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Dominion Dreadnought vs. Dominion Cruiser
magnumoftheblack
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
Has anyone run the numbers between the two dominion ships? Which is more viable for PVP? Just doesn't make sense to buy a ship that is not PVP worthy.
Post edited by magnumoftheblack on
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jemhadar Dreadnought carrier turns and moves to slow to take advantage of its Cmdr and Lt tac stations and doesn't have enough healing for a ship like that to survive.
Jemhadar Heavy escort carrier has worst turn of any escort and also bad boff layout for an escort so probably won't fare to much better. It has Cmdr tac and lt universal, but if you use the universal as tac it will only have ensign sci.
Sort of like the steamrunner, people thought it was cool at first, but only having ensign sci really limited it and now it isn't even seen in pvp much.
PaxOttomana: gawd mirror event is like fighting a tsi premade, they keep comin and comin!
I have to disagree. The Dreadnought Carrier only has enough heals for an Escort, with the penalties of a being a carrier. It's turn rate is only 1 point better at base then the Vor'quv, and I think .5 better then the Recluse. That sort of a disadvantage is just not going to win it any popularity contests.
Not to mention you have to be either Super Lucky, or Super Rich, or both, to have both the JHDC + JHAS just for the new Pets. I'd say that the JHHEC is a better ship then the JHDC. But of course that's my opinion.
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
1 Commander Tactical, 1 Lieutenant Tactical, 1 Lieutenant Commander Engineering, 1 Lieutenant Commander Science
Be perfect for no win scenario! Have gravity well and enough bite to justify having such low turn rate. I would actually want the dreadnaught if it had that layout and got rid of the stupid ensign slot to get a second lt com.
The JHEC isn't an escort. Its a 7 weapon flight deck cruiser which gave up a weapon slot to have enough turn to put the Excelsior to shame. Load it with single cannons, slot a sci in that universal, carry basic eng necessities and paint the town pink with your CRF3.
I do like the JDNC as well. I do wish it didn't have so many tac slots!! 5 is enough. I find myself forced to carry a tric mine and getting DP3. Which of course is pretty damn powerful by itself.
The big big difference is that extra weapon. It is the only 7 weapon 2bay carrier the Feds have. I think that alone makes it better than a Recluse. In my book, it is giving up VM for an extra weapon to BFAW from so YMMV.
Btw, anyone else humming Imperial March while taking the JDNC for a shakedown cruise? I was talking through a rebreathing mask to my fleetmates for a while since I got mine this afternoon.
"Last Engage! Magical Girl Origami-san" is in print! Now with three times more rainbows.
Support the "Armored Unicorn" vehicle initiative today!
Thanks for Harajuku. Now let's get a real "Magical Girl" costume!
how is that unfortunate? lol *flys off in said MUPE*
Well I was hoping that the new lockbox ship would have had slightly better Boff layouts. the rest was awesome. I love the idea of a team attack pattern buff but I wouldn't want to use these ship. I like my bug ship a whole lot better then these. I even like the free breen ship more then these. I have an mvam though and this ship opens up a lot more options including more visualizations for the Fleet Advance Escort.
I was not excepting the mirror ship to be the best prize. That was a bit of a let down but that just means for a few hundred ec I just got a lot of option for my mvam. That is nice. The other sad part is that the dominion ships aren't second place either. the new warhead on my peregrine fighter is.
This means this lock box is the cheapest one for me.
It has not endearing qualities whatsoever, other than looking awesome.
The only thing I can describe it as, is that is resembles one of those second world war destroyers that get towed-to-sea to serve as targets for the navy.
It cannot turn so its main armaments are useless, even with a purple MXII RCS console. More one cannot afford else its hull will be paper thin.
It cannot heal. There is just no way this thing can be made viable for PvP IMO.
Two or more focused targets on it, the ship is overcome relatively quickly.
TT, CVS1 or APD, CRF2, APO3
EptA, Aux2batt1, ES2 or Dem2
ET, Aux2batt1
EptW or EPTS1, Epts2 or RSP1 or even Aux2Damp (10 sec shared cooldown w/Aux2batt)
HE1
Shield Batt, Eng Batt
It has Eng self Tank Captain abilities to go w/mini Tac and Sci captain abilities. The Lt Uni allows flexibility to slot more offensive Tac Torp/BO2 or Sci Debuff/Repair abilities as needed. It can be damaged focused w/Dem2, team rep w/ES2. Still have EPST2 or RSP1 for it's own shield defenses. With the rep system repair bonuses you don't need as many self shield repairs.
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
I've always felt any ship with native subsystem targeting should have one native beam to work with it, but that's just my opinion.
I can't say much about either to be honest.
The Dominion Dreadnought is about as much use for PvP as the other slow turning carriers, but it'll be awesome in STFs and other PvE contentwhere you can happily equipp it with DHCs. The dominion fighters are the best DPS pets in the game, no doubt. Phaser procs, cannon rapid fire 2, quantum torps and beam overloads will wreck NPCs.
The Dominion Heavy Escort Carrier seems to be fine for PvP *IF* properly set up. With the dominion fighters it'll be quite powerful, more so then the FHEC
Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Must admit starting to wonder that myself.
The bottom line is this. For the main flagship of the Dominion, I was not expecting a ship this fragile.
That's another of STO paradox. The bigger and more powerful the ship should be (judging by TV series), the more TRIBBLE it usually is :P
It's Polaron procs, and the Jem'Hadar fighters suck, and the Jem'Hadar attack ship fighters are bugged to hell and do weak sauce dmg, if and when they decide to attack.
1 look at its station setup shows that it would literally be the most fragile thing at end game
Run a Lt. Eng and you're really a squishier HEC (I suppose you could run double RSP, you'll prob need it lol). A Lt. Sci and you're gonna struggle as well (though I like those one better, you could go TSS2/1, HE1, EPtS1/RSP1/EPtS3 or something). It's basically an escort without the Def bonus or the speed and turn to get out of arc.
I don't wanna pass judgment too fast because I'm sure someone might be able to bring out its strengths or come up with a build, but really I just can't see it working. Slow, massive ships can't do anything with a Com. Tac that justifies it being on a team. APO has poor scaling, you can't make cannons work and beam skills stop at Lt. Com, so.
vids and guides and stuff
[9:52] [Zone #11] Neal@trapper1532: im a omega force shadow oprative and a maoc elite camander and here i am taking water samples
for something completely unable to avoide damage, thats pitiful. an escort with those stations could make great use out of them to keep itself alive, because its also dealing a large amount of damage in return, has a high innate defense score, and can fly and turn very quickly, allowing it to avoid incoming fire. this thing cant do anything about an escort camping on its tail and shooting it till it runs out of defensive options and heals
all ships can tank just as well as each other, because they all are using the same abilities. the difference is how long they can keep up their survival. this carrier is going to run out of 'invulnerability' much quicker then anything else in its weight class.
escorts do fine with the lower number of heals because they have high defense and damage avoidance ability. the jem carrier has nether large numbers of tanking abilitys to cycle and fall back on, nor any damage avoidance ability. its screwed.
it has a chance not to suck if that LT tac was ether eng or sci, but since its tac its a non starter. a pve toy. the only time it can use all that tac is when its using DHCs on imoble STF targets
I ran the ship with EptS I, RSP I, EptS III and used the remaining for HE I, and TSS.
It's ability to withstand the opening salvo is quickly depleted, even against a single escort.
By the time that the escort has recovered preparing the secondary attack, that's when things start to come apart for this ships defenses. Its the gap between the CD of EptS III with little to fall back on, and hardly any maneuverability to speak of.
By this stage of the attack you are fighting rear-guard action only, with possibly only 3 weapons trained-on-target. Throughout all engagements, I felt like I was continually fighting only defensively.
As soon as another ship appeared, I knew I was doomed every single time.
At no point did the pets I was launching seem to deter the attack, or even frustrate the attacker enough to break off his attack. I was the only one breaking a sweat, amid the thunderous "LOL" in zone chat.
Sounds strangely familiar....eh, the Galaxy-X !
EPtA leaves a gap in your cycle a mile wide, one that TSS1 alone won't patch up.
vids and guides and stuff
[9:52] [Zone #11] Neal@trapper1532: im a omega force shadow oprative and a maoc elite camander and here i am taking water samples
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
EPtA1, RSP1, EPtS3
TSS1, HE2
HE1
with 2 or 3 purple damage control doffs. with only 3 eng powers, you have no choice really, and you need your aux heals as strong as possible.
i could keep a much quicker excelsior or vorcha alive alright with that, but i would also have AtB with tech doffs putting all that at global. a more support heavy cruiser would also run AtS3 and have ether ET2 or ET3, and TSS2 instead of HE2 with all that hull heal coverage too. and itcould run up to 2 ES, or have an EWP on there. so not only does it lack room for half the defensive options, its got next to no support capability. if anyone shoots at it it wont have anything to spare.
Hence why the JHAS is the most powerful escort in the game despite four of them being required to take down one Galaxy (with a suicide attack!) in the show...
Dread Bug w/ 6 turn:
X, X, X, X
X, X
X, X, X
X, X
X
...or...
X, X, X, X
X, X
X, X, X
X, X
X
vs. Assault Refit/Fleet Assault w/ 7 turn:
X, X, X
X
X, X, X, X
X, X
X, X
As for consoles, both the Fleet Assault and Dread Bug are 4/4/2 (while the Refit is 3/4/2).
Assault sports .15 Impulse.
Dread Bug .17 Impulse.
Assault sports 30 Inertia.
What does the Dread Bug have though?
Also, the Dread Bug's at 45k hull with a 1.15 shield modifier vs. 42.9k/1.1 for the Fleet and 39k/1 for the Refit...
For comparison - Heavy Bug:
37.5k Hull
1 Shield Modifier
12 Turn
.2 Impulse
? Inertia
4/4/2 consoles
X, X, X, X
X, X, X
X, X
X
X, X
So, you could basically do the same layout on the Dread and Heavy:
X, X, X, X
X, X
X, X, X
X, X
X
The Dread would have +7.5k hull and a +1.15 shield modifier (as well as +1 hangar, +5 aux power).
The Heavy would have +6 turn and +0.03 impulse (as well as +5 shield power).
Inertia?
Which would you say has better survivability?
Then again, folks may want the following Heavy layout for the Dread:
X, X, X, X
X, X, X
X, X
X, X
X
but, the thing cant go on with that station setup and ever show its face in pvp. but you cant tac away tac from it due to pve'ers. hmmm
make the other LT station universal too, TRIBBLE it. then its pvp usable, and stf ready.