Questions about Veno

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  • MaouHime - Raging Tide
    MaouHime - Raging Tide Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Can you tell me the trick behind AOEing mobs? ^^

    Whenever I do it, they all end up chasing me around after 1 Noxious Gas. So all i Could do, was to attack all mobs with my pet until I could kill them all with 1 Spell b:cry.

    Is there any better way?

    The reason maybe is that I tried to AOE Mobs which are 9 levels below me.

    Desdi, Serenity it's up to you b:laugh
  • Solandri - Heavens Tear
    Solandri - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,843 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    MaouHime - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Can you tell me the trick behind AOEing mobs? ^^

    Whenever I do it, they all end up chasing me around after 1 Noxious Gas. So all i Could do, was to attack all mobs with my pet until I could kill them all with 1 Spell b:cry.
    Your pet has to have generated enough aggro on each mob that a single AOE won't overcome that aggro. At early levels this is usually just a simple matter of letting the pet Bash each mob at least once. But at higher levels (when your Noxious will do a lot more damage) you'll have to have it Bash + get in a few attacks on each mob. Heck, at higher levels you have to worry about pulling aggro even when your pet is attacking only one mob.

    Because of this, I've never found AOEing with a herc to be a time-effective strategy. Nearly every time I've worked out the numbers, killing the mobs one at a time would be faster for a veno (albeit more mana-intensive). The exception is if you can one-shot or almost one-shot the mobs with your AOE. Then it doesn't matter if you pull aggro off your pet because the mob is dead.
  • MaouHime - Raging Tide
    MaouHime - Raging Tide Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Thx, for the explanation, I will keep that in mind and for now I will keep trying and learning.
  • Cocobelle - Sanctuary
    Cocobelle - Sanctuary Posts: 960 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Solandri - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Your pet has to have generated enough aggro on each mob that a single AOE won't overcome that aggro. At early levels this is usually just a simple matter of letting the pet Bash each mob at least once. But at higher levels (when your Noxious will do a lot more damage) you'll have to have it Bash + get in a few attacks on each mob. Heck, at higher levels you have to worry about pulling aggro even when your pet is attacking only one mob.

    Because of this, I've never found AOEing with a herc to be a time-effective strategy. Nearly every time I've worked out the numbers, killing the mobs one at a time would be faster for a veno (albeit more mana-intensive). The exception is if you can one-shot or almost one-shot the mobs with your AOE. Then it doesn't matter if you pull aggro off your pet because the mob is dead.

    I think AOEing with a herc is pretty effective as long as the herc's reflect works. But with other pets, I think it's better if you do it one mob at a time. I'm not sure about the walker or magmite since I haven't used any of those for a long time.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    AoE grinding is not really that practical without an herc or a pet with reflect. I will sometimes use DoTs to soften up 1-2 extra mobs while working on another one, but there really is little difference in terms of killing speed. The problem is you really can't spam Noxious as often as the cooldown would allow you since you have to keep mobs aggroed by constantly switching targets on your pet, and the extra number of keys you need to press for each mob killed (this really becomes a consideration on long grinding sessions) is usually more than doubled, not to mention you're running extra risks as some special status mobs (usually only a minor distraction) can become a bigger obstacle when dealing with multiples. Also, i find when grinding in a small area that spawn times become an important consideration. Killing three mobs at the same time saving 5-10 secs to then be stuck 10-15 secs waiting for their respawn would be wasteful, while roaming around really does seem to cut into how much you can make, as you must now factor in walking times and other grinders (i usually attack a mob just as the last one is dropping) while wandering mobs walking in mid-fight become a consideration, increasing risk.

    Grinding is a somewhat dull, tiring activity so i do consider it important to get through it in as efficient and leisurely a manner as posible. Grinding as i do it nowadays does allow me the oportunity to chat in the meanwhile or to check my character info, gear, the boutique, etc. AoE grinding, for me, would mean i would have to be more actively engaged (most likely bored) and make less coin for my trouble. Not worth it.
  • MaouHime - Raging Tide
    MaouHime - Raging Tide Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Great way of grinding and havin fun b:laugh
    So I should forget AOE for now, because its not that profitable as it could be with an Herc or "Solo-Mobing". However, is it ok if I start AOE with my Brother who started his BM a few days ago and is almost at my level?
  • Mauntille - Heavens Tear
    Mauntille - Heavens Tear Posts: 694 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    It'd be a good idea to at the very least play around with your aoe's so that you can learn how they work and how to control them. You should be using them differently depending on if you have a pet tanking (and then which pet and which skills), another player tanking, or even yourself tanking.

    If you're uncomfortable with it at first, start with just a couple of mobs to guage the relative strength of the aoe vs. attacks. Then work your way up.

    You may not find yourself using them as much in the earlier levels, but you'll get their full worth later.
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Mauntille - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    It'd be a good idea to at the very least play around with your aoe's so that you can learn how they work and how to control them. You should be using them differently depending on if you have a pet tanking (and then which pet and which skills), another player tanking, or even yourself tanking.

    If you're uncomfortable with it at first, start with just a couple of mobs to guage the relative strength of the aoe vs. attacks. Then work your way up.

    You may not find yourself using them as much in the earlier levels, but you'll get their full worth later.

    Don't get me wrong, Noxious is certainly splendid for squad work if you've got a tank that can handle keeping aggro on 3-4 mobs, although i would discourage use of Nova outside of certain scenarios such as RB since with any sort of competent squad you'll be getting no more than 2-3 hits in on any given mob, one of those being an Ironwood, which can make filling up your chi bar rather difficult and the benefits of the skill with 5-6 people attacking are unlikely to make much of a difference. At least i would say this holds up until 69 unless you have to deal with upwards of 5-6 mobs which is a rare occurence. Yes, grindspots are the ideal place for experimenting the use of your skills, but grinding as an activity is mostly about getting as much xp/loot as you can in the shortest amount of time. You should take the time to fully master the use of your skills, but even such training you should limit to a certain extent as time really is the most valuable of the resources available to you.
  • MaouHime - Raging Tide
    MaouHime - Raging Tide Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Ok for now I see and learn how much my Noxious is capable against a set number of mobs and in what kind of situation that is.

    Hmm, I just noticed that most of the people posting in this Forum are either from Heavens Tear or Sanctuary b:laugh maybe I should have started one there. ^^

    Ohh well I'm hitting my bed now, cause it's like 2 am here b:shocked
  • RiiC - Raging Tide
    RiiC - Raging Tide Posts: 40 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    OK so I have some question have my 1st veno character.
    How do you make a monster your pet, I believe I can do that now but with no instructions in this game most of the time it leaves one holding the ????? by the handle. b:puzzled
    Also can you get a pet that you can Ride and/or Fly?
    I suppose those are going to cost extra b:cry
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    There's a quest that will teach you as well as provide you with your first pet. You get it at level 3 from the Pet Trainer npc if i remember correctly... Look on the Quest Tips section of the forums for Ence's guide to lvl 1-20 Untamed quests.

    Edit; As for your other questions, pets that can fly come free of charge. The most recommended is the lvl 9 Petite Sawfly. Your other good choice is the lvl 22 Skatefish, in case you would like a different choice. There are no pets you can ride, but all classes have access to animal mounts. Their price may seem somewhat steep for someone new to the game but you can get them for as low as 1 million coins at the moment, which really isn't that much at high levels.
  • Mauntille - Heavens Tear
    Mauntille - Heavens Tear Posts: 694 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Don't get me wrong, Noxious is certainly splendid for squad work if you've got a tank that can handle keeping aggro on 3-4 mobs, although i would discourage use of Nova outside of certain scenarios such as RB since with any sort of competent squad you'll be getting no more than 2-3 hits in on any given mob, one of those being an Ironwood, which can make filling up your chi bar rather difficult and the benefits of the skill with 5-6 people attacking are unlikely to make much of a difference. At least i would say this holds up until 69 unless you have to deal with upwards of 5-6 mobs which is a rare occurence. Yes, grindspots are the ideal place for experimenting the use of your skills, but grinding as an activity is mostly about getting as much xp/loot as you can in the shortest amount of time. You should take the time to fully master the use of your skills, but even such training you should limit to a certain extent as time really is the most valuable of the resources available to you.

    I didn't mean to say use them in all cases; just to try them out in semi-controlled situations. Depending on the strength of your nova and casting in general, it doesn't hurt to use it while grinding either. You can nox-nova-nox a large group of mobs and usually kill them before they start to run at you. (Remember that nova will seal most of them). It's also useful in helping to keep a stun-lock going. For example, a BM's aoe stun and a carefully timed nova will keep the mobs sealed for a fair amount of time...

    But yes, most useful in places like RB and FF.

    The point was to not just ignore a skill with the thought that "it'll be useful later". If you play around with your skills, you may find new usues for them and get more bang for your buck. IMO, you should always know what you are and aren't capable of. This comes from experimentation.
    OK so I have some question have my 1st veno character.
    How do you make a monster your pet, I believe I can do that now but with no instructions in this game most of the time it leaves one holding the ????? by the handle.
    Also can you get a pet that you can Ride and/or Fly?
    I suppose those are going to cost extra

    You get a tame skill that you can use on mobs your level or lower that are not "infected by wraiths" (they'll have a little icon on the nameplate). Pet's with lower hp are easier to tame.

    As far as "pets" that you ride and/or fly, you'll get a free flyer as a quest reward when you're level 30, like every other class. There are no free land mounts although you can get a couple different ones from running endless DQs (not worth it, imo), or by purchasing them from the boutique or other players.
  • MaouHime - Raging Tide
    MaouHime - Raging Tide Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Hey there again b:laugh
    Today I ( lvl 51 )just bashed Qinzi b:pleased with my lvl 46 Eldergoth Sharpshooter and the help of my brother ( Archer lvl 50 ), however, we were wondering about why we cannot seem to either stun him nor freeze him with my brothers spells, so I was wondering wether he is immune to negative effects.
  • SeaStorm - Heavens Tear
    SeaStorm - Heavens Tear Posts: 315 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Some bosses have a low % chance to be stunned, frozen etc. while they can get damage over time (DOT) every single time that skill hits. If any mob/boss is immune to a certain affect it will be stated under their "name plate." For example: Mountain Finger in FB99 Demon (aka Abaddon or Abby) states "wood immunity" another boss in there is "fire immunity" etc. These notations will appear in the same place that you currently see things like "weak" "increase life" "increased magic resistance" etc.

    Also for increased magic resistance mobs, drop into fox form and normal attack (unless you have a few other fox skills like - fox wallop, befudding mist, leech, etc - then toss those in)....mobs (other than the ones labeled weak) that have a stat list like increased life, increased magic resistance will give more exp when they die vs weak or normal mobs.

    I've always kept my pet's aggro skill max'd for their lvl as the higher the skill lvl the more damage it does. Since you are lvling as well and thus increasing the amount of damage you do you need to pet's damage amt to continue to increase. I also kept all pets within a one lvl range below me as if they were two or more lvls below I would steal aggro off them when dealing DD.

    As for the part about patakas vs swords, I believe in general that patakas tend to provide crit bonuses with a higher end damage spike.

    @RiiC all the pets you tame for your veno are battle pets, you cannot use them as land or air mounts.

    (note: from an early abbrev. comment....SOT is the Sage FB99 and one of our BHs is located there)
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MaouHime - Raging Tide
    MaouHime - Raging Tide Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    I have been doing Qingzi 5 times now and well the 1st time he dropped quite nice, the 2nd-5th time, however, the only things he dropped were mass coins b:cry. So I have been thinking, whether it is still worth my time killing him.
    I'm still lvl 51.

    And can you plz give me an advise about when and how I can do FB 39 with my brother ( Archer ) and can my Eldergoth tank any bosses there just like with Qingzi?

    Thanks b:laugh
  • Solandri - Heavens Tear
    Solandri - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,843 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    MaouHime - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Ah and btw, do you use Magic Swords in End-Game, because they have the highest Phy.Atk out of all Magicinstruments.So the Fox form gets more out of it. If that is the case, I was wondering why PWI is giving us Venos A Pataka as a Rank IX? xD
    The patakas actually have the highest physical attack, slightly higher average than the magic swords. But the developers apparently don't understand the effect of attack speed on DPS. So they give venos (whom they intended to melee) the third-worst physical DPS of the four magic weapon types, and they don't do anything about 5 atk/sec builds being completely unbalancing to the other classes in the game.
  • Yindra - Sanctuary
    Yindra - Sanctuary Posts: 784 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    MaouHime - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I have been doing Qingzi 5 times now and well the 1st time he dropped quite nice, the 2nd-5th time, however, the only things he dropped were mass coins b:cry.

    Well, at least you got coins :-) The guy is level 35, 16 levels below you --- and Perfect World is a game where level differences are penalized. You got lucky the first time, that's all.
    And can you plz give me an advise about when and how I can do FB 39

    No idea, haven't been able to do it yet.
    Slow progress, game is getting way too grindy :-( Quests I still hope to be able to do some day: FB39, General Feng
  • MaouHime - Raging Tide
    MaouHime - Raging Tide Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    No one's gonna tell me, which lvl I need to do FB 39 solo / or with my Brother (Archer same lvl as I am)?? And ecspecially which Pet to use? b:laugh

    Oh and btw Today I did Qingzi 2 more times and 1 time he dropped real nice again!
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Solandri - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    The patakas actually have the highest physical attack, slightly higher average than the magic swords. But the developers apparently don't understand the effect of attack speed on DPS. So they give venos (whom they intended to melee) the third-worst physical DPS of the four magic weapon types, and they don't do anything about 5 atk/sec builds being completely unbalancing to the other classes in the game.

    Any differences in class = unbalance. I could go on and on about how Wiz's can range tank while melee takes a beating or how some classes don't even get hit normally, or how archers have the longest range, or how barbs get the most HP from vit, etc etc.
    Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.
  • Mayfly - Dreamweaver
    Mayfly - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,094 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    MaouHime - Raging Tide wrote: »
    No one's gonna tell me, which lvl I need to do FB 39 solo / or with my Brother (Archer same lvl as I am)?? And ecspecially which Pet to use? b:laugh

    Oh and btw Today I did Qingzi 2 more times and 1 time he dropped real nice again!

    You ought to be able to solo 39 when you get the 53 heal, using an eldergoth to tank the bosses at range.

    Note that the eldergoth isn't using any skills in range mode, so it's real easy for anyone to pull aggro. Also, if you try to use the eldergoth's roar to get aggro back, it's likely to die at that level.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Weekly Japanese/English bilingual webcomic
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  • Solandri - Heavens Tear
    Solandri - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,843 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    tweakz wrote: »
    Any differences in class = unbalance.
    LOL. No tweakz. I've helped design and code MMORPGs. Any difference != unbalance.

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