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Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
I dont know about the rest of the community but I think that something missing from Star Trek Online are full raids. I know I have heared that Cryptic is never going to introduce them in STO because they want to make things fairly easy for the players. However there are players who are looking for something that will truely challenge their abilities in game. I personally think raids are the perfect way to go about doing that.
Now when I say raids for STO what Im talking about is something thats harder and longer than the current STFs with ( up to ) 10 bosses. Each of these bosses would have a loot table with items that would be class specific. Like a sniper rifle thats has stats designed for a Tac Officer to use, or a tricorder design for a Sci Officer, or personal shields desing for an Engineer Officer.
Up the difficulty on the bosses. Lets have something more than just a pew pew fest on bosses. Make the bosses in the raid have a strategy to them. Things have to be done in a certain way, or in a certain patern. And everyone has to knoe excatly what to do in when to do it. Should things not happen that way the raid wipes and youll have to start that boss fight again.
In order to have a system of raids in the game you will have to make it so these raids are not mission based. There can be a story but not revolving around a mission. I say this because if it revolves around a mission there will be the problem of people dropping out and the raid not being able to replace them. If there is no mission for the raids then the raid team could bring new people in a different points in the mission to fill spots that have become vacant. This would be important because I think that if real raids are introduced they should be more more and no less than 10 man raids.
Well those are my thought is a possible way to improve this wonderful game. I welcome feed back from the community.
(( NOTE: I am simply attempting tp come up with ideas, if you disagree please feel free to say that you have a different opinion. Just please try to be mature about it. ))
Now when I say raids for STO what Im talking about is something thats harder and longer than the current STFs with ( up to ) 10 bosses. Each of these bosses would have a loot table with items that would be class specific. Like a sniper rifle thats has stats designed for a Tac Officer to use, or a tricorder design for a Sci Officer, or personal shields desing for an Engineer Officer.
Up the difficulty on the bosses. Lets have something more than just a pew pew fest on bosses. Make the bosses in the raid have a strategy to them. Things have to be done in a certain way, or in a certain patern. And everyone has to knoe excatly what to do in when to do it. Should things not happen that way the raid wipes and youll have to start that boss fight again.
In order to have a system of raids in the game you will have to make it so these raids are not mission based. There can be a story but not revolving around a mission. I say this because if it revolves around a mission there will be the problem of people dropping out and the raid not being able to replace them. If there is no mission for the raids then the raid team could bring new people in a different points in the mission to fill spots that have become vacant. This would be important because I think that if real raids are introduced they should be more more and no less than 10 man raids.
Well those are my thought is a possible way to improve this wonderful game. I welcome feed back from the community.
(( NOTE: I am simply attempting tp come up with ideas, if you disagree please feel free to say that you have a different opinion. Just please try to be mature about it. ))
Post edited by Unknown User on
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"Raids" in their common form (WoW/EQ1-esque style content) are something I have always absolutely loathed about MMOs due to often huge time commitments, and the necessity of scheduling one's life around a video game. This form of content often consumes more than its fair share of development resources while excluding the more casual player base with the end result being expensive pieces of content few players will really see. I am extremely glad that form of "raid" does not exist in STO. Crytic should focus on trying something new rather than regurgitate an antiquated design.
I know people are thinking Wolf 359....... so am I... a fight with 1 old school Borg cube rather than the endless weak ones we have now..... Not really a raid...... but a large group activity that anyone can join.
crystalline entity anyone?
You are not being fair. Plenty of people have great ideas for endgame, but if they do not want raids, you cannot start dismissing their opinions just because it does not match yours. When you ask for player opinions, expect the answers to go both ways.
What I don't like is essentially copying raid style content. I'm not fond of having to re-organise my life to play a game and I'm actually quite fond of the mini-raid format of the STF's (could certainly do with more of those). So not actual raids, but expanding on STF's and Fleet Actions, making them them more challenging and in need of a strategy for greater rewards.
The problem with requiring an exact pattern to beat them though is that in STO we're not pigeon holed into specific roles and the variety of options at our fingertips is one of the strongest aspects of STO, to then make content that requires us to use a certain set up, specific classes with specific ships and specific builds to complete is a step backwards. The other issue I take with raids is that all you're really doing is repeating a pre-determined set of actions. A raid may be hard but it's pretty much paint-by-numbers. In STF's there's usually more than one way to tackle a certain problem.
Parts of your idea have merit when adapted to STO but I think the raid-ship is starting to sail, I for one, will not be sad to see it go.
Actually, with what Blizzard has done with raiding in World of Warcraft, anyone who wants to raid is able to now, quite successfully. Every raid has a 10 man setting which rewards the same loot as the 20 man setting, and pick up groups beat the raid bosses every day, and there are ways to trigger harder encounters for those organized groups who want a stiffer challenge.
Essentially, the days where "raid" meant only the top few % ever saw the content have been gone for years now. In fact, most WoW raids these days take less time than it takes most folks to clear through the STF's here, so the argument about it taking too long is also no longer valid.
So, raids that fit this mold should be perfectly valid for STO, since your objections would be invalid in that scenario, no?
I mean, certainly there needs to be SOMETHING added to the end game to make the end game a viable place to be rather than a place where you farm a few dailies and then log off to log in your most recent alt ... or just log out altogether.
TBH nothing like crystaline entity, im not talking about people getting 1 shot and then the cube fully repairing its self...............
That being said, I would like to see the ability to join into larger groups than 5. In almost every series, we saw several instances where a large group of ships would join together for battle. At least in DS9, ships were grouped into "Fleets" and "Wings" (reference lines like "the 5th fleet..." or "have all Galaxy wings...").
Some examples of large-scale fleet engagements:
Vulcan-Andorian War (Ent)
Battle of Azati Prime (Ent)
Wolf 359 (TNG)
Blockade of the Romulans during the Klingon Civil War (TNG)
Siege of DS9 by the Klingons (DS9)
The Battle of Chintoka (DS9)
Retaking DS9 (DS9)
the Second Battle of Chintoka (DS9)
Taking Cardassia (DS9)
Year of Hell (fighting against the Krenim Timeship) (Voy)
Borg/8472 war (Voy)
Endgame (Voy)
Battle of Bassen Rift (Nemesis) - (referencing this one because Starfleet had sent a task force to assist)
Battle of Procyon V (Ent)
In each of these engagements, there were more than 5 ships on one side or the other, often hundreds of ships. That's how big space battles in STO should be: anywhere from 10 to 100 ships all working together. We can kind of do that now with Fleet Actions, but we're still limited to groups of 5. Even 10v10 pvp has to divide up rather than all being in the same group. That's a problem that should be fixed.
That would be a much better choice IMO.
Live long and prosper.
Ahh raiding...... Raid night = meeting time, 30-40 mins of stragglers and bs, 15-30 mins of group setup, 15-45 mins of trash and sub bosses, 5-15 mins of loot whining, 15 mins of boss setup and pee breaks, 20 mins of waiting for key people to finall get back from the pee break, 5-10 mins of fixing groups due to some folks needing to leave, 15 mins of moving to the final encounter 5 more mins of fixing groups, Ok engage when I tell you, WHO FIRED????, wipe.....15 mins torecover and fix groups due to folks needing to go, ENGAGE!!!, 5- 15 mins kill mob and mob's encounter mechanics, 15-20 mins of loot whining, YAY RAIDING!!!!!.
I miss all that, not.
I was a raid leader for a top EQ guild for several years. I absolutely loved raiding. So I guess you assertion that "nobody likes them" is off base, at least when it comes to me. I also know many people who play mmo's solely for the challenge that getting many people together to bring down something difficult entails. You don't speak for everybody, and just because you wouldn't want to play a "raid" (whatever that means in your mind), does not mean that we do not either.
End game content is seriously lacking. A re-imagined loot system with content for 10-20 people fleets, which were as accessible as the current raids in WoW ... that would be a fantastic addition to the end game.
In case you are not familiar with how things are done these days in raiding, read my previous post.
This has not been the case for raiding in quite some time now.
Except that WoW raiding has been made completely accessible to the masses now. Literally you can log in, say in chat that you are looking for a raid, get invited, and go kill bosses. It is extremely open to anyone who wants to experience it.
Raids in STO would not have to be static 1 to 1 copies of raids from other games. Just give us end game content ... something where we can get together with our friends to defeat something truly challenging for great rewards.
We're not the developers, so it's not really our job to figure out HOW to implement it... but certainly something needs to be done.
That has not been my experience. If it's not gear score or achievement requirements, it's some other form of d'baggery that makes the experience extremely unpleasant. I'm not against group content by any means but it has to do a better job of including as many players as possible.
I may not be a game developer but I know what I do and don;t like in my games and raiding is on the top of my list in terms of things to avoid.
Who's gonna tank? You can't really point to WoW as a great success. Tanks were literally demanding payment to raid, and now the system is bribing them to run content. I've been queued for an hour and a half while waiting for a tank because I refuse to have to pay someone even more to play content.
Only with a real Borg Cube. Not the Borg "battleships" that are in the game now.
But your posts suggest that it is not the raid content itself that you dislike, but rather some things you feel have been associated with previous raid content. Raiding can be added as end game content and designed in such a way as to mitigate or eliminate your complaint areas.
We have our own version of raids called fleet actions, and a cue system is going to be released for them in Season 4. Essentially making them raids.
Well ... so glad we've got you here to decide what there is place for in this game and what there isn't place for in this game. We can all go home now guys, Champion1701 has put to rest our desire for end game challenging content.
For the record, if you cant finish a STF, you are not properly geared or you do not know how to play your character well enough to be successful bottom line. I am not ripping on those that dont like the STFs, I dont care if some dont want to do them, thats fine. It those that say the cure is too hard or impossible to do, etc. that I have issues with.
There comes a point in every MMO where you have to have strong end-game content to keep people subscribed, if you dont the game will die. More STFs or changing fleet actions to raid content, so long as its challenging, it would be welcome to me.
Your right and I apologize.
This would be an admireable first step in the direction of true raids. After all...with the world of STO being at war...wouldn't raids reflect that more than the current skirmishes we have available?