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Re: 12/19 changes to FaW
newromulan1
Member Posts: 2,229
Looks like the New changes will suck all your power away for the duration of faw??
Post edited by newromulan1 on
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ugh
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
They are FIXING the damn drain! I'd hardly call that a bloody nerf!
EDIT: If it ends A2B builds... in my dreams, lets put it that way...
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
Harden up Princess
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FAW was broken.
Wasn't aware of the non-Phaser bit, but as for the rest...here's an example from one of my guys, if I understand what was happening correctly. He's got 11.3/s PTS.
A Standard Beam fire cycle is 4/5. A second weapon drains 10 Weapon Power on the first shot...that's held as long as shots are being fired. So that -10 is gone for 1-4 seconds and then the PTS kicks in for that final second, in my guy's case - returning 11.3 Weapon Power. The more weapons you fire, the more drain there is - but that return on the 5th second is the same...before kicking into the next cycle.
With FAW being 5/5, there's no second there of gain. So using FAW requires greater overcap to keep up with that loss of power than normal firing.
What appears to have been happening though, is that it was only the first second of the firing cycle where the drain was being applied. That left FAW with 4s of gain...meaning my guy would have gotten 45.2 back with FAW (when it should have been only 11.3 with & without FAW).
Definitely a major bug...that appears to have been fixed.
If my understanding is correct of what took place and what's being fixed.
edit: Mind you, can't recall at the moment (running races kills brain cells), whether FAW is actually (5)4/5 or 5/5 - can't remember if there is still the second at the end or not. Hrmm, let me bounce back to orbit and check on a guy with beams.
Normal: (1s/shot, 1s gap) 4/5
FAW: (0.8s/shot, 1s gap) 4/5
So the second at the end is still there. I'll edit the bit above with that then.
As long as they buffed beams appropriate to compensate for that...given the difference in drain mechanics between Cannons and Beams.
People like to complain about the Beam overcapping compared to Cannons, but it's usually from a fundamental flaw in the understanding of the differences.
Sure, there's little point in going past 135 with Cannons...but that's the thing, you can get the same benefit with Cannons stopping at 135 that somebody with Beams has to push 170-180+ to do the same.
It's not a good thing that somebody with Beams can do that, it sucks that they potentially have to make that choice - sacrificing power elsewhere to do it. But, it's a balanced option that Cryptic has put in place to allow folks to sacrifice in one area for something in another area. Folks with Cannons likewise have made a choice, they've gone with reduced arcs...but they can put power elsewhere to help them maintain those arcs.
People act like Cryptic did all of this on a whim...
...are certain players able to ooze power these days because of things that have been added? Yep, but that's an issue of addressing oozing power - not overcap. The overcap is fine...the amount of power players can ooze is the issue. But Cannon folks won't talk about that, cause that would affect them too...they just want to nerf the Beam folks.
/facepalm
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
It's a recent bug, a month or two old at the most if I recall correctly.
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Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
Sorry, but no. Beams are NOT supposed to be the best weapon in the game. By intent, by design, by the old archaic trilogy of classes, escorts running DHCs shall be the strongest hitters in the game.
I have no issues with beams being EFFECTIVE, but currently they're just broken. The fact that they CAN be exploited so badly shows this. At any state that they end up existing, when all is said and done, they should be LESS effective by a large margin than DHCs.
A 4/3 DHC/turret setup should ALWAYS out-DPS a 8-beam FAW boat, ***every time by a long shot***
I'm a cruiser driver, and I enjoy the gameplay dynamics of it most times, but I'm more of an average DPSer. Ok, above average, but breaking 10K is good for me. My oddy tank shouldn't be able to send out 20k DPS. It just shouldn't. Not that I can, but that's basically what some beam boats are doing.
So, when all bugs are fixed, when all balance restored, all loopholes CLOSED, beams should be less than HALF as effective as DHCs. 8 firing on target vs 4(+3 turrets). That means dropping beam damage a lot and raising DHC damage a little.
Dual Heavy Cannon damage should not be increased at all. It's already possible to get oneshotted by a Cannon Rapid Fire III Alpha strike if the player doesn't have defenses offline. Beam arrays are also fine in their current state. They are only a problem when a player pulls out Emergency Power to Weapons and stacks it up with Fire at Will, Directed Energy Modulation (+doff), and Auxiliary to Battery (+doffs). The biggest culprit is Auxiliary to Battery with Emergency Power to Weapons, but I have an entire thread started on that ball of wax. http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=957361
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
FAW is now dead! lol
lol. i dont think people realize how terrible turrets are. thanks to them, the total base DPS of 8 beams is only just behind 4DHC and 3 turrets. thats why all this energy drain bypassing and 4 tac console cruisers and the on target uptime beams got have closed the effective damage gap so much lately, and why 10 shot per cycle faw produces the number damage numbers it does. nothing can touch the total numbers produced by beam arrays firing 10 different shots per cycle. the counter to that is that its shot all over the place, it cant be directed. but when theres 3 or more faw boats, basically its directed at everyone, and its as if you are directing all 10 shots were you want them
escorts, cannons, they should be spike kings. total dps? no. they should not be best at every single thing.
I want to know why only beam specials have extra power drains whereas cannons do not.
CSV/CRF dont do this?
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
AFAIK weapons all use the same drain mechanic--power is debited for the duration of the firing cycle, and then refunded when the cycle ends. I dont know if CSV/CRF behave any different. Maybe one of the systems devs will look.
The devs don't care about this game beyond getting more money from people.
2 more months Zelda.
That's still a problem, all you need is two Fire at Will Auxiliary to Battery Scimitars and you may wipe out an entire opposing team though all heals outside of reverse shield polarity. The fire at will damage should be divided between all targets, it shouldn't deal the same damage against each additional target in range.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
Make a thread in another section.
Then the cannon whiners.
Effectively you have 7 weapons and 8 Weapons.
Cannons and Turrets are 256 x4 + 132 x3 = 1420 BASE Mk XII
Beams are 176 x8 = 1402 BASE Mk XII
So cannon whiners be gone.
Also BFAW is MEANT to increase DPS, 1, 2, and 3 increase by 25% , 32% and 40% Respectively.
CRF 1, 2 and 3 improves BASE damage by 30%, 40% and 50% respectively.
BO 1, 2, and 3 inflicts 600%, 725% and 850% increased damage.
CSV 1, 2 and 3 improves BASE damage by 15%, 20% and 25% Respectively.
So yes DHC/Turret combo does 18 more damage than beams BY DESIGN than beams are all you get. Plus the +10 to Crit Severity inherent in them.
The only way DHC will be what all these whiny cannon jockeys want is if they create DT's, and DHT's. Dual Turrets and Dual Heavy Turrets. But suffer from increased power draw.
DT's -8 WP 180 Base Damage, DHT's -10 WP 180 Base Damage +10 Critical Severity. Maybe that would make you cannon whiners happy and let you finally ACTUALLY do more total base damage than beam runners, while suffering more power loss of course like beam users always do.
Oh and for you cannon junkies you get what? Single Cannons, Turrets, Dual Cannons and Dual Heavy Cannons. Beam guys get......Beam Array and Dual Beam Bank, the latter has nothing to increase frontal damage to put in the rear, like say a 360 degree Beam Array that has -8 WP and does 132 Base damage. We get the rear array to help out DBB's and you get better turrets for your backside. But oh wait that would still keep us on pretty even footing wouldn't it.....
Back to the OP once this hits i have base line test already done to compare it too, so i will have to get back to you on the actual difference in DPS, but frankly i feel like it will be fairly negligible.
I am Il Shadow and i approve these Shennanigans!
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@Aquitaine985
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? what exactly are you talking about... cannons drain... have you ever used them. lol
Faw doesn't drain as I think everyone knows.
Glad they found the issue and fixed it... hopefuly they hvae banned the code from there systems so this doesn't come back next patch.