APS Should Be Nerfed PVP Only

Oh come on, Bloody. You're acting like a complete moron right now.

Consider that physical attacks are on a lower base than magic to begin with. Then toss in the fact that casters have a range advantage while a good portion of the battle for melees is getting to the caster. Now toss in the addition that casters have stronger spells on average just from the skills alone (500% weapon damage skills > 200% weapon damage skills) and it's obvious why "tanky" heavy armor has more magic resist. Combine that with the fact that there's far more ways to increase p.def than m.def and what does increase m.def gives a lower value than p.def and it becomes fairly obvious.

Yes, base-wise casters have a lower phys defense than m.def, but base is the least of our concerns since if you're purged and reduced to your base in PvP, you turn into a 1-shot for either side. After all, archers have the highest "base" run speed, but you don't see them out-running demon venos and barbs in tiger when they aren't using elven alac/holy path to get to 15.0 now do you?

Now take a look at what happens when you go beyond the stupid argument of "but **** base XXX hurrrrr"

http://pwcalc.com/e006aa8286790220 Arcane going extreme for p.def while still wearing arcane armor
http://pwcalc.com/cd88215b2e5f1102 Heavy going extreme for m.def while still wearing heavy armor.

I dunno about you, but last I checked, 52k > 43k. That's right, the caster has more p.def than the melee has m.def even though the base on their amor would say otherwise! Even better? The caster doesn't have to nuke their p.def via marrow to do it!

BUT WUT ABOUT DA BAAAAAAAAAASE?! Remove the arcane's p.def buffs and it has 14k. Remove the heavy's m.def bufsf and it has 13k. Again, the arcane's p.def beats the heavy's m.def Oh and let's not forget to look at the damage range. At 18k-20k vs 12k-18k, hit for hit the caster will be hitting the heavy harder to begin with, even if they had the exact same defense against each other.


Fact of the matter is, what you're arguing is utterly stupid, which is why nobody is going to agree with you unless they're brain dead.

Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »

that 45 str tome on caster is pro
lol, i know, I know, you were just lazy.
but still lol.

Yeah. Same difference if I used the 45 mag one thanks to restats and all so saving time ftw. b:surrender

Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »

that 45 str tome on caster is pro

I would use a 45 str tome on my caster any day. Throw in a couple gold... that 45 str is just as good as a 45 mag tome.

Holy ****. I haven't seen you use that avatar in ages! Not since http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=721242 come to think of it...

/semi-nostalgia activated

Hexalot - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Once it procs, a +12 R9 Zerk axe will one shot most casters and even quite a few LAs out there. And of course, axes have no real attack speed to speak of.

You do know unless cursed... a +12 r9 ax zerk more then likely won't even tick another la r9's charm right.

_Bloody_Fox_ - Lost City wrote: »

No one from lost city is even replying in this thread at all LOL.
But I can guarantee base-wise, HA have more mag def than Arcanes have P def. It's just fact. I already made two characters on pwcalc to compare but I lost my internet so I am not doing it again lol. Tell me why tt90 HA gets 655 mag def and Aracne gets 171.... Anyways I gotta go to school and then to work but I am sure someone from lost city will agree eventually

Heavy armor does give more elemental res. than arcane has phys res. Having both a 97 barb and a 101 cleric, I would agree that heavy armor with elemental ornaments are better than arcane with physical defense ornaments. And beside the differences in resistances, arcane armor refining does very little compared to refining heavy armor. When sharding arcane, you have to choose hp or phys def, because there's no way you're going to get both.
Of course there are exceptions to this. (stone barrier on wizards, etc) But for the average player, this is usually the case.

Lord_Ghetto - Dreamweaver wrote: »

the arguement was arcanes are squisher to mele classes then mele are to arcanes?

so any1 here actually pk and keep a dmg counter in genteral chat? reason i as is id like to see the dmg a mag class does to a mele ...and vice versa b/c i know hit for hit the caster is doing alot more dmg assuming both are using close to the same lv gear

Casters generally hit harder then melee classes, but melee classes don't usually have 1-3 second channelling for every hit. Even with my -24% channeling, an archer can hit me 2-3 times before I hit him once. And archers have a slow attack rate compared to most melee classes.
In my earlier post, I was just agreeing with the OP that heavy armor has advantages over arcane of the same level.

prof wrote: »

the only time heavy had the advantage was when skill cancelling wasn't nerfed - now that it is, none of these heavy classes put out enough dps to actually kill a caster with a brain(which obviously isn't you).

dont make me laugh. never needed CC and im doing fine.

barb ftw

-24% is a problem? Think again, prof. Even with -100% channeling, clerics have a minimum of 1 sec cast time. So the maximum aps with mag skills is 1. And every melee class can do better than that with minimal effort.
I used archers as an example for attack rate, not damage per second. Ranged weapons have the lowest attack rate of any weapon. The point I was making is that no matter what the channeling for a cleric, any melee class will get more hits faster.
Next time you quote me, read and understand what I wrote first.

Prof, go troll somebody else.
I never said anywhere that I personally have a problem fighting melee classes. It was a discussion of attacks per second. Like I said, understand what I wrote before you quote.