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Change the respec system! thread
seraphantilles
Member Posts: 97 Arc User
Below are various ideas to improve the ability to test and use different Captain and ship builds.*
Post your own ideas! Or just flame mine.
General problem: Even for experienced players, there is a lot of guesswork and trial-and-error involved in honing a captain build. We currently respec and test builds using Combat Log parsers, etc., but this wastes respec tokens and is not amenable to quickly testing multiple variables in a build.*
Reason for the problem: This game's skill structure is extremely complicated and poorly documented. There are so many different skills and underlying subsystems that are all interrelated. Now you throw into the mix BOffs, DOffs, constant nerfing/tweaking, special buff items from mission rewards, set bonuses, ship types, consoles, and procs... I wonder sometimes if anyone truly "gets it."*
General solution proposed: make it easier and quicker to change aspects of a build.*
Specific new features to address this are shown below.
(1) Ship loadout save slots.*
Description: You could save and instantly load up a "loadout" -- the collective set of ship equipment, BO assignments, DOff assignments, and space power tray assignments. Just like with DOffs and BOffs, all slottable ship items would exist in a new "ship inventory" that is seperate from the main inventory. It should be big enough to hold 3 items per slot in the ship (expandable via Zen purchases of course). Each saved loadout would be a combination of items from the new "ship inventory," plus the player's BOff and DOff inventories.*
Similar to: ship and avatar costume save slots.
Problem this addresses: having to swap out all your ship items, BOff/DOff assignments, and *power tray assignments when you want to run a different mission type. Then you realize you left the Borg console on your Escort so you have to fly back to ESD and take the elevator up... Swap items out... Etc. (Yes I know K7 would be faster but that's not the point.)
(2) Captain skill "respec" save slots.
Description: when respeccing your Captain you could save the whole skill tree into a "respec" save slot. You could even save a partial spec. Then later if you respec again, you could easily recall a previously saved skill tree.
Problem this addresses: if you want to respec for a particular type of ship or mission, it's a pain in your butt to load back a previous build. If there were save slots for the respec, that would be awesome!
(3) On-the-fly respeccing between saved Captain builds.
Description: players would have a certain number (perhaps an expandable number) of "on-the-fly" respec slots. It would cost a respec token to assign a Captain build to one of these slots. Then the player could switch between these "on-the-fly" respecs without paying a respec token, and without having to visit the Captain trainer again (perhaps assign an Expertise cost to it).*
Problem this addresses: someone might want to test between two or three different builds. This way they could switch between them without penalty while testing. They could also use this to have a custom build for PVE and another one for PVP, or one that's more ground focussed and one that's more space focussed, etc.*
Note: My gut says this will be controversial, but I can't think of a reason why it would be harmful to the game. Most people are going to just use it to figure out what kind of build works best for them, then stick with that.*
(4) Make BOs*able to train other BOs in skills they already know. Make Captains able to train all ranks of skills they can train Rank III in.
Description: self explanatory.
Problem this addresses: currently it's a huge pain to retrain BOs. You have to fly to ESD and deal with this weird NPC who is somehow the only person in the galaxy capable of training anyone without evaporating! Or you have to go on the exchange and buy a BOff just so you can have them transfer their knowledge to one of your existing BOffs, at which point, they evaporate. Not only is all this ridiculous and nonsensical from an RP perspective, but it's a huge hassle.*
Example of the solution: once you have a BOff with FAW III, you could then use them to train another BOff in any rank of that skill up to III, without having to go find a Tac captain friend or fly to ESD, and without the trainer mysteriously evaporating. Also if you're able to train EPS III, you would also be able to train EPS II and EPS I. This would make it much easier and faster to tweak builds etc.*
I'll post more ideas later, time permitting...
Post your own ideas! Or just flame mine.
General problem: Even for experienced players, there is a lot of guesswork and trial-and-error involved in honing a captain build. We currently respec and test builds using Combat Log parsers, etc., but this wastes respec tokens and is not amenable to quickly testing multiple variables in a build.*
Reason for the problem: This game's skill structure is extremely complicated and poorly documented. There are so many different skills and underlying subsystems that are all interrelated. Now you throw into the mix BOffs, DOffs, constant nerfing/tweaking, special buff items from mission rewards, set bonuses, ship types, consoles, and procs... I wonder sometimes if anyone truly "gets it."*
General solution proposed: make it easier and quicker to change aspects of a build.*
Specific new features to address this are shown below.
(1) Ship loadout save slots.*
Description: You could save and instantly load up a "loadout" -- the collective set of ship equipment, BO assignments, DOff assignments, and space power tray assignments. Just like with DOffs and BOffs, all slottable ship items would exist in a new "ship inventory" that is seperate from the main inventory. It should be big enough to hold 3 items per slot in the ship (expandable via Zen purchases of course). Each saved loadout would be a combination of items from the new "ship inventory," plus the player's BOff and DOff inventories.*
Similar to: ship and avatar costume save slots.
Problem this addresses: having to swap out all your ship items, BOff/DOff assignments, and *power tray assignments when you want to run a different mission type. Then you realize you left the Borg console on your Escort so you have to fly back to ESD and take the elevator up... Swap items out... Etc. (Yes I know K7 would be faster but that's not the point.)
(2) Captain skill "respec" save slots.
Description: when respeccing your Captain you could save the whole skill tree into a "respec" save slot. You could even save a partial spec. Then later if you respec again, you could easily recall a previously saved skill tree.
Problem this addresses: if you want to respec for a particular type of ship or mission, it's a pain in your butt to load back a previous build. If there were save slots for the respec, that would be awesome!
(3) On-the-fly respeccing between saved Captain builds.
Description: players would have a certain number (perhaps an expandable number) of "on-the-fly" respec slots. It would cost a respec token to assign a Captain build to one of these slots. Then the player could switch between these "on-the-fly" respecs without paying a respec token, and without having to visit the Captain trainer again (perhaps assign an Expertise cost to it).*
Problem this addresses: someone might want to test between two or three different builds. This way they could switch between them without penalty while testing. They could also use this to have a custom build for PVE and another one for PVP, or one that's more ground focussed and one that's more space focussed, etc.*
Note: My gut says this will be controversial, but I can't think of a reason why it would be harmful to the game. Most people are going to just use it to figure out what kind of build works best for them, then stick with that.*
(4) Make BOs*able to train other BOs in skills they already know. Make Captains able to train all ranks of skills they can train Rank III in.
Description: self explanatory.
Problem this addresses: currently it's a huge pain to retrain BOs. You have to fly to ESD and deal with this weird NPC who is somehow the only person in the galaxy capable of training anyone without evaporating! Or you have to go on the exchange and buy a BOff just so you can have them transfer their knowledge to one of your existing BOffs, at which point, they evaporate. Not only is all this ridiculous and nonsensical from an RP perspective, but it's a huge hassle.*
Example of the solution: once you have a BOff with FAW III, you could then use them to train another BOff in any rank of that skill up to III, without having to go find a Tac captain friend or fly to ESD, and without the trainer mysteriously evaporating. Also if you're able to train EPS III, you would also be able to train EPS II and EPS I. This would make it much easier and faster to tweak builds etc.*
I'll post more ideas later, time permitting...
Post edited by seraphantilles on
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Comments
why drain a BO another BO...
you can have tons of BOs and give anyone other abilietys for different ship/playstyles.
i have 5 of ea says 5x tak BOs 5xeng BO,....
and anyone have other skills for other ship playstyle on this way you can try out anythink at once, switch in a combat BOs and you have perm other skills for testing so what is the prob on that?
and RESPEC is what, sorry i am nuub?
Exactly. You should never have to "drain" a BO of their skills just to train another one!
Yes but if you want to switch between sets of BOs, many steps are involved. You have to go change them all, one by one, and hopefully remember which BO has which skills. It would be easier to simply load a single saved ship loadout.
It means changing all your Captain's skills.
Free players will still have to pay for a respec token, so they will still get income from selling them. I think it would work out.
I just got a Fleet Scourge Destroyer (an escort) and as I outfit it to my liking I'm constantly hamstrung by this fact and have to limit myself to single target abilities so I don't draw unwanted attention to my glass cannon.
So basically I can't use any AoE skills else I'll get aggro too much/often.
Also I want to spec into attack patterns, but that's something my cruisers don't need so I haven't specced into it.
I don't want to spend respec points each time I switch ships.
I'd be happy to pay for "spec save slots". Where specific skill trees I've setup can be reloaded when ever I want, to match the ship I'm in. We could still respec each slot as we do now with our current single skill tree.
Rolling around in an escort for some dps fun with a cruiser tank skill setup wont be the best and will hold back the potential fun I can have with my new ship.
Amen! I think this is clearly a money-makig opportunity for the game. So hopefully they realize that, and do it!
Exactly. I think this would get people to not only buy the spec slots but also it would encourage people to buy more ships.
I think it would also increase how many people play both PVE and PVP since most people are specced for one or the other.*
I'd especially like it if, with one menu command, I could load up a set of captain skills, and the BO and equipment loadout that I want.*
I don't even think these features would be hard for devs to add to the game, compared to some of my other suggestions on other threads (like the new PVP game modes or fleet starbase donations management).
Should it be free (as in: energy credits only)? Yes.
Should either of the above at LEAST be implemented for paying members? Yes.
Will it happen? Unlikely, because being reasonable isn't exactly a PWE thing.
That way you can tank your cruiser to the end of time and you can dps tweek your escort as you please.
I'm looking at the future addition of the Vesta as a DPS based sci ship and hoping its a great enough ship that I will never fly anything else; as my skill respec for it is gonna make flying any other of my other ships land in mouth breathing ****** vill spec land.:(
Yeah it would be cool if each ship had some number of Captain spec save slots. Personally I might want two or three per ship, but who knows.*
I mean, of all the things that people ask for, loadout and spec save slots are really just a UI improvement. It doesn't affect balance or gameplay at all. It's something that would be simply optional for players to use -- but for those of us would use it, it would greatly enhance the game experience.*
Like I just got the Regent. Ok so now I have to go change all my weaps over to it, respec into torps again (which I will want to undo as soon as I'm back in my escort), redo my BO layout for it, fly to ESD and retrain some BOs in basic skills that my capt. should be able to train them in himself, and redo my power tray. Oh wait, forgot that one turret and left it on my other ship; gotta fly back to somewhere with a shipyard...*
Having a Tuffli Freighter on my Engineer, I got a taste for how much of an enjoyment improvement there is just from having quick and easy access to being able to change between ships without leaving the sector (for those who don't know, it has a Ship Selection officer so you can switch out items between all your ships, etc.).*
I imagine the devs have to look at most every feature idea skeptically, and ask, "Do we really need this." "Is this a priority." They have limited time. But the players also have limited time. My argument is that the proposed features above are huge time-savers for players. That means players spend more time actually playing the game.
These features also help players to learn the game by making it easier to test different builds and ship layouts. Then it makes it easier to actually use the ship layouts.*
Now, maybe Cryptic would lose some business from guys who buy three respec tokens a day. But I think sales of extra respec save slots would more than make up for it.*
I just hate paying for a respec that, after I respec again, I can't even use anymore. It's just wasted money. That is lame.
Yes, we have multiple char slots, but that is not helping this problem really at all. The character-bound aspect of many items, including rewards like Lobi crystals, DOffs, and STF gear, rewards players who focus on building up one or two main characters. However, the current skill respec costs system makes me wish I had 10 toons, and fully equip each one... just so I could switch to the best ship/character-build combination quickly. And while I know there are some people with hundreds of alts, most of us just have a small number of chars, and each one has many ships and many BOs, several sets of different types of ship items, etc.*
So don't just say, "Make more characters." Multiple character slots are nice, but not a solution to this problem.