My Thoughts on Archer Skill 'Re-balancing'

Yeah. Them making sage also a part of the whole burst damage thing was poorly done, IMO. And making i guaranteed on top of that was just.. meh.

I was hoping it'd make sage's strengths improved instead of making them demons but slightly different.


But at least demons still get the burger fairy.

Demon still has Spark Burst and Barrage. They are still better at fisting and mass pk.

In 1 vs 1 pk with bows I'd rather be sage because of the range, stun and crit. Also the chaining together of metal skills. (Not that I will ever get to PK in this version coz I cant afford anything better than rank 8).

Demons can close the crit gap quite a bit using the Faction Base Buff (with which sage QS doesn't stack).

I bet Asterelle will come along and tell us, objectively, what is best.

_blood_rain - Sanctuary wrote: »

More annoying than the skill changes is the recent plague of sage pride that's been going around.

I'm not so much seeing Sage pride as Demon shame. You guys should have known that if you tinker with the devil It's all gonna end up bad in the end. The cackling cockerels have had their wings clipped. The hens are taking over the chicken coop b:chuckle

_blood_rain - Sanctuary wrote: »

The base crit buff doesn't stack with demon crit buffs either >.> kinda pointless for a demon archer. The only archers I knew who used em were sage, or just really dumb demons.

Ah yea, should have guessed. But do you really fire off STA and Stun for the crit all that often?

EDIT: yea stun is usually the opener. Been so long since i played demon I cant even remember how much your crit gets buffed or how long it lasts etc.

Asterelle does the duration of PK affect those figures? Would an RPK lasting about 10 or 20 seconds bias the results toward sage? In a time frame of, say, 10 seconds how many extra attacks would the Demon get?

Demon quickshot is still better IMO. Attack speed gives you more changes to crit in itself and a better chance to proc purge. I believe that's why they made sage QS proc 100%; the crit buff isn't as strong as the attack speed buff in the first place.


Sage stun arrow was pretty good already and is now even better. I can see it making or breaking a 1v1, but as a TW junkie, the crit is still more important to me. I used to think sage/demon stun arrow was a tossup to preference and style, and while I still stand by that, the sage stun does synergize with their QS now the same way demon QS and stun did.


Sage did get some nice buffs but if I got to pick again I would still be demon. However I've always said that because it was my play style, not because I felt one or the other was better. Especially with the buff to Awaken, I think chi drain is more useful than chi gain. And of course, demon barrage is unquestionably better.

From asking around my archer friends, none. They're mostly just annoyed at the godaweful noise crappy sage archers are making.


Yes, crappy sage archers. The good ones didn't need the buff to be good so...

It's fun fuelling the ancient demon/sage conflict but really I don't think Sage is better now. In some situations perhaps. I think people now have more of a choice when they come to their cultivation path. That's a good thing.

Elenacostel - Heavens Tear wrote: »

To be honest, my biggest complaint about demon is the horrible triple spark icon. It is so fugly that I actually made a macro that consists of triple spark -> attack so that I don't have to look at the horrible piece of art on my skill bar.

LOLOLOLOL b:laughb:laughb:laugh Sorry I am kind of hyper today and that often translates into easily amused.

Come On Guys can't we just give this Demon vs Sage a rest already. We are all Proud Archers so lets just help each other to fight better and play better also make our class command even more Respect regardless to what cultivation path we choose. b:pleased

Iyania - Heavens Tear wrote: »

LOLOLOLOL b:laughb:laughb:laugh Sorry I am kind of hyper today and that often translates into easily amused.

No need to apologize, you can hyper me any day

lol at sage archers who think that becoming half-*** versions of demon archers is a good reason to act arrogant.

Kinda nice for you to crit more often than you dont for pretty much any hit you deal.

In my opinion it's as close as you could get it to being balanced.
It's not like they've taken anything away from demon archers.

In some cases sage is better, in some cases it isnt. That's the whole point i think...b:chuckle

Sage hits harder, crits more, gain chi faster allowing for better chaining of magic damage skills (along with the fact that thunderous blast has a lower channel and cast time) and general chi consuming skills which means in combat you could probably boa sooner than a demon, anti stun and so on.. so are more defensive (<-generalisation here) and in general the debuffs/status effects are just better e.g. STA, stunning arrow, storm rage (which now decreases defenses by 50% apparently? (according to this thread) etc.

From my point of view - sage's are able to deal a lot more magical damage over time out than a demon, demon still seems to pull ahead in terms of physical damage what with their quickshot and crit buffs which arent that bad tbh.

I mean sage archers in my mind have always been a bit more magic damage based and archers are a crit based magic and physical damage class.

Kinda makes sense in terms of the whole initial balance idea?

And sorry if i got this wrong (please correct me if i have) but vicious arrow now increases wood damage taken by a target by 35%? (i think! again sorry if this is wrong)
If thats true however, it will be kinda nice for sage archers to team up with mystics and venos.. (*hopes its true cause my wifey's a mystic* b:dirty)

Demon hits faster, higher chance to purge per unit of time for those with purge bows (which is freaking OP), has higher base crit (which is kinda nice for those long BOA's on the crystal and towers) and accuracy (from what i remember at least).


In conclusion i think before the update the shift in the spectrum of

Sage is just better<->playing style justifying sage<->playing style justifying demon<->demon is just better

thing was a little more heavily stacked on the "demon skills just being better" side.

Now it's most definitely somewhere towards the middle which i think is the whole idea of giving people a choice.
At least people will now think more carefully and are more likely to form their own opinion rather than just blindly going demon because some R9 archer or whatever in their faction is and says its better.

But then again - I'm sage b:victory

Bhavyy - Raging Tide wrote: »

Sage hits harder, crits more, gain chi faster allowing for better chaining of magic damage skills...

That's why I dislike the change, it takes away demon's role of attacking faster and criting more. Sure the dps increase isn't that huge, but they still took one of the main roles of demon and gave it to sage. Just feels bad from that viewpoint.

Anfisa - Lost City wrote: »

That's why I dislike the change, it takes away demon's role of attacking faster and criting more.

Well you cant have both!

Sage has to be able to kill SOMETHING!!