Pay to win game, the breakdown!
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KnaveslLobo - Heavens Tear wrote: »so id really like to know how you plan on "winning" this game
since it never ends. just like life no one truly "wins"
That depends on your outlook. Some people look at things in a game and the goals they set for themselves, and when the achieve them, consider themselves to have 'won' the game. As for life... again it depends on your outlook. I'm happy with my life. I'd say from my point of view, I'm winning at life. At least so far. What the future may bring is an unknown, but.. anyway you get what I mean I am sure.
~S0 -
by win i mean like Daikoku (sp?) type of win, where at some point in time, he owned the whole map.. or the type of win where everything is +12 and nobody can kill you 1v1.
Plus why does everyone assume that people that oracle dont spent time learning how to play their charecters? they kill mobs to racle and test allt heir skills and after they are done oracling spend some time learning each skill, its effects, and testing those skills out on friends who are different classes.
So you can oracle and be just as good as anyone else lol..0 -
Well .. you all got it wrong.. All of u wanna make it look like if the Zhen buyers are the 'winers' the allmighty and the non Zhen buyers are the loosers who dont own anything.. OH i got news for you!!!! Not one single one of the pixels or Server space that you think belongs to you, Is or will be ever yours..Even if you spent 10,000 Dollars baby .......... So don't feel so proud and don't feel like your the sh*t Because at the end.. Who are the real loosers?
im reading this stuff and im just thinking.. where the F! are you getting my opinions from? did you even read teh original post? if so please quote the section that says get rid of all people who dont charge or how everyone that doesnt charge is a complete loser that should just quit.. damn... just making up things as you go along... how about "You can still be a good player without charging if ou have a good guild blah blah balh.." Go read the post before you comment, idiot.
Oh and btw why do you hate cats so much? **** cats isnt a good thing you should be ashamed... thats just as much information pulled out of your post as you pulled out of mine..0 -
oh i agree being happy with who and where you are is the key
but do you ever really win? in life you die in game theres always someone bigger and better , thats the way it is .
besides the joke is on all the players really paying and nonpaying , ive been admin , gm, part time owner of a few games, heres a little tip they want the conflict ,the complaining. why because it genarates intreste in the game , the more they can do that the more ppl,the more ppl the more money .
in the end they dont give two hoots about the player base and thire gripes
as long as the money rolls in , if it drys up oh well close it change the name a few detaile and start over.
so whos the winners here ?0 -
KnaveslLobo - Heavens Tear wrote: »besides the joke is on all the players really paying and nonpaying , ive been admin , gm, part time owner of a few games, heres a little tip they want the conflict ,the complaining. why because it genarates intreste in the game , the more they can do that the more ppl,the more ppl the more money .
in the end they dont give two hoots about the player base and thire gripes
as long as the money rolls in , if it drys up oh well close it change the name a few detaile and start over.
so whos the winners here ?
wow... interesting insight, I had never even thought of that.0 -
KnaveslLobo - Heavens Tear wrote: »
in the end they dont give two hoots about the player base and thire gripes
as long as the money rolls in , if it drys up oh well close it change the name a few detaile and start over.
so whos the winners here ?
i take it that in the end, pwi is the real winner here...0 -
Why anyone would spend real life money on pixels Ill never understand.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thank you Forsakenx for the picture. b:thanks0 -
It's like that in every type of business.KnaveslLobo - Heavens Tear wrote: »besides the joke is on all the players really paying and nonpaying , ive been admin , gm, part time owner of a few games, heres a little tip they want the conflict ,the complaining. why because it genarates intreste in the game , the more they can do that the more ppl,the more ppl the more money .
in the end they dont give two hoots about the player base and thire gripes
as long as the money rolls in , if it drys up oh well close it change the name a few detaile and start over.
The majority of businesses in a given field don't really care about their customers or their product, as long as the money keeps coming in. It's only a minority of businesses that put in the effort to care about quality, keeping their customers happy and being innovative leaders in their field.
Now, it could just be that PWE has totally managed to fluke out and be the leader in their field, with the one of the highest quality f2p games currently out there. It may also be a complete fluke that PWE is receiving constant mentions in mainstream business media as a hot-stock company to watch out for.
But personally, I don't think it's a fluke. I think it's probably because PWE/PWI hires people with different attitudes than the ones you describe their competitors as having. They may not be doing a perfect job of it, and they make make lots (...and lots... and lots and lots and lots...) of mistakes, but they're still better than any other f2p company I can think of.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
PWI Merchanting Guides: warrenwolfy.wordpress.com0 -
OP is a load of rubbish.
PW was doing fine as a non pay-to-win game for the first year, as it was on several other unnamed servers.
The game went bad when they let out the anni packs and then got greedy putting them back into the game 3 times.
Theres this thing called balance. Before cash shop used to give you an advantage, but you still needed to work hard to achieve good gear.
Now its just all cashshop, and same for xp (something the devs stated they would never do)0 -
Even if you spent 10,000 Dollars baby .......... So don't feel so proud and don't feel like your the sh*t Because at the end.. Who are the real loosers?
Shhh. They already know it. Most people wont admit they spent a lot of cash for exactly those reasons. Im always amazed how gold buyers exceed gold sellers by such a huge margin.... if you believe the forums.0 -
you really think so?
look at whats happening now ...
ive seen it before
do the gms really care or is it they dont enforce TOS out of love for the game, why should they enforce it , who dont want a place where you feel you can break the rules and get away with it?
again it genarates intreste and more ppl to make money off of.
another tip, TOS is not there to be enforced they dont have to ,it only protects the owners so they cant be held liable
owners add more and more cash items in game just because they love the player base so much , mhm right
its happens in every game
dont get me wrong i like the game and i play it alot , but i dont fall for all the hype . maybe im jaded but i just dont beleive it anymore
as you said its a bizz and as a bizz the model never changes as long as it works (woking as in it makes them money) nothing will change0 -
i guess the OP wasnt around for the first 6-8 months or so of this game... Before the cash shop was let off its leash.Q - How to win on Perfect World?
A - Throw money at it.0 -
I have been playing this game since Beta, I started on the Asian version but it was pvp only I got to level 57 Barbarian and then Perfect World International was announced based in the US. Less lag being local mostly translated so understandable and no third party zen selling lack of botting and no corrupt gms.
I started playing this game almost 2 years ago as i mentioned i was in the beta now lets take a minute and go back on the asian version the price of gold was 300k coin but yet the cash shop had a ton more items than we have here, and your cubits went a whole lot further. We come to this game not even 2 years old right around the six month mark and gold is pushing 300k with a 1/3 of the cash items as the other version which is like 4 + years old and then we see nothing but sale after sale every update very few if any items and the same bugs as day one of Beta.
This game has turned into a lets see how much money we can milk from every player before we close our doors and create something new. I mean seriously who pays 20 dollars for fashion then has to spend another 30+ to get it the color they want and god forbid you want normal colors like black or white because they costs a fortune form the auction house or other players
i agree that the greed of several players is causing the economy to spiral out of control but you know what the gms and devs could do some regulating of items like they do in other games people should not be able to gouge for things like they do but they do it becuase there is no one who is regulating it
for example its like no one ever figured out that selling more of an item at a lower price could make them more money in the long run I do not and I stress i do not believe in people buying their way to the top especially in a pvp type of game and that's exactly what territory wars is pvp where the greediest players win.
First and fore most this game is about playing together and cooperation, that why you have to in most cases have a squad or factions help with bosses and dungeons and sometimes quest but the greed in the game really inhibits players from truly working together.
People i have found horde exp selfishly horde reputation and require squad members to be of specific class builds that cost money this game has turned into in just 1 year a money pit yet keep this in mind your real money doesn't buy you anymore zen than it used except when they do bonus zen purchase.
Free to play definitely pay to win.0 -
its sorta anybody's option to buy lots of gold and be the best, its fair because anyone can do it, take out a loan, go bankrupt, w/e but anybody, in theory, can be the best.... so i dont see where this is all going anymore lol0
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If I would be a student and had tons of free time, I would play for free. But I'm working, also have family with kids, so for me is selling gold the way to play efficiently without spending hours just for grinding.
So I welcome the option send a gold and buy TT mats to make armor for example. I don't have time for running TT instances and at the end go away just with few priceless mats.(because I pick up mats as last usually as a DD)[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »If I would be a student and had tons of free time, I would play for free. But I'm working, also have family with kids, so for me is selling gold the way to play efficiently without spending hours just for grinding.
So I welcome the option send a gold and buy TT mats to make armor for example. I don't have time for running TT instances and at the end go away just with few priceless mats.(because I pick up mats as last usually as a DD)
i dont think any non-cash player could complain about that.
i it s ok if non-cash/cash players can get same things with enough time/money
it is about balance, which pwi dont have anymore since all that op event gear added (and it kinda must to have at end lvls now)BUILD EFFICIENCY CALCULATOR: pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1129681
AGGRO MECHANICS: pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=481682
GAME IS DEAD wiki-article: pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=9382820 -
There are 2 big reasons why I'm not hopping on the cynicism bandwagon.KnaveslLobo - Heavens Tear wrote: »owners add more and more cash items in game just because they love the player base so much , mhm right
its happens in every game
dont get me wrong i like the game and i play it alot , but i dont fall for all the hype . maybe im jaded but i just dont beleive it anymore
as you said its a bizz and as a bizz the model never changes as long as it works (woking as in it makes them money) nothing will change
First off, people have been making the same accusations and complaints since forever. Back when PWI first launched, the accusation was that higher cash-shop prices (relative to other versions of PW) were cited as proof-positive of PWI's greed. Now lower cash-shop prices (due to sales) are cited as proof-positive of PWI's greed.
Likewise, anything they do that makes the game harder in some way inevitably provokes shouts of "Greed!" on the forums, but when they do things like lower prices or offer x2 weekends the same shouts of "Greed!" erupt.
So basically, if they do anything they're accused of being greedy, or even if they do nothing they're accused of being greedy. It's such a broken record. Yet when I look at all the players who seem to be blissfully having a blast actually playing the game I start to realize why PWI doesn't seem to listen to the forums as much as we forum posters feel they ought to.
Second, the refrain of, "they're just milking us for money before they shut the game down!" has been around since the start, yet despite this claim PWE just keeps right on investing huge amounts of money into creating additional content for the game.
There are tons of f2p games that have had no content upgrades for years, and in those cases the accusation makes sense. But it makes no sense when talking about the current state of the Perfect World franchise.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
PWI Merchanting Guides: warrenwolfy.wordpress.com0 -
The thing isnt complaining about the hardcore cash shoppers, i mean if you can do it do it and its better for you, but what people complain of is the increasing difference between the shoppers and the non shoppers.
I came back to PWI a week ago after being absent for like 10 months and i found everything so changed that im still learning some new things, but what impressed me the most was the price of gold, almost 4 times what it was when i left, and its not that i blame cash shoppers, because 10 months ago buying gold was taking an advantage from non buyers as well. So it had the same meaning, but that advantage wasnt as big as it is now, and its not good to have a big breach between buyers and non buyers because it discourages people at the beggining of the game, and finally the game turns into something like what 2moons is now, and any of you who know the game im sure that dont want this to be like that.
To round up what i mean is that theres no necessity of having gold at 400k, some time ago it was 100k and everyone was peacefull, and cash shoppers still had an advantage, and it didnt discourage people who believed that without paying you could be as good as anyone else, and we know that it beggins like that but as you grow your addiction grows and you finally end up buying, and i think thats the best way to make non buyers real buyers, not the way they are trying to make it now.0 -
apparently in 2moons i was an abyssal demon! b:victoryElena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
Qui: b:dirty0 -
WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary wrote: »There are 2 big reasons why I'm not hopping on the cynicism bandwagon.
First off, people have been making the same accusations and complaints since forever. Back when PWI first launched, the accusation was that higher cash-shop prices (relative to other versions of PW) were cited as proof-positive of PWI's greed. Now lower cash-shop prices (due to sales) are cited as proof-positive of PWI's greed.
Likewise, anything they do that makes the game harder in some way inevitably provokes shouts of "Greed!" on the forums, but when they do things like lower prices or offer x2 weekends the same shouts of "Greed!" erupt.
So basically, if they do anything they're accused of being greedy, or even if they do nothing they're accused of being greedy. It's such a broken record. Yet when I look at all the players who seem to be blissfully having a blast actually playing the game I start to realize why PWI doesn't seem to listen to the forums as much as we forum posters feel they ought to.
Second, the refrain of, "they're just milking us for money before they shut the game down!" has been around since the start, yet despite this claim PWE just keeps right on investing huge amounts of money into creating additional content for the game.
There are tons of f2p games that have had no content upgrades for years, and in those cases the accusation makes sense. But it makes no sense when talking about the current state of the Perfect World franchise.
Well, should the Gm's care about cry's of greed? no is the correct answer, its a bussiness and to be succesful they have to be greedy, as cashshoppers will buy more during sales.. and sales really dont matter for pwi as they are giving you nothing anyway, every cent they make is a profit.. so i think the gm's shouldnt care about what people think in terms of the company being greedy, they are, as all people should be..
Im not talking about the type of greed as in guild greed but the type where you charge gold and then try to get a higher price even though its putting someone in a bad money spot, because why should you care? you can always find another buyer, or use the gold.0 -
its funny how people label the company greedy:
#1 none of you need to actually pay anything to be successful in pw
#2 they aren't aiming to milk you as much as they can before they killswitch PW. its called we have a bad US economy, and the company needs to have a larger customer base if they want to make it through it.
#3 the only greedy ones in PW are the ones charging a ton of coin per gold, they are the ones trying to milk you for the most 'money' they can get in a sense.
those who disagree with the blunt truth, and wanna keep bashing PWE/whine on the forums are stupid.0 -
Erond - Heavens Tear wrote: »The thing isnt complaining about the hardcore cash shoppers, i mean if you can do it do it and its better for you, but what people complain of is the increasing difference between the shoppers and the non shoppers.
I came back to PWI a week ago after being absent for like 10 months and i found everything so changed that im still learning some new things, but what impressed me the most was the price of gold, almost 4 times what it was when i left, and its not that i blame cash shoppers, because 10 months ago buying gold was taking an advantage from non buyers as well. So it had the same meaning, but that advantage wasnt as big as it is now, and its not good to have a big breach between buyers and non buyers because it discourages people at the beggining of the game, and finally the game turns into something like what 2moons is now, and any of you who know the game im sure that dont want this to be like that.
To round up what i mean is that theres no necessity of having gold at 400k, some time ago it was 100k and everyone was peacefull, and cash shoppers still had an advantage, and it didnt discourage people who believed that without paying you could be as good as anyone else, and we know that it beggins like that but as you grow your addiction grows and you finally end up buying, and i think thats the best way to make non buyers real buyers, not the way they are trying to make it now.
Gold used to be 800k... yeh thats right, we screwed the economy over that much... buts its good, as we make more money...0 -
You made more money, yea but sooner or later its gonna end up like a stupid p2w and in the history of mmos i havent seen a p2w go far. Bassicaly theres the difference between p2p and f2p, because p2p are for that, to oblige people to spend money, but f2p are there to turn people into buyers inflicting the addiction, and thats what PWI was based and created for, because if not it would have been a p2p since the beggining. But now its turning into that f2p intending to be a p2p that we call p2w, and as far as i know about mmos none got away with it.
And making money isnt up to the buyers, because the economy doesnt move according to what you want, it moves according to the company releasing new content and increasing the demand, its not because of you, so the credit or fault of **** PWIs economy is of PWE.0 -
AndyNagato - Lost City wrote: »its funny how people label the company greedy:
#1 none of you need to actually pay anything to be successful in pw
#2 they aren't aiming to milk you as much as they can before they killswitch PW. its called we have a bad US economy, and the company needs to have a larger customer base if they want to make it through it.
#3 the only greedy ones in PW are the ones charging a ton of coin per gold, they are the ones trying to milk you for the most 'money' they can get in a sense.
those who disagree with the blunt truth, and wanna keep bashing PWE/whine on the forums are stupid.
The facts are that in this recession the country has been in for almost a year this company not only launched this game and expanded it but and to all amazed made enough money to launch jade dynasty and another paid for game plus expansions so tell me how hurt were they in this recession because all i say for months was sale after sale and few bug fixes and very little real content for everyone for all the money they were raking in0 -
here is a thought how about you lower the price of zen permanently for the next 6months to a year and let everyone who wants to buy some do so seems to me that the more players buy zen the more the company makes in profit even though its at a lower price quantity over high cost i would definitely buy some if it was cheaper and i am sure others would as well simple business 101
but that is my concern it seems to be how much can we make right this minute there obviously not thinking long term but very short term0 -
AlbireoTwo - Lost City wrote: »Why anyone would spend real life money on pixels Ill never understand.
So, I take it you never go see a movie in a theater, correct? You wait until it "premieres" on broadcast TV? Because, obviously you don't have cable or satellite TV, either, or buy/rent DVDs, as that would be "paying for pixels".
This game is a form of entertainment, no more and no less. Are there other things I could've spent my money on besides a mount and a herc? Of course. But I didn't.0 -
Gold used to be 800k... yeh thats right, we screwed the economy over that much... buts its good, as we make more money...
here's news for you: gold prices are high because coin is worthless. you're not richer because everything that has anything to do with the boutique got more expensive. so those charms, refines, mounts, aero, whatever, their in-game price rose with the rising gold prices. so 20m coins meant a lot more when gold was low than it does now.
high gold prices just makes it harder for everyone honestly. even if you charge, you're not going to want to dig into your wallet every single time you need/want something.Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
Qui: b:dirty0 -
err what?
We make lots of coin and then buy stuff from boutique using coin? no, we sell some gold for coin and then buy teh stuff we need using gold, meaning that our prices never change, yours do...
Yes, the coin is worth less on some other things but really it doesnt affect us that much... stuff from boutique never changes in price... if anything we can get a better deal from people who sell items instead of gold, but we arent being gipped here... lol0 -
RedBuIl - Lost City wrote: »unfortunately thats the only way it can be, servers cost money.
But there are multiple options...
pay to win (cash shop)
massive amounts of pop-ups during game and advertising in game
mandatory advertisement forms ( like the free gold stuff)
or if its sponsored by some millionare...
but usually its just p2w, easier plus gm's get some bonuses from gold prices..
Servers cost what... maybe 60 a month.. they make more than a fortune than that.0 -
SupaRoyalty - Lost City wrote: »Servers cost what... maybe 60 a month.. they make more than a fortune than that.
...try adding some to that figure. It's a LOT more then 60 dollars. MMO's are the single most expensive servers to run as they are constantly on, constantly hammered at by players grinding, and have to keep up with a bandwidth you don't even want to think about.
The bandwidth alone from just chat is insane as it has to appear on EVERY persons screen at approximately the same time. Just using one server, it's probably upwards of several thousand players at once. Now multiply that by the number of servers we have now. Those are players in every major city in the U.S. talking at the same time as battles, respawns, inventory requests, sale requests, movement packets, etc. etc. etc. You'd most likely cry to see the cost per minute that the servers run at.
There's also maintenance, power bills, the coders pay, advertising costs, and other misc expenses...The power and maintenance are part of the bill each and every month, but the other parts have to be factored in for how much they need to get to each month as well.
$60? Way way way to low. Try hundreds a week and thousands a month, PER server.0
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