Is IH really Stackable?

Amencat - Sanctuary
Amencat - Sanctuary Posts: 484 Arc User
edited November 2010 in Cleric
Thought you can not Buff someone as long the current (same) Buff runs out of time.

So why is IH so effective?
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Post edited by Amencat - Sanctuary on
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Comments

  • Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear
    Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear Posts: 4,864 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Oh hello, you must be new here.
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  • Amencat - Sanctuary
    Amencat - Sanctuary Posts: 484 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    just thought it would make more sense use 1 IH and as long that one works, use Blessing of the Purehearted or Stream of Rejuvenation, when IH runs out cast it once again and then something else ...
    Some Rules each PWI Gamer should know
    1. Dont break this rules & no matter what: DONT TRUST ANYONE!
    2. Dont pay wine or heads fee (like to get kicked after that?) b:chuckle
    3. Dont borrow items (since when return gms scammed stuff?) b:embarrass
    4. Dont use your password in faction-forums (like hacks?) b:fatb
    5. Dont give your mats to the tt-banker (obvious, not?) b:beg
    6. Dont wait for help, or heals, or any other miracles,... (for more examples just play pwi and you will hate the whole humanity) b:bye
  • TrueHarmony - Archosaur
    TrueHarmony - Archosaur Posts: 332 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I kind of hope your trolling XD a lvl 80 suggestion a combo that includes pure hearted blessing O.o''''.

    Ironheart does stack, as far as i remember its about five before they reset without -chan gear. IH is just the way to go no matter how you look at it, spam 3 or so on the tank, dd the boss while they tick, spam on the tank, dd on the boss.
    Yeah my sig doesn't match my name...i would say im being all clever and trying to confuse people...but im really just too lazy to make a new one
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  • vristion
    vristion Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    No one really knows why the buff is stackable. Only thing I can guess is the codeing somehow was implemented to be like the debuffers that do stack... rather one or all was intentional, no clue.
  • Candie - Raging Tide
    Candie - Raging Tide Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    It stacks because it's DoT , not a buff . Well , not DoT but ... umm ... anti-DoT
  • Sun_Burn - Lost City
    Sun_Burn - Lost City Posts: 579 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    ^ dot damage stacks for the same reason IH stacks.

    Im curious how Stream of Rejuv's DoT heal actually stacks with IH. Does the DoT heal from stream overwrite the IH or does it get added to IH's DoT
  • vristion
    vristion Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Sun_Burn - Lost City wrote: »
    ^ dot damage stacks for the same reason IH stacks.

    Im curious how Stream of Rejuv's DoT heal actually stacks with IH. Does the DoT heal from stream overwrite the IH or does it get added to IH's DoT

    No, the HoT is the same, SoR is moreless a 1 click WS+IH combo....or BoR maybe with amount of raw direct heal.
  • Sun_Burn - Lost City
    Sun_Burn - Lost City Posts: 579 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    vristion wrote: »
    No, the HoT is the same, SoR is moreless a 1 click WS+IH combo....or BoR maybe with amount of raw direct heal.

    what do u mean the heal over time is the same? IH has a different HoT ammount than SoR's HoT. So is the SoR's HoT ammount added to the remaining IH HoT or does it overwrite say the 2-3 remaining "ticks" of IH?
  • vristion
    vristion Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    One HoT would work independant as would the other, but still the same Buff/DoT whatever...

    so for instance, one heals for 100 the other for 200 it would go

    100
    200
    100
    200
    100

    works much like if you had one cleric with lvl 1 IH, and one with lvl 10 both casting on the same player. Each of their buffs/DoT whatever will work independant. but still co-exist
  • Sun_Burn - Lost City
    Sun_Burn - Lost City Posts: 579 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    vristion wrote: »
    One HoT would work independant as would the other, but still the same Buff/DoT whatever...

    so for instance, one heals for 100 the other for 200 it would go

    100
    200
    100
    200
    100

    works much like if you had one cleric with lvl 1 IH, and one with lvl 10 both casting on the same player. Each of their buffs/DoT whatever will work independant. but still co-exist

    never tried it with 2 clerics with different heal levels.
  • vristion
    vristion Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Yea....well also even two lvl 10 IH would differ depending on the magatk they have..

    But one way to test these theories is to duel a Barb down, cast one SoR followed by an IH, watch as the HPs go up, one pulse will be much bigger than the next...

    Same thing with testing a second cleric's IH stacking, Take a low level 40ish cleric.. have them cast on a player with low HPs, you follow with one of your own... The increaseing HPs will be diferent each tick.
  • RedsRose - Lost City
    RedsRose - Lost City Posts: 12,354 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    vristion wrote: »
    Yea....well also even two lvl 10 IH would differ depending on the magatk they have..

    ^ This

    But the search function would help...there has been more then a few threads on this.

    IH stacks...
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  • Irage - Sanctuary
    Irage - Sanctuary Posts: 13 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    At least one past thread has claimed to have tested and confirmed that IH's heal over time also stacks with the heal over time portion of Stream.
  • XSOOKlEx - Raging Tide
    XSOOKlEx - Raging Tide Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    ok so im still trying to figure out how many IH's stack and when its cancelled. ive typed in "IH stacks" and its not pulling up any threads. saying its to common or to long.
    i have a friend(cleric) that wont let a psy use bubble after they have spammed 3 IH's.
    also i just made a cleric myself, and that same friend is telling me to be careful about "over healing".
    so what counts as "over healing" and when do IH's cancel eachother out?
  • ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver
    ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,457 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    XSOOKlEx - Raging Tide wrote: »
    ok so im still trying to figure out how many IH's stack and when its cancelled. ive typed in "IH stacks" and its not pulling up any threads. saying its to common or to long.
    i have a friend(cleric) that wont let a psy use bubble after they have spammed 3 IH's.
    also i just made a cleric myself, and that same friend is telling me to be careful about "over healing".
    so what counts as "over healing" and when do IH's cancel eachother out?

    as far as i know bubble stacks with IH
    never tested it myself but everyone I asked said that.

    overhealing = healing too much, more than required isntead of healing + DDing/Debuffing.
    for example, if nobody is not in danger (the cleric heals everyone as required) you should not use bubble but DD (and save it for an emergency)
  • Xoria - Sanctuary
    Xoria - Sanctuary Posts: 419 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Candie - Raging Tide wrote: »
    It stacks because it's DoT , not a buff . Well , not DoT but ... umm ... anti-DoT

    Ironheart Blessing can be purged by a veno, making it a buff of sorts, so saying it's a buff isn't entirely correct, but it's not entirely wrong either.

    Ironheart Blessing probably creates multiple instances of the same skill. By this I mean:

    Take one barb. Use Flesh Ream. Hold down Flesh Ream. What do you see? Do you see the same instance of the bleed effect increase in damage, or do you see many instances of bleed with roughly the same damage being dealt?

    The answer is you see multiple instances of bleed going on. The same is probably true with Ironheart. However, unless the Devs make healing values shown on screen (like what so many other games have implemented), I don't think we can be 100% sure.

    Unless someone hacks into the client and delves into the files that show the formulas for healing, etc., etc. (not suggesting it should be done!).

    Also, I've also heard Ironheart can only be stacked 5 times, blah, blah, but where is the basis of this information?
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  • Lana - Raging Tide
    Lana - Raging Tide Posts: 469 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Xoria - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Ironheart Blessing can be purged by a veno, making it a buff of sorts, so saying it's a buff isn't entirely correct, but it's not entirely wrong either.

    And here i was wondering, if bosses that purge actually DO purge stacked IHs as well (since i got that impression especially on 3-3 BHs) b:thanks
    Xoria - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Also, I've also heard Ironheart can only be stacked 5 times, blah, blah, but where is the basis of this information?

    I do believe it stacks as many times as you can cast it in 15 seconds, before the first IH runs out.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Paramedic - Dreamweaver
    Paramedic - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,801 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=749622


    and yea - seems IH can be purged and acts like buff which increase health regen
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  • Meyki - Sanctuary
    Meyki - Sanctuary Posts: 222 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    DoT can be purified, DoT stacks, IH is hot, hot stacks and can be purged. So... what are we talking about when it is as simple as that? b:shutup
    IH is as much buff as poison from Nether Servants or w/e.
  • Xoria - Sanctuary
    Xoria - Sanctuary Posts: 419 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Paramedic - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=749622

    Ty for the link~
    [In a distorted place and time][The knife that stabbed me in the back grants me wings]
    [I keep looking to the sky][In order to flee from the memories]
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    [The world that expands inside of your arms is][///the last secret garden///]
    [If you've already forgotten me, don't forget...]
    [The things that we once embraced]
  • ClericMD - Lost City
    ClericMD - Lost City Posts: 127 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Xoria - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Ty for the link~
    Paramedic - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=749622

    and yea - seems IH can be purged and acts like buff which increase health regen

    Skill Ironheart Blessing Level 10

    Range 26.5meters
    Mana 229.5
    Channel 1.0 seconds
    Cast 1.0 seconds
    Cooldown 1.0 seconds
    Weapon Unarmed, Magic Instruments

    Requisite Cultivation Spiritual Initiate
    Bless the target to recover 714 HP plus 30% of
    your base magic attack over 15 seconds.

    No demon or Sage yet

    I agree with all that he wrote, but you people must remeber IH duration is 15 seconds and take 2 seconds (2 looooooong seconds to cast b:angry) .

    so you cast:

    IH(1) Have 15 sec of duration
    IH(2) have 15 sec IH(1) duration have decrease for 2 sec
    IH(3) 15 sec IH(1) duration have decrease for 4 sec IH(2) Decrease for 2 sec
    IH(4) 15 sec IH(1) 6 sec IH(2) 4 sec IH(3) 2 sec
    IH(5) 15 sec IH(1) 8 sec IH(2) 6 sec IH(3) 4 sec IH(4) 2 sec
    IH(6) 15 sec IH(1) 10 sec IH(2) 8 sec IH(3) 6 sec IH(4) 4 sec IH(5) 2 sec
    IH(7) 15 sec IH(1) 12 sec IH(2) 10 sec IH(3) 8 sec IH(4) 6 sec IH(5) 4 sec IH(6) 2 sec
    IH(8) 15 sec IH(1) 14 sec IH(2) 12 sec IH(3) 10 sec IH(4) 8 sec IH(5) 6 sec IH(6) 4 sec IH(7) 2 sec
    IH(9) 15 sec IH(1) time off IH(2) 14 sec IH(3) 12 sec IH(4) 10 sec IH(5) 8 sec IH(6) 6 sec IH(7) 4 sec IH(8) 2 sec


    So the max IH that ONE cleric can stack is 8 and have 1 sec of max regeneration.

    Unless a veno pass for there, purge you and fu.ck you XD
  • Lana - Raging Tide
    Lana - Raging Tide Posts: 469 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    ClericMD - Lost City wrote: »
    IH(1) Have 15 sec of duration
    IH(2) have 15 sec IH(1) duration have decrease for 2 sec
    IH(3) 15 sec IH(1) duration have decrease for 4 sec IH(2) Decrease for 2 sec
    IH(4) 15 sec IH(1) 6 sec IH(2) 4 sec IH(3) 2 sec
    IH(5) 15 sec IH(1) 8 sec IH(2) 6 sec IH(3) 4 sec IH(4) 2 sec
    IH(6) 15 sec IH(1) 10 sec IH(2) 8 sec IH(3) 6 sec IH(4) 4 sec IH(5) 2 sec
    IH(7) 15 sec IH(1) 12 sec IH(2) 10 sec IH(3) 8 sec IH(4) 6 sec IH(5) 4 sec IH(6) 2 sec
    IH(8) 15 sec IH(1) 14 sec IH(2) 12 sec IH(3) 10 sec IH(4) 8 sec IH(5) 6 sec IH(6) 4 sec IH(7) 2 sec
    IH(9) 15 sec IH(1) time off IH(2) 14 sec IH(3) 12 sec IH(4) 10 sec IH(5) 8 sec IH(6) 6 sec IH(7) 4 sec IH(8) 2 sec

    Please calculate this again with about -40% chan b:thanks
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  • ClericMD - Lost City
    ClericMD - Lost City Posts: 127 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Chan dont afect the coldown and the cast time, only afect the channelling time so if you have -40% chan (you are rich chan are so expensive b:chuckle) your iron will take 0,6 sec to channeling but still cast in one sec so you "shot" it in 1,6 sec, and still having the 1 sec cooldown.

    I read that have -40+% chan in clerics make the IH have a graphycal bug and too a bug that make if dont cast. But never probe by myself.
  • Deceptistar - Sanctuary
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary Posts: 10,454 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    ClericMD - Lost City wrote: »
    Skill Ironheart Blessing Level 10

    Range 26.5meters
    Mana 229.5
    Channel 1.0 seconds
    Cast 1.0 seconds
    Cooldown 1.0 seconds
    Weapon Unarmed, Magic Instruments

    Requisite Cultivation Spiritual Initiate
    Bless the target to recover 714 HP plus 30% of
    your base magic attack over 15 seconds.

    No demon or Sage yet

    I agree with all that he wrote, but you people must remeber IH duration is 15 seconds and take 2 seconds (2 looooooong seconds to cast b:angry) .

    so you cast:

    IH(1) Have 15 sec of duration
    IH(2) have 15 sec IH(1) duration have decrease for 2 sec
    IH(3) 15 sec IH(1) duration have decrease for 4 sec IH(2) Decrease for 2 sec
    IH(4) 15 sec IH(1) 6 sec IH(2) 4 sec IH(3) 2 sec
    IH(5) 15 sec IH(1) 8 sec IH(2) 6 sec IH(3) 4 sec IH(4) 2 sec
    IH(6) 15 sec IH(1) 10 sec IH(2) 8 sec IH(3) 6 sec IH(4) 4 sec IH(5) 2 sec
    IH(7) 15 sec IH(1) 12 sec IH(2) 10 sec IH(3) 8 sec IH(4) 6 sec IH(5) 4 sec IH(6) 2 sec
    IH(8) 15 sec IH(1) 14 sec IH(2) 12 sec IH(3) 10 sec IH(4) 8 sec IH(5) 6 sec IH(6) 4 sec IH(7) 2 sec
    IH(9) 15 sec IH(1) time off IH(2) 14 sec IH(3) 12 sec IH(4) 10 sec IH(5) 8 sec IH(6) 6 sec IH(7) 4 sec IH(8) 2 sec


    So the max IH that ONE cleric can stack is 8 and have 1 sec of max regeneration.

    Unless a veno pass for there, purge you and fu.ck you XD
    Im pretty sure my regen lasted well over 1sec back in 2008 when there was no -%channeling gear and we GRINDED on mobs till lv90s... >.>

    <.< why is the forum topics reverting back to 2009 topics or is this a new wave of pple who just dont use the search button.
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  • Meyki - Sanctuary
    Meyki - Sanctuary Posts: 222 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »
    <.< why is the forum topics reverting back to 2009 topics or is this a new wave of pple who just dont use the search button.
    Search button sucks in many ways. When you have some additional questions, you can't post to old topic, because at least five people would start yelling necro at you using as big letter as this site allows. And new players are coming, forum politics is set as it is, so people are forced to create similar threads every day. I used try to search things here, but to be honest, who would read twenty pages of stupid text without a chance, after reading it, add her question at the end? So...


    @ClericMD: well, the "time off" is 7 IHs (without channeling gear) no big deal, do I get it right?
  • Deceptistar - Sanctuary
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary Posts: 10,454 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Meyki - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Search button sucks in many ways. When you have some additional questions, you can't post to old topic, because at least five people would start yelling necro at you using as big letter as this site allows. And new players are coming, forum politics is set as it is, so people are forced to create similar threads every day. I used try to search things here, but to be honest, who would read twenty pages of stupid text without a chance, after reading it, add her question at the end? So...


    @ClericMD: well, the "time off" is 7 IHs (without channeling gear) no big deal, do I get it right?
    it usually only sucks when there is
    -not enough info.
    -you fail at searching good.
    -your too lazy to read.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]lagunal8.deviantart.com
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  • Meyki - Sanctuary
    Meyki - Sanctuary Posts: 222 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »
    it usually only sucks when there is
    -not enough info.
    -you fail at searching good.
    -your too lazy to read.
    Maybe, but you didn't get the point. Why would one bother reading and searching some old threads without any chance of interaction when he/she can simply create new thread, get answers and be allowed to post there. It is way easier, so why bother?
  • Deceptistar - Sanctuary
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary Posts: 10,454 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Meyki - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Maybe, but you didn't get the point. Why would one bother reading and searching some old threads without any chance of interaction when he/she can simply create new thread, get answers and be allowed to post there. It is way easier, so why bother?
    Because by searching you get a variety of threads that usually hold a multitude of information over a period of time. Its like a library. Sure you can make a new thread, but if your not using search your basically just picking to look at one thread in a limited time frame, rather than multiple threads that could hold some nice info scattered here and there and even other subjects you didnt know about. Some pple like the easy way altho the info could be somewhat shallow, some like to research more and dig in deeper. "To look up one and find out ten."
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  • Meyki - Sanctuary
    Meyki - Sanctuary Posts: 222 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Because by searching you get a variety of threads that usually hold a multitude of information over a period of time. Its like a library. Sure you can make a new thread, but if your not using search your basically just picking to look at one thread in a limited time frame, rather than multiple threads that could hold some nice info scattered here and there and even other subjects you didnt know about. Some pple like the easy way altho the info could be somewhat shallow, some like to research more and dig in deeper. "To look up one and find out ten."
    b:victory okay I understand. But still, this is not gonna happen. People don't think like this. They want answer. Fast and without hard work. I know forums (not about games though) where you can post in old thread and get new discussion, so people use search much much more, because they are not afraid of posting in old threads.
  • AshliHope - Sanctuary
    AshliHope - Sanctuary Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    ClericMD - Lost City wrote: »
    Skill Ironheart Blessing Level 10

    Range 26.5meters
    Mana 229.5
    Channel 1.0 seconds
    Cast 1.0 seconds
    Cooldown 1.0 seconds
    Weapon Unarmed, Magic Instruments

    Requisite Cultivation Spiritual Initiate
    Bless the target to recover 714 HP plus 30% of
    your base magic attack over 15 seconds.

    No demon or Sage yet

    I agree with all that he wrote, but you people must remeber IH duration is 15 seconds and take 2 seconds (2 looooooong seconds to cast b:angry) .

    so you cast:

    IH(1) Have 15 sec of duration
    IH(2) have 15 sec IH(1) duration have decrease for 2 sec
    IH(3) 15 sec IH(1) duration have decrease for 4 sec IH(2) Decrease for 2 sec
    IH(4) 15 sec IH(1) 6 sec IH(2) 4 sec IH(3) 2 sec
    IH(5) 15 sec IH(1) 8 sec IH(2) 6 sec IH(3) 4 sec IH(4) 2 sec
    IH(6) 15 sec IH(1) 10 sec IH(2) 8 sec IH(3) 6 sec IH(4) 4 sec IH(5) 2 sec
    IH(7) 15 sec IH(1) 12 sec IH(2) 10 sec IH(3) 8 sec IH(4) 6 sec IH(5) 4 sec IH(6) 2 sec
    IH(8) 15 sec IH(1) 14 sec IH(2) 12 sec IH(3) 10 sec IH(4) 8 sec IH(5) 6 sec IH(6) 4 sec IH(7) 2 sec
    IH(9) 15 sec IH(1) time off IH(2) 14 sec IH(3) 12 sec IH(4) 10 sec IH(5) 8 sec IH(6) 6 sec IH(7) 4 sec IH(8) 2 sec


    So the max IH that ONE cleric can stack is 8 and have 1 sec of max regeneration.

    Unless a veno pass for there, purge you and fu.ck you XD

    The first ironheart will fade halfway through the 8th, simple math if you take ironhearts channel time, 1 second, and 1 second cooldown, thats 2, 15 second duration, divided by 2, is 7.5, but, you cannot get a Half a stack, so its rounded down to 7, thus, you get 7 total stacks of ironheart at 0% channeling, with the primary healing at around 5 stacks giving the most stable potency, with -24% channeling, you still get 7 total stacks, even though ironheart is a 0.76 channel. if you spam ironheart on a target, count the number of times before the buff icon fades, when the buff icon fades, the first ironheart is gone. meanwhile with -24% channel, every other spell is tons faster, including pureheart, which sits at a 2.28 channel time, instead of 3. the most stacks of ironheart you can ever achieve is 15 per cleric, and thats provided you have no lag, and instant-channeling.
    at 50% channeling, you'll get 10 max stacks of ironheart, the first fading halfway before the 11th, thus you gain 3 stacks of ironheart from 0 to 50% channel. meanwhile every other spell has their channel times cut by 50%, even pureheart, at 1.5 sec channel, would make ironheart obsolete. especially factoring in sage/demons 1375+50% base magic attack.

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