5 aps Sage or 5 aps demon?

2

Comments

  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Ariella_ - Lost City wrote: »
    Quoted the OP for you since you guys are incapable of looking at the 1st page.

    And yea, i was ignorant asking this question so early...Frost arrow. LOL I was actually basing a decision off that stupid *** skill. How worthless.

    Im still split btw. Didnt consider the option of being able to wear better gear and still be 5 aps if i was demon. And demon boa is also sexy. Idk -.-

    I read the first page and I re-read it in your quote and I still think it's ridiculous.

    Demon barrage is better than sage barrage by a longshot and even sage archers would agree.

    The sage perks are higher base damage (better for skill spammers), longer stun, longer range.

    Demon perks are quickshot (attack speed), crit (so better for auto-attack), and barrage. Oh yea the demon buff WoP is better but who cares about that right?

    Which is better depends on how you play; a good demon archer and a good sage archer are both valuable to PvP. However, a **** demon archer is much more useful than a **** sage archer.

    Maybe you should go demon 9_9
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  • _blood_rain - Sanctuary
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary Posts: 2,532 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear wrote: »

    Which is better depends on how you play; a good demon archer and a good sage archer are both valuable to PvP. However, a **** demon archer is much more useful than a **** sage archer.

    Maybe you should go demon 9_9

    ooohhh snap!
  • Sarrafeline - Sanctuary
    Sarrafeline - Sanctuary Posts: 4,661 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    I stunned a Demon archer at 32 meters on my Sage archer. Right before Stun wore off, I used Aim Low and froze him. I then used relentless Courage to boost my APS to 1.54 APS for 8 seconds, which was the end of him. During the Freeze time, had he been Sage, he could have at least tried to shoot back... As it was, he couldn't. I was out of his range.

    the Demon archer was an R9+12 DoT archer. I am a 96 +6 HS archer.

    The rest of that TW, Sins were popping on me and oneshotting me, mostly because I kept sneaking up on their walls and picking off their Archers/Wizards before they could get out the center gate.

    And yeah, once I hit 100, I'm gonna be 5.0 base with a +10 set of GV's. I possibly will even go R9 on my archer, but not for a long time.

    Someone mentioned APS. once you have spirit and coins to burn on genies, you can make a Relentless Courage genie that will get a 5.0 APS base with GV's archer up to around 1.82 APS with an R8 bow. I don't have all of the gear yet, but I do believe my genie w/ RC will do so for me once I get it to 100.
    101 Sage Sin*/Archer
    100 Demon BM*/Barb
    96 Demon Cleric/Sage Seeker
    95 Demon Wiz/
    94 Sage Veno
    85 Psy/80 Mystic
    And a handful of other alts, all 79 and under.
    *Pre RB level
  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    A R9 +12 DoT archer losing to a HS +6 means terrible player. In order for that to happen he'd have to have unrefined armors or non-r9 armor with low refines.

    Nothing against your playing ability of course, but your scenario describes a silly R9 player more than a demon vs sage comparison.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    ಥ_ಥ MOAR.
    SkyKoC - How long is yours?
  • Devoted - Lost City
    Devoted - Lost City Posts: 3,634 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    I'd like to see a +6 CV bow kill a +12 rank9 archer in 8 seconds without triple spark. Hell, I'd like to see you out DPS his charm while he was afk.

    I'd also like to point out for the 100th time using a sage vs demon archer fight is pointless when arguing sage vs demon. There are 9 other classes in this game, just because you theorycraft a way to beat a demon archer doesn't mean sage is better.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Relying on genie for attack speed is assuming a lot in mass PvP, as most archers use genie skills for defensive purposes. Also, to match Demon QS in attack speed bonus with Relentless Courage, you need a genie with 112 strength.
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
    Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
    Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
    Qui: b:dirty
  • Hurrdurr - Lothranis
    Hurrdurr - Lothranis Posts: 1,468 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    That R9 +12 DoT didnt bother with any defensive skill during aim low time? Even assuming you could DD through 15k HP on 30 def level archer with HS +6 (11k p.attack?) that archer probably deserves to die for not using any kind of defensive skills.
  • Anfisa - Lost City
    Anfisa - Lost City Posts: 274 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Devoted - Lost City wrote: »
    I'd like to see a +6 CV bow kill a +12 rank9 archer in 8 seconds without triple spark. Hell, I'd like to see you out DPS his charm while he was afk.

    I'd also like to point out for the 100th time using a sage vs demon archer fight is pointless when arguing sage vs demon. There are 9 other classes in this game, just because you theorycraft a way to beat a demon archer doesn't mean sage is better.
    Oh god, your forum title. Nicely done b:chuckle
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Archer vs Archer is one of the stupidest matchups.

    Crit, Miss, Purge, Quickshot proc, it's all about luck whoever wins.
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  • Hurrdurr - Lothranis
    Hurrdurr - Lothranis Posts: 1,468 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    even a purged +12 archer with 15k HP should be able to charm tank a HS +6 archer with 247 crits in a row.

    With my +10 armour and part JoSD I can tank R8 archers b:shutup
  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    A R9 +12 DoT archer losing to a HS +6 means terrible player. In order for that to happen he'd have to have unrefined armors or non-r9 armor with low refines.
    Devoted - Lost City wrote: »
    I'd like to see a +6 CV bow kill a +12 rank9 archer in 8 seconds without triple spark. Hell, I'd like to see you out DPS his charm while he was afk.

    I'd also like to point out for the 100th time using a sage vs demon archer fight is pointless when arguing sage vs demon. There are 9 other classes in this game, just because you theorycraft a way to beat a demon archer doesn't mean sage is better.
    Hurrdurr - Lothranis wrote: »
    That R9 +12 DoT didnt bother with any defensive skill during aim low time? Even assuming you could DD through 15k HP on 30 def level archer with HS +6 (11k p.attack?) that archer probably deserves to die for not using any kind of defensive skills.

    I guess you three weren't here when some idiot explained how a +5 TT99 can could own a full +12/r9 jade archer. Ever since then... they just been coming out of the woodwork.

    Sarrafeline - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I stunned a Demon archer at 32 meters on my Sage archer. Right before Stun wore off, I used Aim Low and froze him. I then used relentless Courage to boost my APS to 1.54 APS for 8 seconds, which was the end of him. During the Freeze time, had he been Sage, he could have at least tried to shoot back... As it was, he couldn't. I was out of his range.

    the Demon archer was an R9+12 DoT archer. I am a 96 +6 HS archer.

    There is so many problems with your post...

    1. Unless the r9 archer can't afford level 11 wing blessing, his ranged will be 32. But I'll let that one slide and assume you mean you locked him at 34 meters.
    2. Unless you have twin accuracy rings... you are looking at a 20-25% miss rate on another archer. So your 12 shots in 8 seconds... just turned in to 10 shots.
    3. From a defense perspective... if your target use blessing... your miss rate would skyrocket to 75%. Your 12 shots just turned in to 4-5 shots (since blessing last 6 seconds).

    I am a +12 r9 sage archer with all non-dot sage skills. My purge and damage is significantly better then yours. Aesthor is a +12 r9 dot archer. With the cute brain of hers... I can not guarantee that I can lock her at 34 meters for 8 seconds totally vulnerable.

    4. Stop targeting idiots and assume they are the norm.
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • Hurrdurr - Lothranis
    Hurrdurr - Lothranis Posts: 1,468 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I guess you three weren't here when some idiot explained how a +5 TT99 can could own a full +12/r9 jade archer. Ever since then... they just been coming out of the woodwork.

    if you're talking about Fleuri's veno harem, yes, I was reading the forums.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Let's just start naming names. You're on Sanct, some of us are on Sanct, we pretty much know the R9+12 archers by name. Just tell us who managed to die to a +6 Lunar so we can be highly amused.

    Maybe it happened in Cube and the archer in question was uncharmed.
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
    Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
    Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
    Qui: b:dirty
  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Let's just start naming names. You're on Sanct, some of us are on Sanct, we pretty much know the R9+12 archers by name. Just tell us who managed to die to a +6 Lunar so we can be highly amused.

    Maybe it happened in Cube and the archer in question was uncharmed.

    Come to think of it... it seems that all the +12 r9 archer ambush/death by a lone assailant happens on Sanc. Maybe you guys need to form a buddy system or something. Probably should also get a lynch mob together and flush out all the +12 r9 archer killers... before one of you takes an arrow to the knee.
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • _blood_rain - Sanctuary
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary Posts: 2,532 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    You know we haven't seen Fleuri around for a while, maybe Sarrafeline inherited her Veno Harem.
  • Ruvil - Sanctuary
    Ruvil - Sanctuary Posts: 382 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Sarrafeline - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I stunned a Demon archer at 32 meters on my Sage archer. Right before Stun wore off, I used Aim Low and froze him. I then used...

    uhm... im pretty sure they were just making fun of what a theory based sage archer would say....

    at least i hope so..
  • _blood_rain - Sanctuary
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary Posts: 2,532 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Ruvil - Sanctuary wrote: »
    uhm... im pretty sure they were just making fun of what a theory based sage archer would say....

    at least i hope so..

    No she's serious. She made the claims of "pwning a full R9 demon archer" on a different recent thread as well.
  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary wrote: »
    No she's serious. She made the claims of "pwning a full R9 demon archer" on a different recent thread as well.

    Dude... I am telling you guys... sanctuary is like the ghettos. Its not like HT... where a full +12 r9 archer can take a leisure stroll in the park without getting ambushed and killed by some TT/lunar runt. Get with the program already and take advantage of the BUDDY SYSTEM. Always travel with another full +12 r9 jade/dot archer. This way... when some +5 tt99 or lunar runt ambushes you guys... the two of you +12 full r9s might just stand a fighting chance.
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • Hurrdurr - Lothranis
    Hurrdurr - Lothranis Posts: 1,468 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary wrote: »
    No she's serious. She made the claims of "pwning a full R9 demon archer" on a different recent thread as well.

    My respect for Sanctuary just hit an all time low.

    Is it me or is it always these sage archers claiming these extraordinary feats with their lack of concentrated damage?
  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Ruvil - Sanctuary wrote: »
    uhm... im pretty sure they were just making fun of what a theory based sage archer would say....

    at least i hope so..
    Hurrdurr - Lothranis wrote: »
    My respect for Sanctuary just hit an all time low.

    Is it me or is it always these sage archers claiming these extraordinary feats with their lack of concentrated damage?

    A real sage archer would say something along the line of... "you know what... **** my cult... i am going to smack you around with my +12 r9".
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • Vindis - Dreamweaver
    Vindis - Dreamweaver Posts: 614 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I am a +12 r9 sage archer with all non-dot sage skills.

    I have more sage skills than Kiyoshi? b:cute

    Besides that, I have nothing really interesting to contribute. It is possible to kill r9s without r9 weps. No need for D&D here...I imagine Sarrafeline's scenario likely took place in a TW? People get crazy lag there and sometimes they just aren't that observant, especially against other archers. Archers really are alot about luck.

    Nothing else relevant to add to this thread b:victory
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    b:bye
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    If it's TW I've killed people with my bare hands....see after VICTORY! pops up, people start doing whatever the hell they want like arma spawns, turn into cat shops etc.

    I froze this cleric, holy pathed up, and 3 sparked to fist! Except I accidentally just de-equipped the bow instead of switching weapons, BUT I ended up killing the cleric anyway! It's because of Demon Spark's awesome attack speed bonus that this was possible. This is why you should go Demon.
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
    Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
    Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
    Qui: b:dirty
  • _blood_rain - Sanctuary
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary Posts: 2,532 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    If it's TW I've killed people with my bare hands....

    Creepy D:


    and I wouldn't say sanc is like the ghetto. I think that one goes to LC just because they think they gangsta.


    I think Sanc is more like a Downtown metro area where many crazies like to congregate because they fit in so well.

    I dismissed her claims instantly anyway, tho I think I know who the alleged R9 archer is.
  • Hurrdurr - Lothranis
    Hurrdurr - Lothranis Posts: 1,468 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    A real sage archer would say something along the line of... "you know what... **** my cult... i am going to smack you around with my +12 r9".

    In this case it's Lunar +6 b:shocked
  • truekossy
    truekossy Posts: 7,021 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Clearly, we're all doing it wrong and need to reroll +5/+6 sage archers. There must be something magical about having a +5/+6 refine when you're a sage that allows so many to constantly beat full R9+12s.

    Clearly, Lucy_Black was an attempt at this gone horribly wrong and if she had kept her refines at +5/+6 she would be 1-shotting everything ever.
  • Decus - Dreamweaver
    Decus - Dreamweaver Posts: 5,033 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    It's because of Demon Spark's awesome attack speed bonus that this was possible. This is why you should go Demon.

    b:chuckle
    Proving that not only archers do math since 2009. b:victory
    Current math challenge: pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1029711&page=45
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • Devoted - Lost City
    Devoted - Lost City Posts: 3,634 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    I'm a +3 cv bow sage archer and I killed a +12 demon archer. Will upload proof later.
  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I am a +12 r9 sage archer with all non-dot sage skills. My purge and damage is significantly better then yours. Aesthor is a +12 r9 dot archer. With the cute brain of hers... I can not guarantee that I can lock her at 34 meters for 8 seconds totally vulnerable.

    I am not cute!!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    ಥ_ಥ MOAR.
    SkyKoC - How long is yours?
  • GAEILGE - Heavens Tear
    GAEILGE - Heavens Tear Posts: 13 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Sarrafeline - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I stunned a Demon archer at 32 meters on my Sage archer. Right before Stun wore off, I used Aim Low and froze him. I then used relentless Courage to boost my APS to 1.54 APS for 8 seconds, which was the end of him. During the Freeze time, had he been Sage, he could have at least tried to shoot back... As it was, he couldn't. I was out of his range.

    the Demon archer was an R9+12 DoT archer. I am a 96 +6 HS archer.

    The rest of that TW, Sins were popping on me and oneshotting me, mostly because I kept sneaking up on their walls and picking off their Archers/Wizards before they could get out the center gate.

    And yeah, once I hit 100, I'm gonna be 5.0 base with a +10 set of GV's. I possibly will even go R9 on my archer, but not for a long time.

    Someone mentioned APS. once you have spirit and coins to burn on genies, you can make a Relentless Courage genie that will get a 5.0 APS base with GV's archer up to around 1.82 APS with an R8 bow. I don't have all of the gear yet, but I do believe my genie w/ RC will do so for me once I get it to 100.


    Loooooooooool you killed him with a +6 HS.. i could walk away from ym computer with +6HS attacking me and the only way id die is if my charm ran out b:chuckle
  • Hurrdurr - Lothranis
    Hurrdurr - Lothranis Posts: 1,468 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I am not cute!!

    I've stalked you before and you total are b:cute

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