Requesting clarification about rating foundry missions

fourxgamer

Hello folks.

I was just looking at Branflakes twitter account and found a conversation there concerning ratings and comments left on foundry missions.

https://twitter.com/PWE_BranFlakes/status/302272492318384131

Is it true that leaving a low score on a foundry mission is reason for somebody to be reported? Or are the concerned authors merely speaking of reporting the less than flattering comments that may be associated?

If it's bad that we leave a one star, what number of stars are acceptable?

I want to know so that I don't get in trouble. Do I need to go turn any poor reviews into 3 star ones?

What sorts of thoughts are permissible when reviewing a mission.

is no different than the many unmoderated posts I've seen lately from some resident, sarcastic folks on this forum. The second post is somebody voting their displeasure at the system, not an attack on an individual.

Please let us know if there is an official minimum rating we're allowed to give and not surprise us later with warnings, thank you.

This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Perfect World Entertainment Community Rules and Policies . ~BranFlakes

zorbane

I'd say the first one is pure malice. If you said that on the forum you'd get in trouble for sure.

Second one is a bit more iffy as it's a "protest" vote.

fourxgamer

So you think they're mad about the text, not the star rating?

zorbane

I'd be mad about both. Someone gave them an unfair rating without playing their mission which is supposed to reflect on the quality of that mission. Wouldn't you be mad?

EDIT: I dunno whose mission the review is for but I know I wouldn't like people saying I sit in front of my computer in my underwear eating hot pockets and not having a job. For your information I am very much employed!

fourxgamer

I'm trying to determine what is a reportable offense.

Seems like there is risk in the system, built in. If you subject your work to the scrutiny of the masses you will get every sort of critique, including unfair ones.

hippiejon

As it is my tweets you are accesing here is what I am reporting.

Every single spotlight mission on the Federation side has received the same "protest" vote rating and comment as on the bottom. This is not an actual rating, It is what can be deemed harassment.

The top one, is nothing but pure malice, and harrassment.
And actually just wrong.

It refers to my missions (plural).
I have exactly one mission published.

It refers to my 3 hour works.
The mission is designed to fit into the Foundry Challenge Rules , so comes in at about 30 minutes.

I have no problem, with one stars. None at all. You people have been one star attacking me for weeks now. Harassment, however, I am not willing to accept.

zorbane

IMO if you're giving the person a bad rating and being reasonable "this mission is boring all you do is water flowers for 30 minutes" you don't have anything to worry about.

Personally I've had plenty of 1 star ratings but if the person leaves a review saying why they think it is a poor mission well...that's just too bad for me. Obviously there's something that someone didn't like and maybe I should fix it.

In your example (the first review)...making personal attacks is always against the rules.

designationxr377

I got one like that on my spotlight today, but, I'm in the position where it didn't hurt me. But, the top one there though is particularly malicey and probably in violation of harassment beyond just the 1 star thing.

I'm going to need to stand by you in asking for some clarification on this, even if he has to tell us via PMs rather than posting it here.

twg042370

My problem is how divorced from the reality of the situation is. They're not being forced to do anything.

But you will always have someone who hates everything you do. It's one of those things you need to accept when you put it out there. But these are just dumb protest votes. And last I looked at the ratings, the five and four stars far out numbered the one stars.

Report the ones with the jackass comments and ignore the rest, I say.

fourxgamer

This person is i'm sure misrepresenting you, but that doesn't seem like harassment to me.
It seems like somebody blowing off hot air.

People can't comment more times than you have missions, there's a definite limit.

I don't see a threat there either.

I've been called all sorts of things lately that haven't all been moderated, so what is the difference here?

But you say one-starring doesn't damage you, that's what I was trying to determine. If that alone is deemed reportable I'd like to know.

fourxgamer

twg042370 wrote: »

My problem is how divorced from the reality of the situation is. They're not being forced to do anything.

But you will always have someone who hates everything you do. It's one of those things you need to accept when you put it out there. But these are just dumb protest votes. And last I looked at the ratings, the five and four stars far out numbered the one stars.

Report the ones with the jackass comments and ignore the rest, I say.

Twg, do you recall all the things you called people like me this past week or two that were way worse than that example in the photo? I have a list of them in my mind, do you remember any of them?

hippiejon

twg042370 wrote: »

Report the ones with the jackass comments and ignore the rest, I say.

Twas my intent.
And what I shall return to.
I have no intention of allowing these haters to draw me back into pointless arguments here on the forums.
Honestly, they can all continue their hate.
For my part, I shall continue to strive to find the ways and places in this game that players from many different groups can come together and create great things.

Haters gonna Hate.

Shrug.

Personally, more or less done with the whole hate thing.
It never solves anything.

So, if it makes these people feel better somehow , they can one star bandit all around my mission. I hope it brings them inner peace. But I will not accept harassment.


Peace, Love and Sunflowers
Have a Great Day !

- John

fourxgamer

Peace out bro, thanks for responding.

zorbane

fourxgamer wrote: »

But you say one-starring doesn't damage you, that's what I was trying to determine. If that alone is deemed reportable I'd like to know.

If that's all you want to know then no it isn't reportable and shouldn't be. If it's done with the intention of hurting the mission and/or the author then you could argue that maybe it could be.

The comments though can be bad!

Are you done posting in your undies from your grandma's basement?

(see what I did there? )

fourxgamer

I'm not offended, you may be right (:

I don't like racist comments, or being likened unto criminals (more slanderous things)
but I don't care if you see me as being in my undies when I type.

Wimp eating hot pockets isn't that bad really, insulting a bit like what you did.

I don't see the difference in systematically 1-starring people, and doing that while explaining why in comments. All the same to me. It's a protest, not illegal in my mind.

hippiejon

You want to know what I actually think about all this, since I haven't actually commented on it elsewhere. Go listen to Foundry Roundtable.

http://starbaseugc.com/index.php/trailers/essential-viewing/the-foundry-roundtable-episode-2-electric-boogaloo/

I'm pretty much done with the forums.
There is no way here to actually have people listen.
Aside from one very angry post well over a month ago, I have called for compromise, and how do we find solutions here that work for everyone, but one angry post demonized me in someone's eyes and they cried my name loudly and attributed to me, all sorts of things. Once that happened, anything I have to say here is useless, because all someone sees is my name and instantly, I am that guy who made an angry post before he'd had his cup of Earl Grey that day. Doesn't matter what I'm actually saying.

So, I'm done here with the forums.
If anyone gives a hoot about my opinions. (Hint : I bet you end up NOT hating me as much as you think you do, then have a listen to the new podcast. Write feedback. Be constructive. Let's have real conversations.)

Peace, Love and Sunflowers
- John

fourxgamer

Good show, I listened to it. You suggested fleet marks be added back somewhere else and not be removed entirely, thanks for that. Listened to the first one as well.

I'm just concerned about what I saw on twitter, and my understanding of what is reportable and/or harassment.




EDIT: If someone is going around picking up Foundry missions, dropping them instantly, 1 starring them out of spite, and leaving protesting comments, this would not be right and should be reported to a GM. As the GM investigates, this would be evident by seeing the same name with review timestamps around the same date/time over and over. I'm not sure what actions the GM would take, whether it was to remove the comment and/or ask the player to stop, but they should at least be aware. One star ratings and comments from someone who didn't like the mission is fine, that's why there is a review/comment/rate process, but our GMs can easily tell whether someone has not played the mission as they would see comments only a matter of minutes later on different mission reviews. Someone doesn't have to play the mission to review, maybe they found a bug and had to drop, but if you saw the same name saying the same comment in multiple missions within a few minutes within each other, I think we can all agree that something wouldn't be quite right. ~BranFlakes

hippiejon

fourxgamer wrote: »

I'm just concerned about what I saw on twitter, and my understanding of what is reportable and/or harassment.

So, here's the way I see it.
You may see something as harassment, that I do not.
Vice Versa.
I may see something as harassing that you do not.

My belief is that if you find something harassing, you should report it, and allow the Cryptic and PWE employees make decisions. It's what they get paid for, and in my world, not worth getting my shoulder muscles in a bunch worrying about past reporting it.

May be they agree that it is harassing, may be they do not.
The proper thing to do in my opinion is to simply pass it on to them, and let them decide.

shrug.

Just my opinion.


Peace
- John

fourxgamer

I guess I'm just used to terms like harassment having very solid, unwavering definitions.
I agree people will interpret things differently though.

I reported something I thought (perhaps imagined) was a racist post that moderators didn't agree with I suppose. It offended me and my significant other, but nobody else I guess.
So you're dead on there.

I was just thinking, I could one-star you and say, "too much dialogue", "too much watering flowers", "too long" etc. and be totally wrong and you'd have no recourse right?

So what's the difference if I'm totally wrong associating you with a nerf, or aggressively involving devs in foundry matters. Do we need to succeed at a test or a survey before we can cast a rating?

This is why I suggested you more prominent authors just find a way to rate yourselves and turn off public ratings. I don't have to be allowed to rate you, but if you leave the option, there's a good chance I will. Let your success be determined by number of plays or Branflakes or Kestrel or somebody. If it's open to the public, get used to crazy stuff.

Hey, maybe have two ratings. Authors' choice and public. I tried to suggest this to you a week ago but you told me I was being wacko and venomous. Authors would have more time to do that than Branflakes by himself. Pick 5 or 10 a week, add them to your roster and let them vote too. That happens in the baseball all-star games for example, and coaches/sportswriters' polls.

Authors already in could nominate or sponsor new additions. I think that'd be cool. Have a drop down for both ratings. Good stories would NEVER be buried, right?

hippiejon

fourxgamer wrote: »

If it's open to the public, get used to crazy stuff.

Agreed. The world is a very crazy place.
It is my belief that the first "review" in the image you linked went into the territory or personal, harassing attack, which made it reportable. So it was reported.
The other was part of a systematic harassment of any foundry mission/author in the Spotlight (In my Opinion) Which made it reportable, so I reported it.
The Cryptic/PWE employees can decide what to do with from there.

fourxgamer wrote: »

Hey, maybe have two ratings. Authors' choice and public. I tried to suggest this to you a week ago but you told me I was being wacko and venomous. Authors would have more time to do that than Branflakes by himself. Pick 5 or 10 a week, add them to your roster and let them vote too. That happens in the baseball all-star games for example, and coaches/sportswriters' polls.

Authors already in could nominate or sponsor new additions. I think that'd be cool. Have a drop down for both ratings. Good stories would NEVER be buried, right?

My personal opinion, is that the current "rating" system is a pile of garbage.
1 to 5 Stars or lollipops or Birthday Cakes or Corvettes or whatever.
Any system where the rating is 1 to 5 will always fail to do anything but draw everything being judged within that system to slowly circle towards 3.

3 has amazing gravity apparently.

What we need is a well thought out and robust tagging and searching system for missions.

The primary reason I am against anything that brings in a concept of "authors choice" is that it just adds a further layer of "rating" to things.

Ratings are a whole other conversation, but i think you begin to see why I don't care about 1 star or 5 star or blue star or red star. None of it matters. A truly working tag and search system along with a UI overhaul are what I think the Foundry can most benefit from.

Seriously,
I'm out of here.
The forums scare me these days :P


Peace
- John

nagorak

I think that any review is basically fair game. Just give it a couple of weeks and the furor will die down. It's not really worth the effort to go to the Foundry just to downrate missions, and only a small population will do that.

twg042370

fourxgamer wrote: »

Twg, do you recall all the things you called people like me this past week or two that were way worse than that example in the photo? I have a list of them in my mind, do you remember any of them?

I'd like to give this a proper response but I've promised to stop.

neoakiraii

Just leave them be they, will tire themselves out like this

http://vimeo.com/24163393

crusader2007

IMO this is "Freedom" and we all have a right to say/rate what is in our minds without insulting others in a repectful manner.

This is still a virtual game after all but some take everything so darn serious. Chill out dudes but if you think people are doing this as "revenge"...why bring in BIG BROTHER into a game...do you want a state of continuing censorship and overburden controls and balances? This is not China or North Korea...it's STO...as long as we all respect each other and protest rationally why re-invent the wheel...After all ....its just a game :cool:

drogyn1701

All "free" societies make distinctions about harassing speech. And on these boards and especially in the game, Cryptic can decide what is harassing speech and what is not. If you see something you think is harassment anywhere in the game or on the boards, it should be reported to the proper authorities and they will take what action they think is appropriate.