New cleric skills (by Korren/Bubbles)

What people aren't seeming to get is that, there are more classes to DD with other than a Cleric. Sure, they don't deal metal damage, but even so, by adding a skill that sacrifices your healing for a few damage points more, you're ruining the class in itself. Support is support. Mystics can heal and DD, why not go that path? Cleric is about healing, buffing, ressurecting and healing even more. Not about DDing. If you want to be a pure magic DD like this new skill introduces, why not go Wizard? Or Psychic? Something that actually is a DD, not a support class wanna-be.

It was your choice to roll a Cleric, why should you get the both of best worlds when you're the game's one and only reliable support class?

daphkate wrote: »

What people aren't seeming to get is that, there are more classes to DD with other than a Cleric. Sure, they don't deal metal damage, but even so, by adding a skill that sacrifices your healing for a few damage points more, you're ruining the class in itself. Support is support. Mystics can heal and DD, why not go that path? Cleric is about healing, buffing, ressurecting and healing even more. Not about DDing. If you want to be a pure magic DD like this new skill introduces, why not go Wizard? Or Psychic? Something that actually is a DD, not a support class wanna-be.

It was your choice to roll a Cleric, why should you get the both of best worlds when you're the game's one and only reliable support class?

You're right, Clerics were made to be support and only support. But think about it, outside of TW, outside of PVE (BH, TT, Nirvana), there's also PVP.

If you guys think clerics are pathetic at PVP because they are "PURELY SUPPORT" then I have to say everything you know about a cleric is a lie. I get really pissed off when clerics are underestimated because of OP sins killing them outside of SZ.

"It was your choice to roll a Cleric, why should you get the both of best worlds when you're the game's one and only reliable support class?"

With all the five aps going around, BP is the new cleric. Stop living during perfect world times of 2008. Cleric's are most important in TW, or TT/WB, but anything other than that I'm sure a squad of 5 aps sins can handle almost anything.

Why should we get the both of the best worlds? Because the people who have stuck with clerics since the beginning deserve it.

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver wrote: »

>.> Look at the skills that everyone else got or has already. Now look at the skills that clerics are given. See why we're complaining?

Also, yes a cleric can heal. However, we chose a cleric BECAUSE WE WANTED TO. Clerics do have potential if played right. Like mystics, clerics can heal and DD. I have a mystic. I like my cleric better. Dealing a lot more damage? Roll a wiz? Well, I still like my cleric. I chose a HEALING CLASS, so I should have the ability to heal. We have less dph, for some defensive barriers, as well the ability to heal ourselves. That is a clerics strength. You want to take away a clerics heals for a bit more damage, as well as take away their blessings and reduce their hp....and this is called balance. We're complaining because as cleric players, we don't find this fair. Already, people view clerics as easy kills. Every class views a cleric as an easy kill. Now with these skills, we've got even less hp, and no healing or blessings...just a slightly better dph, and the ability to negate charms some. In other words, we're an easier kill, and much more squishy. Every other class has some real advantage with different forms. Barbs get more hp, pdef, speed, and a good set of skills. Venos get more pdef, accuracy, and a good set of skills. Psy's get the same skills, but with higher defense in white voodoo, and higher attack in black voodoo...causing a countereffect in the opposite. Clerics get to become even squishier. Yeah. That's fair.

You are 100% correct. Player's view clerics ALWAYS as the "easy kill". Like wtf, Mystic's get to see sins, Seekers get new pets and can see sins, EA's can stealth.....and clerics recieve garbage skills that disable our heals...what a joke.

The only person I know that don't even bother healing is a R9 with full JOSD's. Too bad the other 99% clerics gets owned.

Honestly, don't disable ALL our healing abilities. At least keep wellspring or something...I rather keep my heals and use my spirit's gift instead for extra damage than disabling my abilities for skills to stop a charm tick and a little more dmg -_-

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

not sure about archo but in the more populated servers, at least in TWs, youll be dead or stunned by the time your casting debuff. Maybe our TWs are just busier...

In WHICH part of my post did I say that you were supposed to do all that on TW ? -.-

Eillysium - Archosaur wrote: »

GEEZ clerics are just too stupid these days.

b:question

risingblood wrote: »

obviously this kid doesnt know how to read chinese

Obviously half of the PWI ppl doesnt know either.

Eillysium - Archosaur wrote: »

Obviously half of the PWI ppl doesnt know either.

Obviously you're too slow to read between the lines.

I'm crossing my fingers for a change on these skills, based on the people that have used these skills (posted on the very official forums and several fansites), every single skill is garbage but the one that prevents experience lost on dead. I'm hoping for a few tweaks in the following weeks, I think that based on the sheer amount of people complaining that PW will improve these skills. I hope so at least...

I will post a few links to a few threads on the first 3 pages of the official wanmei forums, just to show what kind of threads Clerics are making overthere:

Cleric's from decline to tragedy
http://bbs.w2i.wanmei.com/viewthread.php?tid=1865146&highlight=mm

Blessing of gods (no exp lost on dead) the only cleric useful new skill
http://bbs.w2i.wanmei.com/viewthread.php?tid=1871437&highlight=mm

I will tell you why PW refuses to give clerics better skills (dont know if this is the correct translation)
http://bbs.w2i.wanmei.com/viewthread.php?tid=1872625&highlight=mm

New skills of clerics (negative)
http://bbs.w2i.wanmei.com/viewthread.php?tid=1865465&highlight=mm

New skills for the MM from my point of view (negative also)
http://bbs.w2i.wanmei.com/viewthread.php?tid=1872555&highlight=mm

Propose that clerics can heal while in purple dance
http://bbs.w2i.wanmei.com/viewthread.php?tid=1869207&highlight=mm

PW has bullied the cleric!!
http://bbs.w2i.wanmei.com/viewthread.php?tid=1861402&highlight=mm

Strongly recommends the strengthning of clerics
http://bbs.w2i.wanmei.com/viewthread.php?tid=1867680&highlight=mm

...

The list goes on and on...

Cedro - Sanctuary wrote: »

I declare myself guilty of google translating b:chuckle, if anyone is interested, Purple Night Dance is most likely a copy of the Priest's skill Shadowform in WOW, in WOW Shadowform is instant cast skill that increase shadow magic by 15%, while reduce all damage recieved by 15%, it provides some other nice bonuses but in exchange it disables holy magic (heals and some blessings).

But at least shadow priests get the buff Vampiric Embrace, which makes it so that "6% of single-target Shadow spell damage caused by casting priest heals the priest and 3% heals the group". Giving MM clerics a buff like that would definitely be a step in the right direction.

JRRigoz - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Couldn't they have simply modified some skills from FW such as damnation, turn them into a metal equivalent and simply given us more attack power that way rather than forcing us into a "Metal Mage" mode? >.>

No. That would require common sense.

Can we please swap skills with the mystics? Keep the no xp loss and give them all the no heals for more damage stuff and we can take the aoe res and aoe ironheart please as well as the buff for improving healing power. No offence to the devs but if I rolled a cleric I want to heal if i wanted to DD I would have gone wiz or psy or mystic if i wanted to do both. By doing it how they have the made clerics have a bunch of rather useless pve skills and gave the mystics some seriously epic stuff ie buff their skill power and buff heal, all of which are more suited to a cleric who is supposed to be main healer. Mystics are given pets and powerful spells to DD and some heals/res balls to act as support healers thats how the build seemed to be designed. Seriously with this update in skills we are essentially relegated to being BB pets -_- where the hell is the point in that? While im feeling pissy I'll add an aoe purify would have been nice too (yes i know I can spam sage purify but its a bit of a chi ****/ time consumr even then) plus being able to aoe res would be very handy during during partial squad wipes (ie vs emperor/steelation/darkcolluseast/illusion lord) when only clerc and barb are left after aoe/debuff aoe ****

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver wrote: »

AOE IH...if the mp cost is relatively inexpensive...which is doubtful, will prove to be superior to CHB. Then you add their hp recovery buff,...which increases their healing power all the more.

AOE Rez buff...The only advantage that I have in this department is that my cleric has sage rez, so no xp loss. Still, I won't argue with them receiving that skill. It helps them better than it helps us.

Buff that does more damage to mobs...So...Mystics can do more damage, and still retain their heals.
Clerics can do more damage, but lose their healing power.
Sins can spark, and heal their whole hp bar with bp.

Mystics can see through stealth. Cool. However, all classes need that ability to be honest.

I'm honestly wondering if the devs actually care about the cleric class anymore. No other class has their ability to heal cut off. Our new moves consist of handicapping us...giving us short term buffs, and long cooldowns. Its pretty much agreed upon that we got the worst skills of the lot, with this new expansion. The no xp loss one is about the only one I wouldn't trade off for another skill from any of the other classes.

I so agree with you! Just hit 96 and I'm a mostly PVE cleric, maybe a bit of dueling with friends here and there and these skills make absolutely no sense if you r not doing TW/PVP. THe new mode sounds interesting but taking away our heals is a bit too much. Stacked IH can only do so much. And decreasing our hp is just ****, we r alrdy squishy enough and all the hp we get will help. Switching on and off the mode doesn't make sense when u r usually dead or stunned by that time in PVP. b:sad

I am really jealous of the mystics right now, they get all the great heals and support stuff, while us clerics (can almost be consider a purely support class) gets a stupid mode that increases our damage by a tiny bit and takes away our heals, which is what clerics are made to do... Maybe clerics won't ever be needed again except for their bb, buffs, and rez? I mean mystics can alrdy replace us in FC teams, r they gonna replaces us in other instances as well? For example TT? I really hope not.

Anyways, I really doubt i will learn any of the new skills, maybe the no exp loss one, but as a cleric i expect myself to sacrifice exp loss for the team when i die. And usually people are pretty good at playing their class by the time you go to the high lvl instances, don't really have to worry about dieing. And i always have rez scrolls and the guardians scrolls in inven, so maybe paying the price of the skill will not even be worth it since i rarely ever die.

So, to sum it up, i am QQing, but i really do believe that clerics got the short end of the rope this time b:cry

To be honest I don't actually know who the extra damage is for? If your low level grinding it may be abit useful but once you get up your aoe's, purify and ironheart aoe grinding poison mobs is the only sensible thing to do. So mid to high levels its useless for grinding. NO ONE is going to want you in squad if your not going to heal especially seeing as wizards have a tough enough time getting squads at high levels when aps is available and they are better DD's than clerics in the first place (except it gets close if you spam elven boon, cyclone and wield thunder in caster).
It's not very good in mass pvp as you'll need to heal allies/yourself plus if your playing a DD cleric in pvp you will need those heals for yourself because of our low hp/general squishiness. Those of us with enough HP to make the HP loss and lack of heals vaguely feasible (ie rank 9's/ full second cast vana/ second cast r8 all with high refs/well socketed) really don't need the extra fire power. Honestly if you have a base magic attack of 20k and 93+ attack levels short of others with similar gear your safe to pretty much one shot anyone. So it makes no sense for those people to have it. Now the people in their tt99 gold and tt90 green can't use it because they are too squishy like that in pvp especially without heals.
That means anyone who could use it doesn't need it and anyone who could use the extra damage cant use the skill because it turns them into a squishy punching bag or a useless member of the party.
Now to those who say clerics are bit.ching when venos/barbs, dont, just think venos get insane phys def in fox form, a huge boost to accuracy and can run as fast as mounts by switching between forms(for demons) and you can heal and command your pets in both forms. Barbs gain massive def boost and a hp boost AND a speed boost, plus if your a demon you don't even loose your damage in true form. Plus the barb and venos are instant transforms with a 2 and 6 second cool down respectively thats long enough to change use a skill and switch back as you see fit 15 seconds + channeling = a load of ****.
*chloroforms self*

Vindis - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Its useful when:

There are 2 clerics in squad Stupid rare anywhere but caster or a boss which NEEDS 2 clerics at which point you're meant to be healing
There is a mystic in squad also Also not very common and why play cleric if you want someone else to be healing? Also cleric heals have more brute force than mystics and can purify (not sure if they'll include that in no heals)
There are mobs that don't attack back (2nd boss of FC) wow 10 mobs in 1 run I suddenly feel that this isn't wasted
When a high damage aoe squad is going group by group (Oh hai tempest on bishops) If you have a high damage aoe squad you won't be doing group by group you'll be pulling lots which means it's best to have heals at the ready incase something goes wrong ie puller needs wop or a heal
When a cleric wants to be an AoE DD for Delta I don't know about you but I don't know many squads who want a cleric for an aoe DD in delta regardless of your power, they want a wiz/seeker/bm/archer/psychic. I don't know about your server but ours always seems to be short of clerics to heal on a Delta run let alone having spares for DD. IJS
Caster nirvana With multiple clerics sure it has its uses in caster, I won't argue a little extra DD would be nice but the base version with the hp tradeoff isnt worth the minimal damage increase
BH runs when not on a boss (Idk about you, but I always stunlock everything so no one rly gets hit) Depends on the squad I alway throw in some DD and seals and chuck in a sirens kiss but I wouldn't take 6% damage or so to remove my ability to heal the sucidal member of my squad instantly, the casting time is more than enough of a delay for the stupid sin/bm/arcer/wiz/psy/mystic/veno to get themselves killed (assuming the cooldown between switching has finished)
Solo questing Some quests sure most chucking an IH or 2 on yourself and gathering a whole area works better is quicker (though not cheaper on repairs) and generally more amusing


Switch back when you need to heal. Oh hai uses Make it instant and give me a 2 second cool down and sure

Think outside the Bubble. b:victory b:chuckle

Here's an idea how about rolling a wiz/psy if you want to mag DD or a mystic if you want to chuck a couple of heals in there too in your spare time. It's not that I can't see any uses for it it's just not a skill set a cleric is really built for or what most people play a cleric to do. If it had either less penalties or a greater bonus I'd love it but as is I think it's largely irrelevent I get probably around the same bonus for casting sage magic shell on myself and I loose no heals and it's faster to cast.