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Don't you think that guns on our backs is against startrek spirit?

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  • tlamstriketlamstrike Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    Look closely the the picture. The 16s aren't charged. (no magazines). Also there is no combat armor evident. Which leads me to believe these women are probably recruits or trainees on a post, somewhere.
    On their belts you will notice they are carrying a Magazine, that leads me to believe that in civilian area they are not allowed to go around with loaded weapons.

    The Israelis have a conscription system and large reserves so they might be trainees or are some kind of secondary rear-guard troops.
    More to the point, Israel is basically a nation under seige, and therefore a combat zone. Any full time soldiery on duty there, probably would be fully loaded out for combat.
    As I understand it, it is not uncommon for IDF troops (and many civilians) to always be armed; even while off duty, hence the lack of body armor in that photo.
    It's a different story in most other metropolitan areas. Your local armed forces recruiter for example, is, in most cases, unarmed. Your local constabulary probably keeps the peace, with holstered pistols, as opposed to assault rifles slung across their backs.
    Depends on where you live. I live in a modest sized city where the police always have a sidearm and a 12 gauge near by. Some of my fleetmates are LEOs and have told me in some cities (namely larges ones down south) patrolman carry automatic carbines or assault weapons they themselves have purchased, although that is probably uncommon.

    EDIT: I should also mention that in the UK police on patrol around certain facilities (like Heathrow Airport) carry submachine guns.
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  • liquidacid29liquidacid29 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    silly women carrying rifles low slung on their back barrel down... tisk tisk... someone should really teach them the proper way...
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  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    tlamstrike wrote: »
    On their belts you will notice they are carrying a Magazine, that leads me to believe that in civilian area they are not allowed to go around with loaded weapons.

    The Israelis have a conscription system and large reserves so they might be trainees or are some kind of secondary rear-guard troops.
    I think it's a simple matter of prudence. If your gun isn't loaded, you can't accidentally shoot someone. It only a takes a few seconds to load it if you know what you're doing.

    But yeah, Israel, like a lot of other countries, has a system where everyone is automatically enlisted at a certain age. The mandatory enlistment isn't more than a few years, but for them it's part of growing up.
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  • linyivelinyive Member Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    Even though "Star Trek: Online" has "Star Trek" elements, the majority of the game's future tech has no aesthetic relation to one and other. Putting a gun on the avatar's back is not a game changer. Since Perfect World/Cryptic decided to abandon certain design aesthetics, "Star Trek: Online" has become a patch work of inconsistent design elements. Everything is stitched together into an incoherent mess.

    "Star Trek: Online" is fun to play, but it doesn't have any rhythm.
  • unangbangkayunangbangkay Member Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    kimmera wrote: »
    ROFL.

    Because capitalism is a concept associated with Asia, and not with North America at all. Good one :).

    I know, right? This "grr grr Asia Asia" sentiment pervading the west is borderline racist. Can you believe the pubs Wargaming.net was shopping World of Tanks to initially said that their concept was "cheap Asian trash"?

    Well eff those guys, Wargaming.net is now huge, gre 1000% and is making money hand over fist. And now the westerners are struggling to catch up and making a hash of it doing so.

    I'm not saying that the Asian F2P pioneers were perfect, early F2P games (Asian ones, mostly) were awful grinds, but a success is a success, and IMO Cryptic's F2P entries are far less egregious than those initial efforts.

    I'm paid for lifetime, have been playing since day one, and I have to say, I have never enjoyed STO more than since it went F2P. It's not perfect, but it's better now than at any time than you had to pay for it, IMO. If that is the "price" of F2P, so be it.
  • unangbangkayunangbangkay Member Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    cptvanor wrote: »
    You are also apparently quite clueless.

    They seldom used rifles of any sort in any of the ST shows, and on the rare cases they did, I can't think of a single case in which they weren't either holding them or had them sit down somewhere.

    However IRL the most common and in fact about the only way to carry a rifle when you want your hands free, is slung across your back. If anyone in a ST show were to ever sling a rifle they'd do it the same way it's done in the game.

    PWE has done nothing that is out side of the "spirit of Star Trek", they simply put the mostly logical way of caring a rifle other then in your hands, into the game.

    Well, most of the time most people carrying rifles in Star Trek were going to use them in VERY short order. Whenever they broke out the big guns it was because the Borg were ten steps from assimilating their asses, so they had no time or reason to sling 'em.

    These days, since the world of STO is at war most of the time, and both Starfleet and the KDF have been heavily militarized, carrying weapons around 24/7 is natural.

    Me, I like to believe they sling the weapons because they can't afford to waste energy storing everything in Elite Force-style "Transporter Buffers" anymore. Only store the spare in the buffer, carry the other one, right?
  • linyivelinyive Member Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    I know, right? This "grr grr Asia Asia" sentiment pervading the west is borderline racist. Can you believe the pubs Wargaming.net was shopping World of Tanks to initially said that their concept was "cheap Asian trash"?
    People throw around that word a little too much. As more and more people begin to abuse the word, everyone else is starting to look the other way. It has become a "boy who cried wolf" phenomenon. If you do not agree with someone's opinion, please hold back from calling them a racist.
  • kimmerakimmera Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    linyive wrote: »
    People throw around that word a little too much. As more and more people begin to abuse the word, everyone else is starting to look the other way. It has become a "boy who cried wolf" phenomenon. If you do not agree with someone's opinion, please hold back from calling them a racist.

    Getting very off topic here, but if I am understanding you correctly, it is fair game to generalize and ascribe every manner of ill to any given foreign region, but criticizing that to the same level is out of line?

    The 'r word' was mitigated by the adjective 'borderline.'

    There is racism. It is a real sentiment that exists. It is one thing to say 'that person/country/culture/region is bad because of a specific manner in which they are actually bad. It is another to say 'they must be bad because they are a bad race/country/culture/region, as if that is the only proof needed.

    The former is reason. The later is prejudice. Saying 'too many people make accusations of racism' isn't proof of a lack of racism. However, someone saying 'they are an asian company and that explains all the ills in STO' is racism. "Being asian' was used to explain complaints with PWE.
  • sovereignmansovereignman Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    No. There are rifles in the ST universe and its the only sensible way to holster it. They just are a bit oversized.

    As for the OT

    Japan went through this in the 80s with their car and entertainment exports in the 70s and 80s.

    The same crop of people who always bring up the ethnicity and political ideology of PWE are the same ones who cried dey took er jarbs at the Japanese automakers and are currently sitting on the border between the US and Mexico to warch out fer dem turerists.

    It's hiliarious that these Trekkers love the universe, probably because of Kirk fantasies but apparently haven't taken much the rest to heart.

    Live long and prosper :)

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  • pepattypepatty Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    Gun in back went with season 6. What this such fashion style? Are we in those stupid heroic fantasy game made by this such pwe company?
    Did you see some people with gun in Deep space nine TV drama? Did you see Kirk or spock with gun in back in Starbase in StarTrek TOS TV Drama? Did you see Picard moves with his gun in back on the bridge in the enterprise? the gun or the rifle in back is so ridiculous.
    I really would like to know why PWE disrespects startrek spirit like this? They can make money without to be so much disrespectful...
    Sure we can hide the gun in back. Especially if you're a kling. But when you change gun. The new one appears until you hide.
    I'm reall angry against pwe because of this.

    Sling them across the back isn't the problem.

    STO is showing a radical military interpretation. Solving conflicts by violence fails the spirit of star trek. First shoot, don't talk.

    All the time sending outsized spaceships with thousand people on board to death isn't Star Trek. ;)

    Sending Peregrine Fighters etc. on kamikaze missions isn't Star Trek. ;)

    Running around in combat suits with guns on a starbase isn't Star Trek. ;)
  • szimszim Member Posts: 2,503 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    pepatty wrote: »
    Sling them across the back isn't the problem.

    STO is showing a radical military interpretation. Solving conflicts by violence fails the spirit of star trek. First shoot, don't talk.

    All the time sending outsized spaceships with thousand people on board to death isn't Star Trek. ;)

    Sending Peregrine Fighters etc. on kamikaze missions isn't Star Trek. ;)

    Running around in combat suits with guns on a starbase isn't Star Trek. ;)

    The possibillity to destroy the Krannek in "Operatioin Gamma" without any consequences was a low point. The game never felt less StarTrek like for me. After all you destroy a disabled ship of another faction with hundreds of Ferengi aboard. I would expect instant dismissal.

    And I doubt entering Romulan space destroying several ships and killing hundreds of soldiers would not lead to a decleration of war by the Romulan star empire. Even in its current state. And it's very unlikely Starfleet would risk Romulans and Klingons to join up for a war against the Federation beacause they do not want them to develop Borg technology. Preemptive strikes in such a dimension are not Trek like at all.
  • kimmerakimmera Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    pepatty wrote: »
    Sling them across the back isn't the problem.

    STO is showing a radical military interpretation. Solving conflicts by violence fails the spirit of star trek. First shoot, don't talk.

    All the time sending outsized spaceships with thousand people on board to death isn't Star Trek. ;)

    Sending Peregrine Fighters etc. on kamikaze missions isn't Star Trek. ;)

    Running around in combat suits with guns on a starbase isn't Star Trek. ;)

    Sigh.... because the Romulan Bird of Prey captain was talked to death in "Balance of Terror."

    And outside intervention on the part of the Organians wasn't necessary to force peace with the Klingon Empire in "Errand of Mercy."

    Kirk negotiated Khan's surrender in "Space Seed" rather than hitting him with a pipe, and later again talks Khan into surrendering rather than engaging in a 'wounded starship duel' and Khan trying to play spoiler via the Genesis device...

    A Klingon named Chang would have his ship peacefully disabled rather than destroyed by the combined volleys of the Enterprise and Excelsior.

    A century later, the Borg would be talked into surrendering by Picard. Every Borg encountered would be rehabilitated rather than killed/destroyed. Picard would visit to learn their culture rather than be assimilated then liberated, and would invite a cube and a queen to tea and to meet Zefram Cochrane. No Borg would be destroyed in this completely peaceful encounter.

    The Dominion Games would be peaceful wargames and not a War at all. No shots would be fired in defense or offense.

    And later, after many peaceful encounters and teaching the song Kumbaya to an entire new quadrant, Janeway would come back from the future to compare notes with another Borg queen. There would be no tea, but there would be spectacular fireworks.

    After all, there is no violence in Star Trek, and especially not on Kirk's watch....

    I often wonder how many of self-proclaimed Star Trek guardians have watched the show at all....
  • kimmerakimmera Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    szim wrote: »
    The possibillity to destroy the Krannek in "Operatioin Gamma" without any consequences was a low point. The game never felt less StarTrek like for me. After all you destroy a disabled ship of another faction with hundreds of Ferengi aboard. I would expect instant dismissal.

    And I doubt entering Romulan space destroying several ships and killing hundreds of soldiers would not lead to a decleration of war by the Romulan star empire. Even in its current state. And it's very unlikely Starfleet would risk Romulans and Klingons to join up for a war against the Federation beacause they do not want them to develop Borg technology. Preemptive strikes in such a dimension are not Trek like at all.

    In the middle of several wars, when the ship's captain has betrayed you, not just running out on you but putting your ship in a potentially lethal situation, after asking you to commit a breach of the treaty that ended the Dominion War.

    Under such conditions, it is no longer a pre-emptive strike but a finishing blow... AND you can still let the Ferengi ship go.

    You do have the 'kinder gentler' option. And remember, Klingon captains are given exactly the same choice.

    The Romulan example is definately legit though. I hate it when the player is handed an idiot ball and forced to accept it.
  • carmenaracarmenara Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    RE: Thread topic.

    Star Trek changes with the times.

    If you strip away all luxuries and creature comforts from Starfleet units on away missions, they resemble present-day infantrymen who act and think like today's soldiers, doing whatever they can to stay alive against overwhelming odds without hope for relief (Siege of AR-558)

    Given STO's primary mode of gameplay which is akin to taking the biggest, shootiest starship and pew pewing everything with a targeting marker on it, it's definitely very Rednecks in Space and I don't think there's anything wrong matching a Jem'Hadar rifle to a 21st century pattern fuchsia dress and walking around on ESD with it.

    I mean, we even have folding katanas and Starship Troopers style action in the JJtrek film.

    Infact, this toon with the 'lolaron dress' seems to attract a lot of praises from STO players, so much that two of my characters have this as their uniform. (It helps that nanoenergy cells boost the JH rifle's capability a lot!)

    So who cares, it could very well be Star Trek... in my wildest dreams. STO is a world where refinement and culture is dumbed down to the lowest common denominator as we travel the galaxy in search of Commendation Points, Refined Dilithium and Prototype Borg Salvage.

    The only form of culture that counts is this: (insert Klingon philosophy of death in glorious battle)

    :D

    In closing and on topic, I don't really care since more customisation options, not less, is the way to go. Customization on -everything- is the big selling point for STO, as opposed to canned outfits and appearances common in earlier MMOs.

    If I really wanted to roleplay prim and proper Starfleet officers I can look up any serious RP fleet, Star Trek fanclub or SIMM and have a ball doing things "The Star Trek Way" anytime I want. But that's not the spirit of STO, which is no longer a 'roleplaying' game outside of specialised guilds, but an action/strategy * one.

    * Directing and advising PUGs in Elite STFs = real time strategy game :D
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  • dariusmajeredariusmajere Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    Weapons need to be able to re-size based on the owner's size. MMO's have been doing this since late 1990's there is NO excuse other than lazyness to have these graphical obscenities in a 2012 game.


    Yep Because in Life Those Rifle's and handguns are always Bought from the Store Sized to its owner :P * eyes the 4'8 girl purchasing the .50 cal rifle* " does this come in my size... and pink?"
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  • dariusmajeredariusmajere Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    Those are polished Renderings, Behind those Images are men controlling them :P It's Legit, Just like that orion prostitute :P
    thecosmic1 wrote: »
    You couldn't find a picture of men with guns? Hmmmm? :)
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  • notapwefannotapwefan Member Posts: 1,138 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    when you are wearing this KDF Elite Guard Cape then half of your weapon is visible. It is like your weapon on back made some holes in your cape.
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  • kimmerakimmera Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    notapwefan wrote: »
    when you are wearing this KDF Elite Guard Cape then half of your weapon is visible. It is like your weapon on back made some holes in your cape.

    This is why a lot of games don't have capes. It is also an example of why capes are often impractical in RL. If you sling a weapon under the cape, then the cape is in the way when you want to use it. Over the cape and the cape is strapped to your body by the weapon and becomes a non-cape.
  • diogene0diogene0 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    Yes it does, and the hide option is bugged, since it appears again if i change my weapon. It's very annoying. I think it's great for my kdf chars, but not for my fed ones. I'd like an option to deactivate it all the time, without being forced to disable the visuals each time I choose a new weapon.
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  • kimmerakimmera Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    diogene0 wrote: »
    Yes it does, and the hide option is bugged, since it appears again if i change my weapon. It's very annoying. I think it's great for my kdf chars, but not for my fed ones. I'd like an option to deactivate it all the time, without being forced to disable the visuals each time I choose a new weapon.

    I agree that is a very annoying bug :(
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    diogene0 wrote: »
    Yes it does, and the hide option is bugged, since it appears again if i change my weapon. It's very annoying. I think it's great for my kdf chars, but not for my fed ones. I'd like an option to deactivate it all the time, without being forced to disable the visuals each time I choose a new weapon.
    I think you have to hide both, I've never tried it though.
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  • liquidacid29liquidacid29 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    Yep Because in Life Those Rifle's and handguns are always Bought from the Store Sized to its owner :P * eyes the 4'8 girl purchasing the .50 cal rifle* " does this come in my size... and pink?"

    I've actually seen a 5 foot 2 girl at a gun show with a m107 CQB model with a pink finish and hello kitty logos stenciled on it
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  • kimmerakimmera Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    I've actually seen a 5 foot 2 girl at a gun show with a m107 CQB model with a pink finish and hello kitty logos stenciled on it

    The gun probably wasn't scaled to her size though :)
  • liquidacid29liquidacid29 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    kimmera wrote: »
    The gun probably wasn't scaled to her size though :)

    it kind was... she was short so she bought the CQB model which has a much shorter over all length... she also had a custom grip on it to accommodate her much slammer hands... lol

    I assume that in ST when they have a replicator sitting right there they could just input the weapon schematics and scale it up or down... in fact given how many different alien species we are dealing with they should have something in place to customize the weapon set up... it's not like humans where one style fits all
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  • velktravelktra Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    Yep Because in Life Those Rifle's and handguns are always Bought from the Store Sized to its owner :P * eyes the 4'8 girl purchasing the .50 cal rifle* " does this come in my size... and pink?"

    No, but many weapons come in different models, which can accommodate a smaller or larger shooter. Some are also modifiable on their own. Take, for example, the M16 and the M4. They're pretty similar, with the M4 being shorter (even with the stock extended) and easier for smaller people to fire. Because the military uses both, it's common practice in the field to give the 4'8" girl an M4 because it fires the same round and has the same stopping power, but she's easily able to carry and shoot it due to its smaller size. With the extending stock, she can also customize the weapon's length to her reach while in a firing position.

    Handguns come in different sizes too. I own a Glock 27 .40 caliber pistol. The pistol is also available in two other models with different sizes, to accommodate different needs. I chose the 27 because it fits in my hand the best, and it's compact enough to carry concealed. I could also have chosen the Glock 30 .45 caliber, but I felt it was too big for me to conceal it.*


    *I live in an open carry state, but I prefer to carry my weapon concealed. Too many people get the wrong idea if they can see your gun.
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  • hroothvitnirhroothvitnir Member Posts: 322
    edited August 2012
    You can try and say bad things about everyone running around DS9 with combat armor and heavy munitions strapped to their back. But you would be ignoring how many times that place has been "And suddenly Boarded" by assault troops.

    At this point its; Hi welcome to DS9, Please check any fresh goods at customs and pick up your temporary issue beam riffle for repelling boarders.
  • crusty8maccrusty8mac Member Posts: 1,381 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    Spirit of Star Trek?

    We come in peace, shoot to kill! :rolleyes:
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  • liquidacid29liquidacid29 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    the spirit of ST died before the first episode aired...

    Gene "the show will be about the peaceful exploration of fascinating cultures and places far out in the galaxy!"

    Producers " ya ya ya but we need more 1/2 naked alien women, laser battles and things exploding"
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  • angrytargangrytarg Member Posts: 11,011 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    linyive wrote: »
    Even though "Star Trek: Online" has "Star Trek" elements, the majority of the game's future tech has no aesthetic relation to one and other. Putting a gun on the avatar's back is not a game changer. Since Perfect World/Cryptic decided to abandon certain design aesthetics, "Star Trek: Online" has become a patch work of inconsistent design elements. Everything is stitched together into an incoherent mess.

    "Star Trek: Online" is fun to play, but it doesn't have any rhythm.

    This. Biggest problem with the game. Just rename it, nothing looks like Star Trek anyway ;)
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  • goedzooigoedzooi Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2012
    the spirit of ST died before the first episode aired...

    Gene "the show will be about the peaceful exploration of fascinating cultures and places far out in the galaxy!"

    Producers " ya ya ya but we need more 1/2 naked alien women, laser battles and things exploding"

    They also wanted sound in space, Gene wanted no sounds in space.
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