Botting Nerfed yet Earning Time not

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LostPoet - Dreamweaver
LostPoet - Dreamweaver Posts: 396 Arc User
edited December 2014 in General Discussion
Yay! b:victory
DQ and drops for bots is down to 1 gold, so the inflation will stop hard.
People will run out of coin, so let the deflation begin!!

However, earning time, has not been restored. It was a good way to put limitations on bots and farming, but now that it has been nerfed, why hasn't earning time been removed or extended.

Especially during holidays or weekend times, where people would like to farm and get money and get gears, if you limit their time, well its like hey, we don't want you to farm or level too fast...
8 Hours also goes really fast; by the time you get done doing dailies, bh, and other instances liike FSP, you've already lost an hour or 2. b:cry

At least, each instance or location could have its own earning time. So limit the amount someone farms 1 stance over and over again, but then they could do something else, without being penalized....
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  • StellaNova - Raging Tide
    StellaNova - Raging Tide Posts: 348 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Yay non botting players won't even earn their repair bill anymore, not on drops, while doing bhs, base quests and such

    this game has been pay2winish for a long time, welcome to next stage: Pay2Play - not that i like the idea of this or rather i could waste my time on other games then...
    Miss my Avatar b:sad


    Starfall Marshall b:victory
  • Mosz - Heavens Tear
    Mosz - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,181 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    StellaNova - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Yay non botting players won't even earn their repair bill anymore, ...while doing bhs, ...

    bh is average 650k a day, you really shouldnt have that in repairs even if you do 30 minutes of pv a day

    additionally easy profit from new dungeon, FSP, high TT/WS/lunar drop demand with new classes and free lvl 100s for all

    you really think lack of profit based botting will hurt uber casuals more than it did the multi botters?

    you really didnt complain about the mass inflation over the last year? didnt notice gold price double and the price of pack items go up 50-100% over the last year? this is actively combatting that and yet still people complaining about things that arent even true..GG
  • Toliman - Raging Tide
    Toliman - Raging Tide Posts: 1,595 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    I had to vote for "Remove bots", but I not see such option.
  • ChiefZoltar - Heavens Tear
    ChiefZoltar - Heavens Tear Posts: 104 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Toliman - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I had to vote for "Remove bots", but I not see such option.

    If bots were removed, people will just go out and get a botting program and have an unfair advantage over the people who have no such program.
  • Toliman - Raging Tide
    Toliman - Raging Tide Posts: 1,595 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    ChiefZoltar - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    If bots were removed, people will just go out and get a botting program and have an unfair advantage over the people who have no such program.

    For this they must be banned.
  • Aubree - Dreamweaver
    Aubree - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,868 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    I voted to remove. It's freakin dumb as hell to enforce this on us because

    1. Not needed because of nerf everything patch.
    2. We don't have a fatigue system law like China does.
    3. No DQ rewards system and I don't see one coming... ever.
  • zombienationz
    zombienationz Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Freedom > Restrictions

    I honestly can't spend money on the game anymore as the constant bombardment of anti freedom conflicts with my morals.
  • Sirkura - Raging Tide
    Sirkura - Raging Tide Posts: 105 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Aubree - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    I voted to remove. It's freakin dumb as hell to enforce this on us because

    1. Not needed because of nerf everything patch.
    2. We don't have a fatigue system law like China does.
    3. No DQ rewards system and I don't see one coming... ever.

    Glad someone actually knows this >.> i think like 99% of players think that the earning time was set only to combat bots. in china its a law because this happened >.>

    http://www.ranker.com/list/8-people-who-died-playing-video-games/autumn-spragg
    first one in particular caught world wide attention.

    honestly earning time isn't so bad, who spends 8 hrs killing things other then botters? >.> i know i rarely get over 4-5 hrs even when i'm just grinding mats. and even then its only one character. whats stopping you from just switching to your new pill baby and grinding more? or another of your characters that your working on.
  • Toliman - Raging Tide
    Toliman - Raging Tide Posts: 1,595 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Sirkura - Raging Tide wrote: »
    ...

    honestly earning time isn't so bad, who spends 8 hrs killing things other then botters? >.> i know i rarely get over 4-5 hrs even when i'm just grinding mats. and even then its only one character. whats stopping you from just switching to your new pill baby and grinding more? or another of your characters that your working on.

    They bot on all their characters.

    This is why I want to remove bots, because they are not players, but bots "and have an unfair advantage over the people who have no " bots.
  • StellaNova - Raging Tide
    StellaNova - Raging Tide Posts: 348 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Mosz - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    bh is average 650k a day, you really shouldnt have that in repairs even if you do 30 minutes of pv a day

    additionally easy profit from new dungeon, FSP, high TT/WS/lunar drop demand with new classes and free lvl 100s for all

    you really think lack of profit based botting will hurt uber casuals more than it did the multi botters?

    you really didnt complain about the mass inflation over the last year? didnt notice gold price double and the price of pack items go up 50-100% over the last year? this is actively combatting that and yet still people complaining about things that arent even true..GG

    an average ain't worth much you know, Ecstasy Cards and Excitement Cards dosn't drop on a regular basis - like you are sure to get at least 5 Ecstasy and 1 Excitement cards each month if you do the bhs every day in a month.

    Based on Ectasycards alone you'll need 118,625 cards to maintain that average

    The other dungeons you mention can make a profit, sure, but both for the bhs and the dungeons, i think you assume i'm one of them "I ain't got a real life" players, sitting online a silly amount of hours every single day

    The nerf of the last dq and drop prices, only hurts the ppl who playes the game for what it is, a place to have some fun - it won't hurt ppl who already have billions, fully geared chars or ppl who act and play like this game is their life or their job

    About the inflation, i've noticed it, just the token price shows it well, complaining where over the inflation? on pwi troll forum?? sure i havn't

    Lets see in 6 months if the prices is down or not - only after some time it will show if this will stop the inflation - i doubt it tho, as some ppl still charge $$ to get what they want, and probally will keep doing.


    anyways - Merry Christmas b:pleased
    Miss my Avatar b:sad


    Starfall Marshall b:victory
  • Sirkura - Raging Tide
    Sirkura - Raging Tide Posts: 105 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Toliman - Raging Tide wrote: »
    They bot on all their characters.

    This is why I want to remove bots, because they are not players, but bots "and have an unfair advantage over the people who have no " bots.

    i fully agree with you here botting is annoying. tho i do find it useful for the more tedious quests, i'd prefere it to just be removed entirely. tho my post was about earning time, not really bots. all in all bots are gonna exist in one form or another. i've seen bots (before they were legal) that were in high factions botting herbs, grinding mobs, etc. its ridiculous and pwi doesn't do much about it. i think only 2 that i know of were ever banned. try going to hell. there is an herb "band" bots often follow it. earning time doesn't do anything to stop them. now combine that with what we saw from the PWCN NW forges. they have the same nerfs we have currently. and most those mats cost hundreds of millions of coin. users are still at a disadvantage because even the standard bot pwi has doesn't farm things like resources advanced bots do. which resources are not tied in with earning time. only thing that can actually help with that is the GMs actually giving a damn in game and banning players >.> more then a week.
  • Mosz - Heavens Tear
    Mosz - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,181 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    StellaNova - Raging Tide wrote: »
    an average ain't worth much you know, Ecstasy Cards and Excitement Cards dosn't drop on a regular basis - like you are sure to get at least 5 Ecstasy and 1 Excitement cards each month if you do the bhs every day in a month.
    An average is worth much, Expected Value is a great tool to calculate things and thats what i gave..
    Based on Ectasycards alone you'll need 118,625 cards to maintain that average
    [COLOR="rgb(139, 0, 0)"]what sorry i dotn get this number at all[/COLOR]

    The other dungeons you mention can make a profit, sure, but both for the bhs and the dungeons, i think you assume i'm one of them "I ain't got a real life" players, sitting online a silly amount of hours every single day
    in 1 hour its easy to get fsp+bh+primals done

    The nerf of the last dq and drop prices, only hurts the ppl who playes the game for what it is, a place to have some fun - it won't hurt ppl who already have billions, fully geared chars or ppl who act and play like this game is their life or their job
    no, it is already reducing prices and reducing inflation, it will make things much more reasonably priced for average players, and will help those not maxed out to catch up

    About the inflation, i've noticed it, just the token price shows it well, complaining where over the inflation? on pwi troll forum?? sure i havn't
    pointless statement, just say it clear:inflation wasnt a problem, or it was

    Lets see in 6 months if the prices is down or not - only after some time it will show if this will stop the inflation - i doubt it tho, as some ppl still charge $$ to get what they want, and probally will keep doing.
    prices are already going down, people charging money to get what they want is also not a bad thing, im sure you want things from the boutique so peopel selling gold is a good thing

    anyways - Merry Christmas b:pleased

    replies in red
  • merchant1337
    merchant1337 Posts: 22 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Just need to say this, people can still make profit from bots... (not as much). 2nd and most important, what makes you think prices drop aka "Deflation". First of all prices did not go higher because of bots... prices go higher because the individual perceives "A high demand" or believes their items are "Super special" and over price stuff. I guarantee you, the prices will not drop that you can take to the bank... if anything they will increase. You can quote me on that or make fun of me or slam it in my face if I am wrong.. But trust me its not about what people perceive is "Supply and Demand" or "to much coins". Its the age old reason in all games in all things prices go up 5 letter word "Greed". Bots have nothing to do with it. That being said what ever they do with bots I don't mind..b:byeb:laugh
  • heerohex#3018
    heerohex#3018 Posts: 4,807 Community Moderator
    edited December 2014
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    Earning time has be in the game from day 1. It was just not active! Second the Earning time is not just in place to stop bots. Your need to do some research on games in china for that part.

    TBH i would rather have auto culty removed and DQ put back or DQ points restored...
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  • LostPoet - Dreamweaver
    LostPoet - Dreamweaver Posts: 396 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Aubree - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    I voted to remove. It's freakin dumb as hell to enforce this on us because

    1. Not needed because of nerf everything patch.
    2. We don't have a fatigue system law like China does.
    3. No DQ rewards system and I don't see one coming... ever.

    +1

    Don't see any news about new DQ system...
    If there was anything in the works, with the 2 last major updates.. something would have been released or said...
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  • hoover69
    hoover69 Posts: 137 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    lets see they added that lame earning time and prices on armors/weapons/tokens and gold went up, then now they nerf dq and armor drops and prices on **** went up even more so how is nerfing **** down and adding earning time helping us?
  • eediot
    eediot Posts: 56 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Useless to remove earning time if drops aren't enough to pay for your repairs.
  • Poopinpanto - Heavens Tear
    Poopinpanto - Heavens Tear Posts: 274 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Before auto cultivation bots were implemented I rarely seen any illegal farming of bots. From time to time I would see one or two but were easy to determine it was a bot and it was reported and shortly after they were gone.People actually grinded for a few hours to get their dq points,and even then when we had Dq points I never ever EVER seen as many green dots farming than I seen with the **** loads of auto cultivating bots we have today.

    I make more from bh's on rewards than doing botting.And yeah Im actually a person who is real lucky on a daily basis with 5mill cards,2 mill cards,even socketstones/mirages to sell.

    But now here is a new threat to the game and probably bh's is the people that are currently abusing ToS with multiple "bh farm alts"..i repeat MULTIPLE BH FARMING ALTS AT THE SAME TIME...again I repeat MUL.....TI.....PLE!So this will lead to exploiting BH and thus will probably get it removed in the long run.China will say "hey we used to not have BH when the game first started so why would it hurt if we take it out." right?

    And why do people always throw down the "repair cost" card all the time?I meen really is 20k or so really that hard to come up with or even hell uhh 100k..100k repair bill would be like a hour on a +10 weapon sin and armor +6 soloing a FF run.Sane sin running solo in brim and killing 3 bosses is like 4-5k repair a run but profit on a x2 drops in there is probably over 200k a run..come on you people don't need to sweat repair bills.

    And also I have never even noticed botting making anything armor wise go up..if you do the math or had any mind of merchanting you can actually see the cost in making the gear and trying to turn a profit from it.To me people who complain about prices of gear are people who never made gear.Its kinda like making oil to gas..IT COST!
  • Keisari - Raging Tide
    Keisari - Raging Tide Posts: 384 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Earning time sucks for anyone running loads of FWS(Kitty's 3 times ran out of it by FWSing), thus Kitty voted for removal.

    About the BH rewards:

    Average reward from BHs ish 810k coins, calculated by using http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/quest/19965 's probabilities. That's excluding socket stones(due to lack of fixed price). If you mainly get sockets and chips...that's just your bad luck. Kitty knows that kind of luck far too well...

    And tbh Kitty doesn't see BH alts really as a problem. BH TT ish pretty much the only soloable BH, Snake being another if enough well-geared. It's impossible to even enter EU or AEU without doing culti so if one can do those on BH-alts, they must have worked quite much for them.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Kittysama - Raging Tide in APS-barb disguise, when avatars were bugged. Now posting again as Kittysama.
    Deleted old mains on Feb. 2014, back with every viable build covered, majority of them at or above non-rb 100.b:cute
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  • Aubree - Dreamweaver
    Aubree - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,868 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    heero200 wrote: »
    Earning time has be in the game from day 1. It was just not active! Second the Earning time is not just in place to stop bots. Your need to do some research on games in china for that part.

    TBH i would rather have auto culty removed and DQ put back or DQ points restored...

    We couldn't avoid the first dq nerfs before anyone dreamed of having an in-game bot; we won't avoid it now. I think we can press for removal of earning time because it should not apply to us in anyway.
  • Toliman - Raging Tide
    Toliman - Raging Tide Posts: 1,595 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Aubree - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    We couldn't avoid the first dq nerfs before anyone dreamed of having an in-game bot; we won't avoid it now. I think we can press for removal of earning time because it should not apply to us in anyway.

    He said, that he want "auto culty removed and DQ put back or DQ points restored".

    He not said about your bot's dreams though.

    And I want to quote useful tactic against selfish bots:
    Keisari - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Today a certain noob-seeker managed to drop into the pond while botting, ofc going for the invinsible mob preventing mining Archosaur Essence. Some suggested getting a psy with Spirit Phalanx to stop him, but as there was no psys available, a single Expel didn't stop the bot and Kitty wasn't sure if it would work anyway, Kitty came up with a solution that worked.b:cute

    What you need: 2 characters with Expel on genies and enough quick energy-recovery on genie.b:laugh

    Expel the bot on first character. When the Expel ends Expel again on second character, don't let the bot hit moar than once or twice. After second Expel bot should try Town Portaling out multiple times, but the mob interrupts it so use Expel once again when genie has recovered enough and bot ish channeling TP.

    If you can't use Expel on Town Portaling bot soon enough, it will start attacking the mob again and you'll need to start over.b:bye

    Also, if you want to get rid of a bot, this tactic should be useable in most places.b:sin
  • Sylvae - Sanctuary
    Sylvae - Sanctuary Posts: 1,018 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Don't forget, the old time players could then auto-culti their dusks/storms 24 hours a day, and level without doing much. So there's be complaining about the advantage old players have since we can afford to not pick things up while maximizing xp earning.
  • Jadsia - Lost City
    Jadsia - Lost City Posts: 1,322 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    I'm enjoying my selfish bot as I speak. 3x exp and it's doing fine.
    I **** bigger than you...

    Shut up and play the game.....Damn
  • Aubree - Dreamweaver
    Aubree - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,868 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Toliman - Raging Tide wrote: »
    He said, that he want "auto culty removed and DQ put back or DQ points restored".

    He not said about your bot's dreams though.

    And I want to quote useful tactic against selfish bots:

    And I was making the point that we will not in any way get either of those things removed. Like I said "We couldn't avoid the first dq nerfs before anyone dreamed of having an in-game bot".

    Some different language if you prefer for comprehension purposes...

    There is no way to avoid DQ nerf from China. We had to accept it as it was years before auto-culti existed. The thread is not about removal of auto-culti or reverting DQ/gear prices.... Because it is not possible at all.

    So back on topic, get rid of earning time.

    I kind of miss Frankie. He at least went to bat for the players. http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=722022&highlight=dragon+quest+reward
    However, our version of the game does not suffer from the same problem as the Chinese version, and we believe that it's unfair to you guys to have to deal with this change.

    China bot problem Watch Vid http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNzU4ODE3MDAw.html?qq-pf-to=pcqq.group
    Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Don't forget, the old time players could then auto-culti their dusks/storms 24 hours a day, and level without doing much. So there's be complaining about the advantage old players have since we can afford to not pick things up while maximizing xp earning.

    Well it's only efficient to do that for the 1 hour hyper, after that I send my storm to reflection. Eventually I do its culti, crazy stone and BH.

    I could just log multiple chars in 8 hour shifts, to bot exp for my storm since we all now have lvl 100 everything. It's not really a good excuse to limit earning time. Too many ways around earning time to try limit the power level of new classes.
  • Sylvae - Sanctuary
    Sylvae - Sanctuary Posts: 1,018 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Aubree - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Well it's only efficient to do that for the 1 hour hyper, after that I send my storm to reflection. Eventually I do its culti, crazy stone and BH.

    I could just log multiple chars in 8 hour shifts, to bot exp for my storm since we all now have lvl 100 everything. It's not really a good excuse to limit earning time. Too many ways around earning time to try limit the power level of new classes.

    You would be correct, if it wasn't for the X3 leveling. That basically neutralizes the downside of exhaustion. So it's easy enough to use 3 hours buffer for farming, hyper pv and run the rest out in farming, then continue to murder at X1.5 xp for 20 hours. Still better than reflection at that rate. If it was X2 only for event, might be different.
  • Toliman - Raging Tide
    Toliman - Raging Tide Posts: 1,595 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Aubree - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    ...

    I kind of miss Frankie. He at least went to bat for the players. http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=722022&highlight=dragon+quest+reward

    ...

    Do you know, when bots were introduced in pwi ?

    What you had quoted ?

    2010 year ?

    Why not 2008 ?

    Edit:
    SweetieBot, you one only can help players to understand, where are necro threads.
  • SweetieBot - Lothranis
    SweetieBot - Lothranis Posts: 18,978 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Toliman - Raging Tide wrote: »
    SweetieBot, you one only can help players to understand, where are necro threads.
    That's enough about me! Let's talk about you for a change.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    I only respond if you begin a line with "SweetieBot", read the link below for commands
    SweetieBot FAQ / Usage: pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1566451

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  • Toliman - Raging Tide
    Toliman - Raging Tide Posts: 1,595 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    SweetieBot - Lothranis wrote: »
    That's enough about me! Let's talk about you for a change.

    I am shocked.
  • Jadsia - Lost City
    Jadsia - Lost City Posts: 1,322 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Funny how some continue to blame botters for problems which have existed for years before auto culti was even introduced. Well, botters have been neutered and guess what? those same problems still exist. LOL.

    Ever wonder why the devs decided to nerf drops instead of botters? I believe it's because they know it's going to take a whole lot of coin to get those new 95 pill babies and the new classes all geared and skilled up so instead of allowing those people to farm their own coin the devs figured PWE and PWI could make a fortune forcing these nabs to charge gold and buy the coin from the high level hoarders like me in the AH. This is most certainly a far more profitable way to sink the coin out of the system for them. It's no wonder why gold prices are still high. It will be for quite some time too because people are going to want to gear and skill up their new toons.

    So you QQers blaming botters for high gold and other CS related prices just got owned. And not by the botters.
    I **** bigger than you...

    Shut up and play the game.....Damn
  • Toliman - Raging Tide
    Toliman - Raging Tide Posts: 1,595 Arc User
    edited December 2014
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    Jadsia - Lost City wrote: »
    Funny how some continue to blame botters for problems which have existed for years before auto culti was even introduced. Well, botters have been neutered and guess what? those same problems still exist. LOL.

    Ever wonder why the devs decided to nerf drops instead of botters? I believe it's because they know it's going to take a whole lot of coin to get those new 95 pill babies and the new classes all geared and skilled up so instead of allowing those people to farm their own coin the devs figured PWE and PWI could make a fortune forcing these nabs to charge gold and buy the coin from the high level hoarders like me in the AH. This is most certainly a far more profitable way to sink the coin out of the system for them. It's no wonder why gold prices are still high. It will be for quite some time too because people are going to want to gear and skill up their new toons.

    So you QQers blaming botters for high gold and other CS related prices just got owned. And not by the botters.


    Botters are one of the causes of inflation.


    If bot got R9 during 8 month,

    then hundreds players got highest gold prices.

    Nothing in universe comes from nothing and thing can't disappear into nothing.

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