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STFs And You: Don't Be This Team
themarie
Member Posts: 1,055 Arc User
Three STF in a row tonight failed.
Normally I can do three STF in one evening without failing on elite. These would be PUGs. I fly a variety of builds... all geared twords DPS and surviving plasma burn.
That said I know what works and does not work. All-cruiser teams with blue-novelty-phasers and FAW do not work. Boarding Party is useless. Spamming turrets everywhere helps nothing. Torpedo spread is a hazard.
Three PUG teams on elite. All cruisers. All with beam FAW, at least one ship with blue phasers per group if not more. Everyone spamming torpedo spread and boarding party shuttles... Not a single crowd-control effort to be seen.
I expect better than this on Elite Pugs. This is the kind of nonsense that I expect on NORMAL level. Losing one out of three STF wouldn't be all that bad, but to lose THREE because THREE groups of random people all decided to bring out griefing cruisers?
I expect better than that from the community at large. I really do. Lets get things clear right now: Don't bring novelty builds into Elite STF. Blue phasers have NO place in Elite STF. Learn to build correctly and don't come in planning to play "little tommy fool-about."
It's a good thing there are policies against shaming bad players, the list would have quite a few new members tonight.
Normally I can do three STF in one evening without failing on elite. These would be PUGs. I fly a variety of builds... all geared twords DPS and surviving plasma burn.
That said I know what works and does not work. All-cruiser teams with blue-novelty-phasers and FAW do not work. Boarding Party is useless. Spamming turrets everywhere helps nothing. Torpedo spread is a hazard.
Three PUG teams on elite. All cruisers. All with beam FAW, at least one ship with blue phasers per group if not more. Everyone spamming torpedo spread and boarding party shuttles... Not a single crowd-control effort to be seen.
I expect better than this on Elite Pugs. This is the kind of nonsense that I expect on NORMAL level. Losing one out of three STF wouldn't be all that bad, but to lose THREE because THREE groups of random people all decided to bring out griefing cruisers?
I expect better than that from the community at large. I really do. Lets get things clear right now: Don't bring novelty builds into Elite STF. Blue phasers have NO place in Elite STF. Learn to build correctly and don't come in planning to play "little tommy fool-about."
It's a good thing there are policies against shaming bad players, the list would have quite a few new members tonight.
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[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
But these fools have been a problem for a year now and the rep system as made them come out of the woodwork. The worst part about all of it, the fools justify their builds by saying "But Elites reward more marks!!". Yeah they do...but if you can't run with the pack keep in the dog house. Wish players had to play 50 or so games in normal before they could enter an elite.
I have get a little joy out of this though. Its going to be a very long and painful grind up the rep system for them.:D Wish they didn't have to take others with them though.
What I have a problem with are these stupid-obvious clown-car builds that are everywhere.
Some of us take this game seriously, and don't appreciate folks who come in, blow a generator, aggro everything then leave.
Cryptic needs to appoint some community game-masters so we can start cracking down on the worst of the griefing.
I get people in Pugs commenting on it.
Yet half the time they can't follow it.
Can you win the Optional in an STF without using it? yes, there's a small chance.
Will you win all the time using it? YES!
They should just make it so anyone blowing something out of sequence is automatically tagged for PvP for the rest of the team and locked from leaving.
I would pay Cryptic $10,000,000 for a PVP Punishment Mode.
Sorry folks, no sympathy here...
They are called 'P U G S' for a reason.
I do nothing but PUGS and have had many an occasion where we failed...
But I don't get all bent outta shape over it.
I just recently started doing Elite PUGS and so far I've found I can hold my own, but I don't hold anybody else up to a higher standard..., just because I can do so.
If it bothers you so much...
DON'T DO PUGS.
It's really that simple.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I see what you did there...:)
http://youtu.be/8Q51Q7N2ANk?t=30s
I'm older..., this is more apropos...
:P
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I just don't get why people keep doing PUGs if it bothers them so much. Because it's faster to get a team perhaps? You have to ask yourself if speed and convenience is worth the gamble of ending up on a sub-par team.
Personally, I run ISEs through the reputation event so I am guaranteed 75 Omega Marks. If it takes more than 30 minutes to finish, then people have already bailed on it or it should be done soon.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The o3 - Killed you good
Question: if you can build a decent ship with "green consoles and weapons".... what, exactly, is the problem with blue phasers that makes the use of them a "stupid-obivious clown-car build"?
Honestly curious, I've not heard any particulars about those weapons. (And, yeah - my pre-Breen-ship tac-captain cruiser had one blue phaser on the back, because, as far as I could see, it was another phaser I could use, to go with my non-rainbow, all-phaser, all-phaser console, build. So I'd like to know what glaring mistake I was accidentally making. So I can be more informed, and not make similar mistakes in the future.)
We were tasked with defending the transwarp gate he runs off and starts flying around the map from the start at full impulse then when the battle starts instead of coming to the transwarp gate with his team mates he helps the four guys at the industrial fabricator. He finally came to transwarp gate after we were the last ones still fighting with only 3 men. After the base defense and we went back to the warp gate for round III he ran yet again to the industrial fabricator and he came in to help his team mates just as we blew the last ship. No one said anything but I commented in zone chat for him and all to hear "Welcome to the Party, seems your a little late champ"
Those are the kinds of people you dont want to be when it comes to teams. You dont want to be the person that leaves your team hanging high and dry even after a team mate (me) said that we have this facility to defend return here for round III.
As far as the blue phasers goes, I have them on my Constitution Refit and I even went one on one with a fleet member to try out a new build he did on his Odyssey, I constantly had his Reman Prototype shields failing between the three blue retrofit phasers Mk XI and the Mk XI transphasic torpedo. Point is though, it doesnt matter what weapon you are using they are all useable. When it comes to large battles such as the STF I mentioned above its more of a team effort and everyone working together. You cant expect one ship to bear the brunt of the battle and carry everyone. I dont know how many times Ive kept the siege dreadnought busy long enough till the rest of my team listened to me and helped me to put fire power on him. Im not using cheap weapons either they dish out quite a bit of damage but one ship isnt going to always be a one man show and those that think everyone can be a one man show is fooling themselves.
Especially with the STF cool down.
However due to the timezone differences getting together enough players is a challenge sometimes.
Elite PUGs are normally not this bad, either we've got a fresh batch of stupid that needs to be trained or we got a bunch of griefers running around.
When I refer to a clown-car build I mean flying in dropping mines wheather or not you are near anything, firing off various random abilities just for the lightshow and aggro-ing everything with spread and FAW before leaving the match. I've seen this far too often lately, it's like someone's cat is mashing buttons on the keyboard.
If I see this kind of behavior again over multiple STFs I am going to assume we have a coordinated trolling-griefing group on the loose and I will take the step of spreading names among the various fleets I hold membership in.... and also file tickets.
We'll see, hopefully it dies down a bit over the next few days, I don't want to get nasty if I can avoid it.
You *can* avoid it; it is called a choice. When one person or group of people start thinking that it is okay to publically shame people without having all of the facts, it usually comes back to bite them in the butt. Hard.
Have you ever exchanged tells with any of those people about whom you complain? I doubt everyone was in the match just to grief.
It's the high and mighty I-am-better-than-everyone-else types that run people away from the game. You yourself said that you take this game seriously, and I would almost say a little too much, mate. If someone not building their ship to your specifications cannot play with you without the possibility of being pubically humiliated, then perhaps you need to take a step back and get some priorities in order. This is a video game; it is not real life! If you have to take the game that seriously, then do as someone else said: Run with your fleet. You could even join the STF chat channels that are geared specifically towards people who run elites often. Start building a list of friends that you can team with when others' on your fleet seem to be absent. There are loads of possibilities here.
Don't misunderstand, I, too, get upset when there are idiots in a PuG, but unless the entire team is uselss you can generally save the match easily enough. Do you ever explain the generators or do you assume that people know exactly what to do? Some people may be playing with their chat tab closed, it does happen. Some may not have english as their native language and may not understand you. Some people may also want specific powers for concept or theme, and some powers tend to stay "trigger" happy all on their own, which in itself can be frustrating. Yes, there are griefers out there, but TRIBBLE also happens. We thought we had a griefer on one of our last ISE's, afterwards they sent my husband a tell, they had no idea what they had done wrong. They were having difficulty with their chat, I sometimes do as well... I won't see a single bit of text for the whole match, but my husband might. This person saw a couple lines of text and didn't know about the generator rule, but after the match we actually talked to them instead of running to the forums to scream foul and griefer. Someone actually learned a little something about that STF that day, and it helped them become a better player.
Long story short: If you cannot put up with less-than-perfect players, then do not join PuG's. Period. If you have to have everything just so, with the best players and the best ships, then form your own groups.
That said...I will...um...confess to literally having had my cat run across my keyboard during Borg Red Alerts (which are the only way I will ever see an Omega Mark...at least people in Borg Red Alerts don't generally treat each other like trash even when they're horrible at it and we end up losing). She cannot seem to understand the rule "lap=OK, keyboard=BAD."
So I would make the following two points: Attitudes like what I am seeing here are the reason I don't even ATTEMPT to learn how to do STFs. And secondly, you DON'T always know what's happening on the other side of the keyboard and who really DOES have kids, crazy cats, or other things happening IRL, so don't be so hasty to judge and ostracize.
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Also, it might take a bit longer to beat ISE with 5 cruisers, but it is doable if everyone does their part. But it is a PuG. If you want to specify which ships and classes are used, form your own team.
The biggest problem is not the weapons loadout. It is that people do not know the proper strategy. Since you obviously know it, try to teach them. Belittling them does not help.
Great post, and I agree. My husband and I (and fleet) run elites often, you are more than welcome to join us at any time. Drop me a PM and I will send you my global name if you like. I am *far* from perfect, nor do I have the most elite ship that money can buy, but I know the ropes well enough and if someone makes a mistake...? It isn't the end of the world. I think I have failed 1 STF in the last 6 months due to a team that truly did have no hope going for it.
Hundreds of those runs have been with friends and fleet mates. Hundreds more with pugs.
There are good pugs and bad pugs. The only optional I have never compleated with a pug is infected ground.
The longest an STF has ever taken me with a pug was two hours (cure ground elite, every one but me and one other quite right at the begining. Fortunatly I had a medic kit and she had a fabrication one. She also had doffs that let her call in 3 morters at a time. Without those we never could have taken the forcfield gates down without at least one more player)
On another ocasion in KA space, I was guarding probes on the right while the rest of the team went left. They were so bad at stopping probes and doing damage that in addition to guarding against probes on my side I was able to take out all the generators, both cubes and both transformers and get my gate down to 50% hull before they finished popping their 2nd transformer. (If any one else wants to be able to do all this solo, I highly recomend an escort, with emergency to engines and tractor repulsers. I also recomend that you dont suck. Also try to do this on a day when the random number generator likes you.)
So do I recomend pugs? Sure why not. Just accept that when things go wrong its your fault for clicking 'engage' when you knew that you might get stuck with an ideot team.
Think of it this way. If you dont play with pugs, you wont ever get to boast about how you did cure ground with just one other person. You will never know if you could take an entire side of KA on your own.
Pugs may not be good for the marks, but they can be good for your ego.
Now boarding party is another story...
This is not about an elitist mentality, but I seriously advocate a kick option and those recommeded 24hrs ban.
First and foremost, there is nothing wrong with Blue Phasers, especially the ones from the Devidian missions. They are cheaper but can be effective with the right setups.
We prefer more quality Very rare weaponry - but we shouldn't frown upon those using blue phaser or uncommon weapons. As long as they have a decent build and decent skill layout.
Lasty:
What do you expect from a PUG in Elite, granted when I personally PUG'ed, I tend to get a very good and decent team - Then there are those moments where the OP has described.
I do not get frustrated nor yell at the masses, simply because I know I am dealing with a PUG team.
ANYONE who can't do a STF on common white gear (mk x) is not ready for elite
I've played enough elite stf's to agree that there are lots of people in it, that don't know what they are doing. Players that should do normal stf's but they are doing elite, because they are hoping that the others are damn good, so they can take a sip of the bigger loot and awards.
I'm not getting raged about it at all, sometimes i say LOL behind my desktop when i'm seeing the actions that some people do but never, NEVER, i get angry or so because of it.
Also the ten percent rule, sometimes i use it, sometimes i don't. It depends on how the team is. If the team is mostly cruisers, yes, but if we got a good mix of cruisers, escort and science, there is a chance we go rambo on it and we normally make it perfectly through.
the scaling version (comes with TOS enterprise) is more than enough for a STF in the hands of any even slightly skilled captain (if you need Mk XII purple ninja death rays you are NOT ready for STF's)
Remember a Decent player in a Captain level vessel with its ORIGINAL weapons can do a normal level stf (with optionals)
so anyone complaining about a lack of ninja death rays needs practice
A new person makes use of team chat, asks questions, learns from mistakes and improves for the next run. There is a difference between "oops I let a probe by" in KASE or "oh no I blew up a gen too soon" in ISE... and coming in with a deliberately poor build, aggroing everything, ignoring /tells and scooting then the optional fails.
None of the people I complain about respond to communication. Communications like "10% rule, please. Everyone know what that means?" Or "Left side first, stick together please."
The second one. I'm in a PUG one of the other members punches that into chat. We end up with two people in clown-car builds on the RIGHT side blowing generators, who left as soon as the optional failed.
I guess... that means I'm an elitist jerk? Simply asking people to play right makes me an elitist jerk.
I see how that works. Clearly expecting a team to function as a team and not grief makes me high-and-mighty.
I suspect you are up to it.
My first STF we had three first timers. Luckily we all used the chat function and mentioned this, and one of the other players explained the steps and what was the aim and the easy way to achieve it.
We did KA in about 10 mins.
So find someone who will explain and go do it.