As title says - I need it for fleet store, our open projects right now are from lack of dilithium, need it for zen, need it to buy ships, need it for everything these days. it's like the new EC except the rarest currency and hardest to get decent amounts of.
And 8k refinement max a day and a tier 5 ships is 120k?
Well you can get dili many ways now, foundry, stf, dili pve missions, and your daily missions are good ways to. I hit my 8K everyday but that is the problem. The 8K limit is just to low. Im sitting on the dili I need for my Andorian cannons but I wont be able to get it for three days because of the refine cap.
PWE please give us a large refine cap limit! You starve us with huge prices and long wait times.
Dilith payouts aren't the problem, it's the refining cap. But since Cryptic thinks raising the refining cap will cut into zen sales, the odds of a cap raise are next to zero methinks.
As title says - I need it for fleet store, our open projects right now are from lack of dilithium, need it for zen, need it to buy ships, need it for everything these days. it's like the new EC except the rarest currency and hardest to get decent amounts of.
And 8k refinement max a day and a tier 5 ships is 120k?
The 8K limit is just to low. Im sitting on the dili I need for my Andorian cannons but I wont be able to get it for three days because of the refine cap.
Do you have other characters? Even if they're lowbies and can't reach the 8k daily limit as efficiently as your main character, you could do the academy history midterm, the exploration missions, have them turn in contraband, do some duty officer stuff, probably some other junk, refine.
Then, go to the dilithium exchange. Set your buy price to 25, calculate how many c-points that'd get you, put up the offer, then cancel it on your main character and pull the dilithium out.
Joined: January 2010
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kate-wintersbite.deviantart.com/art/0x01-Treachery-293641403
Cryptic already provides an easy way to by-pass the daily cap - it's called spending real money!! Buy Zen and convert if you want things faster. F2P is an illiusion - someone has to pay or no-one would be playing the game as it would shut down.
No, it's a misnomer. F2P only means initial game purchase and recurring monthly subscription is not required in order to participate; which does not stop people with a false sense of entitlement or who are accustomed to having everything handed to them from complaining that not everything is provided without a fee.
No, it's a misnomer. F2P only means initial game purchase and recurring monthly subscription is not required in order to participate; which does not stop people with a false sense of entitlement or who are accustomed to having everything handed to them from complaining that not everything is provided without a fee.
As title says - I need it for fleet store, our open projects right now are from lack of dilithium, need it for zen, need it to buy ships, need it for everything these days. it's like the new EC except the rarest currency and hardest to get decent amounts of.
And 8k refinement max a day and a tier 5 ships is 120k?
It just seems unbalanced
Dilithium is rather easy ...
I think Cryptic ought to double the refinement limit for 500 zen for silver plays and give it for a discount for gold players.
Hopefully I'll come back from my break; this break is fun; I play intellectual games.
Escorts are so powerful just buy two character slots and make 2 Tac officers and do stfs with them
Refine 24,000 dilithium a day trade the dil to your main character
Free doffs
Sell all your omega marks and processors on the two new characters so you dont have to do many STFs with them
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
No, it's a misnomer. F2P only means initial game purchase and recurring monthly subscription is not required in order to participate; which does not stop people with a false sense of entitlement or who are accustomed to having everything handed to them from complaining that not everything is provided without a fee.
WAR IS PEACE, FREEDOM IS SLAVERY, and IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH.
F2P often ends up costing a lot more than a subscription based game.
Dil reward is not a problem. We earn more dil than we did in the past.
-Foundry spotlight : 2-3K dil
-Contraband : 2K dil
-eSTF : 960 dil
-trading BNP for dil, from eSTF : 1Kdil/5BNP
-Daily academy lore question : 480 dil
That's already 5-6K. Then you may have your reputation to grind, that's around 1-2K dil for both of them, per day. Also add some doffing, which will earn several hundred of dil quickly.
As you can see, it's really easy to have dil. However, the 8k limit is the real problem for many players.
I think Cryptic ought to double the refinement limit for 500 zen for silver plays and give it for a discount for gold players.
Charging 500 ZEN for everyone, except Gold players would be perfect IMO.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Let's not forget pvp. PVP missions also reward 1440 dii, assuming you enjoy pvp. Do arena/assault/etc matches 3 times in a row, and you got yourself 1440.
It's fixed now? Last time, after 1.5 hours long Foundry mission (probably because I read it all), I only got 1440 dilithium.
Dunno, I earned enough dil on several alt from spotlight mission to trade for 30zen each. Which mean around 3K, so it seems to be working, at least for me.
Pretty much what everyone else said... if you're having trouble GETTING dilithium you're doing something very wrong. I can go days without bothering to get dilithium because I wind up with so much I can't refine. Actually that's nice since it lets me enjoy other content without always fretting about getting dilithium.
As to the refine rate? I'd love to see it get bumped to 10k/day or something but doubling it would be major overkill. Even so there are plenty of ways around it. Just train up your klingon alt (you do have one right?) and do 3 STF's (45 minutes) and 1 Spotlight (15-30 minutes) and you'll get 8k dilithium a day out of it... then just use the exchange to move the dilithium over to your main.
I think we're now at a point where they probably would like ways of increasing returns.
But they're focusing on nudging people up towards the 8k a day cap and ignoring how many days a week the average person plays.
What I suspect is that the average person plays seriously twice a week or so and so the goal probably needs to be more like 10k dilithium an hour with a weekly cap of around 50k.
Anything else is trying to micromanage people into playing daily and just won't work.
Now... From there, what you need to do for people who play daily or play more is allow them to do something constructive beyond refined dilithium acquisition, possibly by allowing unrefined ore to be traded in for something. Effectively, make the unused ore "overtime compensation" while refined ore remains what is used as general currency and in trade for ZEN.
So for example:
Expand the Lobi store.
Make ore tradeable for Lobi at a limited rate per week. (Say, 50k ore for 50 Lobi as a one time hand-in per week.) This only opens up after hitting the weekly refinement cap.
There's a refinement cap of 50k per week that resets weekly, not daily.
People earn 10k dilithium per hour.
Under this system, I'd imagine people would hit targets more reasonably, without penalizing people who play more too severely. I suspect this would actually NOT mess up Cryptic's planned Starbase progression, which seems to me to currently be based around fleet members earning 56k a week and contributing 25% on their income to the fleet. The problem right now is that people aren't earning 56k per week and that the 25% or so average they expect people will contribute to fleets (which probably is reasonable as an average, knowing some will contribute 100% and some will contribute none) will only happen when people can comfortably earn closer to 50k a week. And people will only earn 50k a week when you allow them to earn it on their own time, including the possibility of a once a week marathon 5 hour play session and then logging out for 6 days.
The problem I suspect is looking at people's average session being 1.25-2.5 hours or so (total guess) and then acting as though they play every day. When those 2.5 hour people may play twice a week and the 1.25 hour people may play four days a week.
But I think they miss the picture by focusing on daily totals rather than weekly totals, especially when I'd wager a large chunk of players have work schedules that result in them having different shift lengths, days off, number of days off, and available free time each week, while still probably having the same number of work hours and same number of play hours from week to week.
Effectively, I'd bet a large chunk of STO players work 30-45 hours, have consistent number of hours from week to week. But the distribution changes from week to week. Meaning they may be able to play 5 nights one week and 1 night the next week, while having close to the same amount of recreation time from week to week, barring holidays and other sporadic plans like dates.
I suspect all of this because it's a common fallacy in businesses with set hours. And while Cryptic has flexibility in terms of part of the hours being "come in early" or "leave late", I suspect they build things around the idea that customers have similar amounts of leisure time from day to day, have weekends free, and have the same schedule each week. And this is probably reinforced for Cryptic by higher weekend traffic.
Whereas I think if they looked at individual numbers, they'd find players have erratic schedules. A player may be on Tuesday lunch and Thursday late night and Saturday afternoon one week and may be on Monday through Saturday prime time the next.
Overall, I think you could figure out how much free time a player has to spend on STO at a a maximum and that the maximum is the same every week but distributed differently. From there, the % of their maximum players use come down to content supply, interest in goals presented, and satisfaction level. Any combination of which could get players up to their maximum. And getting a player at their maximum increases both the likelihood of C-Store/lockbox sales and the price they're willing to pay. Keeping in mind that you're judging a player against their personal maximum. (Which might be two hours for some people and sixty for others. But you want people maxed out on whatever their personal percentage is once you've determined it because someone who isn't at their personal percentage max will buy less.)
And from there, the goal is to get the median player up to their maximum. And Cryptic may be gating themselves by making goals daily rather than weekly. (And I suspect Blizzard has already done the metrics on this for MMO players in general and this is why they de-emphasized dailies and shifted big level goals over to weeklies you can do seven times in a week in any distribution rather than daily resets.)
takes a bit of figuring out but once you know how as stated many times in this thread the problem is not earning Dilith. It's the refining cap.
The way around it is to get a couple extra character slots and make alts for running STF missions and transfer the Dilith to your main.
Considering you can do that it would be in Cryptics best interest to put an option to pay zen to increase the Dilith refine cap for an account or character.
But at the same time I bet most people are not interested in making extra characters just to earn/refine dilth - which helps increase it's value.
You can get around the 8000 cap by earning on multiple toons. If you want all the dilithium for use on a single toon then just put it all up for sale on the dilithium exchange for a rate lower than the going rate (you don't want it to sell). For example, if the current exchange rate is 90 dil for 1 zen then offer 80 dil for 1 zen. Cancel all your offers and all your dilithium will go into your exchange balance where it can be withdrawn by a single toon.
Allow each player to increase their refinement limit by 2000 dil for 1000 zen. Let gold players do this a max 6 times for a 20,000 limit, allow F2P players to do it only once for 10,000 limit.
I want so so much off c store. . But even playing 5 hours a day I can not make unless I spend them 5 hours grinding. . This to me is unfair as I want to play the game not grind
Comments
PWE please give us a large refine cap limit! You starve us with huge prices and long wait times.
It is unbalanced...in Cryptic's favor, not yours.
Then, go to the dilithium exchange. Set your buy price to 25, calculate how many c-points that'd get you, put up the offer, then cancel it on your main character and pull the dilithium out.
Fanfiction! ZOMG! Read it now!
kate-wintersbite.deviantart.com/art/0x01-Treachery-293641403
yes - what you said.
Dilithium is rather easy ...
I think Cryptic ought to double the refinement limit for 500 zen for silver plays and give it for a discount for gold players.
I hope STO get's better ...
This is a fantastic idea.
VESTA MULTI-MISSION SURVEILLANCE EXPLORER - U.S.S. HOPE IN HELL NX-902013-A
Refine 24,000 dilithium a day trade the dil to your main character
Free doffs
Sell all your omega marks and processors on the two new characters so you dont have to do many STFs with them
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
WAR IS PEACE, FREEDOM IS SLAVERY, and IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH.
F2P often ends up costing a lot more than a subscription based game.
-Foundry spotlight : 2-3K dil
-Contraband : 2K dil
-eSTF : 960 dil
-trading BNP for dil, from eSTF : 1Kdil/5BNP
-Daily academy lore question : 480 dil
That's already 5-6K. Then you may have your reputation to grind, that's around 1-2K dil for both of them, per day. Also add some doffing, which will earn several hundred of dil quickly.
As you can see, it's really easy to have dil. However, the 8k limit is the real problem for many players.
It's fixed now? Last time, after 1.5 hours long Foundry mission (probably because I read it all), I only got 1440 dilithium.
That's the problem.
As to the refine rate? I'd love to see it get bumped to 10k/day or something but doubling it would be major overkill. Even so there are plenty of ways around it. Just train up your klingon alt (you do have one right?) and do 3 STF's (45 minutes) and 1 Spotlight (15-30 minutes) and you'll get 8k dilithium a day out of it... then just use the exchange to move the dilithium over to your main.
- Damn the torpedos! Full speed ahead!
I think we're now at a point where they probably would like ways of increasing returns.
But they're focusing on nudging people up towards the 8k a day cap and ignoring how many days a week the average person plays.
What I suspect is that the average person plays seriously twice a week or so and so the goal probably needs to be more like 10k dilithium an hour with a weekly cap of around 50k.
Anything else is trying to micromanage people into playing daily and just won't work.
Now... From there, what you need to do for people who play daily or play more is allow them to do something constructive beyond refined dilithium acquisition, possibly by allowing unrefined ore to be traded in for something. Effectively, make the unused ore "overtime compensation" while refined ore remains what is used as general currency and in trade for ZEN.
So for example:
Expand the Lobi store.
Make ore tradeable for Lobi at a limited rate per week. (Say, 50k ore for 50 Lobi as a one time hand-in per week.) This only opens up after hitting the weekly refinement cap.
There's a refinement cap of 50k per week that resets weekly, not daily.
People earn 10k dilithium per hour.
Under this system, I'd imagine people would hit targets more reasonably, without penalizing people who play more too severely. I suspect this would actually NOT mess up Cryptic's planned Starbase progression, which seems to me to currently be based around fleet members earning 56k a week and contributing 25% on their income to the fleet. The problem right now is that people aren't earning 56k per week and that the 25% or so average they expect people will contribute to fleets (which probably is reasonable as an average, knowing some will contribute 100% and some will contribute none) will only happen when people can comfortably earn closer to 50k a week. And people will only earn 50k a week when you allow them to earn it on their own time, including the possibility of a once a week marathon 5 hour play session and then logging out for 6 days.
The problem I suspect is looking at people's average session being 1.25-2.5 hours or so (total guess) and then acting as though they play every day. When those 2.5 hour people may play twice a week and the 1.25 hour people may play four days a week.
But I think they miss the picture by focusing on daily totals rather than weekly totals, especially when I'd wager a large chunk of players have work schedules that result in them having different shift lengths, days off, number of days off, and available free time each week, while still probably having the same number of work hours and same number of play hours from week to week.
Effectively, I'd bet a large chunk of STO players work 30-45 hours, have consistent number of hours from week to week. But the distribution changes from week to week. Meaning they may be able to play 5 nights one week and 1 night the next week, while having close to the same amount of recreation time from week to week, barring holidays and other sporadic plans like dates.
I suspect all of this because it's a common fallacy in businesses with set hours. And while Cryptic has flexibility in terms of part of the hours being "come in early" or "leave late", I suspect they build things around the idea that customers have similar amounts of leisure time from day to day, have weekends free, and have the same schedule each week. And this is probably reinforced for Cryptic by higher weekend traffic.
Whereas I think if they looked at individual numbers, they'd find players have erratic schedules. A player may be on Tuesday lunch and Thursday late night and Saturday afternoon one week and may be on Monday through Saturday prime time the next.
Overall, I think you could figure out how much free time a player has to spend on STO at a a maximum and that the maximum is the same every week but distributed differently. From there, the % of their maximum players use come down to content supply, interest in goals presented, and satisfaction level. Any combination of which could get players up to their maximum. And getting a player at their maximum increases both the likelihood of C-Store/lockbox sales and the price they're willing to pay. Keeping in mind that you're judging a player against their personal maximum. (Which might be two hours for some people and sixty for others. But you want people maxed out on whatever their personal percentage is once you've determined it because someone who isn't at their personal percentage max will buy less.)
And from there, the goal is to get the median player up to their maximum. And Cryptic may be gating themselves by making goals daily rather than weekly. (And I suspect Blizzard has already done the metrics on this for MMO players in general and this is why they de-emphasized dailies and shifted big level goals over to weeklies you can do seven times in a week in any distribution rather than daily resets.)
The way around it is to get a couple extra character slots and make alts for running STF missions and transfer the Dilith to your main.
Considering you can do that it would be in Cryptics best interest to put an option to pay zen to increase the Dilith refine cap for an account or character.
But at the same time I bet most people are not interested in making extra characters just to earn/refine dilth - which helps increase it's value.
"We are smart." - Grebnedlog
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