Caster run from Hell!!

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands · July 2012

Retsuko - Heavens Tear wrote: »

kinda offtopic, but i was wondering.

I always see people ask for psy or wizzies for caster in WC. Right now, a half decent mystic who uses his/her storm mistress in caster does more DPS then a psy or wizzie with the same gear. So why do people never ask mystics for caster?

People don't know the mystic power, on my mystic never a psychic got aggro on me, yesterday in a caster the psy had a +10 weapon which is higher than me and i had aggro on all boss all the run. People forgot that NV have a fast chan/cast + demon NV do more damage while sage one give chi, i have NV sage since few days and it's crazy how much often i can triple spark more often than other caster (wizz/psy) and i have sage thickets which almost one shot the 4 mobs on the third boss, normally thickets+gale force they are all dead.

Personally i don't have trouble to find squad, the second i say i have invigorate they want me in the squad (Morai skill giving 20% more damage on skills).

I edited to add that: I just done a caster run and the wizz had a magic tome +45 magic (i wish i got that) and i had aggro on all boss all the run on my mystic (tbh he prolly do something really wrong). XD

Vedovis - Lost City · July 2012

@Tweaks I do agree about lazy venos, (had enough of them to last a lifetime x.x) however if theres another veno in my squad, and her amp is superior (sage), I'm not going to overwrite their amp with mine, which is demon. Only time I would amp is when theirs wears off, so the squad has a continual amp running.

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide · July 2012

Morale of the story, don't take people with less than 5k hp into casters.

Sorry if it seems harsh, but at 100+ 5k hp is pretty easy to get to, +5 refines on g12 gear will give you most if not more of that if you are pure mag, sharding citrines can get you even more than that. My psy had 5k hp at lvl 90 and was and is still pure mag, 97 and 5.5k.

People die because they expect other people to do all the work for them. Sometimes it's best they die a few times to learn their place.

Yes I know I'm mean, get over it

Euthymius - Heavens Tear · July 2012

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide wrote: »

Morale of the story, don't take people with less than 5k hp into casters.

After running a good number of caster NVs on and off 2x, I've yet to see one with a lot of dying from those with around 4.5k HP or so outside of the third's Fatemeddlers and the 4th/Final's super attacks without BB.

I had roughly 4.7k HP in my Lunar gear till recently and managed through all of my runs just fine. Not everyone with <5k HP is liable to insta-death.

BurnWhenIWiz - Heavens Tear · July 2012

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide wrote: »

Morale of the story, don't take people with less than 5k hp into casters.

Sorry if it seems harsh, but at 100+ 5k hp is pretty easy to get to, +5 refines on g12 gear will give you most if not more of that if you are pure mag, sharding citrines can get you even more than that. My psy had 5k hp at lvl 90 and was and is still pure mag, 97 and 5.5k.

People die because they expect other people to do all the work for them. Sometimes it's best they die a few times to learn their place.

Yes I know I'm mean, get over it

Hmm.. *has less than 5k hp at 101, and tanks in about 70+% of the caster vanas I run w/o dying* Not sure how having less than 5k hp means that you are letting other people do the work for you. Unless you mean they hang back because they're worried about dying.

It ain't just the size of the HP bar, it's how you use it, and how much you know how to time your sparks, expels, shields, etc.

I love a good mystic in a caster vana, but it just seems that there are fewer of them that know what they're doing, vs other dd classes. Some apparently have forgotten they have plants, other use the wrong ones, and some think their pet should do the dd and just spam heal it.

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide · July 2012

5k is just a good simple number. I never said anyone with less than that is going to die 100% of the time and if you are a good player knowing your class having less than 5k is not going to prevent you from doing just fine. But most players with less than 5k hp at 100+ are **** and die alot, why? because they are powerlvled noobs. Of course there are pwerlvled noobs with more than 5k hp and they die slightly less because of the extra hp lol

Quilue - Sanctuary · July 2012

@ above
I believe a lot of people suggested 5k hp or more in regular NV because the worst AOEs is 5k. (Like that Blackwing mob if no one kills it)

You don't really need very good gear to be any good in caster....With genie skills, pills, and a class' innate skills, resourceful people can survive just as they always have before rank gear came out. Pills come so easily now too...because of AEU. What's really stupid is that some people apparently run NV and expect to faceroll when their gear sucks...they should be in a mentality to play, to use what they have, and to survive.

BungaSakura - Raging Tide · July 2012

regarding caster nirvana squad, i barely picky for making squad. cause so picky means i need to waste like more than 10 teles and maybe half an hour to gather all 6 ppl. I often go with ppl who have 4k hp. I also often go with 3-4 cleric since im cleric, i also go with archer who has 4,2k hp, sometimes i go with 2 venos. some of them die, some of them manage to survive.

What i have notice on ppl who die alot in caster is this, they have tt90 gear and they used channeling ornament. and if they have rank 8, they use rank 7 or 8 ornament (i forgot tho but its elemental res). This is the reason why most of them die, because they have really low phisical defence. on third boss for example, the reason why many ppl die is cause of the mob. and all the mob give phisical damage. they also spawn randomly. so its really important to make sure that we have atleast decent phisical defence. and phisical ornament, atleast +3 with g12 legendary ornament or OHT helps alot.

and if we have veno in squad, i usually ask bramble for all squad. bramble are very usefull to reduce the damage from mob at third boss. and also if we have seeker or wiz in squad. my suggestion to squad is they stay close each other on wiz/seeker aoe skill, because that way mob wont hitting 1 ppl for long because wiz/seeker are killing them while we also do aoe skill.

i used to tell this to some ppl who have lower gear cause it will help them to stay alive. we help each other by giving usefull information are always good, because in the future, they want to squad w me. This is my 2 cents

Empu - Sanctuary · July 2012

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

I just don't understand the people that rush to 100 but have such crappy gears that they can't carry their own weight in a squad. b:surrender

Exactly what I thought when reading the post b:laugh

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide wrote: »

Sorry if it seems harsh, but at 100+ 5k hp is pretty easy to get to, +5 refines on g12 gear will give you most if not more of that if you are pure mag, sharding citrines can get you even more than that.

Actually, as you can see here, all +5 on a pretty decent (at least imo) basic setup of TT99/r8/warsoul is still pretty far from 5k. I added 4 immac citrines on each piece just to see, and still not 5k hp.

I recently got my wizard to 100 and re-experienced that it's not all that easy to have 5k+ hp with basic gear in AA. It really refines like ****.

But yeah, to many players totally neglect gear till 100 then intend to miraculously get great gear out of nowhere.

Yuna_Sama - Heavens Tear · July 2012

Well... I just did my 1st Caster... No one was particularly overgeared I think (lowest HP was 4,9k - highest 6k) and it went pretty well... I don't think it's gear that matters that much (as long as you have at least TT90 or something) but more with how ppl play their class... We had 2 veno's (including me), 1 cleric, 1 mystic, 1 psy & 1 wiz... And no one died at all... So I think you just had bad luck with ppl who don't know how to play their class...

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide · July 2012

Empu - Sanctuary wrote: »

Exactly what I thought when reading the post b:laugh

Actually, as you can see here, all +5 on a pretty decent (at least imo) basic setup of TT99/r8/warsoul is still pretty far from 5k. I added 4 immac citrines on each piece just to see, and still not 5k hp.

I recently got my wizard to 100 and re-experienced that it's not all that easy to have 5k+ hp with basic gear in AA. It really refines like ****.

But yeah, to many players totally neglect gear till 100 then intend to miraculously get great gear out of nowhere.

Sure don't do a full set of gear and of course a person has less. Lets see tt99 top, pants +5 with shards just as you did with a simple neck, belt and rings and oh look more than 5k hp. not that hard. If you have trouble getting 5k on a pure magic caster you probably have trouble getting 5k on a pure vit barb. I have a caster of every class but a mystic all of them had more than 5k of hp by lvl 90 and all of them are pure magic there isn't any big secret to it.

@Quilue - You say at above but you didn't seem to read. I said if you know what you are doing you don't need 5k, 5k is just a simple baseline for me for 2 reasons. 1-with less than 5k you can die pretty quick even as a good player 2- with less than 5k I can't be sure you know what you are doing, because you have obviously done something wrong to have less than 5k. It isn't hard to get there and what's really sad are the ones that don't even have 5k WITH a barb buff.

Empu - Sanctuary · July 2012

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide wrote: »

Sure don't do a full set of gear and of course a person has less.

You are the one who said :

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide wrote: »

Sorry if it seems harsh, but at 100+ 5k hp is pretty easy to get to, +5 refines on g12 gear will give you most if not more of that if you are pure mag, sharding citrines can get you even more than that.

It's funny how after all the complaining about normal nirvana, caster squads have become just the same. I can't help but to see a relation between 5 aps and 5k hp. The players in squad need decent enough geared to be a help to the squad and not a burden.

Ofc, you're entitled to have your own opion on the minimum hp needed for caster nirvana. I'm just glad we are on same servers and can't end up in the same squad.

Changuita - Harshlands · July 2012

Hey... I've been there too. Pretty much the way I don't let that happen now is that if I am building the squad... I do not allow anyone under r8+5. If I am entering a squad, I look at everyone else's gear. The best way to get good caster squads is to go with people you know- trusted team members.

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide · July 2012

Gear means gear not just top, pants, helm, boots and wrists. Rings, neck, belt, wep, and tome are all gear. You simply wanted to show a toon that had less than 5k hp so you didn't do a fair comparision, that's what politicians do distort the truth enough to make them sound right all the time all the while spewing lies.

I have no problems taking someone I know knows their class with less than 5k hp or someone near 5k. But if you are a random person and I invite you and you have 3.6k hp sorry but I'm kicking you. It's nothing personal and I'm certainly not an elitest only taking the best +10 r8/r9 (I am neither and only my sin even has r8) but I have a good idea of what it takes to be a good fast run with no deaths for anyone. If i know you have what it takes I don't mind taking you, if someone I know knows you have what it takes I don't mind. But if I don't know you and your gear isn't below par, sorry but you've got to prove yourself, once you do you'll always be welcome.

Dark_Doll_ - Sanctuary · July 2012

Fixed it : http://pwcalc.com/491e7ebaa1dac893 (even cheaper then Zorac's version)

Also reduced sockets to 3/ each armor piece.b:bye

BerserkBeast - Sanctuary · July 2012

tweakz wrote: »

I'm tanking, so why do those 4.5k hp fledglings not stand on far side of BB from me? Is the aoe not avoidable? Not AD'able? It's making me love Mystic more now because I've finished the boss on my own. But the more I love myself, the more I despise others. b:chuckle

You couldn't describe yourself better

Yuna_Sama - Heavens Tear · July 2012

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide wrote: »

I have no problems taking someone I know knows their class with less than 5k hp or someone near 5k. But if you are a random person and I invite you and you have 3.6k hp sorry but I'm kicking you.

I agree with you on this part... I have kinda crappy gear myself I must admit (mold/TT90/FF Green/ Morai Weap) although everything is +2 or +3... But I still managed to get 5,2k hp by good choices and sharding while still being cheap (and I even got to shard some Garnet's too)... There's no excuse for any class to have less then 4,5k hp... If someone has only 3,6k hp then he/she is definitely doing something wrong....

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide · July 2012

Yuna_Sama - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I agree with you on this part... I have kinda crappy gear myself I must admit (mold/TT90/FF Green/ Morai Weap) although everything is +2 or +3... But I still managed to get 5,2k hp by good choices and sharding while still being cheap (and I even got to shard some Garnet's too)... There's no excuse for any class to have less then 4,5k hp... If someone has only 3,6k hp then he/she is definitely doing something wrong....

And sadly that's not just a number I picked out of a hat, cleric that wanted to come with my squad over the weekend had 3.6k. If the rest of the squad was op and the person was a faction member, I might bring them so they can learn, but other wise I'm sorry but someone else will have to help you.

Yuna_Sama - Heavens Tear · July 2012

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide wrote: »

And sadly that's not just a number I picked out of a hat, cleric that wanted to come with my squad over the weekend had 3.6k. If the rest of the squad was op and the person was a faction member, I might bring them so they can learn, but other wise I'm sorry but someone else will have to help you.

That just won't do... At least get your armor to +2 and put some flawless (or higher) citrines in it... It's not that expensive... Especially when choosing the cheaper path of gear (like I did)... I don't blame you for not taking them... 3,6k is about getting one-shot in Caster... 4,5k is the minimum amount of HP needed to survive I think...

Hot_pho - Heavens Tear · July 2012

ian, y u never ask me to caster :< i'd keep u alive. b:thanks our play times are different anyways.

tweakz wrote: »

I'm wondering because it seems to be the case that we have a lot of self centered, rude, ignorant, and bad players on HT.

its true. i feel the same =.=' there are many clerics with tt99s and 4k hp and think they can out dd r8 clerics and so they dont heal. there are players that think 4k hp is enough to survive 100 instances(im sure if you know what you are doing you can.) but come on it doesnt take much to +4-5( with mirage only no d.orb require or tisha or neat tricks) even tt90 or tt99 your gear only which would give you just about 5k-5.5k hp and most clerics/veno has vit added to their built it should be quite easy.

nothing fancy even if you have tt90 and lvl 72 gears you can still have 5k hp pure mag. with no tome http://pwcalc.com/0cce9b43b625627f this is the gears that i use in my 90s for all my chars minus the weap. the tt99 sword is the cheapest gold tt99 weap you can obtain.

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands · July 2012

BurnWhenIWiz - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Hmm.. *has less than 5k hp at 101, and tanks in about 70+% of the caster vanas I run w/o dying* Not sure how having less than 5k hp means that you are letting other people do the work for you. Unless you mean they hang back because they're worried about dying.

It ain't just the size of the HP bar, it's how you use it, and how much you know how to time your sparks, expels, shields, etc.

I love a good mystic in a caster vana, but it just seems that there are fewer of them that know what they're doing, vs other dd classes. Some apparently have forgotten they have plants, other use the wrong ones, and some think their pet should do the dd and just spam heal it.

Depend on gears and cleric, on my cleric i keep wizz of 4.xk hp while on my wizz with 5,5k hp i was dying all the time i had terrible luck for find good cleric when i was on wizz.

Yes a player need to know how to play but the HP ''bar'' help to survive too.

And yes as mystic myself now i see a lot of mystic don't use plants or the wrong one.

Changuita - Harshlands wrote: »

Hey... I've been there too. Pretty much the way I don't let that happen now is that if I am building the squad... I do not allow anyone under r8+5. If I am entering a squad, I look at everyone else's gear. The best way to get good caster squads is to go with people you know- trusted team members.

Well often people have a R8 weapon, but **** gears.

In the best world every AA will have more than 5k at lvl100+ (which is easy), but if i was making a squad with 5k hp+ that would take 1 hour make a squad.

Yuna_Sama - Heavens Tear · July 2012

Just to give an example to all the low-HP ppl out here... Extra: Wristguards stats - Evasion + 62, Phys Res + 94, Chan -3... Belt - HP135, Phys res +100... Weapon: Empyrean Edge +3 with Immaculate Sapphire Shard...

Pretty much noob gear as you can see... But good enough to get some decent attack, def & HP... This entire set cost me under 25 mil if I remember correctly... So when being a cheap piece of b:fatb at least do it right... b:chuckle

And adding some Vit every now and then also helps a lot... A total of 50 base vit would probably be enough to have above 4,6k HP using this exact gear... No use doing much damage if you get one-shot after all... Classes like Psy's might need some higher shards or higher refines though... b:avoid

shopitup · July 2012

Yuna_Sama - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Just to give an example to all the low-HP ppl out here... Extra: Wristguards stats - Evasion + 62, Phys Res + 94, Chan -3... Belt - HP135, Phys res +100... Weapon: Empyrean Edge +3 with Immaculate Sapphire Shard...

Pretty much noob gear as you can see... But good enough to get some decent attack, def & HP... This entire set cost me under 25 mil if I remember correctly... So when being a cheap piece of b:fatb at least do it right... b:chuckle

I decided your example is crazy because venos shouldn't need 67 base str unless they're going HA or something. So I reset some of the stats --- cut down the vit to where I think it'd make more sense to cap it, for instance --- changed two pieces of gear (arms and tome), as well as added on a cheap & nasty magicsword. Found, then, I only had to up the refines by one level to get even better HP. Should still be doable for maybe 30-35 mil, and quite possibly for less.

Silmarill - Heavens Tear · July 2012

its all about how you playing your char..i was 100 lvl cleric with crapy requiem blade as weapon and almost no refine tt 90 when i started normal nirvana.i did tons of runs and i rarely had sq wipe out and as ian i did earn my r 8 with hard work,anyway point is...its all about skills like clerics use freaking plume shell that will make life much easier if you are bad geared same as psy will for them

Yuna_Sama - Heavens Tear · July 2012

shopitup wrote: »

I decided your example is crazy because venos shouldn't need 67 base str unless they're going HA or something. So I reset some of the stats --- cut down the vit to where I think it'd make more sense to cap it, for instance --- changed two pieces of gear (arms and tome), as well as added on a cheap & nasty magicsword. Found, then, I only had to up the refines by one level to get even better HP. Should still be doable for maybe 30-35 mil, and quite possibly for less.

Yeah well the STR thing was a little mistake since she's my 1st char... Found it out a little late... Gotta redo that sometimes during a sale (was even more before restating last time)... Not denying anything... But still she does her job well... b:chuckle Good to know now what her base STR should be... Was worrying I'd make some calculation mistakes by then... b:thanks

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear · July 2012

Hot_pho - Heavens Tear wrote: »

there are players that think 4k hp is enough to survive 100 instances(im sure if you know what you are doing you can.)

All of the following happened to me last night. one shotted through bb with 14k hp. taken a ~15k hit outside of bb. got aps'ed for 3-4k per hit. no amount of skills is going to let you survive that without the hp to back it up.

MageMERC - Harshlands · July 2012

Hot_pho - Heavens Tear wrote: »

...but come on it doesnt take much to +4-5( with mirage only no d.orb require or tisha or neat tricks

Do you guys forget when you weren't filthy rich or something. I used 140 mirages yesterday to +2 something, so how the hell do I cheaply refine all my stuff to +5. Do I just use up those spare couple million mirages I have lying around?????

tweakz · July 2012

MageMERC - Harshlands wrote: »

Do you guys forget when you weren't filthy rich or something. I used 140 mirages yesterday to +2 something, so how the hell do I cheaply refine all my stuff to +5. Do I just use up those spare couple million mirages I have lying around?????

10,000,000,000 coin <- even if you npc'd a single million of them. How can you cry about being poor when you're not using your resources? Your poverty shouldn't be our problem. It's something you need to work on and fix.

MageMERC - Harshlands · July 2012

tweakz wrote: »

10,000,000,000 coin <- even if you npc'd a single million of them. How can you cry about being poor when you're not using your resources? Your poverty shouldn't be our problem. It's something you need to work on and fix.

tweakz!! I was being sarcastic. If it takes me 140mirages to +2 something how the heck do I come up with enough mirages to +5 all my gears. I should add I used my free tishas and tienkuns (on 2 chars so 10 of each) to try and change my broken dream from +4 and after using up another 300mirages I did get it back to +4.

The point was I dont have a couple million mirages lying around.

EDIT: why dont you get a barb to buff the squad before you go in?

EDIT: actally take my on caster, i have a barb on other account - that'll get my hp over 5k b:cool

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands · July 2012

MageMERC - Harshlands wrote: »

EDIT: why dont you get a barb to buff the squad before you go in?

Barbs still exist in PWI?? b:shocked

Caster run from Hell!!

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