Believe it or not, it can be done. That being said; it can be done by the hackiest of means and I doubt it runs particularly well. Take a look at Free60
I'm not saying it can't be done. I'm saying it wasn't released on X Box 360.
I'm sure that you can hack any console to run any game you want, but why would you want to do that and risk making your console completely inoperable?
I'd rather buy a computer with reasonable specs that I know I can upgrade later as and when required.
How can I put this delicately? Speaking as someone who is currently typing this on a PC whilst sitting less than ten feet from a PS3 and an Xbox 360, I can confirm from personal experience the person you're laughing at is completely correct, and it is them who should be laughing at you.
By way. The 2 new cons are the same just faster loading Times. So have it. LOL. I know my stuff.
The ignorance required to utter this statement is breathtaking. Luckily, ignorance can be cured with a little education, provided it's not accompanied by stupidity, so have a look at this:
And lastly, you said we had to pay for updates. DLC is not an update, those are optional addons. Required content has always been free, and no, map packs for halo are not required content.
Anything else you wish to correct me on teacher?
*edit
I forgot about final fantasy XI, though I have no idea what the infrastructure is like behind that that allows cross platform play, or if its even still available for play.
"DLC" as used by most every game developer, producer, distributor and other knowledgeable users refers to "Downloadable Content" which pretty much covers EVERY byte of additional data not already found on game CD/DVDs.
And I specifically added in the little qualifier on my statement - "Depending on the game that you're playing...".
I'll send you my bill for educational services provided.
Back to topic - STO is not in a condition programming-wise where it could be ported over easily to a dumbed-down stupid version for any console or console service.
XB1 has made enough problems for itself, doesn't need help with clunky ports, especially when it's taking a game from the PC master Race and giving it to the dirty console peasants.
Lol....24 hour check-ins or no games for you. What the hell, Microsoft?
Lol....24 hour check-ins or no games for you. What the hell, Microsoft?
I was wondering about that and whether it could be construed as an invasion of privacy or whether it would be strictly legal to enforce that requirement on someone.
It's probably a moot point since MS will have no choice but to back down since Sony aren't gong to do that.
XB1 has made enough problems for itself, doesn't need help with clunky ports, especially when it's taking a game from the PC master Race and giving it to the dirty console peasants.
Lol....24 hour check-ins or no games for you. What the hell, Microsoft?
In the end what will be more surprising than that is the amount of people that are ok with being treated that way by MS. I say let them have at it if they really prefer the Xbone to reading a manual once in a while to make a game work.
I'll sell you some weapons from New Romulus. Never fired, only dropped once.
"DLC" as used by most every game developer, producer, distributor and other knowledgeable users refers to "Downloadable Content" which pretty much covers EVERY byte of additional data not already found on game CD/DVDs.
And I specifically added in the little qualifier on my statement - "Depending on the game that you're playing...".
I'll send you my bill for educational services provided.
Back to topic - STO is not in a condition programming-wise where it could be ported over easily to a dumbed-down stupid version for any console or console service.
By your logic, the forums here are DLC. Sorry but you're comparing apples to oranges. You tried to make it sound as if seasonal releases are optional downloads for sto and you would be charged for them. The qualifier I specifically used for paid dlc was 'optional', which does not apply to this topic what so ever. Those updates to sto, as you well know, are required downloads. You will not be able to login to the game with out them.
*edit
I suppose I should point out for the sake of clarity that unless cryptic starts charging for seasonal releases, IF this silly game were to find its way onto the consoles, neither MS or Sony would be able to charge for seasonal releases either.
You are correct, the person who needs to do some research is you.
The upcoming consoles are already under specced compared to modern PCs (and not even top of the line PCs, mid-range PCs are more capable than the console specs released thus-far).
As for consoles being 'the same just faster loading times' is hilariously wrong. Both are moving to x86 eight-core processors, both are getting jacked up to 8 Gigs of RAM (a considerable increase for the PlayStation from the PS3's piddly .5 gigs). Both are getting improved video cards, improved wireless, etc...
You really don't know your stuff, and should stop claiming as much.
On topic, the time and money investment, not to mention the bureaucratic hoops needing to be jumped through, simply aren't worth it for Cryptic or PWE to pursue.
How can I put this delicately? Speaking as someone who is currently typing this on a PC whilst sitting less than ten feet from a PS3 and an Xbox 360, I can confirm from personal experience the person you're laughing at is completely correct, and it is them who should be laughing at you.
Then it sounds like you need to upgrade your PC.
♪ I'm going around not in circles but in spirographs.
It's pretty much this hard to keep just one timeline intact. ♪
I believe that Cryptic should enquire and investigate into porting STO and maybe even other games by cryptic to the xbox one or the ps4. They both have the specs to handle STO.
The PS3 is based on an nVidia 7800 GPU, now five generations old. Compare it to my (high end prior generation), GTX 680 which has more than triple the memory bandwidth and nearly a tenfold increase in the output in terms of operations per second, and it's pretty obvious that they can't compare.
You want to run a direct comparison? Look at cross platform titles and see how they stack up. Crysis 2 can run at a higher resolution than 1080p on a PC (I run it at 1440p) and with higher resolution textures. Skyrim is another example. Many titles can't even run at a true 1080p on a console because they can't run at a decent minimum frame rate.
what hole did you pull all of this from? no wait, don't tell me, your TRIBBLE. For starters, MS announced yesterday, at E3, that they are dropping the point system for purchases and moving to direct cash purchases, just like with the MS store apps in windows 8. Not that it makes a difference really, in the long run it all works out to be the same amount of cash required for a purchase directly vs buying points and then buying w/e items it is you want. This just cuts out the middle man.
I've never once paid for a game update on xbox live. Who ever gave you that info is a moron or a liar, or both. Either way its clear you've never used xbox live.
3rdly putting sto server maintenance in the hands of someone other than cryptic would be a good thing, however MS will not allow cross platform between xbox and pc currently. Software development would still be the responsibility of cryptic.
And no, MS does not limit the amount of updates someone can release... that's just about the dumbest thing I've ever heard. If its broke, and with cryptic it always is, they're not gonna tell em they can't fix it cuz they've used up some mythical allocation of updates.
What an insightful answer you wrote there, well done, I am certain your 3rd grade English teacher would be oh so proud.
OK, here goes.
When you buy something from the Microsoft store, a percentage of that payment is taken by them before they pass the rest onto the developer. Now, if that developer wants to maintain their profits, or increase them, they generally increase the price of said item to offset the percentage that Microsoft take. This will be the same under the new policy as it was with the old "Points" system. Now who do you think will bear the increased cost? That's right. Us.
With that very simple part out of the way I'll carry on.
Microsoft's policies and practices are well known in the industry, and to many outside of it. When I said that Microsoft charges for updates, it should have been clear from the rest of my post that I was not referring to charging end users, but rather they charge the developers. Had you done even the smallest amount of research instead of merely face-rolling across your keyboard you would know this.
Here, I shall even provide you with a handy link to an example of said practice by Microsoft.
See? Also, for the record, Microsoft happily allows cross PC/XBOX integration, but only as long as they are holding all the cards. So, lets see, you managed to get absolutely everything wrong, make yourself look rather silly, and embarrassed your 3rd grade English teacher into the bargain. Nice one.
Im for this. More players = More money= More content.
Dr. Miranda Jones: I understand, Mr. Spock. The glory of creation is in its infinite diversity.
Mr. Spock: And the ways our differences combine, to create meaning and beauty.
What an insightful answer you wrote there, well done, I am certain your 3rd grade English teacher would be oh so proud.
OK, here goes.
When you buy something from the Microsoft store, a percentage of that payment is taken by them before they pass the rest onto the developer. Now, if that developer wants to maintain their profits, or increase them, they generally increase the price of said item to offset the percentage that Microsoft take. This will be the same under the new policy as it was with the old "Points" system. Now who do you think will bear the increased cost? That's right. Us.
With that very simple part out of the way I'll carry on.
Microsoft's policies and practices are well known in the industry, and to many outside of it. When I said that Microsoft charges for updates, it should have been clear from the rest of my post that I was not referring to charging end users, but rather they charge the developers. Had you done even the smallest amount of research instead of merely face-rolling across your keyboard you would know this.
Here, I shall even provide you with a handy link to an example of said practice by Microsoft.
See? Also, for the record, Microsoft happily allows cross PC/XBOX integration, but only as long as they are holding all the cards. So, lets see, you managed to get absolutely everything wrong, make yourself look rather silly, and embarrassed your 3rd grade English teacher into the bargain. Nice one.
Have a lovely day.
Hey genius, you realize you linked articles relating specifically to xbox live arcade which is not a category sto would fall in, right? But please continue your "research". Here, I'll help you. I can link stuff too.
Note from the list of games, those are the "HD" revivals of old games, board games, side scrollers, etc.
Dig something up for a mainstream title like Mass Effect, Halo, Skyrim, things along those lines and get back to me. Cuz I've been looking, and I don't see Bungie, Obsidian, EA, Bethesda and all the others complaining or passing on costs to customers for patches. Policy for XBLA != policy for the rest of the service.
Perhaps you should read and comprehend your articles before you link them.
Also probably not the best idea to base your entire argument off something that happened between a publisher for some random indi developer and MS. Contracts can be such a bother when not properly negotiated.
Hey genius, you realize you linked articles relating specifically to xbox live arcade which is not a category sto would fall in, right? But please continue your "research".
You do realise that the update fees and the update schedule apply across the board right? All patches, expansions and updates have to be certified by Microsoft as safe for use on the XBOX hardware, so unless you are a developer working directly for Microsoft or one of its own studios (Like the creators of Halo), you are going to have jump through every hoop there is and fork out lots of money.
Next up, Mass Effect, Skyrim and games of that ilk are not MMO's (And so do not fall into the same category as STO), even so they still have to abide by Microsofts rules regards updates and expansions. They must all be vetted by Microsoft, and there is a fee. Why do you think most DLC costs money, and in some cases quite a lot of it? $20 was it not, for Dawnguard? Same for Dragonborn I believe.
As long as a companies software runs on XBOX hardware they are bound and restricted by Microsofts very stringent policies and prices. When compared to the way Sony operate, the choice is clear that going down the Microsoft route would prove very, very costly.
I have another link for you, one I highly suggest you read through. It's long I'm afraid, but it gives you a very clear insight into how Microsoft does business and just what their intentions are. The article talks about Win 8 and the Metro system for PC, but it must also be noted that the same rules apply to XBOX ONE and its Win 8 OS.
You do realise that the update fees and the update schedule apply across the board right? All patches, expansions and updates have to be certified by Microsoft as safe for use on the XBOX hardware, so unless you are a developer working directly for Microsoft or one of its own studios (Like the creators of Halo), you are going to have jump through every hoop there is and fork out lots of money.
Show me where games that are not XBLA games have the same policies? Hell I can't even find anything regarding policy for xbox development period outside of the TOS for the indi developer kit. It really all sounds to me like contract negotiations between the developer/publisher and MS. If it is as painful as you are trying to make it out to be, xbox live wouldn't be as large as it is.
Next up, Mass Effect, Skyrim and games of that ilk are not MMO's (And so do not fall into the same category as STO), even so they still have to abide by Microsofts rules regards updates and expansions. They must all be vetted by Microsoft, and there is a fee. Why do you think most DLC costs money, and in some cases quite a lot of it? $20 was it not, for Dawnguard? Same for Dragonborn I believe.
As long as a companies software runs on XBOX hardware they are bound and restricted by Microsofts very stringent policies and prices. When compared to the way Sony operate, the choice is clear that going down the Microsoft route would prove very, very costly.
Interesting you brought that up, Dawnguard was priced the same on Steam, and for the first week on PSN it was priced at a discounted rate of $10 and went back up to $20 there after. So MS got a cut from steam and PSN sales of dawnguard, right? DLC costs money because developers like to get paid. Of course MS is going to take a cut, so will anyone else that is going to distribute the content.
Regardless, I still fail to see what an optional add on for a game has to do with a required patch that we have to get to play STO.
I have another link for you, one I highly suggest you read through. It's long I'm afraid, but it gives you a very clear insight into how Microsoft does business and just what their intentions are. The article talks about Win 8 and the Metro system for PC, but it must also be noted that the same rules apply to XBOX ONE and its Win 8 OS.
I read your article and immediately I found it to be defamatory and stopped reading it. I'll go ahead and quote it for you:
Because no software can ship on this future platform without it going through the Windows Store, the team that built Skyrim would have to send it to Microsoft for certification. Then Microsoft would tell them if they could ship it.
Do you know what Microsoft's answer would be?
I do. It would be "no".
This is not speculative; it is certain. Skyrim is a game for adults. It has a PEGI rating of 18. If you read the Windows 8 app certification requirements you will find, in section 5.1:
Your app must not contain adult content, and metadata must be appropriate for everyone. Apps with a rating over PEGI 16, ESRB MATURE, or that contain content that would warrant such a rating, are not allowed.
and inspecting the app certification requirements, they conveniently left out a portion:
Apps with a rating over PEGI 16, ESRB MATURE, or that contain content that would warrant such a rating, are not allowed, unless the app is a game, is rated by a third party ratings board, and otherwise complies with these certification requirements.
Also this article states that developers can post free apps on the app store and they're not required to use MS's ecommerce for 'in app purchases', IE cstore, buy more zen to sell for dil, etc. Which means MS doesn't get a cut if the developer accept payments directly.
*edit
looking a bit more closely over the article, I noticed one thing that really stood out. the date on the article was oct 16 2012. Windows 8 didn't hit store shelves until Oct 26 and this article was harping over a draft of getting applications certified for windows 8. MS has had certifications for software since at least in the days of XP, prolly before that as well. Certification is not required to develop and publish for windows, its required if you want the "Works for windows blah blah" sticker on it. Also, this article and the windows 8 certification process has jack to do with Xbox one.
This will never happen, for one if it joined with a console type game, STO would go under and crash, fail.
Besides this is an MMO online game, made for computer gaming, i dont no about anybody else, but i will choose to play a computer based game over a console game anyday
Juat so much more interesting, and funner.:)
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] "This is Fleet Commander BumBle!..
Vice Admiral of the U.S.S. Prometheus!..
I order you to lower your shields and weapons or ill be forced to fire upon you!!!"
This thread has now most definitely run its course, and isn't providing any civilized discussion, so due to this as well as the high number of flaming/trolling posts and/or reported posts in this thread, I'm closing this thread down.
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Thanks,
syberghost
Former moderator of these forums. Lifetime sub since before launch. Been here since before public betas. Foundry author of "Franklin Drake Must Die".
Comments
I have to agree with that.
It doesn't sound as simple as a "port", though.
RIP KDF and PvP 2014-07-17 Season 9.5 - Death by Dev
I'm not saying it can't be done. I'm saying it wasn't released on X Box 360.
I'm sure that you can hack any console to run any game you want, but why would you want to do that and risk making your console completely inoperable?
I'd rather buy a computer with reasonable specs that I know I can upgrade later as and when required.
Actually I meant to quote someone else and quoted you by mistake. Sorry for that.
How can I put this delicately? Speaking as someone who is currently typing this on a PC whilst sitting less than ten feet from a PS3 and an Xbox 360, I can confirm from personal experience the person you're laughing at is completely correct, and it is them who should be laughing at you.
The ignorance required to utter this statement is breathtaking. Luckily, ignorance can be cured with a little education, provided it's not accompanied by stupidity, so have a look at this:
http://uk.gamespot.com/forums/topic/29359187/ps4-vs.-ps3-comparison
I can't easily find a similarly detailed comparison of Xbox 360 v Xbox One, but it's going to be a similar level of difference.
"DLC" as used by most every game developer, producer, distributor and other knowledgeable users refers to "Downloadable Content" which pretty much covers EVERY byte of additional data not already found on game CD/DVDs.
And I specifically added in the little qualifier on my statement - "Depending on the game that you're playing...".
I'll send you my bill for educational services provided.
Back to topic - STO is not in a condition programming-wise where it could be ported over easily to a dumbed-down stupid version for any console or console service.
Lol....24 hour check-ins or no games for you. What the hell, Microsoft?
I was wondering about that and whether it could be construed as an invasion of privacy or whether it would be strictly legal to enforce that requirement on someone.
It's probably a moot point since MS will have no choice but to back down since Sony aren't gong to do that.
In the end what will be more surprising than that is the amount of people that are ok with being treated that way by MS. I say let them have at it if they really prefer the Xbone to reading a manual once in a while to make a game work.
By your logic, the forums here are DLC. Sorry but you're comparing apples to oranges. You tried to make it sound as if seasonal releases are optional downloads for sto and you would be charged for them. The qualifier I specifically used for paid dlc was 'optional', which does not apply to this topic what so ever. Those updates to sto, as you well know, are required downloads. You will not be able to login to the game with out them.
*edit
I suppose I should point out for the sake of clarity that unless cryptic starts charging for seasonal releases, IF this silly game were to find its way onto the consoles, neither MS or Sony would be able to charge for seasonal releases either.
Good luck with that bill though.
You are correct, the person who needs to do some research is you.
The upcoming consoles are already under specced compared to modern PCs (and not even top of the line PCs, mid-range PCs are more capable than the console specs released thus-far).
As for consoles being 'the same just faster loading times' is hilariously wrong. Both are moving to x86 eight-core processors, both are getting jacked up to 8 Gigs of RAM (a considerable increase for the PlayStation from the PS3's piddly .5 gigs). Both are getting improved video cards, improved wireless, etc...
You really don't know your stuff, and should stop claiming as much.
On topic, the time and money investment, not to mention the bureaucratic hoops needing to be jumped through, simply aren't worth it for Cryptic or PWE to pursue.
Then it sounds like you need to upgrade your PC.
It's pretty much this hard to keep just one timeline intact. ♪
He was saying his PC is better already. Albeit in an odd way.
Too much to convert, and just too much period.
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Perfect World Entertainment Community Rules and Policies . ~syberghost
The PS3 is based on an nVidia 7800 GPU, now five generations old. Compare it to my (high end prior generation), GTX 680 which has more than triple the memory bandwidth and nearly a tenfold increase in the output in terms of operations per second, and it's pretty obvious that they can't compare.
You want to run a direct comparison? Look at cross platform titles and see how they stack up. Crysis 2 can run at a higher resolution than 1080p on a PC (I run it at 1440p) and with higher resolution textures. Skyrim is another example. Many titles can't even run at a true 1080p on a console because they can't run at a decent minimum frame rate.
You know stuff all.
What an insightful answer you wrote there, well done, I am certain your 3rd grade English teacher would be oh so proud.
OK, here goes.
When you buy something from the Microsoft store, a percentage of that payment is taken by them before they pass the rest onto the developer. Now, if that developer wants to maintain their profits, or increase them, they generally increase the price of said item to offset the percentage that Microsoft take. This will be the same under the new policy as it was with the old "Points" system. Now who do you think will bear the increased cost? That's right. Us.
With that very simple part out of the way I'll carry on.
Microsoft's policies and practices are well known in the industry, and to many outside of it. When I said that Microsoft charges for updates, it should have been clear from the rest of my post that I was not referring to charging end users, but rather they charge the developers. Had you done even the smallest amount of research instead of merely face-rolling across your keyboard you would know this.
Here, I shall even provide you with a handy link to an example of said practice by Microsoft.
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20120721/18262519786/charging-40000-to-issue-patch-makes-games-better-microsoft.shtml
There now, isn't the internet fun? We can find all sorts of articles and things to read and make ourselves not look like fools.
Oh wait, here is another
http://www.xblafans.com/microsoft-holding-up-skullgirls-xbla-patch-due-to-size-restrictions-61789.html
YAY! Learning is fun!
See? Also, for the record, Microsoft happily allows cross PC/XBOX integration, but only as long as they are holding all the cards. So, lets see, you managed to get absolutely everything wrong, make yourself look rather silly, and embarrassed your 3rd grade English teacher into the bargain. Nice one.
Have a lovely day.
Sig by my better half.
Mr. Spock: And the ways our differences combine, to create meaning and beauty.
-Star Trek: Is There in Truth No Beauty? (1968)
profit/return: $1
maintenance+updates: a lot, again not just $
overall project idea: garbage
Hey genius, you realize you linked articles relating specifically to xbox live arcade which is not a category sto would fall in, right? But please continue your "research". Here, I'll help you. I can link stuff too.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XBLA
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Xbox_Live_Arcade_games
Note from the list of games, those are the "HD" revivals of old games, board games, side scrollers, etc.
Dig something up for a mainstream title like Mass Effect, Halo, Skyrim, things along those lines and get back to me. Cuz I've been looking, and I don't see Bungie, Obsidian, EA, Bethesda and all the others complaining or passing on costs to customers for patches. Policy for XBLA != policy for the rest of the service.
Perhaps you should read and comprehend your articles before you link them.
Also probably not the best idea to base your entire argument off something that happened between a publisher for some random indi developer and MS. Contracts can be such a bother when not properly negotiated.
You do realise that the update fees and the update schedule apply across the board right? All patches, expansions and updates have to be certified by Microsoft as safe for use on the XBOX hardware, so unless you are a developer working directly for Microsoft or one of its own studios (Like the creators of Halo), you are going to have jump through every hoop there is and fork out lots of money.
Next up, Mass Effect, Skyrim and games of that ilk are not MMO's (And so do not fall into the same category as STO), even so they still have to abide by Microsofts rules regards updates and expansions. They must all be vetted by Microsoft, and there is a fee. Why do you think most DLC costs money, and in some cases quite a lot of it? $20 was it not, for Dawnguard? Same for Dragonborn I believe.
As long as a companies software runs on XBOX hardware they are bound and restricted by Microsofts very stringent policies and prices. When compared to the way Sony operate, the choice is clear that going down the Microsoft route would prove very, very costly.
I have another link for you, one I highly suggest you read through. It's long I'm afraid, but it gives you a very clear insight into how Microsoft does business and just what their intentions are. The article talks about Win 8 and the Metro system for PC, but it must also be noted that the same rules apply to XBOX ONE and its Win 8 OS.
http://gamasutra.com/view/feature/179420/the_next_twenty_years_what_.php
Enjoy.
Sig by my better half.
Show me where games that are not XBLA games have the same policies? Hell I can't even find anything regarding policy for xbox development period outside of the TOS for the indi developer kit. It really all sounds to me like contract negotiations between the developer/publisher and MS. If it is as painful as you are trying to make it out to be, xbox live wouldn't be as large as it is.
Interesting you brought that up, Dawnguard was priced the same on Steam, and for the first week on PSN it was priced at a discounted rate of $10 and went back up to $20 there after. So MS got a cut from steam and PSN sales of dawnguard, right? DLC costs money because developers like to get paid. Of course MS is going to take a cut, so will anyone else that is going to distribute the content.
Regardless, I still fail to see what an optional add on for a game has to do with a required patch that we have to get to play STO.
I read your article and immediately I found it to be defamatory and stopped reading it. I'll go ahead and quote it for you:
and inspecting the app certification requirements, they conveniently left out a portion:
Also this article states that developers can post free apps on the app store and they're not required to use MS's ecommerce for 'in app purchases', IE cstore, buy more zen to sell for dil, etc. Which means MS doesn't get a cut if the developer accept payments directly.
*edit
looking a bit more closely over the article, I noticed one thing that really stood out. the date on the article was oct 16 2012. Windows 8 didn't hit store shelves until Oct 26 and this article was harping over a draft of getting applications certified for windows 8. MS has had certifications for software since at least in the days of XP, prolly before that as well. Certification is not required to develop and publish for windows, its required if you want the "Works for windows blah blah" sticker on it. Also, this article and the windows 8 certification process has jack to do with Xbox one.
Besides this is an MMO online game, made for computer gaming, i dont no about anybody else, but i will choose to play a computer based game over a console game anyday
Juat so much more interesting, and funner.:)
"This is Fleet Commander BumBle!..
Vice Admiral of the U.S.S. Prometheus!..
I order you to lower your shields and weapons or ill be forced to fire upon you!!!"
This thread has now most definitely run its course, and isn't providing any civilized discussion, so due to this as well as the high number of flaming/trolling posts and/or reported posts in this thread, I'm closing this thread down.
Thanks,
syberghost