It actually is easy

truekossy wrote: »

And yet... what OP did is the exact opposite of efficient. Your statement about solo ability is false as it's also much easier for a veno to heal a tank pet than an assassin to solo with the same resource investment at that point in time. You do not need to invest in more than heal and a NPC weapon to be a **** veno that can still get by. Meanwhile, even a **** sin will need semi-decent armor, weapons, and skills to survive at the lower levels or they will simply die. You don't need a tome as water from the pet manager is beyond cheap and legendary pets are actually looked at less nowadays, not that they're even relevant to this topic.

If this were a thread that wasn't about the horribly bad way of doing things OP mentioned, sure. I'd gladly agree that n up-to-date veno and sin early on are similar but Sin gives greater benefits later. However, that's not the case.

... And really pet levels are nonfactor if you're doing your quests and don't have a large deal of pets. I had a maxed pet bag on my veno since level 1 and had it filled by my 30s. Yet the only pet that concerned me prior to the massive jump at higher levels was my turtle. And this was without using room 4 for fast and easy pet levels.

Dude, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one.

Edit; I had written a more thorough reply but the text got chopped off for some reason (I guess I accidentally used an accent instead of an apostrophe and the xenophobic forum programming cut me off) as I do have stuff to do guess i'll have to leave it at that until I find time to rewrite my response...

MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

Dude, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one.

Edit; I had written a more thorough reply but the text got chopped off for some reason (I guess I accidentally used an accent instead of an apostrophe and the xenophobic forum programming cut me off) as I do have stuff to do guess i'll have to leave it at that until I find time to rewrite my response...

Fair enough, though I think we're also arguing on different subjects. I do agree with what you say when we start talking about investing in the characters, being efficient, and so on different(outside of the pet level thing but that's personal experiences and opinions and I know for the majority your side would be far more accurate than my experience). However, I have tried a minimal investment style on both my veno and sin on the EU servers... and it sucked a LOT more on the sin that burned pots and life powders, got smacked around by everything and so on for quite some time compared to the veno that could... heal a walker once or twice, then meditate during fights while the pet did the work.

That only applied to normal grinding and I hated both enough to scrap them and decide I'd never try that again, though.

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

... /facepaw. ...


And no offense OP, but even delivering newspapers would make more money than this long and inefficient way. Hell, I make more money going to school. b:surrender

Agree with it.

tripletriad wrote: »

What i'm trying to say is that I've tried a similar thing as OP did.. but I did it on my sin and it's my main char, and that two things make a big difference in the result..

Why ppl always take a jump into end-game? I make my sin 1 year ago, and now it's still 61.. All my time with PWI I spent with low to mid lvl toons, tried sin, wiz, barb, cleric, archer, and seeker.. And sin is one of the worst performer amongst all, in low to mid lvl range that is..

ofc I think venos in my level range having it "easy", I always think like that..
How come playing low level squishy class that are forced to tank the mobs all the time is easier / cheaper than playing veno?
I play sin because I know it will be good at higher level, but it doesn't mean they're already good from the start..
I know some ppl said that playing sins is too easy like playing baby difficulty.. But you gotta realize that it will become too easy only if you skip the long process, and take a jump straight to the end-game..

This would have been a good post if we ignore the fact that leveling is really fast and easy.

No I'm not talking about power leveling by buying FF runs or anything.

It's ridiculously easy to level these days with amount of dailies around. When you hit the level, public FF runs give even more exp (people DO run regular FFs without buying them off end-geared players you know).

XLeeu - Heavens Tear wrote: »

THIS

I think most of you missed the intent of the post.

It was a way to show that you can make money in game without spending real money.

Yes I know you all bashing me cause I chose a Veno....but that is a class you can coose !! YES it will be more difficult with some other classes I AGREE.

The the person that asked me what my secret on inventory was -- Umm read the post - I said that I had to go to town quite often to sell - I did not keep anything cause I wanted to see how much i can make.

I did NOT play the char during 2x for the simple reason that it would be misleading. So during 2x you can actually make more money.

Look - Point of fact - As a VENO you can make money to start a merchanting business without cash shopping. THATS the point, not all these other nitty gritty stuff you all going on about.

A lot of people complain the game is dead.....when was the last time you picked a new toon and decided to play the "right" way.

- No powerlevel
- No Cash shop
- ALL quests

I was actually quite fun - b:laugh

Anyway - I guess not a lot of people on here would understand that, and would rather bash a post, than give positive comments on it....no wonder so many QQ'ers....

X

Marry me b:dirty

THIS is the best post i've seen on this thread :O and I would have to agree, nobody I see ever quests or is a non-pleveler... I have tried to complete every quest I can (nearly have 50 fodders of hay for 'The Punishment' quests.. from about 20-30 levels ago ), and when my quest list is empty, THEN I go and FC.

I fly and explore the world, take screenshots, actually LEARN about how to play my class as I play the game. And at the same time, sell all drops I can. I have a few million spare from this im saving for other things, like a new pair of wings.

I feel like a hipster, because apparantly now Questing and 'playing the game properly' isn't mainstream..

Mor_Toran - Sanctuary wrote: »

The main point to making money in-game is making a profit.

Farming is not a waste of time unless you spend countless hours not profiting from it.

If it takes you more time to make money in-game than it does IRL, then it IS a waste of time AND money.

Seriously, am I arguing with children who have no concept of this?

b:chuckle

Smarie - Sanctuary wrote: »

You missed a post....

It's easier to spend some time farming that to waste your hard earned cash on a **** exchange rate.

/facepalm

Yeah, if they can afford internet access, they can surely afford to spend $10 on a silly game instead of playing part time for 3 months.

Oh, but I guess I am arguing with children. I'm sure in SA you can find a job that pays more than 10 cents an hour.

xP

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I think my econ degree just roll over and died after reading that...

This whole thread makes my head spin.

When gold was at 80-100k, yeah, you could farm or grind more coin at better than slave labor rates. With gold at 1.6m you're better off walking dogs for a buck each or digging trenches for $10 a day.

TempleSlave - Lost City wrote: »

This whole thread makes my head spin.

When gold was at 80-100k, yeah, you could farm or grind more coin at better than slave labor rates. With gold at 1.6m you're better off walking dogs for a buck each or digging trenches for $10 a day.

It's funny to use the word "slave" when you have ...that nickname...it's pretty childish lol. No we are not slaves but what do you now.


My little story is similar in a way and worse in the other.

PWI exchange rate is the USD..let's call it "Unit A". My money, that i earn by working full time 6 days a week would be "unit B". In my country, Unit A= ~40Unit B. Yes, FORTY. sooo for me A= B*40

I go to work and i earn 3000 B's. You (ok, your mother for the kids that troll here) go to work and you earn 3000 A's.

Now please tell me, when i buy Zen i "feel" the price Identical with you? Instead of 20 bucks i actually have to pay 20X40 according to MY "buying power". So -ghasp- i'm a lot more productive if i just grind and merchant for that new pair of wings than to pay for it.

I did pay for some things, but as much as i want...that can't happen too often. I only admit a single fact; there are a lot more "accesible" games on the market than PWI, this one being one of the most restrictive (VERY expensive items...EXTREMELY low buying power -what's 6 mil after all when a pixel shoe costs as much-...a very GREEDY company that ruins the economy over and over again etc)

So dear OP,you should ignore some random trolling elements here and expand your little test, if you have time, and tell us your income after you merchant for a little while. I'd be curious about your experience with what sells faster, easier, what mats...(2* crafted weapons were/are a great income for me)...if it's better to use the AH or the shop...etc ...

TempleSlave - Lost City wrote: »

If it takes you more time to make money in-game than it does IRL, then it IS a waste of time AND money.

Seriously, am I arguing with children who have no concept of this?

b:chuckle

This is a game to play to have fun. lol
If you care so much about money you should stop play and go make money irl.
PWI is a game not a second real life where it's more important to make money than play.
I know some people that have catshop 24/7, but log 1-2 times a week 2-3 hours for play.

TempleSlave - Lost City wrote: »

.....

It all depends on your real life circumstances and what you want to do in the game. Just because you repeat yourself over and over doesn't mean that there aren't plenty of us who are enjoying the game free to play, and that there aren't people who are successful at it. You can call people nutjobs because they don't agree with you all you want. Doesn't change facts.

TempleSlave - Lost City wrote: »

If it takes you more time to make money in-game than it does IRL, then it IS a waste of time AND money.

Seriously, am I arguing with children who have no concept of this?

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I think my econ degree just roll over and died after reading that...

Let's put that econ degree to work here.

Humans are lazy, they prefer leisure over work, basic premise. If given the option of living like a king with no work, will you take it? If the majority of humanity says no, i will accept your no, otherwise the premise stands :P.

We work. There are limited numbers of hours in a day, 24 hours, on earth in this reality. I am sure there are example of longer shorter days, so be it.

In those 24 hours you have to sleep. Let's call that S. Waking hours are 24hour - S = W (waking hours). Voilla S+W = 24, nifty math b:victory.

So we only have W left to enjoy life.

To enjoy things we need to sustain our life and maybe purchase some things to make life better.

That means i am willing to give up some of free time to work so i can enjoy a better life.

Now the hazy part, our preferences, different people different cases. We'll assume strictly convex indifference curves to make life easy. You don't want me to give you an equation for that, trust me b:cute.

Indifference curve simply means, a set of combinations in your W where you work for some hours and enjoy the other hours. Let's call work hours = H (short for horror), and leisure time = L. W = H+L. That means L = 24 - S - H. Simple so far?

Now a person is comfortable in their current set of H and L. To make a person give up L, you have to give them compensation, because since we are lazy folks, we would rather not work. Different people will want different compensation levels, but for most part is an upward sloping curve and bends back after a point. Like an opposite C. That means if i have to give an extra hour of work, i need more money. If i have to give up 6 additional hours of leisure every day from my normal leisure hours, i may not take the job because i demand a very high compensation for my leisure time lost. That is why the CEO's are paid millions, they play golf during work, drink at lunch, while you slave away at the office. To make those CEO's work more, they need the big bucks, that is why the curve bends backwards after a point.

Whew, basic ground work done, and i am sure most of the people will never read this, but that's ok, i can simply quote this post over and over again, makes my life easier b:chuckle.

Now the OP has some L. S/he plays this game and treats it as a leisure activity. In what universe will someone advise the OP to give up that L and put in more H, to enjoy an activity that s/he already enjoys for some P hours? By taking more H, the OP has fewer hours to play the game, making the OP worse off, unless the job pays really well and the OP's indifference curve reflects that based on the constraints that s/he has.

That is akin to saying, you have 5 hours of free time everyday, to enjoy those free hours more, you need to work for 4 of those hours, leaving you with 1 hour? Under some circumstances people do it, especially if the compensation is good. But why should a person give up more leisure time to have leisure time? That does not make sense. No where did the OP mention the gear or goals, OP only said how s/he (tell me if you are a guy or a girl so i can stop writing s/he b:cry all the time) made money to start a merchanting enterprise.

If the response is that more work = more money = more enjoyment in game, yes holds true, but is also means less playing time, and this is what this game is, a fun game. If this game was work, i don't see a monetary or monetary equivalent compensation to the players. Not everyone wants to be 101, r9+12 josd in 1 month and be facerolling a keyboard. Some people play this game to have fun, and don't need to invest real hard earned money for a game.

I have nothing for or against people who spend on the money on the game, everyone is free to do what they want with their money. But to tell another player to get another job so s/he can enjoy the game more, that is wrong and the reason for this long post.

Take a look at world economies, read the journal papers on economic disparities, the world is a frightening place. Having internet is a blessing, spending 10 dollars extra on a game is not an option for a vast majority of this world (I can make that claim because 10 dolalrs converted in other currency = rich folks b:cute). Take an example i am working on, i pay for a branded t-shirt that is 50 cents to 2 dollars. That same t-shirt is sold in usa canada for 50~150 dollars. If you take that 50 dollars in USA, and go to where i buy it, that means you can buy 25 t-shirts instead of 1. If the option of buying 25 t-shirts or buying 1 t-shirt was available, which would you pick? Most people would go for 25 t-shirts, simply because more is preferred to less in most cases when consuming things up to the point where diminishing marginal utility hits zero. That leads one to investigate how much more can 50 dollars serve you in a country where your clothes cost you a few cents? In such a country you can live like a king, while in usa, canada where at best the income will be in the middle 40%~60% of the top earners. To ask those people to spend 10~100 dollars on a game, not even their own currency, actual dollars, you can see why it won't fly.

Work hard, Play hard and sleep well.
I have 8 hours for each in 24 hours.
How, when and where I work is a personal choice.
How, when and what I enjoy playing with is a personal choice.
How, when and in what way I sleep is personal choice.
It may not be the way others think it should be done.
But I am not you.
I am me and will enjoy my life my way.
So should others. b:chuckle