Assassin Skills

SinfulLia - Archosaur wrote: »

Personally I think if knife throw had a chance to purge it would be really great

Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Raving Slash
For the next 8 seconds you suffer a 30% loss to damage, but gain a 50% physical defense boost and 30% magic defense boost.

Cooldown 10 seconds..

VergilSama - Raging Tide wrote: »

umm for pve make demon Rib Strike Reduce target's attack speed by 100% :P

edit : and a question : does demon subsea increases the duration of the skill by 7 seconds ? means that it will last 16 second ?

Deadalus - Harshlands wrote: »

Yes, althought, that 8 + 7 = 15.

Skaitavia wrote: »

I would like to see Assassin's DoT skills (Toxic Torrent and Puncture Wound) be based off of soulforce instead of a static damage multiplier that doesn't do much damage at all in both PvE and PvP.

_JlN_ - Heavens Tear wrote: »

A charm disable effect - since we are sins, we should be able to strike that vital organ in our opponents that affects their charm.

The_Stoner - Raging Tide wrote: »

how about tidal and and focused mind avoid bramble that would help us out nicely then we wont b compleatly useless when it comes to those brambled or atleast give it a 50% chance to avoid bramble damage

Slice/nDice - Archosaur wrote: »

yea i like the idea of a charm disabling effect, tho "overpowered" all sins really have thats worth nething is a few stuns most ppl can get out of pretty easily, and **** skills, that would make it where we actually have a chance against a strong veno or barb or psych. and the idea of soulforce base skills is really good, i think sins skills need to be overhauled really if you dont have decent aps as a sin you really dont have much at all, i even wouldnt mind losing bloodpaint for some decent pvp apt abilities, and also whats with knife throw being the only range skill sins even have, every other class even if not range oriented has at least two, so if anything id at least like another ranged attack

Edalus - Momaganon wrote: »

Power Dash: change it to a self-buff and erase the damage component, extend the duration to 10 sec. Or they could make this skill much more stronger and extend the duration, making the Sin the class which does high and leval critical damage for a short duration; I am speaking of enhancing Rage Damage up to 400 or 500% (total) and the normal 40 or 50% Crit chance buff.

400% or 500% Rage Damage. Very nice. You effectively make an assassin the deadliest class in the game, but only this time with no counters. Full S3 sins with Powerdash effectively have 100% critical. Therefore, any Powerdash would basically one-shot anyone, through def charm. With 400% Rage damage, you wouldn't even need zerk, and if you did have zerk, you could one-shot through pdef charm. Please explain the balance of this.

Auto-Attack: lower damage in PvP for 50% at least or make "Fortification Draught" a permanent buff which lasts for 15 mins and procs like now with a 10 sec cooldown between each proc.

The only apothecaries that last more than 2 minutes usually are self-buffs, i.e, passive. Like, NW wine, which improves your own stats. Fortification draught, which has a script of its own to "activate" at a certain time, is too complex to be added to that list.

Speed up or strengthen some skills (like Raving Slash or Slipstream Strike) so that a Sin can hit once a second with some skills or can do a bit more spike damage, giving him better chances to build up pressure.
Maybe introducing Combos would be great which enhance following skills.

Slipstream level 11 hits insanely high. Raving Slash... meh, it would be nice if something was added there. But "combos" are seeker-stance only.

The Sin uses two daggers, so it would be ok to give him another Knife Throw, or making Raving Slash a range attack, given that it gets partly adapted to the old Knife Throw.

Another ranged skill would be nice, possibly with an animation similar to Gemini Slash.
"Ghost Dagger" - the shadows infuse the assassin's body, making them able to move instantly and deal a deadly strike, then return to their previous position.

The Sin is like the Bm bound to melee attacks but lacks the high defences so there should be means for him to catch up with his enemy; most often the enemy gets plenty of chances to run around a little till every side effect of the skills runs out.

Whirlwind genie skill. Get it.

Another option would be to erase the time component of skills like Power Dash and give them a per hit component like "for the next 5 hits, the crit chance gets improved by xx%".

So, like, Pdef and Mdef charms? No, that part of the game is for apothecary only. Besides, it that would be OP. Example: "New" Powerdash - wait 1 minute - Inner harmony - wait one minute - double spark - inner harmony - attack. This could be too easily abused, like the first triple sparks in stealth during the first weeks of the expansion.

Or they could emphasise the crippling aspect of a Sin so that the Sin lowers with every skill the defences and accuracy and channel speed of the enemy giving him better chances the longer a fight lasts: stackable debuffs so to say, and every skill has another little debuff which stacks.


Spell Cutter reduces channeling speed. Subsea "reduces defenses". Powerdash, condensed thorn, and our own sparks increase our own damage. Accuracy is pretty much a non-factor in this game now.

Edalus - Momaganon wrote: »

A bit overdramatising, are we not?
400 or 500% Rage Damage during a 10 sec time frame or for the next hits is nothing that would make the Sin into the deadliest class, really, ever fought against S2 or S3 Seeker? Or Bms? Or even Clerics?

Yes, I've fought all full S3 classes on a half-dph armour S1 sin. Powerdash is OP as it is if you know what is going on.

A Sin does not have much time or chances to kill them nor does he have the chance right now - with skills - to beat 30k+ hp. Even killing a S3 Cleric is virtually a thing of luck. (I am talking about opponents with high refines and sockets)

If you don't have the same gear as your opponent, you ought to expect difficulties.

He would oneshoot everyone? Certainly, only those enemies he was already able to oneshoot. Power Dash was good in the days as S1 was the strongest armour, but now the defences are much stronger.

S3 already has a chance to 1shot another S3 with a zerk crit. Powerdash at that level, along with your suggested "improvement", would basically make a 1shot a consistent option. Please explain how the ability to one-shot a character every thirty seconds is not unbalanced.

Would a Sin become a killing machine? Surely not, heard of Ironguard Powder? Or Faith? Or Absolute Domain? Or Pan Gu's Essence? Get it. There are varous ways to counter this, the Sin would only be a real threat at times and not simply an annoyance.

So you're telling me that a sin is only an "annoyance", which is why you go into IG/Faith/AD/PanGu/Sutra. The sin is a threat as it is; any more amp on Powerdash and the sin would become OP.
You could take my words with a grain of salt if I was another class. But, coming from a sin, I'd say its an opinion.

To see the other side: other classes like Wizards, Psychics, Seekers, Clerics or even Blademasters have the means to oneshoot a Sin - even in S3 with high refines - or to kill him almost instantly. But what can do the Sin? Sneak to them and spark and use Power Dash and hope to get a lucky-shot as without zerk his damage would only be enough for lower refined opponents.

So you're telling me the only way to kill someone with equal gear is to... stealth to them, spark, and powerdash? Okay.

Even a Slipstream Strike lv11 deals not insanely high damage; that is only possible against enemies with TT99 or R8 as their armour is now strongly outgeared.

Any normal hit is weak vs equal gear. DPH sins rely on crits and zerks to kill their equally geared peers (especially the tankier ones).

And I spoke of real Combos not only a succession of two skills; I had in mind a skill chain which would amplify the damage or with variation lead to crippling effects on the target.

Staggering Strike on someone with an Eye of Northern Defense causes a freeze. That sounds like a crippling effect.
Arme Nier+Duelist's Glee will deal an extra 4000 damage and disable weapon. That sounds like a crippling effect.
There are more. It would be best to leave classes with what they're given - otherwise, you'd might as well argue to give sins something like a mystic's self heals, or a venomancer's pet. Classes in the game are played because they have a specific available skillset, not because they have the skills of every other class all in one package.

One thing to remember: We are talking about Sin's skills and not Genie's skills, that are skills only available to Sins and I do not take into account skills of a Genie and even more Genie's skills which have a false description because it does not state that the skill Whirlwind freezes its target for 1 sec and then slow it.

So again, you're saying that every class should have every "method" of doing something. It is foolish to disregard genie - the main reason for their implementation was to subsist the lacking's of one's own class, not just be "there" because they're not needed.

This is a thread to speak out some ideas: where is the gain of saying what one deems possible and what not? APS is the most slug brained tactic in PvP and if you think changing Fortification Draught would be too difficult, well, why not then lower auto-attack damage per se (in PvP at least)? Like every damage is already lowered?

APS is the most slug brained tactic in PvP, but not because of its damage.
It's the fact that any APS sin can be basically three-shot by an equally geared DPH playstyle. The problem of overpowering damage that an APS sin possesses has already been countered - this is why you don't see QQ all over the forums about it.

Well, if you think it would be viable to wait two minutes to kill some enemies and then to wait again two minutes to do it again, then yes, it could be a tactic -- but to counter this, there could be two conditions: either next 5 hits or at most 20 sec. (This way it would be harder to ruin a skill like Power Dash but that slow-poke tactic would be prevented.)

You seem to imply sins require apothecary to kill someone.
You seem to imply Powerdash, aka 100% crit, should be applied for either 5 hits, therefore for an infinite time period, or for 20 seconds.
Triple Spark only lasts 15 seconds. Yes, please, make our 2-spark skill more overpowered than our triple spark.

Spell Cutter, Subsea Strike are twee skills and do not have anything special on them: 3 sec slower channel is mean but does mean nothing nowadays. And 30 or 50% more damage reads nice but is negligible -- except against TT99 or R8 toons.

Spell Cutter - interrupts casting, acts as a damage skill, hits hard. Yes, we could totally get rid of it.
Subsea Strike is a twee skill. It amplifies damage by up to 30% on a non-sage character. Of course it is not necessary. That would also explain why APS sins use windshield for 20% more damage, and why people Extreme Poison for 20% more damage. Yes, I understand you.