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Looking for a Fleet with a Tier V shipyard.
amayakitsune
Member Posts: 977 Arc User
Any fleets gotten to tier 5 yet? Im interested in working out a deal to buy the Fleet Assault Cruiser Refit.
Post edited by amayakitsune on
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Part of the first team to beat the No Win Scenario (both KDF and Fed)
It's been a long road, getting from there to here~
So lets work out a deal.
I'm not asking to get it for free. But when you tell me that I need to pay for 25 million EC for a ship that is no where near worth that much... or when you tell me that 100k dilithium is equivelant to 8 million EC or that 250 Contraband is worth 10 million EC, Im gonna tell you your prices are bad.
I was more the willing to pay some EC (ie 5 million or so) and I'm more than willing to dump Dilithium/Fleet Marks/Commodities/Doffs/whatever in to a project in return for letting me use exactly 1 Fleet Ship Provision. But not at those conversions up there... thats a losing proposition for me... I'd be paying more than the ship is worth. (For reference that ship is worth exactly 5 dollars to me, because that how much a FSM costs.)
Im an average player... I get to play 1 to 2 hours a night and sometimes more on the weekends. I've never had 25 million EC. Ive never had more than 50K dilithium. Ive only ever had 1 full stack of contraband.
The supply is high, but as far as Ive seen the demand is low. You dont charge through the roof when the demand is low, and your supply is high.
Unfortunately, that is the going rate right now. There are very few fleets that are T5. So either you pay up or wait for your fleet to get to T5. The price seems fair to me considering lockbox ships on the exchange go for 80 million + and some of the T5 ships are just as good.
I dont even think the lock box ships are woth what they are. They arent that good.
But still when youve reached Tier V Military youve gotten dozens of Fleet Ship provisions. So your supply of fleet ships is high... Ive not seen much in the way of demand for them. They arent that much better. For me its a marginal upgrade from my Assault Cruiser Refit. Not one worth 25 million EC. At most its worth 10million... and maybe some dilithium are a good exchange rate...
What you think they are worth obviously doesn't matter as people are buying them for those prices. The demand for T5 ship yard access is actually pretty high. I've seen a lot of people on here and in game asking to purchase T5 ships from the fleets that are already there. You yourself are asking for that so the demand is high enough. As for the price point...well they've already got people paying 25 million...if no one was willing to pay that much the cost would be lower.
I'm sorry you feel our prices are too high. However, what we offer is in fact a luxury good. Those tend to be priced high and don't really obey the standard rules of supply and demand. Speaking of supply and demand, however, we've already gone through about 1/4th of our ship requisitions so far, with several resupplies, on top of having quite a bit of demand.
I in particular have tons of satisfied customers with only one unsatisfied customer who, in the end, still paid for his ship and left at least satisfied with that part. Even if he did have some unflattering words for me. I make no effort to pressure people into a sale. I'd rather they be informed and happy with their purchase so I get good word of mouth rather than an unhappy customer who felt pressured into their purchase and has buyer's remorse. I've frequently sent people to other fleets offering 'only' Tier 4 shipyard access because that was all they needed to get the ship they wanted.
As far as the prices on contraband and dilithium, I can definitely confirm that 250 contraband sells for 10m. I sold a stack for that much just a few hours ago, in fact. As for dilithium, my fleet has that sorted quite well and has no real need for donations of it. I'm willing to talk to you in game and see if an arrangement can be made, if you change your mind. You can reach me in game at @atheonyirh.
Not necessarily picking one side or the other here (25 mil is more than I'd pay for a single ship as well, but thats just personal opinion), but what youre buying isn't the provision. Thats just an overhead cost. What you're paying for is access to something there just aren't many of out there, and the people who built it sunk a lot of money into doing so. They're well within their rights to say "we dropped millions of dil and billions of EC into this. If you want to use it, you need to contribute at least a fraction of what we did." 25 million is the same as about 250k dil, which even just for that T4-to-T5 transition they spent many times over. Provisioning costs are the least signifcant expense in all this.
Except "Top Tier" is little more than 10% more hull, 10% more shields and a console. Not exactly worth an additional X million resources if you ask me.
Although buying something like the Mirror Patrol Escort for 1Mil ECs is a lot more reasonable than 120K Dil for the regular version...so....
I am assuming all the fleet members that contributed to building your starbases, get a cut....
Or they use the EC to purchase commodities and Doffs necessary for other Fleet projects, taking some of the burden off of Fleet members.
Anyway, the 25 million EC sounds reasonable to me. I assume the price was set to be reasonable for someone who really wants a ship, but filters out enough people that they aren't completely swamped with demand for their ships. That's just supposition on my part, though.
How do we distribute it among all the fleet members? Well, there's only two of us as it is...
No... I'm sorry... but what Im paying for is the provision. As that is the only thing it costs the fleet I'm buying from. You can try and tell me Im paying for the ship itself... but youd be wrong... because in this transaction, the ship itself doesnt matter. Theyre charging the same for a Tier 1 Fleet ship as they are for a Tier 5. You can try and tell me I'm paying for access to the base... but only a moron pays someone to do something that costs them nothing. So I'm left with the only thing that I'm costing the fleet in question which is a single fleet provision. And dont try to make it out like I'm being a burden on the people who got their fleet to this level... they got it there... and from what I heard in game from one person... it sounds like they got it there mostly with help from people from other fleets. (Although Ive no way of confirming that... if true this is nothing more than a get rich quick scheme.)
It doesnt cost them anything to invite me to the base/invite me to the fleet. It isnt costing them any real money, as it will be costing me. In the end the only thing it costs them is a single Fleet Ship provision. And I'm more than happy to pay for the provision I'm using up. In the end I'm the only one forking over anything of value.
But a provision is worth... at most 40k dilithium. (Thats the 200k dilithium project/the 5 provisions it awards). Id also be happy to give the fleet a moderate sum of energy credits. (5 million, is a nice number). And I'd be willing to donate commodities to projects, or fleet marks, should I have them. Or Doffs, or Embassy provisions, if they dont want to spend their own fleet credits on them. But I'm only willing to pay a reasonable price. 25 million isnt reasonable, especially for a 10% upgrade to shields and hull + an extra console. 10 million EC straight is the most I would pay.
So youre part of 1st Aquarious? And theres only 2 members in the fleet? Or am I misreading...
~~~~~
As it is, for 25M EC, I'm happy to stay in my regular Assault Cruiser Refit. The Fleet skin is awesome, and the +10% shield/hull and the extra console would be nice. But not for that price. I'll wait until more fleets get to tier 5 and they cant get away with highway robbery. Heck I'll wait the 2 years it'll take my 4 man fleet to get to tier 5 if need be.
Which doesn't change the fact you are still buying a rare commodity. And nothing worth anything in life is free or cheap.
What you are basically saying is you think it's too expensive. We're telling you that it's not based on the rarity of what they are offering and the cost it put on them to have the ability to offer this in the first place. They are willing to share this rare and wonderful commodity of a Tier V shipyard with the rest of the feds in the game. That act of charity alone makes it worth the EC cost they are stating. And then the fact that they are allowing you to use THEIR shipyard and THEIR provisions (I will grant you the provisions are cheap, but to get a tier V shipyard? That's the exact opposite of cheap) means they have every right to charge whatever they deem fit. And if you ask me, 25 mil ECs for a Tier V ship is well worth it.
And their 40 mil EC deal? That's just gold.
I have personally done business with 1st Aquarius, and I purchased 4 fleet ships from them. I am very much satisfied with my investment, and expect to continue to be satisfied with any future purchases I make from them. And as you are beholden to your opinion, you can do what you will. But do NOT slander them by saying they are charging too much. If you really have an issue with it, just don't buy from them. But do NOT insult them in the process.
Its not slander... might wanna check that dictionary again. My statement was in no way false (as its an opinion) nor is it malicious, nor is it referencing any of the people in the fleet. (For reference my statement was that their prices or outrageous, exorbitant and TRIBBLE. Not their fleet, or them.)
I have an issue with something, I'm going to vocalize it. Deal with it.
This commodity is not rare... judging by the number of high tier fleet ships Ive seen. They also arent that wonderful... theyd need much better stats for that.
Youre right... getting to Tier V military isnt cheap... but if what I read today is true... then they didnt do nearly all of the work to get there and just had help from other fleets... (I make no accusations, I cant prove what I was told, only that it is what I was told, but I do believe in knowing all the sides)
And ignoring that... who pays someone for previous work theyve done of their own free will? That would be akin to someone fixing a computer for free, at cost to them, and then the next time charging a 100 dollars to swap a 20 dollar part provided by the person who would be paying them.
Im not going to pay you for you having done something that you wanted to do, and did on your own time, under your own free will. Im gonna pay you for exactly what Im going to be using. And Im not going to pay large prices when it isnt worth it.
If you are only looking for T3 or T4 shipyards, I'm pretty sure you can get it very cheaplly. If you are looking for T5 shipyard but do not want to play, well make your own fleet and grind to T5.
The two of us (contrarydecision and myself) actually did all the work in getting it up to Tier 5, aside from the assistance of a third person who drifted to a PvP fleet around Tier 2 or 3 Starbase.
It's more like someone putting in all the resources needed into developing a pharmaceutical item and then asking people to pay a price for it. The components of the item may not be expensive, but the R&D that went into it was. As was said here:
Also, your analogy is slightly flawed. You never bought a ship for free from us. It would be more akin to just the second half of that. You're welcome to replace the computer part yourself; you need the skills and knowledge of how to do that, of course. A person might just replace that part for that cost, given the materials. It's called the cost of labor, a service provided. Prices aren't based solely on goods, but on the sum of goods and services.
Alright then. We aren't asking you to pay us for doing that. We're only asking you to pay us if you want to use what we did to your benefit (namely, for a ship). No one is stopping you from creating your own T5 Shipyard.
Part of the first team to beat the No Win Scenario (both KDF and Fed)
It's been a long road, getting from there to here~
The price, again, isn't for joining the fleet. We aren't looking for members. We sell the shipyard access for when people need it, and then let them go on their way.
For more information, feel free to visit this thread.
Part of the first team to beat the No Win Scenario (both KDF and Fed)
It's been a long road, getting from there to here~
25 mil EC isn't that much honestly for a ship like a T5. It costs about 25 dollars for a ship off of the C-Store, you are offering 5 million EC which is roughly about 5 or 6 dollars.
A T5 fleet ship is definitely worth at least 15 or 20 dollars. And with the low supply of them around, that also would double that price if you ask me.
These are all really rough estimates by the way, I just woke up, don't yell it me for some bad math haha, but its still roughly close to just about what the others are saying.
If you don't want to pay, fine, go join a T3 fleet and help them to T5, then you should be able to get one fairly. If not, you'll have to pay the price.
Thankfully my fleet is almost a T5, we should reach it in a week or 2.
The dilithium was really easy, though. As a lifetime playing since beta, I had quite a few captains when the Emblem to dilithium conversion occurred.
Part of the first team to beat the No Win Scenario (both KDF and Fed)
It's been a long road, getting from there to here~
Some fleets have made an investment to get the T5 shipyard as quickly as possible, and they have a limited window of opportunity to make money from their foresight and effort. While you may not like the price, the fact remains that there isn't much in the way of compitition.
While I think you could probably find 50 guys willing to pay 1m EC for a ship for every guy willing to 25m, I doubt they want to spend their whole time selling ships.
If you want a cheaper ship, have some patience. As more shipyards come online, the cost will go down. As you said, it's not as if their stats are that much better than the T3 or T4 ships.
when you are of the opinion, that the "provision" is too expensive for a t5 shipyard vessel, feel free to search another fleet with a t5 shipyard, selling their "provisions" for less.
thats how the market works.
good luck
I attribute this problem to your poor financial planning. You shouldn't ever be spending more than you're taking in: Otherwise your accounts aren't increasing. This applies as much to real life as it does in-game.
Well, the supply isn't really high: They apparently are the only game in town. The demand is certainly there, but I'll agree their price is definitely too high: They're not making nearly as much money as they could be if they charged a lower price and had a higher sales volume as a result. Still, it's their decision to make.
To be honest? I could be making more money from this, you're right. But what would I do with it? I've earned what is, even to me, a staggering and nearly stupid amount of EC already. I'm running out of sane places to put it now, in fact. I'm a fairly simple creature, in the end. I have the things I really want in this game. None the less you don't save for today, you save for the future. There will be things I want in the future, obviously. Like when the next lockbox comes around.
In reference to what others have said, however, what those people saw were the "broken backs", as one skeptic put it to me in conversation, of alt accounts, the occasional friend wishing to donate in appreciation for being allowed use of the shipyards as we were going up the tiers, and and an arrangement with another fleet to share our respective T5 resources. Why more fleets didn't get together and specialize to the benefit of all involved I don't know. I'm still trying to find the fleet that had the sense to go T5 Science first and corner THAT market...
But, right, where was I? You're not just buying "a provision", to be blunt. As others have explained you're purchasing access to something you either will never have, in the case of a bunch of small fleet populations, or may be anywhere between weeks to months away from but don't feel like waiting for. They're not mind blowingly amazing, no. As explained, they are a luxury good. One that is priced accordingly. The fact you do not personally feel that it is worth the listed cost does not mean that others do not find the cost more than acceptable. Its also perfectly fine if you don't personally feel that they are worth that cost. Like I said before, I don't try to pressure people into sales. I let them decide for themselves. I barely even advertise now at days, I just let word of mouth bring in more customers. Word of mouth has been quite kind so far, too.
I've had customers out thank me for doing this. They gave up hope of their fleets ever reaching tier 5 even before the fleet mark changes occurred, and I've had several contact me in a panic sense then wondering if I was going to raise prices due to it. In the end we are providing a service. A luxury service. You're welcome to not want or pay for that service, but please stop trying to frame it as something unethical when it's merely something you don't deem cost effective.
As a note, I say "I" instead of "we" a lot here because while it was the two of us who got this far, I'm typically the one dealing with the sales. I'm on more often, at more normal hours, and am more willing to deal with the public and wade into Zonechat than my partner here. ;D
so you will be able to have access to all fleetships, on all your fed-toons, whether if you're want to be in a fleet or not.
sry op, where is your point about it being expensive? it's 40 bucks and you only get access and not the ship itself, yeah.
but on the other hand one c-store ship is 25 bucks (their pricing for a single t5 ship too) and you won't ever get the opportunity to get access to fleetships when you don't want to be in a fleet (for those people this deal is just like gold).
also c-store ships are way more easier to obtain, so even while there are more costs for purchasing the fleetship itself after paying for the access, stays within the given sto pricing policies (i don't bother about the math, proove me being wrong 8))...
too expensive? then just wait and decline the grateful offer till you find another way to get t5 ships.
got in contact with another fleet a while ago which sold single provisions (t4) for 4-6m ec each. referring to that you'll get your share after buying the 8th-10th ship (beside the fact you also can get t5 ships now ^^).
myself already own 5 fleetships, so i would not be far from "making profit" out of such a deal...
(2 from aquarius. so yes, i'm a satisfied customer
my suggestion: if your fleet is already t3 shipyard you may just should try out the fleet excelsior