While I think the Odyssey could fill that role, I personally would rather it not. I don't see the Enterprise being a carrier really - it's always been a ship of the line and I don't think that should change.
Also the Odyssey, although big enough... I don't think is really laid out for it. A carrier needs bays that are easy to access in-quantity, and the Odyssey's shuttlebay doesn't strike me as being particularly easy to launch a dozen ships through quickly.
Which isn't to say I don't want to see a Fed carrier. Holy TRIBBLE I do! But I think a new ship design or a revamp of the Jupiter Dreadnought would be the better way to handle that. Particularly since the Dreadnought would be on about the same scale as the Vo'Quv, and thus you could keep the whole turns-like-a-whale-in-molasses turning feel. Which also prevents the headache of trying to balance two wildly dissimilar types of carrier.
(I'll also add that as much as I want a Fed Carrier someday... I think we need to wait for Heretic-et-al to finish revamping the Klingon carriers. Makes sense not to add yet another thing to be rebalanced >.>m)
*edit*
Just to be clear, I know you're talking about a Retrofit version, rather than the initial version; but it doesn't make a lot of sense to retrofit a ship that's just-now launching I don't think. >.< And even if we allow for that, to make it a convincing carrier would require a lot of visual revision per what I mentioned above. So it wouldn't look like it does now.
Well rebutted! I think I can agree with you on all your points, with the way you explained your opinion. I agree, while I may think it cool to just retrofit the lovely Odyssey class to be a carrier, it would be far better to first finish the Klingon's and then have "Stafleet respond" in kind.
I made the mistake of rushing an entry out and focusing on a gimmick rather than originality when I entered but the first thing I did when I started looking at my take was to try out different exponential and linear regressions on the size increases of the Enterprises to get a feel for the size.
That's actually small compared to what I was looking at.
The Enterprise-C was 526 meters, was the 3rd class of Federation Enterprise, and was 1.82 times the length of the first. The F is the 6th class so I'd guesstimate it as being 1.82 times the length of the C or around 957 meters.
If it's only as much bigger than the Sovereign as the Sovereign was compared to the Galaxy, that puts us at around 730 meters.
The most complicated regression I did plotted the year of each class's debut with its length. That and a lot of the other work I did suggested a natural flow would put this ship at over 1000 meters to get us on track for the J.
A wealth of insight here, thank you! I just loved the massiveness yet sleekness of the Enterprise-J. I remember waiting and hoping for more episodes about it beyond what little was shown. Sadly, that never came true.
Drexler saw the Enterprise-J "as a multi-generational vessel, that had large parks, entertainment zones, and entire universities on board. The ship is so large that turbolifts would be replaced with site to site transporters. [It] had one deflector, recognizably descended from the NX. I opted for spindly nacelle struts because I felt it suggested a technology beyond what we were familiar with. They are beyond transwarp. They can fold space, and they are exploring other galaxies besides the Milky Way."
My exact reasons why I cannot stand this ship, nor what cryptic has done with this contest, and how to fix most of the most extreme issues, and make this ship something we're not going to look back in a few months and ask 'what the *BLEEP* were we thinking' over:
Saucer/Engineering Hull Relationship: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=21j8ygx&s=7
Issues with the engineering shuttlebay, and the silly use of a clamshell door in a design that doesn't make optimal use of it: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2rddtlk&s=7
Bad concept implimentation on the underside of the engineering hull, and the blending from engineering hull to saucer (especially the scallop underneath the shuttlebay, NONONO!): http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=33w48kk&s=7
The Extreme proportion failures and flow issues between engineering hull and the saucer: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=1zqfzig&s=7
More examples of the 'guppy'/'potato' look of the engineering hull, and the reason why the saucer section and engineering hull don't look like part of the same ship when head on: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2z8xnad&s=7
The final, utter dealbreaker for me, and conclusions on why it really fails hardcore in establishing a unique identity for itself, and the reason why it's best served as just making it an assault cruiser retrofit: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=28ktvle&s=7
I pretty much agree with all of the critique, as well as all of the complements. The vast majority of the issues seem to be down to the twin neck design. It's kind of like the Akira in that things look out of place and dis-proportioned on most angles. Top down looks great, but the more of the twin necks you can see the more things seems out of place. The sad bit is that had Cryptic had simply put all of the good parts of the F onto a Sovereign base we'd probably have one of the nicest Star Trek ships ever made. Seems like the execution was good but the base ideas were flawed, a description that sometimes seems to fit Cryptic as a whole.
Bridge:
OH the bridge! I re-made the bridge section atop the "cake" only a few days before the final shots were taken and given to Marcom. Some of the shots are pre-polish, some are post. The post polish ship has a bridge with a top like the one you might have seen in the Perpetual concept for a bridge interior. I spent a day with Jeremy Mattson revising the bridge because the one that was there was just dull and uninspired so we redesigned it... I'll get some shots of that for you soon You won't be disappointed.
This is the bridge you guys are using as a template? I can scarcely IMAGINE it livened up.
Truth be told, I'd rather imagine a blank spot where it is whenever I see it. It's got some major issues to work out before it's released, and even then, you've really failed the spirit of the contest, and failed to make a visually distinct Enterprise, with a valid reason for a new class, instead of refitting a Sovereign. It's hull separation lines are identical to the proposed ones for the Sovereign class, and it's so close in design that it might as well be called a sovereign refit. It's the exact same issue you've had so many times before, just in a new and different way. You're trying to make something cool, but trek ships aren't designed to be 'cool'. The Prime, the -A, the -B, C, D, E, all of them were designed with a minimum of detail (some moreso than others), and a high flow from one section to the other. The ones that have a high dislike quotent, like the -D, -B, and -C, have less of it than others, and issues with proportions, the same issues this 'Enterprise' does.
It doesn't have a coherent feel to it, from the top of the saucer being too high up, and giving the ship an off-kilter look from many upper angles, to the guppy 'necks' and the striping on the front of the engineering hull. If you would bring the leading edge of the necks up against the hull, instead of spacing them out, and reduce the outer mass of the neck section, you would get a much better flow, and loose a lot of the proportion issues, and NO SHIP in starfleet has stripes all over the front of it's engineering hull. If you're going for an armor look, make it a solid plate, and don't plaster anything over it. It makes the design look immature in genesis, even if you had an actual thought as to why they should be there.
And there really is no point in having a clamshell door engineering saucer bay. Having a recessed roll up, or break-slide open shuttlebay would both make sense, and not disrupt the back of the ship, and take advantage of the design somewhat better.
Another main issue is, as shown, the scalloping on the underside of the engineering hull, under the shuttlebay. Why is that there!?! I don't see any hatches within it for cargo access, and it's just extraneous detailing and hullforming for no actual gain of function. The design would look far better with it removed. Also, the attempt at blending the sides of the engineering hull into the reverse slope of the engineering hull underside is commendable, but it would work better if you extended the front edge of it out further, and kept a sharp, defined angle from the sloping inwards to the flat of the curve. It would pay homage to every single other enterprise, and in a way that steps forward, instead of making something icky looking.
Essentially, everything you've put in to try and move it forward, you could slap on the -E, and get the exact same effect.
But, I give great props for the nacelle/pylons, and the work on the saucer shuttlebay/impulse engine setup. Unique and a step forward, but once again could be put on a sovvy, and get the exact same effect.
I just want to add to this quickly. If I remeber right, you did support Fuzzy modems enterprise design if im correct(as I did post on his forum how much I liked the design and thought it would be a good Enterprise).
You did at one point as well If I remember posted that everyone should support it to be the next enterprise if Im correct.(Im at work at the moment and have no time to post the link where you said this, but I will when I finish work). What I cant get my head round is...the new Ent F looks like an Enterprise...Fuzzy modems...well not as much now when you compare them.
Yes at first I loved Fuzzy's design, but now it would just make another cool looking Federation starship, and to be honest this new Odessey class looks so much like it should be the nxt Enterprise. From what I have seen from your reaction to the overall result is just pure jellousy on your part that Fuzzy's diddnt make it. I think its also really unfair on how Adams Williams has accepted your criticism and you have replied with this statment.
I will end this before I loose my temper by saying that how you have reacted to both Adam Williams design and Adam Ilhe's original concept is both imature and unfair, and you should be ashamed of yourself by calling yourself a Trek fan.
All of this is still YOUR opinion on the aesthetics of the design. I do believe it was Spock who said the needs of the many out way the needs of the few, OR THE ONE. While I myself might have made a few choices different in the final design, I am not beating down Capnlogans or Cryptics door everyday telling them they messed up the design and not to put too fine a point on it but if anyone should have the right to do that it would be me.
50% of the fanbase seems a little far fetched as a number as I have in the past week seen more praise than criticism. Actually the only criticism I have seen is from the same handful of people who "loathed" my original concept. Same rhetoric post after post.
So you are disappointed and bitter, guess what that's no one's problem but your own. Last time I looked there was no rules stated in the contest that the winning design had to make you all warm and fuzzy inside. No matter how you try and state it, every post you have made, while you claim it is not a personal attack, has been about how Capnlogan messed up. You have even more than once stated he has design tendencies that you disapprove of, all of these wrapped in quasi-critiques.
100% correct and on-the-money, Mr. Ihle. You go, sir! :cool:
Edit:
Oh, I also want to call attention to this thread here:
I think the OP is right on target with his idea that the Enterprise needs SPEED!
The J was envisioned to be able to explore other galaxies by folding space. Please, please consider his suggestion and I'm sure you'll agree that the F should be the first generation of Federation starships with -- COAXIAL WARP DRIVE!!!
I just want to add to this quickly. If I remeber right, you did support Fuzzy modems enterprise design if im correct(as I did post on his forum how much I liked the design and thought it would be a good Enterprise).
You did at one point as well If I remember posted that everyone should support it to be the next enterprise if Im correct.(Im at work at the moment and have no time to post the link where you said this, but I will when I finish work). What I cant get my head round is...the new Ent F looks like an Enterprise...Fuzzy modems...well not as much now when you compare them.
Yes at first I loved Fuzzy's design, but now it would just make another cool looking Federation starship, and to be honest this new Odessey class looks so much like it should be the nxt Enterprise. From what I have seen from your reaction to the overall result is just pure jellousy on your part that Fuzzy's diddnt make it. I think its also really unfair on how Adams Williams has accepted your criticism and you have replied with this statment.
I will end this before I loose my temper by saying that how you have reacted to both Adam Williams design and Adam Ilhe's original concept is both imature and unfair, and you should be ashamed of yourself by calling yourself a Trek fan.
I've just spent the las 20 mins looking through this thread and Im appauled at all of the commnets made by Captain_Richardson. I mean come on man...grow up. Have an opinion yeah, but saying to pass through designs to experts (Probert and Drexler)prior to realising is just dam right rude.
I cant belive some of the comments made on this design. I love it personaly and I've noticed it's had more alterations made to it also (mainly the registry near the main shuttlebay, registry on the secondary hull side and the new cool looking bridge modual...impressive).
I just feel sorry for Adam Ilhe, Adam Williams and so on for the negativity from you. I spose I should really laff at it really. You should be shot out of an airlock sir.lol.
I just feel sorry for Adam Ilhe, Adam Williams and so on for the negativity from you. I spose I should really laff at it really. You should be shot out of an airlock sir.lol.
The vast majority of his critique seems to be on the money. The issue, if there is an issue, seems to be how he voiced his otherwise well thought out opinions. You, on the other hand, have definitely went too far with that last comment. Complete lack of class oh your part, sir.
Hmmm.... maybe. I know I can make the glows pulse..... animation would be better... it would probably require an overhaul of the material system though.
CapnLogan mentioned to me a couple of weeks back that the impulse engines became visible once the primary hull separates from the ship. right now, they're embedded out of view.
Hmmm.... maybe. I know I can make the glows pulse..... animation would be better... it would probably require an overhaul of the material system though.
I'll look in to it.
Maybe you can do it like the TOS Constitution? I remember that its buzzards were indeed animated.
A pulse of some kind would be nice. Actual animation like a spin or a swirl would totally be better though. What you guys did to the TOS connie might totally work in this case. Since this is supposed to be a precursor to the J and the animated render of the J does show spinning Bussards it's conceivable that this ship might have that tech in place.
A pulse of some kind would be nice. Actual animation like a spin or a swirl would totally be better though. What you guys did to the TOS connie might totally work in this case. Since this is supposed to be a precursor to the J and the animated render of the J does show spinning Bussards it's conceivable that this ship might have that tech in place.
I was referring to the TOS Constitution as an example of animated bussard collectors, but I did not mean to suggest reproducing the exact same animation. A subtle pulsing glow would be more to my personal tastes, over the more primitive looking Connie spin.
Then again, maybe the people texturing will be able to find the right balance for that.
The vast majority of his critique seems to be on the money. The issue, if there is an issue, seems to be how he voiced his otherwise well thought out opinions. You, on the other hand, have definitely went too far with that last comment. Complete lack of class oh your part, sir.
Not at all. The guy satated that there work should be seen by proffesionals before beig published. Im sorry but thats not fair on anyone. Im anoyed at the fact of all the negativity on this forum regarding this new Enterprise. It is bar far one of the sweetest ship designs in STO at the moment.
I've seen Captain_Richardson's original comments with Fuzzy modems design entry, and they all but praise the design. The moment Fuzzy's design didnt even get a mention in the top 10, his comments have all been negative, and the threads prove this.
I take back if any of my comments seem too harsh, but I think the designers of STO need a little more credit that they actually get in these forums.
I think it looks like a bird, perhaps an Eagle? Especially from rear/dorsal 3/4 view.
Who's gonna make Captain?
I didn't see it until this was mentioned, but the from below and off to the starboard bow view does look slightly reminiscent of the way a Galor would look from that angle, although proportioned vastly different. It's a very tenuous connection though.
TBH, I will still not see it as the next canon Enterprise, because I have not seen the Enterprise blown up, decomissioned or whatsoever. Beside that STO is only soft-canon and it is good so.
I didn't like the Ship because of this essential point (at least I think it is one), but...
from what I see there on the screenshots I have to say I am deeply impressed and you did an amazing job Capn! It looks beautiful with all the new texture on it and it is very elegant...and you have removed the split-tail yay!
I don't have the right words now, but please continue to carry out the essential Trek design and its philosophy. This game needs original Star Trek content and not some borrowed or "because-it-might-look-cool" ships *cough-imperial-cough*
Keep up the amazing good work Capn, you are officially my Nr. 1 dev here ( take this other devs! :P )
I've seen Captain_Richardson's original comments with Fuzzy modems design entry, and they all but praise the design. The moment Fuzzy's design didnt even get a mention in the top 10, his comments have all been negative, and the threads prove this.
I do agree with that, but I think the character assassination has gone on long enough. Plenty of people already rebuked Richardson. Let's not sink to that level any further and just move on, shall we?
There was something I skipped in my earlier critique post. I thought I'd add it.
Windows:
Yeah, windows! XD
The Enterprise-F is the first STO ship I see that is presented with the Type 3 windows and escape pod set (kind of like the Intrepid/Galaxy-classes) rather than the triangular escape pods and porthole windows seen in Type 1.
Of further note, though, are the indents on the underside of the primary hull, where a new style of window is shown - they're more like horizontal slats/lines. I like them. They make me crave for a new window type that would match them.
A suggestion: perhaps a window material could be implemented with something similar? When you look at the window layouts of ships, there are a few single windows, but several windows are clustered together in twos and threes. Would it be feasible to combine those sets into becoming a single wider window to match the look of the windows on the ventral saucer indents?
It might add some uniqueness to the visuals of the ship, hint at more advanced technology - though windows really aren't all this high tech - the feel on the dots of light illuminating the ship could be sharper and give a hint further toward the Enterprise-J.
My only issue with the ship is that it looks very similar to the Sovereign. But, the Galaxy isn't dissimilar to the Ambassador class and the sovereign isn't a bad looking ship, so thats a non-issue.
I think the size difference is going to be thing that sets it apart from the Sovereign the most and its hard to see that right now as there haven't been any size comparison shots with other ships.
I think its a good step forward to the supermassive starfleet ships like the J.
I do agree with that, but I think the character assassination has gone on long enough. Plenty of people already rebuked Richardson. Let's not sink to that level any further and just move on, shall we?
There was something I skipped in my earlier critique post. I thought I'd add it.
Windows:
Yeah, windows! XD
The Enterprise-F is the first STO ship I see that is presented with the Type 3 windows and escape pod set (kind of like the Intrepid/Galaxy-classes) rather than the triangular escape pods and porthole windows seen in Type 1.
Of further note, though, are the indents on the underside of the primary hull, where a new style of window is shown - they're more like horizontal slats/lines. I like them. They make me crave for a new window type that would match them.
A suggestion: perhaps a window material could be implemented with something similar? When you look at the window layouts of ships, there are a few single windows, but several windows are clustered together in twos and threes. Would it be feasible to combine those sets into becoming a single wider window to match the look of the windows on the ventral saucer indents?
It might add some uniqueness to the visuals of the ship, hint at more advanced technology - though windows really aren't all this high tech - the feel on the dots of light illuminating the ship could be sharper and give a hint further toward the Enterprise-J.
Perhaps your right. I was a little harsh towards Captain_Richardson, and he allready has been grilled on this subject, so Mr Richardson I apologise If I came over a little to harsh.
It's just frustrating when you see so many negative things on these forums, but in way I spose thats like any fan base forums.
Really, you should get in touch with Probert, and Drexler, and run design concepts by them, it'll really weed out some of your tendencies, and get your design sense to the best point it could be (if cryptic lets you)
Not sure what world you're living in, Cpt... but in this one Intellectual Property is enough of a tangle without introducing unpaid consultants into the mix. Even worse for a property like Trek where the rights are all over the map.
Far better to do the work and properly run it by CBS the way Cryptic has to do it anyhow. If CBS greenlights it, nobody else gets veto powers.
I'll admit that the paint scheme on the front of the hull in the reveal shot does not thrill me. It has the unfortunate effect of making her look like a pregnant guppy, at least from the angle we're given. Aside from that, I like the lines of her in general and I reserve final judgement until I can see her in 3-D.
in all the grilling, Cpt_Richardson seems to have removed himself from this discussion...
about time, now we can move on to actual discussion about the Enterprise-F
The one issue I have with the ship is all those escape pods on the underside. Doesn't look super great in my opinion. Other than that...
I don't understand why there is often a reference to this ship needing to be a stepping-stone to the Enterprise J. There's still G, H, and I to go through - plenty of time for more J-looking designs.
During critique during the DTNE diaries it came to my attention that the design looked flimsy as well ...
Nothing wrong with flimsy - the designer of the original Enterprise specifically made the nacelle pylons flimsy so that it would look like the nacelles were attached using awesome future technology.
Shaun555, I think you pointed thefinger on what they probably first concepted the saucer separation to be like (or close to) when they chose Adam Ihle's submission.
According to an Interview STOked had with Al Rivera, the original idea was to have the saucer detach ventrally with the top support remaining in a Prometheus-like triangle. That's probably what he meant with bridge personnel not having to transition to a battle bridge. The dual neck functionality was probably justified there since that kind of separation wouldn't be possible with a single neck (basically, they likely needed the room in the hollow between the two necks to pull that off).
However, that didn't pan out: with the saucer detaching down rather than up, model clipping would've been unavoidable with the embellishments the Devs were adding to the ship after the first clay model. I bet from there they had to revise it; the necks were fixed less at the periphery of the saucer and there was no longer enough room to have the primary hull detach down and fly away.
It's probably why the catamaran-style necks no longer appear to justify themselves aside from satisfying criteria to sticking to the winning entry. It was a good, appealing idea that John Eaves toyed around with that Mark Kingsnorth even modeled out, but that in practice unfortunately wouldn't have gone all that well.
Hey Logan, I know you are busy and all, but what about the variants? I had an idea where maybe the variants could be used to make the new Odyssey class closer resemble older trek designs of the Enterprise. Keep in mind, I'm not talking about that old argument about having old ships in higher places, but I really love... love the way the hard angles come across on ships like the Constitution or the Excelsior classes. There's all that blockish feel to the whole ordeal with these curves and engines that jet out just enough to create a breath taking ship. So, maybe a variant where the nacelles are closer into the ship, the hull might be shortened a bit, but beefed up, and a more circular saucer to boot. I hate how a side view of the Sovvy just makes it seem sooooo long, it just seems to stretch out forever to me and I'd prefer a more compacted design if possible.
I realize that you guys already have variants in mind or done for that matter, but this is just a humble suggestion.
Thanks by the way for all of the awesomeness you've been working on lately!
Loving it so far, but please make a variant that has a single neck. xD
Also don't know if it can be done for one ship or if it requires a "engine overall" but can the deflector styles be separate from the hull "skins"? I like the material 4 dark hull and slight orange bussards, but love the defector style from material 2.
One of the reasons some people may feel less of an Enterprise vibe from this might be the lack of near photorealistic images.
This is for a videgame and as highdetailed as it is, it can't come close to the looks of an Ent-A, D or E as we were first introduced to them.
Another one is that it's missing a sense of uniqueness the other ones had.
When we met the other Enterprises they always had the Hero-Ship status and being out there alone. Bit appearances from other ships of the same classes aside.
This ship will be more then common, as nearly everyody who can get it probably will get it.
Still hoping for a big ceremonial reveal either in/ around ESDwith her maiden voyage or something, or as the hero ship in a mission where WE become the guest stars for a change.
With the Boldly Go speech, her own Enterprise worthy theme music (any chance to get an established Trek name to compose it, like Ron Jones?) and all bells and whistles it deserves.
THEN it will feel like the Enterprise for sure.
Comments
A wealth of insight here, thank you! I just loved the massiveness yet sleekness of the Enterprise-J. I remember waiting and hoping for more episodes about it beyond what little was shown. Sadly, that never came true.
Just loved his vision of it.
I pretty much agree with all of the critique, as well as all of the complements. The vast majority of the issues seem to be down to the twin neck design. It's kind of like the Akira in that things look out of place and dis-proportioned on most angles. Top down looks great, but the more of the twin necks you can see the more things seems out of place. The sad bit is that had Cryptic had simply put all of the good parts of the F onto a Sovereign base we'd probably have one of the nicest Star Trek ships ever made. Seems like the execution was good but the base ideas were flawed, a description that sometimes seems to fit Cryptic as a whole.
This is the bridge you guys are using as a template? I can scarcely IMAGINE it livened up.
http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/745/mainconceptstobridgeps.jpg
I just want to add to this quickly. If I remeber right, you did support Fuzzy modems enterprise design if im correct(as I did post on his forum how much I liked the design and thought it would be a good Enterprise).
You did at one point as well If I remember posted that everyone should support it to be the next enterprise if Im correct.(Im at work at the moment and have no time to post the link where you said this, but I will when I finish work). What I cant get my head round is...the new Ent F looks like an Enterprise...Fuzzy modems...well not as much now when you compare them.
Yes at first I loved Fuzzy's design, but now it would just make another cool looking Federation starship, and to be honest this new Odessey class looks so much like it should be the nxt Enterprise. From what I have seen from your reaction to the overall result is just pure jellousy on your part that Fuzzy's diddnt make it. I think its also really unfair on how Adams Williams has accepted your criticism and you have replied with this statment.
I will end this before I loose my temper by saying that how you have reacted to both Adam Williams design and Adam Ilhe's original concept is both imature and unfair, and you should be ashamed of yourself by calling yourself a Trek fan.
100% correct and on-the-money, Mr. Ihle. You go, sir! :cool:
Edit:
Oh, I also want to call attention to this thread here:
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=225391
I think the OP is right on target with his idea that the Enterprise needs SPEED!
The J was envisioned to be able to explore other galaxies by folding space. Please, please consider his suggestion and I'm sure you'll agree that the F should be the first generation of Federation starships with -- COAXIAL WARP DRIVE!!!
http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Coaxial_warp_drive
I've just spent the las 20 mins looking through this thread and Im appauled at all of the commnets made by Captain_Richardson. I mean come on man...grow up. Have an opinion yeah, but saying to pass through designs to experts (Probert and Drexler)prior to realising is just dam right rude.
I cant belive some of the comments made on this design. I love it personaly and I've noticed it's had more alterations made to it also (mainly the registry near the main shuttlebay, registry on the secondary hull side and the new cool looking bridge modual...impressive).
I just feel sorry for Adam Ilhe, Adam Williams and so on for the negativity from you. I spose I should really laff at it really. You should be shot out of an airlock sir.lol.
The vast majority of his critique seems to be on the money. The issue, if there is an issue, seems to be how he voiced his otherwise well thought out opinions. You, on the other hand, have definitely went too far with that last comment. Complete lack of class oh your part, sir.
Thanks for the speedy reply CapnLogan!
Ah man, I really can't wait for this ship to come out.
A pulse of some kind would be nice. Actual animation like a spin or a swirl would totally be better though. What you guys did to the TOS connie might totally work in this case. Since this is supposed to be a precursor to the J and the animated render of the J does show spinning Bussards it's conceivable that this ship might have that tech in place.
Genuinely curious - what Cardassian design elements are you seeing??
I agree, what Cardassian elements are you seeing?
I think it looks like a bird, perhaps an Eagle? Especially from rear/dorsal 3/4 view.
Who's gonna make Captain?
I was referring to the TOS Constitution as an example of animated bussard collectors, but I did not mean to suggest reproducing the exact same animation. A subtle pulsing glow would be more to my personal tastes, over the more primitive looking Connie spin.
Then again, maybe the people texturing will be able to find the right balance for that.
Not at all. The guy satated that there work should be seen by proffesionals before beig published. Im sorry but thats not fair on anyone. Im anoyed at the fact of all the negativity on this forum regarding this new Enterprise. It is bar far one of the sweetest ship designs in STO at the moment.
I've seen Captain_Richardson's original comments with Fuzzy modems design entry, and they all but praise the design. The moment Fuzzy's design didnt even get a mention in the top 10, his comments have all been negative, and the threads prove this.
I take back if any of my comments seem too harsh, but I think the designers of STO need a little more credit that they actually get in these forums.
I didn't see it until this was mentioned, but the from below and off to the starboard bow view does look slightly reminiscent of the way a Galor would look from that angle, although proportioned vastly different. It's a very tenuous connection though.
I didn't like the Ship because of this essential point (at least I think it is one), but...
from what I see there on the screenshots I have to say I am deeply impressed and you did an amazing job Capn! It looks beautiful with all the new texture on it and it is very elegant...and you have removed the split-tail yay!
I don't have the right words now, but please continue to carry out the essential Trek design and its philosophy. This game needs original Star Trek content and not some borrowed or "because-it-might-look-cool" ships *cough-imperial-cough*
Keep up the amazing good work Capn, you are officially my Nr. 1 dev here ( take this other devs! :P )
I do agree with that, but I think the character assassination has gone on long enough. Plenty of people already rebuked Richardson. Let's not sink to that level any further and just move on, shall we?
There was something I skipped in my earlier critique post. I thought I'd add it.
Windows:
Yeah, windows! XD
The Enterprise-F is the first STO ship I see that is presented with the Type 3 windows and escape pod set (kind of like the Intrepid/Galaxy-classes) rather than the triangular escape pods and porthole windows seen in Type 1.
Of further note, though, are the indents on the underside of the primary hull, where a new style of window is shown - they're more like horizontal slats/lines. I like them. They make me crave for a new window type that would match them.
A suggestion: perhaps a window material could be implemented with something similar? When you look at the window layouts of ships, there are a few single windows, but several windows are clustered together in twos and threes. Would it be feasible to combine those sets into becoming a single wider window to match the look of the windows on the ventral saucer indents?
Most double or triple windows usually lead into the same room, so, making it a single wider one looks feasible to me. It sure doesn't look half-bad in Mass Effect from inside.
It might add some uniqueness to the visuals of the ship, hint at more advanced technology - though windows really aren't all this high tech - the feel on the dots of light illuminating the ship could be sharper and give a hint further toward the Enterprise-J.
I think the size difference is going to be thing that sets it apart from the Sovereign the most and its hard to see that right now as there haven't been any size comparison shots with other ships.
I think its a good step forward to the supermassive starfleet ships like the J.
Sauron has taken refuge on the new enterprise?
Perhaps your right. I was a little harsh towards Captain_Richardson, and he allready has been grilled on this subject, so Mr Richardson I apologise If I came over a little to harsh.
It's just frustrating when you see so many negative things on these forums, but in way I spose thats like any fan base forums.
Again I apologise for my outrage.
Not sure what world you're living in, Cpt... but in this one Intellectual Property is enough of a tangle without introducing unpaid consultants into the mix. Even worse for a property like Trek where the rights are all over the map.
Far better to do the work and properly run it by CBS the way Cryptic has to do it anyhow. If CBS greenlights it, nobody else gets veto powers.
I'll admit that the paint scheme on the front of the hull in the reveal shot does not thrill me. It has the unfortunate effect of making her look like a pregnant guppy, at least from the angle we're given. Aside from that, I like the lines of her in general and I reserve final judgement until I can see her in 3-D.
about time, now we can move on to actual discussion about the Enterprise-F
I don't understand why there is often a reference to this ship needing to be a stepping-stone to the Enterprise J. There's still G, H, and I to go through - plenty of time for more J-looking designs.
Nothing wrong with flimsy - the designer of the original Enterprise specifically made the nacelle pylons flimsy so that it would look like the nacelles were attached using awesome future technology.
Oh I get what you're saying, I thought the saucer would detach from underneath the X-shaped frame like so.
http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/6841/saucer.jpg
But I dig what you did, reminds me of how I thought the sovvy would separate.
According to an Interview STOked had with Al Rivera, the original idea was to have the saucer detach ventrally with the top support remaining in a Prometheus-like triangle. That's probably what he meant with bridge personnel not having to transition to a battle bridge. The dual neck functionality was probably justified there since that kind of separation wouldn't be possible with a single neck (basically, they likely needed the room in the hollow between the two necks to pull that off).
However, that didn't pan out: with the saucer detaching down rather than up, model clipping would've been unavoidable with the embellishments the Devs were adding to the ship after the first clay model. I bet from there they had to revise it; the necks were fixed less at the periphery of the saucer and there was no longer enough room to have the primary hull detach down and fly away.
It's probably why the catamaran-style necks no longer appear to justify themselves aside from satisfying criteria to sticking to the winning entry. It was a good, appealing idea that John Eaves toyed around with that Mark Kingsnorth even modeled out, but that in practice unfortunately wouldn't have gone all that well.
Well, that's my hypothesis anyways.
I realize that you guys already have variants in mind or done for that matter, but this is just a humble suggestion.
Thanks by the way for all of the awesomeness you've been working on lately!
Also don't know if it can be done for one ship or if it requires a "engine overall" but can the deflector styles be separate from the hull "skins"? I like the material 4 dark hull and slight orange bussards, but love the defector style from material 2.
My 2 cents...
I like the idea but it will take some time.