.
You can say what you want about mini, but being afraid to explode while decloaking on superior numbers isn't one of them.
you hide in fvf. who the f u again? i mean i know galileos, hes been around for years. meet me any time kerrat cracked planet (where alot of real good players actually test their builds against hordes of enemies, as opposed to pugstomp arenas... ), or holla in opvp for 1v1. ANY MONEY says a proton crit/ bo3 crit will instant vape you. prolly vape without, non crit even 2 of 3 iso/proton/bo3. with my kdf. wont happen every time, but it will happen eventually. rinse repeat hit n run tactics ftw. making it as easy as possible for you to kill me (as opposed to how most roms play)
but keep your eyes away from the potential for that 100k instant proton crit that will kill anyone. until YOU can reproduce it non stop, i dont see that as the issue. the issue in terms of the GAME BEING FUN is that crappy heal heavy console loaded panda/other noob roms can get vapes 90% vs the noobs/lighter tanks/ post snb. the few uber recluses who demand mega dmg from a truly dedicated spiker are too few and far between and dont factor into the discussion. they SHOULD NEED TWO PEOPLE TO KILL THEM, which is what would happen if they had x2-x4 hull (or really if they have voth shield up/backstep/whatever other hax they can pull when ur first shot didnt kill them instantly).
i dont see ANY problem raising the bar so that i need to shoot more than one weapon, and crappy undedicated heal heavy tank roms cant attain the spike necessary, to kill in one pass. ya dig?
lets really take a look at what could actually happen, if u really tried
200k ion beam crit
200k+ kumari cannon shot crits
500k ramming speeds (now with no self damage!)
2-300k destabil torp crits
150k bo3 on the regs
75k+ single q torp crits
iso charge 80k first hit - 200k 4th hit
proton aoe 75k+ crits
etc etc
dedicated for one particular maximum effect creates potential to generate instant kill damage, many different paths result in the same outcome.
that outcome being a <30k base hull kdf bop or 35k hull fed sci ship SEVERELY AT RISK OF INSTANT DEATH
(while they 65k cruiser with armor consoles, a great heal spec/boff layout, and lightning fast reaction times will live vs even the best alpha (not me, mt tie) 90% +.)
while back trinity uber tank tsi legend 4 yr veteran said hey kill me ! and challenged people to get him. took me over 20 minutes(i used ion), and even mt tie over 6 minutes of non stop aphas to "get lucky (iso crit for mt) and instant vape him.
so the change is going to hurt someone, as any change does, considering this game isnt a 1v1 game, i dont see why that guy who really cant kill the alpha bop anyway, needs to be held up as the reason why hulls shouldnt be increased......
If everyone is given a buff the high end will gain more of course, but the relevance of the gain is so little. If the tank can be killed, you will be able to generate the wee bit more damage. It isnt often they are "just barely killed". So if you can beat his defense cycle, reaction time, or team with snb / debuffs. The bonus hull will not prevent that guy form dying.
BUT IT WILL PREVENT THE REGULAR PLAYERS AND PEOPLE IN 90% OF BATTLE PREPAREDNESS MODES from the potential to be VAPED EASILY
Again, coming from someone who maximizes the possible damage outcome across multiple attacks, the change would simply be more of the weapons i am actually shooting being needed for a kill. Not that they wont die, Id just actually deliver a bit more damage.
Raising hull would punish hybrids/non torp users/ those reliant on one off console powers.
Frankly the more i think about it, the more i agree wholeheartedly, hulls for all ships could be raised up to 4x current values. Its time for people to actually have to try, to dedicate their console slots, and to really push to get kills, not just simply "be rom"
/end indecipherable rant
The proton barrage has its flaws too. You sacrifice quite alot of CritH and normal energy damage (2%~ flat per console) to get it buffed up to those figures.
Secondly the activation time is **** like FOMM, its like a full second before it applies, TRIBBLE it up and it doesnt go off at all. 1 full second is huge for fast vaping, every millisecond counts where your opponent has no time to react.
Third, its bad to rely on 1 console or weapon to do everything for you, once its nerfed you'll be screwed. And I know particularly you rely on the last magic one shot pony, and you're back to square one when its nerfed to TRIBBLE.
If you have a build that can achieve it with a mix of a few combinations, if one thing is nerfed its often easily compensated with some other mixture.
.....I don't know if anyone mentioned this yet or not, but instead of increasing hull points, how about fixing the crew function?
.....If you have 3000 crewmen working their collective butts off trying to repair your boat. Then they should outperform 150 guys attempting to do the same repairs right?
.....Yes, there is a difference in the size of the ships. So the bigger the ship the more sq ft of hull you have to repair/heal. But if 150 crew in a escort is equal to 3000 crew in battle cruiser, then why bother with crew size at all?
.....A hull repair rate, based a ratio of the crew size in relation to the hulls hp could be developed that actually made crew count matter.
.....Crew loss would also have to be adjusted. Larger crews would lose a lower percentage of their crew count for a given amount of damage received.
.....In theory, this could compensate for the damage output differentials. The big cruisers with 3000 crew members would actually benefit from carrying around a small army. As it is now, crew size is pointless.
Not Dying too quickly should be something that needs some skill, gear, effort !
Killing quickly should be something that needs some skill, gear, effort !
I dont want a Game of tanks ! And i dont want a game of Tacs !
What does that mean ? Everything and nothing one could say ! But i think there are so many variables, so many things to consider, so many consoles, Boffs, Doffs, Ships, and so on...endless list. You cant just say "we need more hull" !
Comments
You make some sense, but aren't looking at it from the other side of the fence. For those that rely on survivability, the damage appears to be the problem. For those that rely on damage, the survivability is the issue.
You are just whining because you got blown up by me consistently ;P
Gali'O
I will take your challenge tho you can vape me in 2 seconds in my recluse k?
What Vet cant kill players in kerrat all day long? Getting 100K hits on Kerrat pugs isnt that hard these as most of them have literally no clue what you are doing to them.
Try again against good players
Im surprised you're still not bored of it after so many years. lol
Dont know who you are ingame but sure no probs ^^
Secondly its pvp, everyone dies every now and then :P
you hide in fvf. who the f u again? i mean i know galileos, hes been around for years. meet me any time kerrat cracked planet (where alot of real good players actually test their builds against hordes of enemies, as opposed to pugstomp arenas... ), or holla in opvp for 1v1. ANY MONEY says a proton crit/ bo3 crit will instant vape you. prolly vape without, non crit even 2 of 3 iso/proton/bo3. with my kdf. wont happen every time, but it will happen eventually. rinse repeat hit n run tactics ftw. making it as easy as possible for you to kill me (as opposed to how most roms play)
but keep your eyes away from the potential for that 100k instant proton crit that will kill anyone. until YOU can reproduce it non stop, i dont see that as the issue. the issue in terms of the GAME BEING FUN is that crappy heal heavy console loaded panda/other noob roms can get vapes 90% vs the noobs/lighter tanks/ post snb. the few uber recluses who demand mega dmg from a truly dedicated spiker are too few and far between and dont factor into the discussion. they SHOULD NEED TWO PEOPLE TO KILL THEM, which is what would happen if they had x2-x4 hull (or really if they have voth shield up/backstep/whatever other hax they can pull when ur first shot didnt kill them instantly).
i dont see ANY problem raising the bar so that i need to shoot more than one weapon, and crappy undedicated heal heavy tank roms cant attain the spike necessary, to kill in one pass. ya dig?
lets really take a look at what could actually happen, if u really tried
200k ion beam crit
200k+ kumari cannon shot crits
500k ramming speeds (now with no self damage!)
2-300k destabil torp crits
150k bo3 on the regs
75k+ single q torp crits
iso charge 80k first hit - 200k 4th hit
proton aoe 75k+ crits
etc etc
dedicated for one particular maximum effect creates potential to generate instant kill damage, many different paths result in the same outcome.
that outcome being a <30k base hull kdf bop or 35k hull fed sci ship SEVERELY AT RISK OF INSTANT DEATH
(while they 65k cruiser with armor consoles, a great heal spec/boff layout, and lightning fast reaction times will live vs even the best alpha (not me, mt tie) 90% +.)
while back trinity uber tank tsi legend 4 yr veteran said hey kill me ! and challenged people to get him. took me over 20 minutes(i used ion), and even mt tie over 6 minutes of non stop aphas to "get lucky (iso crit for mt) and instant vape him.
so the change is going to hurt someone, as any change does, considering this game isnt a 1v1 game, i dont see why that guy who really cant kill the alpha bop anyway, needs to be held up as the reason why hulls shouldnt be increased......
If everyone is given a buff the high end will gain more of course, but the relevance of the gain is so little. If the tank can be killed, you will be able to generate the wee bit more damage. It isnt often they are "just barely killed". So if you can beat his defense cycle, reaction time, or team with snb / debuffs. The bonus hull will not prevent that guy form dying.
BUT IT WILL PREVENT THE REGULAR PLAYERS AND PEOPLE IN 90% OF BATTLE PREPAREDNESS MODES from the potential to be VAPED EASILY
Again, coming from someone who maximizes the possible damage outcome across multiple attacks, the change would simply be more of the weapons i am actually shooting being needed for a kill. Not that they wont die, Id just actually deliver a bit more damage.
Raising hull would punish hybrids/non torp users/ those reliant on one off console powers.
Frankly the more i think about it, the more i agree wholeheartedly, hulls for all ships could be raised up to 4x current values. Its time for people to actually have to try, to dedicate their console slots, and to really push to get kills, not just simply "be rom"
/end indecipherable rant
So you are trying to address a problem, spike builds, that capitalize on cloak ambushes by negatively affecting the rest of the gamut of available damage options that visible ships use through increasing the lifespan of only some ships.
Cryptic has created this issue, and players have responded to it.
> Cryptic implemented ballooning "free" resistances, heals, elite fleet shields etc.
> Players respond with escalating from old 4x DHC to double tap spike builds. They Eschew Torpedos because Torpedos work off of outdated mechanics, are generally sub-par if you don't have a cloak, and require heavy investment for what amounts to a dead weapon slot for 80% of a match on a visible Escort.
> Then we get Romulans, with Battle Cloaks for everyone and Crit values skyrocket - these builds obviously gravitate to double tap spike builds.
> Complaints reach a peak, devs nerf double tap.
> Players escalate, respond with adding torpedoes and any one of a huge selection of large "one shot" capable clickies like ION beam, Isometric Charge, etc.
> We get another round of escalating crit values.
What you're requesting is the next escalation, the next inflation.
All this will do is force the builds only using 1 or 2 spike weapons into loading even more of them and dropping them on APA cycles only.
It will also further push standard escort builds out of the metagame.
Which if you notice cryptic continues to implement new spike weapons.
A.Hawk didn't like specifically how double tap BO worked around the typical cooldown mechanics for BOFF abilities - but the powers team has had no issue adding other (primarily monetized) items that basically do the same thing but usually in a more dramatic way, with higher damage output & longer cooldown.
the next escalation will come regardless, whether its the form of a +100 structural integrity p2w console or proper dev action is out of our hands. we could however agree to agree that a certain situation that is occurring more than ever (seemingly unfair instant kills) should be addressed. I for one agree a solution that seems acceptable would be a flat rate across the board increase of ship hp. some of my ships have less hull than a shuttle ffs!
Well said, I would agree and add in battle fatigue, no ship that takes damage should be able to heal back 100% of the damage. Why you ask if you give more HP that can be healed back 100% matches will take forever as with everything in this game healing in a PvP match should have a diminishing return based on damage received. 10K in damge received in one volley you can only get back 9500 of the hps, take another 10K in damage you can only get back 9000 in HPs eventually the heals would do nothing with the absolute lowest would be 50% of damage received being restored.
I think you are on the right track. Though instead of GCD, which is a little too harsh, I suggest a shared lock out period similar to how activating a copy of BO locks out all other BO for 5 sec.
As it stands, it's easy to quadruple tap someone using the abilities you named above. To think the Dev removed Double tap only to permit Quadruple tap is just :rolleyes:
I can see my Dyson Ship in PVP just to record the Explosion Animation it'll be SWEET!
Of course I'll probably stay in Tactical mode since everyone thinks Escorts/Destroyers are Overpowered :-)
Love
Soleta
Founding member of Alliance for Science
it was heavily discussed by me and others (altho pandas were notoriously silent about it) that the "double tap" was never the issue, or an issue at all. The rom decloak tet cascade/ iso u will learn to fear, if u havent alredy (or realized what actually killed you)
uh...your success rate is super low based on what I can see in Kerrat. More likely than not, your alpha ended with you being vaped. Take last night for example, you alpha someone, he dodged it, I subnuked you, you rammed me but you went kaboom. Minutes later, you again tried to alpha someone else. He dodged it, 2 others fired at you, then you went kaboom again.
Then you switched instance out of frustration. Not sure how you go to the 90%+ number, it bears no resemblance to reality whatsoever.
That's MT.
Of course you would support a solution that strictly benefits your style of play, that's pretty much par for the course.
The wiser solution would be to put hard global cooldowns across all clicky consoles/gear set clicky powers, forcing players to use 1 and not be able to stack all of them on a target at once.
Like that ION beam? Go for it, but it should put a hard CD onto Iso-charge, Proton Barrage, etc.
Also curbing many of these new exotic one-shots from ignoring standard resistances or ignoring shields as a few of them do would be smart design and prevent nearly instant TTKs.
Much like ground kit swapping, they also need to put an end to being able to cloak up and just re-slot a second clone console for 0 CD time. (a mechanic, the kit one, A. Hawk has stated is not working as intended)
We'll never see it because cryptic sells us this stuff, and it appeals to a large segment of their playerbase to buy and slot a fun power.
So an update on the so called "90%+ successful ambush rate" from Mini. We are in Kerrat right now, Mini is trying hard to ambush a couple of German Fed cruisers. He died 5 times in under 10 minutes, not a single successful ambush, not even once.
At one point, he almost got away after successfully jam sensored me. But my mines still found him and he went boom!!! Did I forget to mention I already bought the new space trait for mines, they work like a charm now.
too bad when theres even a close to even amount of feds to kdf u log out/change zones. that same night i left that zone to join where there were more feds. ur fail doesnt really warrant a response, as u are the definition of a troll, u aggravate and elicit responses to get peoples accounts banned. thats what duck dynasty said anyway
He made a big deal the other day when he joined in for the finishing blow as I was already being ganged up on by 5 people.
Nice tractor spam!:D
All it means is they will still flail uselessly at the team of piranhas that have them pinned down in spam as they pick them apart.
Hull is meaningless, moar dmg pl0x
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
I don't always see eye to eye with mini on a lot of issues, but you are using an example where he is going up against 2 cruisers, which basically have a huge advantage vs. Decloakers right now through no-target needed 360 degree FAW-spam as a sign of something?
I was in a match, quite some time ago, where mini was repeatedly trying to, singlehandedly, decloak strike on our panda team.
He died a lot, but the point is he never once quit, never once raged and continued to try repeatedly.
You can say what you want about mini, but being afraid to explode while decloaking on superior numbers isn't one of them.
The proton barrage has its flaws too. You sacrifice quite alot of CritH and normal energy damage (2%~ flat per console) to get it buffed up to those figures.
Secondly the activation time is **** like FOMM, its like a full second before it applies, TRIBBLE it up and it doesnt go off at all. 1 full second is huge for fast vaping, every millisecond counts where your opponent has no time to react.
Third, its bad to rely on 1 console or weapon to do everything for you, once its nerfed you'll be screwed. And I know particularly you rely on the last magic one shot pony, and you're back to square one when its nerfed to TRIBBLE.
If you have a build that can achieve it with a mix of a few combinations, if one thing is nerfed its often easily compensated with some other mixture.
.....If you have 3000 crewmen working their collective butts off trying to repair your boat. Then they should outperform 150 guys attempting to do the same repairs right?
.....Yes, there is a difference in the size of the ships. So the bigger the ship the more sq ft of hull you have to repair/heal. But if 150 crew in a escort is equal to 3000 crew in battle cruiser, then why bother with crew size at all?
.....A hull repair rate, based a ratio of the crew size in relation to the hulls hp could be developed that actually made crew count matter.
.....Crew loss would also have to be adjusted. Larger crews would lose a lower percentage of their crew count for a given amount of damage received.
.....In theory, this could compensate for the damage output differentials. The big cruisers with 3000 crew members would actually benefit from carrying around a small army. As it is now, crew size is pointless.
Not Dying too quickly should be something that needs some skill, gear, effort !
Killing quickly should be something that needs some skill, gear, effort !
I dont want a Game of tanks ! And i dont want a game of Tacs !
What does that mean ? Everything and nothing one could say ! But i think there are so many variables, so many things to consider, so many consoles, Boffs, Doffs, Ships, and so on...endless list. You cant just say "we need more hull" !