PWI PvP Tournament [Now with sign-up dates in red]

Neodaystar - Sanctuary · May 2014

sparkiesoft wrote: »

Not sure how we're going to split up weapon/gear, but I'm open to options. As for g16 +10-12, they will of course be put in some sort of bracket. Right now we're focused on the highest bracket, but like I said before, any ideas you all have let me know.

Sparkie, it is hard to place participants with mix gears/refines/shards. Just remember that all this adds up to is numerical data that determines the character's overall strength. As mentioned by another person before, why not base the brackets on a player's attack and defense index, soul force level, and spirit stats as well. These stat values you can reach has a correlation to a person's equipped gear type, level, etc...

Any person in game with an item called "eye of observation" or gear that has this ability, can activate a special in game feature to check another person's overall attack and defense index. I am not sure what the threshold values for each type of gear/refines/shards/lvl - but as a gm you can easily equip any item and compile the numerical data into a chart to help with organizing brackets.

People with similar index stats usually means their gear strength is similar, and in the end - the winner is determined by skills, teamwork, and some luck.

Desdi - Sanctuary · May 2014

Neodaystar - Sanctuary wrote: »

Sparkie, it is hard to place participants with mix gears/refines/shards. Just remember that all this adds up to is numerical data that determines the character's overall strength. As mentioned by another person before, why not base the brackets on a player's attack and defense index, soul force level, and spirit stats as well. These stat values you can reach has a correlation to a person's equipped gear type, level, etc...

Any person in game with an item called "eye of observation" or gear that has this ability, can activate a special in game feature to check another person's overall attack and defense index. I am not sure what the threshold values for each type of gear/refines/shards/lvl - but as a gm you can easily equip any item and compile the numerical data into a chart to help with organizing brackets.

People with similar index stats usually means their gear strength is similar, and in the end - the winner is determined by skills, teamwork, and some luck.

Yeah this is a good idea; I forgot about that feature.
They should definitely go with this.

strinthme · May 2014

Thanks

Wolf_joker - Lost City · May 2014

Thanks

XXHotXx - Morai · May 2014

+1 5v5 (2 max per class allowed, and 1max sin and 1max barb) with no restrictions on buffs

or +1 for the 3v3 (1 max per class allowed) self buffs

no resurrection allowed (res scrolls, cleric revive, mystic resurrection)

Socqar - Lost City · May 2014

XXHotXx - Morai wrote: »

+1 5v5 (2 max per class allowed, and 1max sin and 1max barb) with no restrictions on buffs

or +1 for the 3v3 (1 max per class allowed) self buffs

no resurrection allowed (res scrolls, cleric revive, mystic resurrection)

Even if I completely understand the reasons, I'd say that's a bit racist (clasist? XD). Why not making just 5 without same class 2 times?

That would be some fun 5 ppl rainbow squads... Barb, bm and ep would be completely a must, meaning other 2 classes would switch (who wanna go pvp without those lvl 11 buffs?)

Marengo - Lost City · May 2014

First of all I agree on using attack/def index for categorizing participants.

sparkiesoft wrote: »

- You have to create your own teams. There will also be a set limit of 2 of each class per team. (IE, no more than 2 clerics, sins, barbs, etc.)

I have a suggestion to mix all players and let pre-defined squad leaders to pick ppl for their squads 1 by 1 or make squads randomly, like on nw. There is a certain disadvantage in it since most active well geared guys have perma squads and feel more comfortable fighting on the side of their friends, but random distribution would add some newness to fight, imo b:chuckle

XXHotXx - Morai · May 2014

Marengo - Lost City wrote: »

First of all I agree on using attack/def index for categorizing participants.

I have a suggestion to mix all players and let pre-defined squad leaders to pick ppl for their squads 1 by 1 or make squads randomly, like on nw. There is a certain disadvantage in it since most active well geared guys have perma squads and feel more comfortable fighting on the side of their friends, but random distribution would add some newness to fight, imo b:chuckle

wow yes an awesome idea would be that players just sign up for the event,

then the gms use stuff like http://www.random.org/integers/

to generate random teams and then its up to them to work best

and if you get an OP team against you just have to blame the bad luck

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands · May 2014

In a 5vs5 I would say like someone else did suggest a rainbow squad, 1 class of each max

Selak - Dreamweaver · May 2014

Sparkie,
This is a great idea,
I would also suggest, that if you guys cannot organize it or do not have the time, maybe one of the forum members could either live stream to a twitch games tv channel or at least post a recording there as it is a gamers site as it would be good advertizing in some ways.
Well done for a cool idea.
b:victory

Ulquiorraa__ - Raging Tide · May 2014

sparkiesoft wrote: »

Okay so based off feedback, here are some projected changes. Keep in mind that these can and probably will change.

Getting everyone in the same gear and on a brand new server for this event is not possible. We don't have the tools and we're more than likely not going to get support from China anyways.

So now that's out of the way, here are some changes.

- Everything goes, charms, pots, etc.

- It goes from being 1 v 1 duels, to 5 v 5 (Maybe 3 v3, what do you think?) straight pvp.

- You have to create your own teams. There will also be a set limit of 2 of each class per team. (IE, no more than 2 clerics, sins, barbs, etc.)

-If we do it this way, the grand prize still remains, which means the winning team would have to split it with each individual.

- There is a 10 minute timer, instead of 5 (Maybe 15).

Thoughts, opinions?

Also, we may push this event back towards the end of June to allow more prep time.

Edit: We would also highly suggest the use of 3rd party communication software, such as Teamspeak, Vent, Skype, or Mumble. This will allow you to coordinate with your team easier.

Free Communication Software

Skype: http://www.skype.com/en/
Mumble: http://www.mumble.com/get-mumble.php

Paid

Teamspeak: http://www.teamspeak3.com/
Ventrillo: http://www.instantventrilo.com/

So In other words u are saying the team that can't get 2 r9rr+12 JoSD clerics must lose, From my experience I suggest u limit clerics in team to 1 please . Cleric is a Monster damn broken Class that can change the whole fight trajectory , Its the winning card for any fight .b:bye

Azura - Lost City · May 2014

XXHotXx - Morai wrote: »

+1 5v5 (2 max per class allowed, and 1max sin and 1max barb) with no restrictions on buffs

or +1 for the 3v3 (1 max per class allowed) self buffs

no resurrection allowed (res scrolls, cleric revive, mystic resurrection)

I think it should be only the buffs you can get from your squad or with pots. Example: if you don't have a cleric, then you cannot have a cleric to buff you from outside.

Annalyse - Heavens Tear · May 2014

Marengo - Lost City wrote: »

First of all I agree on using attack/def index for categorizing participants.

I have a suggestion to mix all players and let pre-defined squad leaders to pick ppl for their squads 1 by 1 or make squads randomly, like on nw. There is a certain disadvantage in it since most active well geared guys have perma squads and feel more comfortable fighting on the side of their friends, but random distribution would add some newness to fight, imo b:chuckle

This is a great idea. I thought people making their own squads was a bad idea from the beginning, as people are only going to pick the best geared +12 people to join them, whereas the gear category will have lesser refined and sharded people in the mix. Set your category limits, have people sign up, and random the squads... it might not be possible to do it rainbow that way, but I also agree that you probably don't want two barbs and certainly not two clerics.

And yeah, 250 gold isn't as bad split 5 ways I suppose. Still too much to only split 3 ways. I still think it would be cooler to offer flyers or mounts that are rare so people could have something special.

How are you deciding who is the winner out of the group of winners amongst the categories? Or are you giving that much gold to the winner of each level/gear group? It's not like the winners can fight each other, but you can't really go by HP % because things are very different in the different categories (and that's also going to be hard to keep track of in groups).

Azura - Lost City wrote: »

I think it should be only the buffs you can get from your squad or with pots. Example: if you don't have a cleric, then you cannot have a cleric to buff you from outside.

I agree with this if squads aren't random. That will make people choose a greater variety of classes.

Desdi - Sanctuary · May 2014

Marengo - Lost City wrote: »

First of all I agree on using attack/def index for categorizing participants.

I have a suggestion to mix all players and let pre-defined squad leaders to pick ppl for their squads 1 by 1 or make squads randomly, like on nw. There is a certain disadvantage in it since most active well geared guys have perma squads and feel more comfortable fighting on the side of their friends, but random distribution would add some newness to fight, imo b:chuckle

I quite like this idea as well b:laugh

Jarkhen - Archosaur · May 2014

Not sure I agree with the idea of picking squads at event time (or randoming them) -- it would (1) take a long time, when the event itself is already going to be eating up a significant portion of Sparkie's time and (2) be a pain in the *** to organize. Plus, it takes away a level of strategy, pre-planning, and the feeling of accomplishing something (or trying to) with a group of friends.

Azura - Lost City · May 2014

Jarkhen - Archosaur wrote: »

Not sure I agree with the idea of picking squads at event time (or randoming them) -- it would (1) take a long time, when the event itself is already going to be eating up a significant portion of Sparkie's time and (2) be a pain in the *** to organize. Plus, it takes away a level of strategy, pre-planning, and the feeling of accomplishing something (or trying to) with a group of friends.

Yeah, I don't think random teams are viable, and most people will want their friends for the tourney.

sparkiesoft · May 2014

I like the idea of going off attack/spirit, etc however I'm not sure on the random teams. As for limits on Clerics and Barbs, we may change that to 1 each, but I'll need to discuss with DoD on that, since he's helping me with the event as well.

My question to you now, what do you think the threshold for attack, defense, soul force, spirit should be for the highest tier?

EG: Players with 100-150 attack, 200-300 defense, 100-200 soul force, 200-300 spirit. Anyone with those numbers, or in-between would qualify for the highest tier. (Keep in mind I made up these numbers, as I don't know what they would look like on the highest tiered players)

ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide · May 2014

Ok, I know I might be a little late on this thread and from what I have skimmed through I'm getting the opinion people are making this more difficult than it need to be.

From Sparkie's POV how ever this event is to implemented, is need to be supported from China. So my first quest is, why not enable the death-match arena?
The instance is already there. It allows for squads from 1 to 6. I would suggest updating the rewards from the winning team takes all from the entry fee to some token that can be traded for avatar cards, event card, EXP, REP, or whatever PWI decides.

I agree with a tier system for levels similar to Thursday's tourney.

As for scheduling, do a setup like marriage where teams can pick a time works best for them.

So from a programming and support perspective much of the work is already done it just reusing existing code from other events for this one; and, this can be a big selling point to China.

Jarkhen - Archosaur · May 2014

The more I think about it (and the more I go around and look), the more I think we should stick with survival index and ignore damage index, which doesn't seem to make much sense (a full r9r3+12 nw upgraded seeker on my server has 93k, while a +10 non-nw veno has 106k -- and you have issues with e.g. barbs, where a +12 josd barb here has 25k).

For the rest -- it's hard to say for sure, but I would put as an absolute minimum:

>150k survival index (maybe something higher for barbs? idk)
>275 spirit (which is somewhere around MS X w/ unleveled B lifeprime + soulprime cards)
>25k soulforce (which is ~= full +10 without NW upgrades)

And leave it at that. Any higher, and you'd be restricting against people that I'd argue would have a place in top-tier fights, at least on Archo (unless you literally only want 2 or 3 squads total participating). You might want to make an exception in a case where one person in a submitted team doesn't quite meet the requirements (bend the rules a little) -- maybe just say that's the requirement for the average gear level.

Also, remember to note that if you have an index that's high enough, there seems to be an overflow error somewhere and it ends up displaying as zero. These people should automatically qualify.

Alternatively, you could do away with the survival index altogether. It's a pain for people to figure out (they have to get an eye of observation or a jungle belt), and spirit + soulforce should do the job fine.

I'd also like to reiterate that I'd 100x prefer a 10v10 format over 5v5 or 3v3, even if it means splitting the reward 10 ways (leave the 2-per-class restriction as is). It'd be much more interesting and you'd have less trouble with class imbalances.

Cytte - Harshlands · May 2014

sparkiesoft wrote: »

(Keep in mind I made up these numbers, as I don't know what they would look like on the highest tiered players)

Man I wish you played more.

Pop in north or south arch, look for the people with the best gears and just see what their stats are, or hide somewhere (honestly anywhere the open world is as empty as space) take of gm gear, summon various tears of gear for yourself put them on writing down important stats and boom, all you;d need to do is ask for people's spirit

The community shouldn't do the work for your vague idea

Deceptistar - Sanctuary · May 2014

if its a group VS group PVP why dont you randomly mix n match pple instead of letting them make their own 'comfy' little groups that read each others minds and moves, just to make it a little more ...thought inducing.
After all, you want it to be a step different than normal PVP gank outside safezone.

Jarkhen - Archosaur · May 2014

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

if its a group VS group PVP why dont you randomly mix n match pple instead of letting them make their own 'comfy' little groups that read each others minds and moves, just to make it a little more ...thought inducing.
After all, you want it to be a step different than normal PVP gank outside safezone.

(1) You're going to end up having an event that takes way too long. If we had a system that could do this automatically, fine. As it is? Sparkie would have to spend 30 mins to an hour splitting people up and getting things organized before he could even start with the fights, which would then be another 10-20 minutes each.

(2) Why some people are so against pre-arranged squads is honestly beyond me. You can pre-plan, you know the strengths and weaknesses of other people in your squad, and I don't know about you, but it's a hell of a lot easier for me to get voice communication going with a squad of people I know than it is with a bunch of randoms. How is any of this considered a detriment? These should be things that are included in squad play, not discouraged.

Eoria - Harshlands · May 2014

Random squads should be saved for a separate tourney once this one has proven a success.

Deceptistar - Sanctuary · May 2014

Jarkhen - Archosaur wrote: »

(1) You're going to end up having an event that takes way too long. If we had a system that could do this automatically, fine. As it is? Sparkie would have to spend 30 mins to an hour splitting people up and getting things organized before he could even start with the fights, which would then be another 10-20 minutes each.

(2) Why some people are so against pre-arranged squads is honestly beyond me. You can pre-plan, you know the strengths and weaknesses of other people in your squad, and I don't know about you, but it's a hell of a lot easier for me to get voice communication going with a squad of people I know than it is with a bunch of randoms. How is any of this considered a detriment? These should be things that are included in squad play, not discouraged.

1) emphasis on the word "random"

2) nothing against it. But like you said, its 'easier'. Making it random just takes away your comfy baby blanket. Frustrating? yes. Its just another hurdle to overcome. But i guess for some, they always like it easy.

edit*
think of it as teachers randomly putting pple in discussion groups. Its always more easier and comfortable with friends but being comfy isnt the point is it lol. Its about exploring new areas, pple, ways of communication, etc.

Jarkhen - Archosaur · May 2014

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

1) emphasis on the word "random"

2) nothing against it. But like you said, its 'easier'. Making it random just takes away your comfy baby blanket. Frustrating? yes. Its just another hurdle to overcome. But i guess for some, they always like it easy.

edit*
think of it as teachers randomly putting pple in discussion groups. Its always more easier and comfortable with friends but being comfy isnt the point is it lol. Its about exploring new areas, pple, ways of communication, etc.

This is a group competition, not a classroom. We aren't here to "explore new people," we're here to compete against other groups.

And no, this isn't about "liking it easy." The groups I'd be competing against would have the exact same advantages. This is about not taking away things that are supposed to be important elements of competitive group play.

Deceptistar - Sanctuary · May 2014

Jarkhen - Archosaur wrote: »

This is a group competition, not a classroom. We aren't here to "explore new people," we're here to compete against other groups.

And no, this isn't about "liking it easy." The groups I'd be competing against would have the exact same advantages. This is about not taking away things that are supposed to be important elements of competitive group play.

No one said its literally a classroom.
The important elements of competitive group play are relative to how high or low you want your hurdle to be when you execute your actions. Im just making the hurdle higher as opposed to you keeping it lower. The basic elements are there, you just have more things to calculate into fact.

Man - Raging Tide · May 2014

Please do not allow buff Apothecary.

Namely Spirit of assault, Spirit of defense, Blinking Poultice, and Shining Pill.

Jarkhen - Archosaur · May 2014

Man - Raging Tide wrote: »

Please do not allow buff Apothecary.

Namely Spirit of assault, Spirit of defense, Blinking Poultice, and Shining Pill.

I disagree with this. They should be perfectly acceptable to be used once the fight has started. They cost your 2 minute apoth cd in exchange for buffs. I don't see why that has to be prohibited.

Using beforehand, sure, prohibit that. But during the fight? No.

Azura - Lost City · May 2014

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

if its a group VS group PVP why dont you randomly mix n match pple instead of letting them make their own 'comfy' little groups that read each others minds and moves, just to make it a little more ...thought inducing.
After all, you want it to be a step different than normal PVP gank outside safezone.

Why do you want to have random teams? To make PW even more different from any other game? In any team game tournament the teams are always people who already know each other. If they can read each other mind's just bare with it.

Also, if it were random teams, you could have situations where the teammates won't work together because they already hate each other.

Deceptistar - Sanctuary · May 2014

Azura - Lost City wrote: »

Why do you want to have random teams? To make PW even more different from any other game? In any team game tournament the teams are always people who already know each other. If they can read each other mind's just bare with it.

Also, if it were random teams, you could have situations where the teammates won't work together because they already hate each other.

like i already stated before, its only to make the hurdle higher be it physically or mentally. Some pple like it lower, the cards in their hands are preset, preplanned, prearranged etc and the only challenge is duking it out with the other side. And then there are those that prefer it higher, a surprise box, you dont know what you get but you work with what you get on your side and the other side, and it makes the accomplishment of the challenges much more. Outside your comfort zone is where the challenges begin.

PWI PvP Tournament [Now with sign-up dates in red]

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