Avenger or Scimitar?

majorzion

Hello Captains
I will get straight to the point.
I have a federation science officer and a rom-fed tactical officer both at level 50.
I have enough dilithium to convert to get either the new avenger class, which I quite like the look of, and the romulan scimitar
bearing in mind that if I got the scimitar I only have enough to get just the scimitar, not the tulwar and the falchion as well, and that I really don't have a preference between big, bulky carrier/cruiser ships and escorts/cruisers which would you recommend that I get?
I am quite new to this so I apologise if I am coming across as being quite inexperienced, I would just like some advice.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

sonnikku

Tough choice. On the Scimitar you have the potential do more damage. You get one more tac console and the option of having 5 Romulan Operative traits that the Avenger simply can't match. (5-10% more Crit chance based on how thrifty you're feeling) On the other hand, the Scimitar has simply awful inertia. The ship in addition to being big and a prime target for warp core breeches is also slow to move and slow to stop. What sucks is sometimes when you're cruising at full impulse and you kill the throttle you'll stop almost on a dime while others you'll skid for a good 10kh. At least if it were more consistent we could gauge the pad distance better.

dahminus

The scimitar dreadnaught is the most powerful ship in game. Nothing compares to its dps output.

+1 to dreadnaught from me

Unknown

This content has been removed.

astro2244

patrickngo wrote: »

The Avenger. Defiinitely. The brightboys at Cryptic took the Tor'Khat (a KDF fleet ship and probably the best cruiser in the inventory bar none), improved the hell out of it (they changed one uni console around so it's actually "Universal" instead of being "put your sci here"), swtiched one weapon forward and enabled it to use both the Fed Cloak consiole, AND Dual cannons, then gave it an inertia rating that lets you use the improved turn rate BETTER than the parent design, and it's a four-console tactical layout, so you're not gimping your firepower, AND has more hull than the parent design.

AND it gets 'cruiser powers'...

In competent hands, it has zero defects, and that's if you DON'T get the fleet version instead.

AND you don't have to have a Romulan toon to get it, but you can have it on your romulan toon.Comparably, this is a choice like picking between a Torkie and a Bortas-the Bort's got five Tac consoles it can't use anywhere but scripted content, no turn rate, gawedawful inertia, etc.

the Avenger's got handling, forward firepower, an the ability to apply that firepower. Raw DPS means nothing if you can't apply it.

You can't use avenger on romulan side

sonnikku

Yep. Nor can your non-romulans have overpowered Romulan Operative traits.

marshalericdavid

edalgo wrote: »

The Avenger is great but I can do the same damage with a fleet Sovereign or Fleet Excelsior.

Avenger with Dual Heavy Cannons and Turrets with Cannon skills can do more damage and kill things faster then either of those other ships can. If your having trouble doing more damage with the Avenger then all I can say is your doing something wrong with the Avenger.

tlamstrike

sonnikku wrote: »

Yep. Nor can your non-romulans have overpowered Romulan Operative traits.

I assume you mean the Captain can't have it. You can get Bridge Officers with that trait from the embassy.

I currently run 2 Romulan Operatives, 1 Romulan with Subterfuge, 1 Nausicaan with Pirate and one Human with Leadership on my Fleet Assault Cruiser.

amincielbleu

The Avenger is definitely not the best ship for your Fed scientific captain. It's best for a PvP-oriented engineer, and for fans that just like the look of it.

The Scimitar is one of the best ships for a Romulan tactical captain, but are you sure that you don't want to fly a Fleet escort with your tactical captain ? Romulan escorts are the best in the game (the Fleet Dhelan seems slightly better for a tactician, the Fleet T'Varo slightly better for a scientific and the Fleet Mogai slightly better for an engineer, but all are great for everybody). Think twice and, if you still prefer the Scimitar to an escort, go for it. It's zen well spent, since it will be unlocked for your whole account, if some day you decide to make a romulan engineer or science captain...

More detailled arguments are available in this thread. I've just summarized the relevant conclusion for you.

shadowwraith77

The Falchion is a better choice IMO over the tulwar or scimitar in its heavier reliance on eng consoles. It carries the same boff layout as the other 2, with +subsystem power in the shldpwr and engpwr, has a 4eng 3sci and 3tac console layout! So pick this baby for its better survivability IMO.

thratch1

edalgo wrote: »

Plus once you get the Avenger you'd have to buy a fleet module in order to upgrade to the fleet Avenger.

This is an important point to consider.

For 2500 Zen, if you buy the Scimitar-class for your Romulan, you're getting a ship on par with Fleet ship stats (higher hull/shields, 10 console slots), just like any other 3-pack ship.

If you get the Avenger class, you'll miss out on that 10th console slot and the extra stat boost, unless you pony up 500 Zen for a FSM, and also belong to or can negotiate access to a Fleet with a high enough shipyard.

dknight0001

From the Romulan forums I hear you really want the 2 console bonus for the scimitar so buying the 3 pack seems the way to go there.

The Avenger for a Sci Captain? if your specced for Sci ships or Carriers it's not going to work that well. If you respec your captain for fire power and cruisers it should work great.

Holographic Fleet and Sensor Scan are good Offensive powers while Subnuke is great in PVP and what ever that shield power is will compliment your defences.

Any captain can fly any ship it's just how you spec them.

Romulans can not fly Federation T5 ships, so all the ships from L40 and up are off limits to Romulans.

On a 1:1 comparison I feel that the Scimitar is the superior ship here. When you consider it has Battle Cloak and a Singularity Core. Throw in some Romulan/Reman BOFFs and your getting a very very powerful alpha strike from decloak.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

isthiscool

Well, You have a Science Fed. so the avenger is not really the best boat for that toon. It cant utilize the best things of a science officer. The Schimitar would be great for your Tac Romulan, however if you do not have enough to buy the Schimitar bundle than the Schimitar will not be as good as it should be. I recommend, either the Tvaro light warbird refit I believe it is. Not the cheap one. or the new Romulan tactical ship. They are very good ships and in the hands of a Tac very good ships. Another route would be to get the Mirror Haffa war bird off the exchange. It is a very solid escort and you can get it for Energy credits instead of Zen. If you want a ship For your science toon. I recommend a science oriented boat. I do not recommend the Atrox carrier or the Vulcan one. There are better science boats out there. The Vesta bundle is great for a science toon but you have the same problem as you do with the Schimitar. Just getting one vesta doesnt give you the best things about the vesta. I cant remember the name of the ship but there is a Refit science vessel that is a pretty good ship and comes with a pretty good uni console. It has a oval shaped disc and 3 nacells. It is a true science boat and would be better suited for a science character that the avenger. An avenger is better for an Engineer or a Tac, but will not work for a Romulan tac.

admiralq1732

save for the Scimitar 3 pack. SO WORTH IT.

talaj

isthiscool wrote: »

Well, You have a Science Fed. so the avenger is not really the best boat for that toon. It cant utilize the best things of a science officer.

Pretty much all of a Science captain's abilities can be used to their full capacity whilst flying an Avenger. Sci boff abilities are another matter, but can be utilized by any captain, and there aren't really any Sci-specific traits - beyond the stacking exotic damage buff - that synergize well to make a science-heavy vessel any more potent in the hands of a Sci captain than either of the others. In fact, in the current STO where DPS is king, science vessels with science-heavy boff loadouts are - farcically - more powerful in the hands of a Tac.....

If you want to run a vessel heavy on offensive & defensive science abilities then sure the Avenger's far from a good fit with only a maximum of 2 lt sci boffs. But if you're a Sci captain looking for something competitive in today's STO, then the Avenger's a great option that chucks out plenty of DPS whilst still being very sturdy, and offers a basic group support tool through the cruiser command interface.

---

On the OP's topic itself you've really got to ask yourself a simple question:

"Do I derive the most fun from being a completely overpowered monster capable of obliterating everything in a 10km radius in short order?"

If the answer is "Yes!" then buy the tactical Scimitar. Go for the 3-pack if you feel you want to have a play around with the additional consoles and the Thalaron Pulse, but you don't need any of that - not even the 2-piece bonus - to make the Scimitar a roflstomping machine of mass destruction.

aetam1

majorzion wrote: »

Hello Captains
I will get straight to the point.
I have a federation science officer and a rom-fed tactical officer both at level 50.
I have enough dilithium to convert to get either the new avenger class, which I quite like the look of, and the romulan scimitar
bearing in mind that if I got the scimitar I only have enough to get just the scimitar, not the tulwar and the falchion as well, and that I really don't have a preference between big, bulky carrier/cruiser ships and escorts/cruisers which would you recommend that I get?
I am quite new to this so I apologise if I am coming across as being quite inexperienced, I would just like some advice.

Both are good ships. The scimitar has the highest dmg potential of any ship in the game at the moment but you do not really need that much dmg.
So I would suggest you get the ship that you think looks cooler or simply buy the ship for the character you like more.

rmxiii

Scimitar you really should save up and get the 3 Pack of it. The Consoles off the Falchion and Tulwar are very got to use on it. Though the Scimitar has the overpowering 5 Tac console slots. For best damage and setup is use the Scimitar with the consoles from the Tulwar and Falchion. The Cloaked Barrage the Scimitar comes with is not that great compared to the other 2. and while having all 3 Scimitar consoles gives you access to Thalaron Pulse, player version of Thalaron Pulse is rather weak.

Avenger is a very good cruiser overall, but as of today, All cruisers now have the cruiser commands avalible. One great cruiser with good tac console slots and a Sci lean is the SUpport Cruiser Retrofit, but that was a reward for doing Temporal Ambassader durring the 3rd Aniversary event so you probably don't have that ship avalible.

sonnikku

You don't need the Scimitar three pack. The consoles are "handy", but there just isn't room. The tactical scimitar is the best ship for it's staggering 5 tactical consoles. That's considered ideal, but the reality is it also doesn't give you much breathing room. As half of your consoles are going solely to dps infusers, that leaves three for science and two for engineering. Except not even that much, because you figure two ultra rare fleet rcs accelerators (40% turn, 10 resist all, 10 kinetic resist) consolidating your armor and turn consoles into one, a plasmonic leech, the borg console for the stats, a valdore console to keep you healed through all the heat you're going to be taking bearing down on enemies with an OP ship and pretty soon you have nothing left. You'd have to give up your plasmonic leech/valdore console just to find room for a rom console for the harness bonus.