The ground part of Boot Camp was stopped on the decision of (at the time) the ground coaches, several of whom were from FES at the time, chose to stop it because 'if we continued, we would have to start teaching broken mechanics and exploits'. If I am remembering that correctly.
Now, my memory could be wrong, still only human.
Ground part of it could come back, if it's what the ground PvPers are willing to do.
I also wouldn't call it a failure either. Boot Camp is very much a 'reap what you sow' situation. When PvPers support it, and there are many people coming in (like the very first class it had), then it does well. When there is little support and few hear about it to join, then there is a smaller class and such.
Simply saying it 'failed' without looking at possibly why it 'failed' isn't looking at the whole picture.
Well, if the regular PvPers aren't taking it seriously, and aren't tying to get it going, and aren't supporting it, then something is wrong, don't you think? I've tried to be involved and mostly got the "bugger off" treatment. But I wish it the best of luck if it ever gets going again.
Well, if the regular PvPers aren't taking it seriously, and aren't tying to get it going, and aren't supporting it, then something is wrong, don't you think? I've tried to be involved and mostly got the "bugger off" treatment. But I wish it the best of luck if it ever gets going again.
Indeed. But just as we cannot force anyone to be a coach, we cannot force people who graduated to PvP. Point is that saying that Boot Camp has failed due to the queues not really improving isn't really true because all we did was just teach them, nothing more, nothing less.
Now, that aside, you got the 'bugger off' treatment. I'm curious, who were you talking to, and when was this? I ask because I would like to first apologize for it on behalf of Boot Camp, since we never want such a thing to happen, as it is meant to be neutral ground, and whoever said that probably wasn't being neutral about it. Nobody is turned down from Boot Camp, either to coach or to be a student.
If you don't wish to talk on it, that is fine as well. If you do wish to talk on it, you can send me a PM to prevent any 'name and shame'.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
The last two days I specifically played Pug PvP, joined no team... quite frankly, this really needs to be addressed.
I reiterate my request for a PUG vs Team Queue. Teams are free to play eachother, but people pugging in should only be faced with other PUGS.... absolutely no teams being formed prior to joining the queue).
It is absolutely ridiculous the number of pre-formed teams, with skills well beyond a Pug group....
As I said in another queue, there are times that I team with Fleeties, and we are improving... and I would use a team queue in those instances.
People facing full pre-formed/premade teams with 4 other pugs who met eachother upon warping in learn nothing of how to pvp... and many just leave.
I am all for people learning, and expanding their skill sets, and I hope that the team we are building in our fleet, will one day be competitive. But that is not today...
None the less, I pugged for 2 straight days... faced numerous premade/preformed teams never saw anyone looking for a match in OPvP nor Tyler Durden... so I call BS on "there are no other teams to play".
So again, we need seperate queues for the true Pick Up games, Team play (I have nothing against this) needs their own queue. The quality of games for both groups of players would improve.
Just to nip this in the bud before it starts over again.
PUGger - "Give us separate Queues, the premades are ruining our fun"
TeamPlay advocate - "So you want to punish those who like teaming with friends? The population can't support this"
PUGger - "So PUGstomping is how you get your jollies?"
TeamPlay advocate - "No, playing with friends is how I have fun"
PUGger - "Whatever, you're just a lousy human being who enjoys griefing the queues"
repeat 20 or 30 times
Enter Random Person with some Sense - "It doesn't matter, Cryptic won't touch PvP with a 10' pole"
don't see a need for this, community is too small as it stands anyways. maybe if it was larger man.
It seems that the queues are better at certain times than others. I try not to play in the morning my time (pacific time) because there are certain players/fleets stinking up the queues then. Later in the day, for me, seems to be fun in pugland. That's just my observation though. But yeah, I don't face premades as often as some say they are. I would go for 1/10 but that's still just 10% of the time.
Not at horizon because he pugs a lot:
I would also like to add that the queue system can be screwy at times. I got put into a random pug with two fleetmates the other day.
In general, if having trouble with premades, just try to play at different times. The weekends usually brings out the trollish players but it also brings out some of the best too. The real fix against stinky premades (as opposed to fair play premades), is to queue up more often. The more one queues the better chance of a great game. Also, dont confuse winning with fun. I lose more often than I win but I have more fun matches than unfun matches.
I would love to see non-teamed queues, however, I do believe that the PvP population is so small, to where it will just add to the problems we have.
If anything, make the non-teamed queues completely random, to where you might have a possibility of a Fed, KDF, Rom-KDF, and Rom-Fed all on the same team. To me, that would be very interesting.
Comments
Well, if the regular PvPers aren't taking it seriously, and aren't tying to get it going, and aren't supporting it, then something is wrong, don't you think? I've tried to be involved and mostly got the "bugger off" treatment. But I wish it the best of luck if it ever gets going again.
Lion Heart of Hammer Squadron
Indeed. But just as we cannot force anyone to be a coach, we cannot force people who graduated to PvP. Point is that saying that Boot Camp has failed due to the queues not really improving isn't really true because all we did was just teach them, nothing more, nothing less.
Now, that aside, you got the 'bugger off' treatment. I'm curious, who were you talking to, and when was this? I ask because I would like to first apologize for it on behalf of Boot Camp, since we never want such a thing to happen, as it is meant to be neutral ground, and whoever said that probably wasn't being neutral about it. Nobody is turned down from Boot Camp, either to coach or to be a student.
If you don't wish to talk on it, that is fine as well. If you do wish to talk on it, you can send me a PM to prevent any 'name and shame'.
The last two days I specifically played Pug PvP, joined no team... quite frankly, this really needs to be addressed.
I reiterate my request for a PUG vs Team Queue. Teams are free to play eachother, but people pugging in should only be faced with other PUGS.... absolutely no teams being formed prior to joining the queue).
It is absolutely ridiculous the number of pre-formed teams, with skills well beyond a Pug group....
As I said in another queue, there are times that I team with Fleeties, and we are improving... and I would use a team queue in those instances.
People facing full pre-formed/premade teams with 4 other pugs who met eachother upon warping in learn nothing of how to pvp... and many just leave.
I am all for people learning, and expanding their skill sets, and I hope that the team we are building in our fleet, will one day be competitive. But that is not today...
None the less, I pugged for 2 straight days... faced numerous premade/preformed teams never saw anyone looking for a match in OPvP nor Tyler Durden... so I call BS on "there are no other teams to play".
So again, we need seperate queues for the true Pick Up games, Team play (I have nothing against this) needs their own queue. The quality of games for both groups of players would improve.
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
don't see a need for this, community is too small as it stands anyways. maybe if it was larger man.
PUGger - "Give us separate Queues, the premades are ruining our fun"
TeamPlay advocate - "So you want to punish those who like teaming with friends? The population can't support this"
PUGger - "So PUGstomping is how you get your jollies?"
TeamPlay advocate - "No, playing with friends is how I have fun"
PUGger - "Whatever, you're just a lousy human being who enjoys griefing the queues"
repeat 20 or 30 times
Enter Random Person with some Sense - "It doesn't matter, Cryptic won't touch PvP with a 10' pole"
Does that pretty much sum it up?
It seems that the queues are better at certain times than others. I try not to play in the morning my time (pacific time) because there are certain players/fleets stinking up the queues then. Later in the day, for me, seems to be fun in pugland. That's just my observation though. But yeah, I don't face premades as often as some say they are. I would go for 1/10 but that's still just 10% of the time.
Not at horizon because he pugs a lot:
I would also like to add that the queue system can be screwy at times. I got put into a random pug with two fleetmates the other day.
In general, if having trouble with premades, just try to play at different times. The weekends usually brings out the trollish players but it also brings out some of the best too. The real fix against stinky premades (as opposed to fair play premades), is to queue up more often. The more one queues the better chance of a great game. Also, dont confuse winning with fun. I lose more often than I win but I have more fun matches than unfun matches.
If anything, make the non-teamed queues completely random, to where you might have a possibility of a Fed, KDF, Rom-KDF, and Rom-Fed all on the same team. To me, that would be very interesting.
Obsidian