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Considering A Cultivation Change - An Analysis

Arenaceous - Lost CityArenaceous - Lost City Posts: 632 Arc User
edited November 2011 in Wizard
Hi,

My name is Arenaceous. I startet playing PWI on the Dreamweaver server when the highest level there was 7x. My first class was a wizard named Xegeth. I was level 97 when they introduced hyperstones, I joined my first TW faction at around level 90 and the most fun thing I ever did PvE wise where those GV gammas I did with lke 3k pdef and around 3k hp selfbuffed. I went sage along with great mages like Mizuoni, Ursa, MageFizban, Stormyyy and later SurferGirl. Later I rerolled on Lost City, rolled a Sin, was disgusted by their PvP skills and rerolled mage. Again I went sage. I was always happy with my cultivation, but lately I stopped to think a bit more. I got a dex genie with spark, I got my full R9 set and things changed. The way I killed people in open PK changed with the time and I started to think that I might benefit more from demon than I do from sage. So I wanted to write down this analysis and be as unbiased as I can be. I am asking you, all experienced mages of any server - demon or sage - to agree where it's worth agreeing with me and to disagree where I make mistakes and logical fallacies. So let's begin

Why change? - Reasons for going demon.

1.) Rank9 makes me use less chi in open PK.

Most of my kills are with simple hits of Nuke skills. I do not use many ultimates in one on ones. Most of the time, the use of sutra with genie spark is prefered which leads me to my next point.

2.) Genie spark changed the way I kill.

A crit from Divine Pyrogram with undine and genie spark hurts. A LOT. It can bypass most players charm with ease. Also one of the strongest sage skills - Sage BIDS - suffers from genie spark. Why? Because Blade Tempest combined with spark is a devasting skill and more reliable than praying for a BIDS crit. Demon offers less channeling time on Dpyro and an ever faster use of the skill with demon Wellspring Quaff. It is also less predictable than a sparked sutra - And costs less chi.

3.) Wizards are lacking control skills.

The first two points mainly talk about why I think sage lost it's punch for me. Now here is why I envy demon mages. In the situations where you need chi you are fighting tough opponents. That means you will be kiting a lot. Of course kiting is more than possible as a sage, but your only change to land an ultimate usually is to wait for the 2 minute cooldown from your Sleep Skill. A demon mage has more possibilities. The occasional Stone Rain stun lets you cast an ultimate. The freeze on Hailstorm is far more reliable and the freeze on pitfall makes it worth to use the skill instead of gush. Demon Emberstorm is a nice extra bonus. I usually use that skill to knock out sins when I think there might be some. And not only knocking a sin out but also stunning them in the process seems quite useful.

4.) Demon offers more pdef.

Demon Stone Barrier, of course.

5.) Demon spark is superior in PvE

Now that I run caster NV a lot, I could really use the -channeling from demon spark. Of course sage let's me spark more often, so this i not a really strong point.

Summary:

All in all, demon supports the way I kill in open PvP. Faster channeling on your nukes, especially dPyro along with more disables seem really good. Also defense wise you win with Stone Barrier.


Staying a sage - Reasons to stick to my cultivation.

1.) A sage mage is a TW mage.

A sage mage is build for TW. The ultimates are without a discussion far superior to the demon ultimates. TW is were mages are best and in TW you will be spamming ultimates. Also the chi conservation supports the plan.

2.) Always having chi is a good thing.

I said before that you need chi when facing really good opponents - or just good geared ones. A sage mage always has chi, whereas a demon has a harder time building chi. My PvP genie does not have cloud eruption, I will miss the ability to build and conserve chi a lot.

3.) 5% more damage is superior to 3% crit.

This is just an opinion I think, but with the firepower of rank9, 5% extra mastery is a lot.


4.) Changing cultivation costs a lot of money and time.

I need to get all the books again, I am losing all my sage skills I farmed/bought over the last year. I am talking about ~100M loss and ~100M for the demon skills. Luckily, I did the culti quest already.

Summary: I already got all sage skills and I can support my faction better in TW. Also the ability to always have chi makes me handle surprise attacks better.


So what should I do? Go demon? Stick to sage? TW is once, maybe twice a week - at 5 am for me. So I PvP more than I TW, on the other hand we shine in TW.

If I went demon, I would collect all the important books first of course. I don't wanna stand there with just demon spark.

Some general questions about changing culti:

Do you lose your lvl 100 culti? Do you have to do it all again? What is with level 100 skills, are you able to use them after you changed if you got them before the change? Do you have to run your lvl89 and lvl99 FBs again?

Thank you for reading the wall of text and thanks in advance for your input.

Erik aka Arenaceous
Post edited by Arenaceous - Lost City on
"Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

"Some have said there is no subtlety to destruction. You know what? They're dead."

- Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
«13

Comments

  • Mystic-Night - Heavens TearMystic-Night - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,619 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    It's simple. What do you want most. To be better in PK, or better in TW.

    PK = demon
    TW = sage
  • Leviath_Imp - Lost CityLeviath_Imp - Lost City Posts: 194 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    hmm u have a good point there about spark.
    Yeah i would say that BIDS is mainly good when theres like 3 cata barbs or smth in tw
    but single focus spark is better...
    BUT.
    theres Soul of Fire, and some people know how to use that like a boss
    and that can cancel the spark part.
    for control skills, I'm sage, so i generally have to kite my *** off to stay alive
    i guess its really your choice--- 20% is a lot, yet it is also so little.
    Also, game is dying. you want to spend THAT much for a culti switch?
    just thot u might wanna consider some of those
    anyway good luck with ur decision!! b:victoryb:victory
  • Arenaceous - Lost CityArenaceous - Lost City Posts: 632 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Well Soul of Fire is nice, I use it myself. But it also costs 80 energy, and people tend to use it as soon as they see sutra, so it's possible to cancle it by just pretending you use spark. There's a counter measure against every tactic, but you are right I tend to go back to using sage BIDS on people that are good with SoF.

    Also if I got 100k everytime people said the game is dying over the past 2 years I would be full R9 +12 by now. :P
    "Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

    "Some have said there is no subtlety to destruction. You know what? They're dead."

    - Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
  • Mumintroll - Heavens TearMumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    I would stay sage. Spark has just 20m distance. This is can be crucial in PvP. I wouldn't depend just on spark. More p.def from demon is nowadays actually useless. 1. because of hyperbolic curve and these +10 refines you have enough p.def.
    2. Nowadays is everything just about attack levels and def. levels.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • PheosNyx - SanctuaryPheosNyx - Sanctuary Posts: 224 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Only reason Id go demon would be for more 1v1 control. For PvE I'm usually on cleric, archer, or bm (unless bh happens to be delta) and being strictly a tw wiz I want the damage reduction when I trip spark, the added damage from sage mastery, the ability to chi and put barrier on immediately after I die, and for BIDS' proc. If pvp in open world is your main concern, I'd say do it. Between demon stone rain, demon emberstorm, and demon FoW, control is less of an issue.
    Ling__Tong 101 bm ~ PheosNyx 103 wiz ~ Arande 100 HArcher ~ xXxKuro 100 barb ~ AnselTyme 101 cleric ~ lukeFONfabre 96 seeker ~ Tori_Anzu 90 mystic ~ KateiiHimura 95 veno ~ Artemaeus 58 psy. Playing since April 2009.
  • Arenaceous - Lost CityArenaceous - Lost City Posts: 632 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    TY for your input. :)

    @Mummintroll: It's not really accurate that stacking pdef gets more and more useless. The relative damage reduction gets better the higher your pdef is. Here is an example: http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=12931411&postcount=49
    Also I am not saying that I don't know how to kill without spark, it's not like I am randomly running in circles if my opponent got SoF on their genie... The range is a factor that's annoying about spark, but luckily we have FoW and Shrink so we can either disable before using spark or close in/shrink out after fast. You just gotta time it right.

    @PheosNyx: At most tight spots in PvE you get a BB which negates the effect of sage spark and just makes it a worse demon spark. That's what annoys me most. And yes, my main concern atm is in fact open world pk, If I wanted, I could farm on my sin... But I don't. >_<
    "Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

    "Some have said there is no subtlety to destruction. You know what? They're dead."

    - Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
  • TehMage - Lost CityTehMage - Lost City Posts: 209 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    There's actually a whole lot more demon wizards nowadays. When i played a year ago before i hit 100. No one wanted to say a demon wizard existed.

    If you really cant attend tw on your mage, you should probably change your culty. It is expensive to change after learning all your sage skills, but I think demon side is more fun (ofc that's my opinion).

    The myth that demon wizards dont have enough chi in tw is a lie, I'm always dropping BT or BIDS in tw.

    Defense is still a big deal, no matter what anyone says. Even if def. lvls come into play.

    Even on the demon culty, I think, we as wizards still lack defense skills but demon stone rain/pitfall/hailstorm are a huge help.

    All around I like my choice better.

    My only regret? 3rd sage fairy looks alot better b:cry
  • HexOmega - DreamweaverHexOmega - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,342 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    hm
    stay sage i would say
    imo sage is on the upper hand when it comes to genies,

    playing a demon wizard without cloud eruption is a pain
    but cloud eruption messes up dex genie builds

    well at least i couldnt find a satisfying form, if you have a good idea link it



    edit
    of course you need different genies in open pvp and tw

    i can assure you chi is not an issue in tw for demons with CE magic genie
    when you hit the battlefield you are at full chi, and you can drop 3sparked BT
    recharging chi is easy due to many targets to gush on
    you use less bids and more MS, MS can stun before anyone can reach you if you do it right



    well. uhm. you should aks Mizuoni what he likes better, sage or demon, ha played both
    most of us have very one-sided experience :)
    i like potato
  • Vindis - DreamweaverVindis - Dreamweaver Posts: 614 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Hyper another wizard. Keep your sage. Make new wizard Demon. Account stash gears and buy books. Ta da! Now you have 2 toons to make comparisons with.

    Personal: I probably prefer sage myself though I do understand your desire for more control skills. You can still have a good 20k p def full buffed as a Sage wizzy. I agree, end game is more about atk/def lvls than actual gear. If r9 didn't have so many atk/def lvls it would only be slightly better than r8.
    Ring Engraving/Amulet Carving Guide - pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1174451

    Retired from PWI.

    b:bye
  • Arenaceous - Lost CityArenaceous - Lost City Posts: 632 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Hai hex :D Right now I am leaning to keeping sage, but only because changing is so expensive and I wanna improve my gear and see what those new wizard skills will be, heard rumors we will get an anti stun... But who knows.

    @Vindis: I would so do that IF I could account stash my Rank9 set >_>
    "Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

    "Some have said there is no subtlety to destruction. You know what? They're dead."

    - Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
  • Vindis - DreamweaverVindis - Dreamweaver Posts: 614 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Hai hex :D Right now I am leaning to keeping sage, but only because changing is so expensive and I wanna improve my gear and see what those new wizard skills will be, heard rumors we will get an anti stun... But who knows.

    @Vindis: I would so do that IF I could account stash my Rank9 set >_>


    Sorry about that. I don't have r9 or an account stash, but I assumed it would have been decent in theory. Forgot about rank being unstashable >_<.

    And I think wizards would be pretty formidable if they got an antistun. Goodbye archers b:bye

    The first wizard skill located here, looks to be an attack. Looks fire-ish. Hopefully it at least has a debuff or is an aoe...
    Ring Engraving/Amulet Carving Guide - pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1174451

    Retired from PWI.

    b:bye
  • PheosNyx - SanctuaryPheosNyx - Sanctuary Posts: 224 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Asty said it was a kind of turn-back-time skill, it's gotta be a buff since there's no other player in the vid to be a target (unless it works like seeker's edged blur). What it does I have no idea D8
    Ling__Tong 101 bm ~ PheosNyx 103 wiz ~ Arande 100 HArcher ~ xXxKuro 100 barb ~ AnselTyme 101 cleric ~ lukeFONfabre 96 seeker ~ Tori_Anzu 90 mystic ~ KateiiHimura 95 veno ~ Artemaeus 58 psy. Playing since April 2009.
  • Leviath_Imp - Lost CityLeviath_Imp - Lost City Posts: 194 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    just stay sage cuz sage is cooler :D
    OH I GOT IT!
    CHEZE went sage on mooooooooo,
    so you should stay sage :D
    cuz cheze is just that guy.
    b:pleasedb:pleasedb:pleased
  • Arenaceous - Lost CityArenaceous - Lost City Posts: 632 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    just stay sage cuz sage is cooler :D
    OH I GOT IT!
    CHEZE went sage on mooooooooo,
    so you should stay sage :D
    cuz cheze is just that guy.
    b:pleasedb:pleasedb:pleased

    Best. argument. ever. /thread


    >_>
    "Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

    "Some have said there is no subtlety to destruction. You know what? They're dead."

    - Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
  • Nurfed_You - HarshlandsNurfed_You - Harshlands Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    i've played both sage adn demon mage and tbh i know for pvp that a sage wiz does jsut as well as a sage wiz.

    Sage PvP:
    could involve a little more kiting whiel waiting for the right moment to charm bypass or sutra
    keep your chi up whiel kiting and waiting for that right moment
    ultimates are still nice in pvp due to crit buff/chance to save a spark

    imho sage is played very defensivly. lots of waiting chi building and tactical choices to make yoru opponent burn chi/genie/apoth

    Demon PvP:
    can force an opportunity for a charm bypass or a sutra with teh added stun and better immobilize skills
    longer distance shrink but gains chi slightly slower longer fights>chi drain
    ultimates arent all that useful and teh chi can be hard to build up in a longer fight.

    in my experience with demon wizardry you generally have to play a little more offensivly and end the fight quickly, or you can be looking at struggling for chi.




    Just a few of the things that i noticed really differed in the playstyles. i can't really say how a demon wiz does in tw as i haven't used mine in tw. i would wager they do fairly well.
    ability to gtfo with longer distance shrink. generally you don't fight back to back to back so chi building isn't really an issue. wiz ulti's hurt regardless of culti at r9+12.

    If i decided to change my r9 mage to demon i would definatly pick up all the books that you'd actually use i.e. not pyroshell/CoF etc.




    The reason your 100culti has to be doen to change culti's is because you change from a celstial sage(achieved after 100culti) to a celestial demon(equivalent culti). i'm not 100% sure on keeping 100 skils. i'm pretty sure you keep them though as you have to be a celestial sage or a celestial demon in order to learn them. i've been debating switching my r9 mage to demon but eh i cba to spend that much relearning skills. good luck to you with w/e you decide
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Mizuoni - DreamweaverMizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    You express similar concerns I did when I wanted to change cultivation. I would say, give demon a spin. After switching to demon, a lot of people who I PvP with (yea in a pve server) said that I was a lot harder to beat for one reason: I wasn't predictable. It's kinda sad it took r9 for you to realize you don't need Sage BIDS lol...Nevertheless, the choice is yours. I had same concerns about switch (I had all but 3 sage skills) and I was worried about chi and etc. but the thing is, when you are demon, you tend to use less chi and it actually builds up pretty fast. (Also, if you have pretty high channeling, you build sparks in castervana like a madman.

    Willing to answer any other questions as I have played a demon and sage wiz at equal gear/equal amount of skills (something not many wizards can say).


    P.S. Whoever told him to make a second wizzy is an idiot because you can't account stash r9 b:surrender
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
    So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE. -cheze
  • Arenaceous - Lost CityArenaceous - Lost City Posts: 632 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Heh, was waiting for you to come here Mizu. :P It was not so much Rank9 but genie spark that made me reconsider my playstyle. Also you have got to admit that sage bids helps you with killing people that outgear you. Now I can pretty much get through all defense, maybe with the exception of one on oneing a full r9 +12 BM with sick mdef... I think I will grab a cheap skill here and there when I see them and wait for the new skill to see what wizards get offered.

    Did you notice a damage difference due to the lack of sage masteries? Honest reply. :P
    "Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

    "Some have said there is no subtlety to destruction. You know what? They're dead."

    - Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
  • rollerpigrollerpig Posts: 79 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Heh, was waiting for you to come here Mizu. :P It was not so much Rank9 but genie spark that made me reconsider my playstyle. Also you have got to admit that sage bids helps you with killing people that outgear you. Now I can pretty much get through all defense, maybe with the exception of one on oneing a full r9 +12 BM with sick mdef... I think I will grab a cheap skill here and there when I see them and wait for the new skill to see what wizards get offered.

    Did you notice a damage difference due to the lack of sage masteries? Honest reply. :P

    ****ING IDIOT,GIVE UP, YOU SHOULD STAY SAGE AND SOBER
    a
    sfasfafqwrqwr
  • Mumintroll - Heavens TearMumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    On private server I did comparison sage/demon masteries I had absolutely identical mages. And with high refined weapon is (sage)damage difference quite big. On another side. The R9 is so powerful that it can be enough to kill people easily as a demon.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • rollerpigrollerpig Posts: 79 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    On private server I did comparison sage/demon masteries I had absolutely identical mages. And with high refined weapon is (sage)damage difference quite big. On another side. The R9 is so powerful that it can be enough to kill people easily as a demon.

    I told youuuu Arenaceous

    I told youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu <3
  • Arenaceous - Lost CityArenaceous - Lost City Posts: 632 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    eff you, I will never stay sober. b:shutup
    "Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

    "Some have said there is no subtlety to destruction. You know what? They're dead."

    - Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
  • khabibulinkhabibulin Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    eff you, I will never stay sober. b:shutup

    I told youuuuuuuuuuuuuu
  • HexOmega - DreamweaverHexOmega - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,342 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    you know what,
    go demon
    and then we start genie discussion again - demon-biased
    ;D


    i wish adroit was still around ;/




    stil looking for the optimal tw+small group pk genie x.x
    i like potato
  • HarmOwnie - DreamweaverHarmOwnie - Dreamweaver Posts: 574 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Personally I am quite happy with my choice as a sage wiz because in solo PvE ( i know not many people are as stupid as I am to play PvE with a wiz) the sage skills are superior to the Demone ones.

    So as I am a content oriented player who doesnt give much about 1v1 PvP and open world PK so obviously TW is the only PvP situation I am going to play my wiz there sage rocks.

    Someone said that sage sparks dmg reduction doesnt pay off well it saved my *** many times when the clerics BB was interrupted by an AOE of a boss.

    Sage elemental resistances from barriers are great when you pull the lvl 100+ mobs in heaven/hell because with the water/fire resistance on the dmg you take is limited. Also in OHT there are mobs where the resistances come in handy when you try to fight multiple mobs.

    Sage Glacial Snares 20% debuff makes you hit with the gush nearly as strong as the inicial glacial which means most of the mobs in PvE can be killed by Glacial Snare pyro Gush. Also divine pyros 20% debuff combined with normal pyro is nice and helps to keep your mana pool up.

    Sage shrink is amazing and emberstorm is also nice because you can use it without causing a charm tick also the 1s lower cooldown on wphoenix rox.

    sage skills that doesnt pay off: wellspring quarf dmg increase is a joke, frostblade only for chi spamming but demon also can do that the re buff time doesnt matter so sage effect is quite useless, sage sandstorm because sage stone rain does also nice dmg and has chan bonus and acc reduction is hardly noticeable on enemies.

    i am still missing sage DB and the lvl 100 skills :(

    greetz harm0wnie
  • Questro - Lost CityQuestro - Lost City Posts: 40 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    I gotta agree with sage too.
    Better chi management. Last longer in battle. Damage is obviously better, able to take on tougher target. Demon control skills are just another extra bonus we dont really need. After all, it only useful barb abd bm. With or without control skill, if you know what you doing, the outcome will be the same.

    I always think a wiz need chi, without chi, you cant shrink, sultra, ults or spark up. Losing the whole idea of even playing a wiz.
    A crit from Archer usually hurt but a crit from wiz usually mean death.
  • Questro - Lost CityQuestro - Lost City Posts: 40 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    3.) Wizards are lacking control skills.

    Of course kiting is more than possible as a sage, but your only change to land an ultimate usually is to wait for the 2 minute cooldown from your Sleep Skill. A demon mage has more possibilities. The occasional Stone Rain stun lets you cast an ultimate.

    Can always fortify/ults vs most class , no need to wait every 2 minutes
    A crit from Archer usually hurt but a crit from wiz usually mean death.
  • Arenaceous - Lost CityArenaceous - Lost City Posts: 632 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    While this is true, smart players can mostly counter a non sleep ult. Spark for immunity, apoth, archer or cleric shell, TE, Balance, Holy Path away, sleep or seal you or just kill you and counter ult with wind shield or domain. There's endless ways to make you waste the ult without sleep. Sure, sometimes it works, especially in group pvp.
    "Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

    "Some have said there is no subtlety to destruction. You know what? They're dead."

    - Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
  • Mizuoni - DreamweaverMizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Heh, was waiting for you to come here Mizu. :P It was not so much Rank9 but genie spark that made me reconsider my playstyle. Also you have got to admit that sage bids helps you with killing people that outgear you. Now I can pretty much get through all defense, maybe with the exception of one on oneing a full r9 +12 BM with sick mdef... I think I will grab a cheap skill here and there when I see them and wait for the new skill to see what wizards get offered.

    Did you notice a damage difference due to the lack of sage masteries? Honest reply. :P

    The difference was maybe 500 PvP damage...It was less noticeable with gush. Tbh, as you stated, with spark and r8, I really don't need to worry about more damage because my damage is adequate enough to 1-2 shot most people. Harder opponents take a bit of luck (My gear is still **** to compare to +12 r9 sins), but I still pop out pretty big numbers. undine + d. pyro + spark on decent geared targets is about 7k or so damage.
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
    So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE. -cheze
  • Mumintroll - Heavens TearMumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    The difference was maybe 500 PvP damage...It was less noticeable with gush. Tbh, as you stated, with spark and r8, I really don't need to worry about more damage because my damage is adequate enough to 1-2 shot most people. Harder opponents take a bit of luck (My gear is still **** to compare to +12 r9 sins), but I still pop out pretty big numbers. undine + d. pyro + spark on decent geared targets is about 7k or so damage.
    Jezus. 500 in PVP is HUGE difference.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • rollerpigrollerpig Posts: 79 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    He's bent on going hell, again

    Guess you could say he's hellbent.
This discussion has been closed.