Shipboard Cooking - what do you feed your crew?

carmenara

You know I always wondered something about those ginormous pots on the mess hall galley - what goes in them?

Today on Yahoo news I found a blog-like article detailing the galley and meals served on board what seems to be a sea-going reseach vessel.

It has a crew of just under fifty and it looks like a heroic task keeping everyone fed and fed well - there's almost an oversupply of food on board and with some good storage methods they are able to keep fruit and vegetables fresh for weeks out at sea.

Something tells me it's going to be an absolute nightmare to feed all 2500 crew (and hundreds more passengers) aboard something as large as an Odyssey class. It's not like you can serve everyone fresh gagh on a Federation vessel, and someone has to have a whole army of cooks and stewards to run the mess halls and galleys virtually 24/7 (considering 3-4 shifts of personnel.)

It's a good thing we have replicators and it's also a great thing we don't have to manage inventory stores and the like. Even the infamous BC3K games (which allowed for extreme micromanagement... when the game worked) didn't go into so much detail as to stock up certain types of food - virtual crew simply ate I think 3 "nutripaks" a day.

On DS9 we can hear Bashir & O'Brien whining now and then about Starfleet combat rations - Dr. Bashir quips that one ration pack can keep someone full and has enough nutritions for "a couple days" or so... which is not unachievable given today's range of "meal replacement" tablets and other interestingly advanced stuff.

However, except for mad persons like myself (who loves MREs, spamwiches and C-rats, go figure), no one is going to tolerate subsisting on combat rations for year-long deployments a Federation starship is capable of. So you do need an army of "whiteshirts" to keep everyone happy aboard a capital ship.

How do present-day cruise liners and bluewater vessels manage keeping crew fed? Does anyone here have CVN or cruise liner experience? Is the food as good as that on the scientific research vessel mentioned in the Y! news link above, or is it merely 'eatable'?

On the STO roleplaying side - do you imagine you have to restock provisions every now and then in ESD or DS9? Or does everyone prefer to mass-replicate meals and do away with that fire hazard called a kitchen?

sollvax

Well KDF side I have an Alien (single race) crew called the Shol they are amphibious aquatic creatures and live entirely on fish
The Empire pays them for their fighting (and science) skills with unreplicated Fish

you will see the Shol Vok (literally "the peoples catcher of fish" ) in battle and see over the comms "extra ration of fish for the Gunners"

carmenara

And I was thinking of that too - good you picked up the idea.

A single-race crew would definitely be much easier to manage on a large scale and especially if fresh produce were to be used.

However, Starfleet's diversity can get in the way at this point, though I don't mind Bajoran food. Haspheret (sp?) = taco bell anyway.

vonbon

Since my vessel the stonehenge is a Defiant class, my crew only consists of 50, and our ships mess hall is limited to only having replicators sadly, although i like to think that some might save up their replicator rations to replicate cooking resources that they can then use to cook up something real, after all a ship runs off the stomach of her crew.

drunkenguyver

As a captain of a multi cultural ship with many different races on board i've delegated that we have themed meals every week, this in turn not only gives the crew a good variety and culinary experience, but also offers individual crew members the taste of home. Although the replicators are convenient, and the crew are welcome to create dishes of their own while off duty in their quarters, i do insist that the galley onboard cooks with real food and spices that i make sure are on board before leaving spacedock and kept fresh with a stasis field in cargo bay 1.

Although on Sundays i do insist on a good traditional Roast dinner for the crew, Chicken, beef or lamb, selection of vegetables with crispy roast potatoes, stuffing and a good helping of yorkshire puddings, cover the lot in tasty thick gravy. Sometimes being the captain has it perks and i'm usually found having seconds.

mikewendell

Last time I looked, all the chef was making was pancakes.

At least that was what was on the stove at the time.

I wondered why the gallery was so empty....

darkstarkirian

I heard that a brown sugar coated and baked Pakled was tastey.
I also heard it was rather easy to get them to just lay down in the oven....

takeshi6

vonbon wrote: »

Since my vessel the stonehenge is a Defiant class, my crew only consists of 50, and our ships mess hall is limited to only having replicators sadly, although i like to think that some might save up their replicator rations to replicate cooking resources that they can then use to cook up something real, after all a ship runs off the stomach of her crew.

I'm pretty much the same with my vessel, the Sao Paulo-Class USS Raging Tempest. Crew of 50, mess hall limited primarily to replicators.

However, one of my alts flies an Odyssey Tactical Cruiser, which commonly carries large classes of Academy Cadets (the character in question is an Academy Field Instructor), so she does have a rather large galley staff from throughout the Federation. :cool:

carmenara

So while we have a good idea of what we want to feed our crews, let's just say for authenticity there is provision for carriage of fresh produce (in stasis) for long term voyages.

How much produce do you need to support an Odyssey size crew + one thousand hypothetical max passenger capacity?

I used some Royal Navy information on this one - this document on the next-generation CVF states that for a crew of 1500 over 6 weeks, 1,000 tons of food are required.

Weekly consumption = 166.6 tons per week
Per week per crew consumption = 0.111 tons per human crew per week

For the hypothetical Odyssey class with 2500+1000 souls aboard (considering Standard Humanoid types), you would require...

0.111 x 3500 = 388.5 tons per week

Considering deep space operations you may want to stock up for a very long voyage as the crew, not the ship, is the limiting factor of endurance. I'll take the SSN analogy here - one self sufficient ship with a very long deployment time, say, two years / 96 Earth weeks.

388.5 x 96 = 37.296 kilotons of food to last self-sufficient 2 years deployment

Granted, with replimats and virtually unlimited capital class warp power you do not need 100% fresh produce, but with a multiracial Federation crew you will want to consider all your member species' nutritional needs as a strictly 100% human crew is going to be very rare in the utopian Federation. This might give a mass/weight/space penalty to the amount of food stored on the vessel especially if you might need to haul not just fresh produce in stasis but "livestock" as well. I'm not sure how live fish in stasis would taste like.

On this note I believe some restrictions are in order. As much as we want to have officers' privledges and authentic Earth styled BBQs and roast events aboard, we have to place some limitations to what is allowed fresh aboard and what should be replicated. It's much easier to generate a replicated grilled fish meal than to have an actual aquarium aboard ship which creates a huge mass and volume penalty. Something as large as a Galaxy class outfitted for exploration and colonial support in the TNG era could hold one but that's out of the question for a ship that's expected to act as a battle cruiser full time in the STO context.


So at least for this Tactical Odyssey class deployed for full time Omega Force strike and task force command operations, I don't mind having replicated steaks and meals of the crew's choosing (computer assigned daily randomized menu) if the ship is on green alert. During a STF tour of duty with up to a dozen ESTF missions per day, replicators will be locked down due to combat power and fleet support requirements and we have MREs and meals prepared from c-rations just like everyone else on combat deployment.

This concept of 'universal suffrage' might be rare in a military command structure, but Star Trek is an environment where commanding officers themselves risk themselves in special operations missions rather than embark specially equipped Starship Troopers for the task.

And besides the less power allocated to replicators and other unnecessary systems, the more power I can channel to weapons. This ship for some reason has problems keeping up 125 weapons power and I needed one assimilated console + 2 plasma distro manifolds for that. Prototype stats, perhaps.

If there's a time to enjoy utopian luxuries it's when we complete the tour of duty and return to Starbase One for refitting. Not before - a united mission is what keeps an international crew performing at peak efficiency, and us officers having the same meal allowances as the crew has a possibly strong effect on shipboard morale.

The use of packaged Starfleet rations aboard also simplifies the logistics chain and makes the ship less vulnerable in the event of resupply at possibly contaminated native sources. No taking on produce from alien worlds = no risk of contamination. We can also use excess Starfleet rations for humanitarian or underway replenishment for other vessels in need.

... And besides, IRL I can whip up the most delicious meals out of C-rations and nothing else

admrenlarreck

In the Enterprise D tech Manual, this is actually talked about. The majority of food on Federation Starships is replicated So only limited fresh food is required. this is the reason that Federation ships can be self sufficent for long periods of time.

The material used by the replicators is actually a combination of recycled material from the ship, as well as Deuterium.

rachelj88

my crew run on Tea with Crumpets or scones on weekends. mainly because I fly the Cutty Sark there is an abundance of Tea... no replicators needed!

captwinters1701

Grog and Mead! What else does a crew need? :biggrin:

grylak

I have no idea what my crew is fed on. I delegate all that kinda stuff to the head Chef. That's why he's on board. I don't like to micromanage.

kassad2

I don't feed my crew anything because they are not real...just entries in a database and lines of code. Which is probably a good thing because I have searched every inch of my virtual ship's interior and have not eno****ered a single virtual bathroom. If they were real and actually ate, I imagine that by now the interior would be filled with a lot of dead potted plants... :rolleyes:

mikewendell

captwinters1701 wrote: »

Grog and Mead! What else does a crew need? :biggrin:

Having flash backs of a Knights of the Dinner Table story on that one.

DM: What are feeding the horses?

Player: Mead.

DM: Um...Meed?

Player: Yup. Mead. It's dirt cheap. Been doing it for weeks now.

Or something like that....

hpcapulet

Horts. Roasted on an open fire and lightly seasoned. Tastes like chicken.

aesica

darkstarkirian wrote: »

I heard that a brown sugar coated and baked Pakled was tastey.
I also heard it was rather easy to get them to just lay down in the oven....

You are what you eat though. Do you want your entire crew to devolve into chest-slapping droolers?

demon971e

My ship's been posted to frontline duty at the Klingon Neutral Zone and during a recent battle our replicator system (along with other more important systems) had been damaged.

So, my crew and I are stuck eating rations until the maintenance engineers can get to it. Yum!

carmenara

demon971e wrote: »

My ship's been posted to frontline duty at the Klingon Neutral Zone and during a recent battle our replicator system (along with other more important systems) had been damaged.

So, my crew and I are stuck eating rations until the maintenance engineers can get to it. Yum!

Lol it's either that or take on 'native supplies'. Fresh Gagh anyone lol.

lilchibiclari

carmenara wrote: »

I used some Royal Navy information on this one - this document on the next-generation CVF states that for a crew of 1500 over 6 weeks, 1,000 tons of food are required.

Weekly consumption = 166.6 tons per week
Per week per crew consumption = 0.111 tons per human crew per week

Is that correct? I find it difficult to believe that each crew member is consuming fifteen kilograms per person per day. Even if you include all of the water mass in food and premixed beverages (e.g. canned drinks), you still get less than half that at most even assuming four thousand kilocalories per day. Most edible/drinkable materials are not that much denser than water, and nobody is consuming a dozen liters a day unless it's mostly water and they are sweating extremely heavily.

senshibat01

Thursday is Pizza and an Home improvement show night .. The Pizza to placate them
The Home and Terra firma to remind them what a boring life they led before we either drafted or pressganged them.

gpgtx

i have a galaxy class of 1,000 not including families and passengers so most of it is replicated but on fridays we have a old fashion BBQ in the holodecks with all the fix-ens

nyiad

Redshirt that have failed their task (0_0)

commadorebob

They're cats. They claw the Chancellor's leg until he feeds then.

kimmera

I feed them all Zgwortz. Except for Ook... he'll eat anything....

aesica

Green eggs & ham. See, those Orions are good for more than just slave trading and escort services after all!

lomax6996

On my ships, from Defiant class Escort to Excelsior class cruiser, we have a little thing called replicators. No galley's, no cooks. None needed. These replicators work on the same basic tech as transporters. They're REALLY neat. They can replicate just about anything right down to the molecular level. They can replicate the finest cooking you can imagine or crude, raw matter or anything in between. They can even replicate little touches like the burnt, crusty bits that would get scraped up off the bottom of the pan. You can program them to vary the product results over a number of given parameters to simulate the way food would never come off the stove EXACTLY the same way twice. You can randomize it so you would never know, yourself, exactly how it will taste. So no cooks, no galleys and no enlisted personnel since everything that MIGHT be done by them is now automated. The toilets are all self-cleaning and there's no paper to be replaced. Where the paper used to go (in ancient times) we have these 3 little sea shells (but I'm NOT telling you how they work... need to know basis only!). There's no laundry and little closet or storage space since all clothing is replicated as needed. Once done with it you simply dispose of it. All waste materials are recycled. There are no children on board. This is a starship, not a nursery. Since average lifespans are nearing 200 and contraception is 100% fail proof and 100% reversible it would make no sense. With an occasional load of raw materials to replace what little is actually lost the ship can be totally self-sufficient for years... except for Twinkies. Noone's ever figgered out what the hell is actually in them even after several centuries and the Chief Engineer gets cranky if she goes short of them...

blademasterronin

I command a fleet escort, so we have limited room for food storage. So dinner is: It's a single cell protein combined with synthetic aminos, vitamins, and minerals. Everything the body needs.

(and beer, lots and lots of beer. If the crew is kept in beer, they are not to concerned with the tatsy wheat tasing nutritional suppliment from the replicators)

radkip

I feed my crew fresh Cardassian, every day, three times a day.

Don't ask where I get it. I'd prefer my supplier didn't disappear...

sumghai

Assuming that I'm on my Intrepid-class sci vessel with the usual crew complement of 150 and standard mess area configurations, as well as the fact that I'm in my little alt-verse...

• Replicators for the most part meet the needs of the crew. My Ops Officer periodically adds new recipes whenever we're docked at a friendly Starbase.
  
  
• One of my junior Bajoran Sci officers, whom we consider to be our very own Reg Barclay, has converted Cargo Bay 2 into a hydroponics garden - this week it's carrots and Andorian tuber root.
  
  
• The Captain's Mess serves only non-replicated food, prepared by our venerable Bolian chef. Vegetables are naturally supplemented from the aforementioned hydroponics garden, whilst meat on the other hand...
  
  
• My Cardassian Sci Officer insists on drinking hot fish juice for breakfast each morning, which results in crew from up to two tables away vacating the vicinity almost immediately. Being Asian myself and as a show of solidarity, I sometimes order a cup for myself as well, but add lots of Soy Sauce before consumption.
  
  
• My First Officer is to blame for starting Pieday Friday.
  
  
• My Ops Officer wants me to officially redesignate Five o'clock as Beer o'clock.
  
  
• A Romulan Security Lieutenant keeps in Cargo Bay 1 a secret stash of Romulan Ale his Senator father regularly sends all the way from Romulus*. It's sort of an open secret - when it arrives via courier the first Wednesday morning of every month, an impressive queue forms. A similar queue forms later in the afternoons, outside sickbay.
  
  
• A lockout code has been programmed into all shipboard replicators, preventing our Caitian Security Ensign from replicating more than one cheeseburger every 24 hours.
  
  
• A similar lockout prevents my Trill CMO from replicating too many desserts. To think that she's responsible for the health of the entire crew...
  
  
• Besides my Bolian chef and El-Aurian bartender, there are no other civilians aboard this ship, no children, and certainly no talented kid wonder cadet. This allows us to get away with having alcoholic ice cream in the replicator menus.
  
  
• My Tac Officer claims that alcohol is vulgar, yet I caught her in MY quarters drinking Vodka Mudshake.
  
  
• My Andorian Chief Engineer is very fond of iced Raktajino. I knew something was up between him and my female Andorian Security Chief when the latter recently started ordering Klingon coffee from the replicators, despite the fact that the latter had declared that it "tasted like an oil slick".

*I did say I was in my own little alt-reality, no?

red01999

Gruel.

Gruel for breakfast, gruel for lunch, grew for dinner if they performed well enough to be fed.

If not, I grind 'em up for dilithium.

Isn't being in the Federation great?

More seriously, they probably mostly feed themselves via replicator. I'd imagine that the larger lounges and mess halls act as restaurants, especially on my Odyssey, and are probably equipped with a few actual chefs and better quality replicators. I imagine that most of those decisions are made by my chefs, though - there's a reason I carry a few aboard.