Do any other Venos w/herc have same prob?

ShiroD - Sanctuary · January 2010

Everytime i do a bh if there is a barb in the squad

or a veno w/o a herc they seem to bash me. Today i did a bh and the veno told me i couldnt tank, even though we had no cleric, the barb wanted me to tank cause he didnt want to tick his charm, but the veno insisted that i was a menace to barbs

and that i bash barbs by even offering to tank lol, anyone else have this problem?b:cute

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear · January 2010

ShiroD - Sanctuary wrote: »

Everytime i do a bh if there is a barb in the squad or a veno w/o a herc they seem to bash me. Today i did a bh and the veno told me i couldnt tank, even though we had no cleric, the barb wanted me to tank cause he didnt want to tick his charm, but the veno insisted that i was a menace to barbs and that i bash barbs by even offering to tank lol, anyone else have this problem?b:cute

For me is doesn't matter who tank. Sometimes in BH I'm the tanker. Tank can be any1 who can do it at lowest risk or expenses.

PandaTheWise - Sanctuary · January 2010

That veno was probably just jealous.

MagicHamsta - Lost City · January 2010

ShiroD - Sanctuary wrote: »

Everytime i do a bh if there is a barb in the squad or a veno w/o a herc they seem to bash me. Today i did a bh and the veno told me i couldnt tank, even though we had no cleric, the barb wanted me to tank cause he didnt want to tick his charm, but the veno insisted that i was a menace to barbs and that i bash barbs by even offering to tank lol, anyone else have this problem?b:cute

that veno be an idiot lol....
o look at me...me are menace to everyone!
me can heal instead of the cleric. me can deal damage instead of an archer, assassin, psychic, veno, or other wizard.
me can tank bosses if me had uber crazy gear + me stone barrier
b:sweat

ya me would say that the other veno just be jealous lol.

Celestyna - Heavens Tear · January 2010

ShiroD - Sanctuary wrote: »

Everytime i do a bh if there is a barb in the squad or a veno w/o a herc they seem to bash me. Today i did a bh and the veno told me i couldnt tank, even though we had no cleric, the barb wanted me to tank cause he didnt want to tick his charm, but the veno insisted that i was a menace to barbs and that i bash barbs by even offering to tank lol, anyone else have this problem?b:cute

most tanks I think welcome herc as a tank so they can save some money. and the snippy veno's without are upset they cant get one.
note: not ALL hercless veno's are nasty about it, some know what herc can do and either cant afford it atm or just plain dont want it due to thier builds or what not

sandeep122 · January 2010

ShiroD - Sanctuary wrote: »

Everytime i do a bh if there is a barb in the squad or a veno w/o a herc they seem to bash me. Today i did a bh and the veno told me i couldnt tank, even though we had no cleric, the barb wanted me to tank cause he didnt want to tick his charm, but the veno insisted that i was a menace to barbs and that i bash barbs by even offering to tank lol, anyone else have this problem?b:cute

i am a herc veno and i like tanking most BH and other non aoe boss , cause

Tanking = very little expense for me (pet heal+Amp)
DDing= high Mp usage(ddskills+fox debuff skills+ MP intensive myraid (H/Fox)

if cleric is there use Mp ,HP switch , = unlimited MP for u b:laugh . btw dont scare ur cleric to death

Also help barb save his repair cost

LloydAsplund - Sanctuary · January 2010

My only problem as a herc veno is people being **** (triple spark + raep damage) on bosses like styg. They die, and blame me/herc for not keeping aggro. And, the barb who refused to tank styg because he couldnt afford that ~3k repair from one boss.

MagicHamsta - Lost City · January 2010

sandeep122 wrote: »

i am a herc veno and i like tanking most BH and other non aoe boss , cause

Tanking = very little expense for me (pet heal+Amp)
DDing= high Mp usage(ddskills+fox debuff skills+ MP intensive myraid (H/Fox)

if cleric is there use Mp ,HP switch , = unlimited MP for u b:laugh . btw dont scare ur cleric to death

Also help barb save his repair cost

looooool
me saw a veno once kill herself using soul transfusion.
b:chuckle
swapped and then got hit by an aoe loool~ (she probably should've swapped faster)
xD
heck or even slower.
xD

LloydAsplund - Sanctuary · January 2010

Since we're on the subject. I hate venos that say "CLERIC HEAL!!!!!" right after transfusion. Especially in the middle of a fight.

_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary · January 2010

Another example of people endangering a squad by blindly holding on to their ideas. Hercless venos are sometimes
a) Jealous. Doesn't matter if you saved up for the pet or bought it, they don't have it so they resent it.
b) Their pet can't tank so obviously nothing else can. It actually wouldn't insult the barb at all, in their mind it insults them. Basically they feel it's like "look i'm a veno and I can do what you never could". In other words they have a silly wanting-to-be-best complex and make themselves feel better by acting like you're as bad a tank as they are. Which in reality obviously isn't true. But by not choosing to accept it they just endanger and slow the squad

If a herc can do it, they're always a better tank. No repair bills, no stress on the cleric, no searching for a full healer/tank combo for an instance. If agro's a problem just don't hit or take off ring/blessing or fight unarmed. I'd choose a slow but completely safe battle over a high risk slightly faster one any day.

MagicHamsta - Lost City · January 2010

LloydAsplund - Sanctuary wrote: »

Since we're on the subject. I hate venos that say "CLERIC HEAL!!!!!" right after transfusion. Especially in the middle of a fight.

this
(>.<)
just saying a simple quick "Transfusion"
or something like "ST"
to the cleric would help alot lol.
(although most me has seen rely on their own HP pots.)
(O.o)

Barbariankev - Heavens Tear · January 2010

i personaly dont like herc tanks on non ? bosses
cause i can steal agro in human form off them without skill spamming(thats with +2giant ape axes with accuracy shard and im tanker build)
while when im tanking DDs dont have to nerf their damage so damm greatly its lower then mine lol and i dont make that big costs from 1 short fb/bh boss anyway

but no cleric and stil insisting a barb tank(as long the barb didnt greatly out level the boss ofc) is being nuts

MagicHamsta - Lost City · January 2010

me like to has a veno in a TT run for the extra no damage reduced damage pets do on ? level mobs.

ShiroD - Sanctuary · January 2010

I have the same problem with people sparking and attacking like mad, i had a lovely squad yesterday, 2 bms and a barb with calamitys, even a phychic and they all took off there blessings and kept skills to a minimum it was nice for once xDb:victory

sandeep122 · January 2010

if u find people doing DD at max capacity warn them once, if they ignore ur warning and DD like Barb tanking , say bb when the die , dont care about those people b:bye

Barbariankev - Heavens Tear · January 2010

sandeep122 wrote: »

if u find people doing DD at max capacity warn them once, if they ignore ur warning and DD like Barb tanking , say bb when the die , dont care about those people b:bye

you do realisze even a barb has the strenght to take a hercs agro without agro skils right? lol thats why herc tanks at normal non ? bosses fail when you have a cleric and barb

_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary · January 2010

Barbariankev - Heavens Tear wrote: »

you do realisze even a barb has the strenght to take a hercs agro without agro skils right? lol thats why herc tanks at normal non ? bosses fail when you have a cleric and barb

Take off both rings and your blessing and try stealing agro off a herc around your level with normal attacks. Go on, do it, I dare you.

The "imma rob agro" thing is silly. Stop hitting so hard. Problem sorted. Who cares if it takes a little longer, everyone lives and you get the BH done with no searching for tank/healers.

When you have a good cleric and barb I'd agree though. Unless one of them is a pot/repairs whiner.

Celestyna - Heavens Tear · January 2010

being that i travel with a veno on a regular basis I have to say in most cases he doesnt have a problem with people taking agro from his herc unless is me b:chuckle for some reason I rip agro away.
back before bh's when it was still profitable to do fb runs for molds we would solo eden and I seemed to always steal agro on that darn fox at 50% hp b:surrender

in a squad if there is a barb/cleric might as well let them tank(and heal) for it. if the barb and cleric were built for survivablity not dding thier damage output is probably less then the veno's would be and allows the veno time to amp ect

edit to add:

_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

Take off both rings and your blessing and try stealing agro off a herc around your level with normal attacks. Go on, do it, I dare you.

The "imma rob agro" thing is silly. Stop hitting so hard. Problem sorted. Who cares if it takes a little longer, everyone lives and you get the BH done with no searching for tank/healers.

When you have a good cleric and barb I'd agree though. Unless one of them is a pot/repairs whiner.

I tried taking off rings and such (back before blessings) and still would get agro, no one else ever did but me .. and its not even that i hit that hard i have over 100 pts in vit >.>
Its like the mob / boss just knows and goes for me

Barbariankev - Heavens Tear · January 2010

_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

Take off both rings and your blessing and try stealing agro off a herc around your level with normal attacks. Go on, do it, I dare you.

The "imma rob agro" thing is silly. Stop hitting so hard. Problem sorted. Who cares if it takes a little longer, everyone lives and you get the BH done with no searching for tank/healers.

When you have a good cleric and barb I'd agree though. Unless one of them is a pot/repairs whiner.

yeah ok i cant steal agro with no blessing and rings and no (agro) skils but my damage is suposed to be very low then again i can arguably deal the same to a single target as an axe bm in humanoid form

XanZerstorer - Dreamweaver · January 2010

Of a herc my level with no rings, no blessing, and auto-attack only? Doubtful.

Of a lower-level herc, even with auto-attack only? For sure. I've done it plenty times, and I often get yelled at by the cleric or the veno.

Hence why I don't like squadding with herc venos unless they know what they're doing, and just like with any class, I have a hard time with that x.x.

ShiroD - Sanctuary · January 2010

I can keep aggro off ppl the same level as my herc, just not archers if they spam skills, but other chars can spam skills and even spark if they are level 73 like my herc ^^ unluckily for me most people i do bh with are higher then me and my herc lol, and alot of the time dont listen when i warn them b:shocked

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear · January 2010

Personally I don't care if I take aggro from bosses which I can tank. If I take aggro at these bosses not big deal. Just cleric will heal me and not original tanker. But at bosses which I cannot tank I'm very careful and using just very low damage spells if tanker is not barb +-2 same levels like me.

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver · January 2010

That veno was just an idiot. Hercs are amazing, can't deny that fact. Besides, if the barb didn't give a damn then why the hell should the veno? I'm guessing that he/she had a bad experience with a herc veno before or she's just, as others have said, jealous. I'm leaning more towards jealousy.

Basingeth - Lost City · January 2010

As a barb. I love it when the herc. can tank, provided it keeps aggro.

A high level veno. with a herc. in TT is awesome. It saves tons of time and trouble.

Plus, I like to DD every now and then, its a lot less stressful. :-D

MANray_ - Sanctuary · January 2010

As an hercless veno, i've actually come to enjoy squadding with my herced counterparts, as i find that our playing styles can be complimentary. While herc brings it's tanking prowess, it's easier for my pet to lure, and the herc allows both me and the other veno greater freedom in switching our roles as DD/support/debuffers. When tanking a boss i always ask the herced veno if she needs assistance healing, and do in fact understand that is better for me to take on the role of pet healer, as it's easier for the other veno to DD/debuff while keeping an eye on the herc's health, in case an extra heal is needed.

Not all of us resent not having an herc. I in fact do not want one (for my own reasons) and i'm currently saving for a phoenix instead. This doesn't mean i don't appreciate herc's qualities and whenever possible i try to support venos that have one in their role. While in no way would i excuse the behaviour that the OP describes, i will say, that venos without an herc do face a lot of rejection and abuse. Ironically enough, it is mostly from other classes.

This is not to say there's not another side to the coin. I've squaded with herced venos that seemed obsessed about proving themselves top dog, and treated me and other venos present in a disrespectful manner. They overwrite your amp, insist on pulling with herc (sometimes not even bothering to take reflect off) and refuse any help healing even when they do need the assistance. They often cause party wipes. I've put to shame many an herced veno that seemed to think bringing an herc is itself enough of a contribution to a squad, and either played the weak DD/pet cleric role or insisted on being a foxform that did nothing but weak melee attacks. Sometimes this "foxform" venos dont even amp...

The quality of the player is something that always eventually reveals itself. There are rotten apples on both sides.

ShiroD - Sanctuary · January 2010

MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

As an hercless veno, i've actually come to enjoy squadding with my herced counterparts, as i find that our playing styles can be complimentary. While herc brings it's tanking prowess, it's easier for my pet to lure, and the herc allows both me and the other veno greater freedom in switching our roles as DD/support/debuffers. When tanking a boss i always ask the herced veno if she needs assistance healing, and do in fact understand that is better for me to take on the role of pet healer, as it's easier for the other veno to DD/debuff while keeping an eye on the herc's health, in case an extra heal is needed.

Not all of us resent not having an herc. I in fact do not want one (for my own reasons) and i'm currently saving for a phoenix instead. This doesn't mean i don't appreciate herc's qualities and whenever possible i try to support venos that have one in their role. While in no way would i excuse the behaviour that the OP describes, i will say, that venos without an herc do face a lot of rejection and abuse. Ironically enough, it is mostly from other classes.

This is not to say there's not another side to the coin. I've squaded with herced venos that seemed obsessed about proving themselves top dog, and treated me and other venos present in a disrespectful manner. They overwrite your amp, insist on pulling with herc (sometimes not even bothering to take reflect off) and refuse any help healing even when they do need the assistance. They often cause party wipes. I've put to shame many an herced veno that seemed to think bringing an herc is itself enough of a contribution to a squad, and either played the weak DD/pet cleric role or insisted on being a foxform that did nothing but weak melee attacks. Sometimes this "foxform" venos dont even amp...

The quality of the player is something that always eventually reveals itself. There are rotten apples on both sides.

I agree with you there, and i love when a veno offer healing help

or if they amp cause its very hard to amp a hard boss and heal at the same time ^^ and i find myself assist healing other hercs alot too

in tts and such, i help heal the higher herc so the higher veno can attack =D

Damewort - Sanctuary · January 2010

I am veno with herc, but used to be hercless for a long time (till lvl89).
In case like that, it is non of other veno's business who tanks. "Potential" tanks decide who tanks basing on their skill and abilities. If herc can tank it and barb is fine with that, then herc tanks. It is true, that herc is bad at holding aggro, so if it is tanking non-? boss then rest have to watch their damage a lot.

There are bad seeds on both sides. And seems that there is a long fight between both camps too... Herc-less venos bash herc-venos for being incompetent, for counting only on herc and for not knowing how to play veno. Herc-venos bash herc-less ones for being useless and that every veno should aim for herc to play veno in its fullest... Oracles makes even bigger mess on both camps...

I kinda like to catch and tank better...
But as rule of thumb goes - eldest veno leads, youngest - assists. If one of venos has herc, then mostly hercless one gets to assist (unless there is big level difference). Funny enough, but if two venos follow this rule, then they can make a perfect team. Then you get a tank, healer, debuffer/DD just from two players.

As for ST... If veno plans to use it on low mp, then better warn cleric before hand that you have a habbit like that. But just always be ready to heal up by yourself... and try to not scare cleric to death...
*stands in front of cleric while attacking boss*uses ST at 10-50mp* twirls around and falls down*lays for a second or two*gets up and continues to DD as nothing happened* b:cute

Psytrac - Dreamweaver · January 2010

ShiroD - Sanctuary wrote: »

the veno insisted that i was a menace to barbs and that i bash barbs by even offering to tank lol

I'll do ya one better. I get bashed for offering to tank WITHOUT herc. (where I can at least. I don't own a herc)

_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary · January 2010

Damewort - Sanctuary wrote: »

*stands in front of cleric while attacking boss*uses ST at 10-50mp* twirls around and falls down*lays for a second or two*gets up and continues to DD as nothing happened* b:cute

I'm not the only one who's done that then xD

XanZerstorer - Dreamweaver · January 2010

Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I'll do ya one better. I get bashed for offering to tank WITHOUT herc. (where I can at least. I don't own a herc)

I've had faction venos ABLE to tank without hercs, and yet get denied access in random groups because they don't have hercs (with tank and cleric in the squad already). It's sad really, and I don't understand it.

What kills me too is the venos who think they're God's gift to PWI because they have a herc. It's a freaking pet. I agree, it's a good tank, but FFS, if you don't know how to use your herc, don't start bashing on everyone else.

drjiggle · January 2010

MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »

this
(>.<)
just saying a simple quick "Transfusion"
or something like "ST"
to the cleric would help alot lol.
(although most me has seen rely on their own HP pots.)
(O.o)

If I'm going to deliberately drop my HP to almost zero because I'm too cheap to buy an MP pot, then I consider it my responsibility to heal myself somehow (HP pot, Metabolic Boost, genie skill, whatever). If the cleric wants to throw a quick Ironheart on me, that's great, and I appreciate it, but the cleric's responsibility is keeping the tank and the rest of the party alive, not helping me manage my MP.

Do any other Venos w/herc have same prob?

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